Mich. governor signs 48-month welfare limit

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by wantsome
My buddy works and he gets welfare in Michigan. He only makes $8 an hour working part time at Walmart. He can't find a full time job. He supports 2 other people his mom and brother. His mom is sick and can't work. His brother is still in school. They rely heavely on Welfare. Right now they don't even have gas. They take cold showers. They're worrried they won't be able to afford to have it turned on for the winter. They don't have cable tv or internet. They have one cell phone. My buddy makes $150 a week and thier rent is $800 a month. If they loose thier welfare thier gonna homeless.

If you read the source, exemptions will be made for medical reasons.

Yeah I did read the source and it said those getting disability will be excempt. My buddys mother is not getting disability although she is trying. I doubt she will get it though.

reply to post by lpowell0627

Your girlfriend may be loosing out on a bit of extra money (as if such a thing really exists for most of us)
But one thing she won't be missing is her dignity and pride in being able to care for herself and her child.
Some things you can't put a price tag on.
It's people like your gf that give me hope yet for this country.

pick on the poor you piece of sh-t garbage. that's the lowest scum kind of politician. the ones that don't have the balls to tackle the wealthy if the state is short on funds.

he and the governor of florida should band together and hold a conference on how to completely screw the poor.

me, if i'm forced to pay taxes, i would rather have it go to welfare recipients than to obamas new tricked out tour bus, state diners, anthrax research or "aid" to ungrateful foreign nations.

reply to post by marg6043

Is call welfare overhaul, but the welfare system in our nation like our government is run by special interest and a corrupted system.

Nothing is going to change in the nation, because those in power either do not have the desire or like it just the way it is to keep the people Dependant on government hand outs, while the nation turns into two dominant classes while eliminating the middle working class.

My personal opinion? Welfare was started under good intentions but has been transformed into something completely different under politicians and political parties.

To make my point, look at the timing of this new welfare law. It comes when the economy is in the toilet and there really are no jobs to be taken.

You can really spot when something has become politically "hijacked" when it goes against all common sense.

Welfare, for example. When the economy is booming and there are enough jobs to go around, politicians dont really care how many people are on welfare or how much it is costing us. When the economy is in a recession, when there are less jobs and they are more hard to come by, politicians are trying to pass legislation such as this where they are limiting welfare and trying to kick people off of it.

Common sense would dictate the inverse. When the economy is good we neeed to get people off of welfare because most dont need it. When the economy is bad people depend on welfare to get by.

We need to create job opportunities for people and then pass legislation to limit welfare. That way personal responsibility is to blame and not the government. Limiting welfare now is creating a system where we say "no more welfare get a job," when there are no jobs to be had.

reply to post by areyouserious2010


What can I say you nail it to the spot, you are completely right, is a lot of special interest when it comes to welfare, involved.

In my Island one of my husband's cousin, makes a lot of money selling items to welfare recipients of food stamps, because in the Island you can open a "for food stamp only store and profit from it", that tells you how many people are in welfare in the Island.

reply to post by wantsome

they are just cutting the cash assistance, or at least that's how I took it, they will still be getting help with their rent, food, ect.....
a lifetime cap of four years, huh???
I bet there's quite a few who've used up their four years years ago!!!
really, I don't think they reallly get much from cash assistance anymore, the bulk of it is in hud, food stamps, medicaid, ect....
so, well, let's hope it doesn't hurt that much???

reply to post by SeleneLux

The real problem is not the poor and helpless it is the rich and powerful.

What qualifies someone as poor and helpless?

Do me a favor. On the 1st or the 15th of the month, wake up one morning at like 6:30am. Go to your local Social Security office or wherever they hand out the checks to people who dont get them in the mail.

I will bet you there is a line that stretches the front of the building for people waiting to receive their check from the taxpayer.

Now in that same morning, drive around to all the local businesses. Best Buy, Wal Mart, any department store or mall or any grocery store. How many people will you see lined up to get a job application? Zero. And that is not because they are not hiring. That is because there is a percentage of welfare recipients who would rather receive a check for free than work for it.

So stop with this "holier than thou" attitude about how the rich are evil. There are countless of rich people who employ countless others and provide them with a job. Do you know how many people welfare recipients employ and provide a job to? The people who work for social security and the politicians who make it easy for them to get a check for free.

To all the narrow thinkers....what do you suppose on should do with all the poor? I know you all think that jobs are abundant. Now a days even McD's is hard to get into. Did you know that families with parents working in fast food are on public assistance almost all the time. Same with that Walmart workforce. The MASS Majority of jobs in the USA do not pay a livable wage. So just because someone is on welfare doesn't mean they are lazy. In fact they probably work more jobs then you do. More hours and harder. They are sadder and worse off for it to. Yet they still qualify for welfare because their wages suck so bad. You go make a life off $7 an hour and feed you kids and pay the rent. Try it on $15 an hour I dare you. It is sad that the public opinion sees these people as losers. Go do some research and you might rethink your whole philosophy. This world is a greedy place. Yet a place were if all was shared and equal we would all still have enough. The fear of someone getting something you didn't reminds be of my 5 and 7 year old bickering. Juvenile. Like I tell my kids SHARE SHARE SHARE!!!
Hey governor say some uses up their 4 years and then 30 years later something happens and they need welfare....there going to be denied because of something that happened 30 years ago even if they paid into the system for 30 years in between that time. See what I mean by narrow minded. These politicians never think things through from all angles. Just the greed angle. Don't jump over a fence before first looking over the otherside.

what,.. so we are supposed to continue supporting the "poor"
70% of these people CAN work if they wanted..
Volenteer, clean up the city community, outreach programs
there ARE things for these people to do, but most would rather
sit at home,reproduce, and place a heavier burden on the system already
for those that actually deserve some assistance.

I think that Governor has a great Idea.
continuing to feed people on welfare is like sending food aid to
people that live in parts of Africa that Are unsustainable and uninhabitable.
not to mention, If you cant afford to feed your self then you should be
sterilized. That alone would reduce a greater part of the issue.

reply to post by outandopen

The MASS Majority of jobs in the USA do not pay a livable wage.

That issue is subject to debate.

I think a more accurate reflection is that the MASS majority of jobs in the USA do not pay a wage Americans think they are ENTITLED to.

You work some menial job somewhere. You surely can afford to live. You can afford rent and food. But you cannot afford the lifestyle you feel you are entitled to. You may not be able to afford:
a car,
an I Phone,
a big screen television,
your designer clothes,
a million shoes,
an X-Box,
a computer,
seven children,
to have the thermostat set to 68 degrees all summer,
AND a drug habit.

You can afford to LIVE though. You might even be able to afford one child.

Poverty in the United States is no where near what poverty is in the majority of other countries in the world.

It is a case of "I see Billy Bob down the street has X, I feel I should have that too." What they didnt take into consideration is that Billy Bob has worked since he was 15 to afford to go to college so he would be better qualified to get a job that pays better. He may even work a part time job to afford X.

Live within your MEANS, and you can afford to LIVE. Work hard and try to better yourself, one day you may be able to LIVE more comfortably.

Originally posted by SHABBYCAT
And honestly ........you really think sitting around being lazy recieving benefits gives a person MORE than a job????? I find that extremely hard to believe. Id really like to see a link or some proof that a person can make more on welfare than working even a minimum wage job. Really ,I want to see this.

it's not that they can make more, it's that they can get enough without applying themselves.

The thing about benefits is that they are guaranteed.

You can get fired from McDonalds. you can't get fired from welfare.
You have to set an alarm to get up an go to work. You can collect welfare in your sleep.
You have to dress well enough to keep a job. You can collect welfare in your sleep.
Jobs have drug tests, competency tests, and period reviews. Welfare does not.

On welfare, you have a lot more spare time. You can stay up late and peddle drugs or prostitute yourself. You can still go to Bingo parlors, you can still hustle.

People that come on here saying people WANT to be on welfare are just full of it in my mind ,I cannot accept that ANYONE would like to be in the system. Like I said I know there are people who take advantage but puhlease .......I seriously doubt a majority want to be on welfare. That's just ludicrous.

Have you worked in Law enforcement?
Have you worked in a soup kitchen?
Have you worked with crack addicts in a halfway house?
Have you worked in homeless shelter?

I've done, and/or am doing those things. I know what I'm talking about. And your full of "it" in my mind; right back at ya.

IF no one wants to be on welfare, next you're going to tell me that no one wants to be in prison. They may not want it, but they somehow "end up there." And are more comfortable there than in applying themselves.

But hey, you're smarter and have more life experience than anyone else here.

You better than thou types who think all out problems stem from social service ie. Welfare are really ignorant. You must not read much on this web site about all the insane spending your government does with your money. The amount spent helping the poor is a drop in the bucket compared to the amount these fat cats in power spend on themselves ( their homes, cars, airplanes, vacations, private chefs ,ect.) Come on ,the president is vacationing at Marthas Vineyard. Do you know the cost???? And YOU paid for it. Why don't we get pissed at those people THEY ARE THE ONES LIVING IN LUXURY ,HIGH ON THE HOG , on our god Damn dollars. These peons taking in the measly foodstamp benefit or what little cash they give are NOT THE ONES REALLY BILKIN the Damn system.

The "fat cats" in martha's vinyard pay for it with their own money. The 30 million people drawing a couple of hundred dollars a week adds up to 300 BILLION a year, across all the states. But what I hear you saying is that any wastage is trivial compared to some other segment of the economy.

Why not stop waste everywhere?

Originally posted by HauntWok
I have no issue with this. I think that people shouldn't be able to live their lives off of welfare. Why should I pay for a person to just sit around and do nothing their entire lives? Sure, people sometimes could use some help, and it should be there for people to receive help, but two years is a good amount of time to either train for a job, or find an adequate job to support ones self.

Yeah I would be envious of that too.

Originally posted by outandopen
To all the narrow thinkers....what do you suppose on should do with all the poor? I know you all think that jobs are abundant. Now a days even McD's is hard to get into. Did you know that families with parents working in fast food are on public assistance almost all the time. Same with that Walmart workforce. The MASS Majority of jobs in the USA do not pay a livable wage. So just because someone is on welfare doesn't mean they are lazy. In fact they probably work more jobs then you do. More hours and harder. They are sadder and worse off for it to. Yet they still qualify for welfare because their wages suck so bad. You go make a life off $7 an hour and feed you kids and pay the rent. Try it on $15 an hour I dare you. It is sad that the public opinion sees these people as losers. Go do some research and you might rethink your whole philosophy. This world is a greedy place. Yet a place were if all was shared and equal we would all still have enough. The fear of someone getting something you didn't reminds be of my 5 and 7 year old bickering. Juvenile. Like I tell my kids SHARE SHARE SHARE!!!
Hey governor say some uses up their 4 years and then 30 years later something happens and they need welfare....there going to be denied because of something that happened 30 years ago even if they paid into the system for 30 years in between that time. See what I mean by narrow minded. These politicians never think things through from all angles. Just the greed angle. Don't jump over a fence before first looking over the otherside.

I think these people feel that the problem will just go away. One half of the population has an IQ of 100 or less -- many are people who just can't make it in this society, the people in this thread seem to believe that the best for those people is Soylent Green. In reality this will not work out well. But we will buy a few more useless weapons.

reply to post by areyouserious2010



um....ya...

these are the things I think that I need to live...
a roof over my head...
a car, transportation.....sorry, no walking here!! used to walk, but them messed up my feet, then they got messed up more through lack of healthcare.....car, is needed, period!!
untilities, electricity, heat, water, ect...
food, a meal a day, at least......
healthcare!!
cigs, but that is irrelevant really, since I don't earn enough for the stuff I listed...
I make more than minimum wage, less than 10 dollars an hour, and this is based on a 40 hour workweek, although our slow period this year was about half a year, and well, we don't get 40 hours a week....
to me, affordable rent would be somewhere between a quarter to a third of my income....well....
sorry, can't find anything in that price range, not even a tiny efficiency in the crappiest part of town....
doubt if I could meet the rest of my needs if I could find it anyways....
luckily, I have a husband!!

but, my point is, no, you cannot live, at least not in my area of the country your can't, on less than $10 and hour.... your rent will take up half of it....

I will jump in here and say," Where have you people been?" There are 40 states that have welfare limitation statutes and 17 of them have less than 60 months. This is old old old news and i really cannot believe that no one here has even taken the time to look and see if this was a first or if this is just Michigan catching up.

TANF itself has a 5 year limitation to limit long term welfare abuse.


Here are some links to info about welfare limitations..

www.mdrc.org...

www.policyalmanac.org...

I live in Michigan and something needs to be done about the welfare abuse- this is a good start.

I see abuse everyday in Michigan and throughout the US (I travel nationwide for work).

I know couples who live together, have kids, make a family together but won't get married....why...so one of them can stay on welfare.

I see people at the grocery store wearing suits and paying for their groceries with bridge cards (food stamps) then walking out and getting into their Cadillac Escalade.

I know people who agree to work for cash at a lower wage so they can stay on welfare or unemployment.

I have talked with people who are always looking for a way they can sue someone/business to compensate their welfare checks, because they feel that they are entitled to more free money than the state can provide.

It goes on and on.

But I am not a heartless bastard, I do agree that there are people who do not want to be on welfare, they are embarrassed when people find out they are on it. Hopefully these people will fit into the categories that will extend their benefits until they can get back on their feet. Want to know who these people are that do actually need the benefits.....they won't be the ones at the capitol carrying signs, they won't be in the mobs you'll see the local media exploiting so they can get better ratings. The people that really need the benefits will be the people that you never see or hear about on the news because they still have pride and still want to make it on their own. The people that need help will eventually get back on their feet and they will do it faster with help from families, neighbors, church help and friends faster than with help from the state. State programs are not designed to help people out of a hole, they are designed to keep good people down.

Originally posted by TXRabbit
This is going to be an interesting story to watch, not only how the public reacts but also how it affects things such as crime, drug use, housing and social trends across some of the poorer areas in Michigan.

This isn't particularly unusual, several other states already have 5 year limits. The only difference with Michigan is they went with the slightly shorter term of 4 years versus 5.

Originally posted by TXRabbit
We all know that social entitlements cost tons of money (which WE pay for through taxes) but how come nobody is attacking the rich or corporate?

So you view this legislation as an "attack"? I don't see it that way, state governments around the country are finding themselves on the verge of bankruptcy and they have to act to reduce costs. They have to cut back on the biggest programs to make a difference, and these types of entitlement programs are at the top of the spending chart. And rest assured, they are going after corporations and the "rich" in the form of higher taxes as well. But they have to be very careful because too much additional tax burden will collapse the already struggling economy.

Originally posted by TXRabbit
That last question was more rhetorical, I know. They'd rather attack the poor because the poor have no chance of fighting back. They don't have teams of lawyers. They don't have lobbyists buying off officials. They don't have a voice.

The poor have a rather loud voice, and politicians really do not like having to sign legislation like this because they know they're going to get slammed for it. But they don't have a choice right now, it's either make hard decisions or face bankruptcy.

Originally posted by korath
I'll bet a lot of them just wait out the four years and then pack up and reapply in another state. Welfare benefits should have a nationwide limit.

Or perhaps get a gun and hone those predatory skills. It's gonna get ugly!

Originally posted by lpowell0627
The answer to all of this is simple:

There are no longer enough working people to pay all of those not working. Why can't people see the simple math in this?

Quite true. Here's a really sobering number, there are 112 million US taxpayers, and 45 million food stamp recipients (source). Now I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that roughly 0% of the food stamp recipients pay taxes, so we have a situation where every taxpayer is subsidizing half of a non-taxpayer's welfare. We can argue all day long about whether or not welfare recipients "deserve" welfare, but the bottom line is that these numbers are simply not sustainable. We've got to cut way back or our entire economy will collapse under this tremendous burden, and at that point NO ONE will be getting welfare. And we also need to hack and slash Medicare, Social Security, Defense, and the deficit. These are the "big ticket" items, and the only way we can get back on track is to make heavy cuts in these areas.

Originally posted by DankKing420
Of course it would be my state. o well itll be interesting to see if this will add to ever growing recall movement of snyder.

Yes and wish they would get on with it, at a time when our state has one of the highest unemployment rates in the country Snyder is going after those who can least afford it.

Hope those who voted for him are happy now.