Mich. governor signs 48-month welfare limit

Originally posted by beezzer
In 48 months, you can get an Associates, a Bachelors, find a job, start a business, invent and market something. . . . or just sit around and wait for a government check.

Personal responsibility.

haha well said....and agreed.....48 months is plenty of time....if i lost my 50K+ a year job I would work at two fast food restaurants to make ends meet....id do online surveys....id do anything i possible had to...but i wouldnt be waiting.

Originally posted by whaaa

Originally posted by Xcathdra


Welfare, when used as anything other than its intended use, is wealth redistribution hiding in plain sight.

Do you consider subsudies paid to oil companies, farmers, www.downsizinggovernment.org...
www.window.state.tx.us...

In effect welfare for the rich and redistribution of wealth to those already wealthy.

Much more fun to scapegoat the poor isn't it?

edit on 7-9-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)

Scapegoat whoever you want. To assume im for big tax breaks for business just reinforces my view that you dont really care to figure out where people stand, instead you just assume and all it does is makes you look like an ass.

Our entire tax system needs to be scrapped and redone. Welfare is not meant to be permanent, regardless of how you want to spin it. Making it permanent was never the intended goal of welfare.

When Maxine Waters states in her speech a few weeks back that welfare should be increased to people have more money to spend, in hopes of stimulating the economy, I looked for a desk to hide under. If all of our elected officals hold her view, then we are screwed.

The goal is to get people OFF welfare, not increase the amount they get.

You, as well as our elected officals, need to understand that baisc concept.

Click here for more information.

I know where they all will go when the welfare runs out . They will come to New York. The land of easy to get welfare forever. It's where they go from all over the country. This state has more welfare fraud than you can imagine.

Of course it will affect you. If you live in any state that enacts this sort of bill then chances are you'll get robbed. On the 1st of October your chances of being mugged, burgled, goes up by 10,000 to one. Actually it's more than 10,000 because some of those who get their benefits cut will turn to drug dealing to make ends meet, and the more addicts there are the more crime needs to be committed to support their habit.

That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. How can you be so ignorant? Do you really have such a poor view of Americans that get assistance that you really think that they will turn to crime, theft, robbery and assault?

You have a very limited and baseless view. Do you really believe the words you said? You are saying that welfare recipients are criminals getting a bribe from the government to not commit crime.

So many people on this thread "Id just work at a fast food restaurant or two"

You REALLY think its still that easy? you must not live in michigan.

so many people are trying your exact ideas that it doesnt work anymore, you better be high school age , and not even have a resume when you apply otherwise you're not getting that job these days.


and as said already even if you do find a "job" these days its most likely minimum wage, and good luck living off that, michigan barely has public transportation, and the cost of upkeep on the car to drive you to work alone can cost your minimum wage.

and before you flame I did go to school and got an IT degree in networking, I never found a new job, never got a call for an interview, and am now stuck paying $3-400 a month for student loans. To kick it all off, if I manage to get my foot into the IT industry just as tech support, I get to take a $3-4/hr pay cut!

College is such a solution isnt it?

And my current job is "temporary" so if I get fired im going to be on that welfare list with everyone else

Originally posted by Kitilani

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by illuminatislave

 

Of course.
If it were "easy" then no-one would be unemployed now. It'll take effort, but getting "paid" for 4 years just to look for a job sounds pretty darned nice. There may be an "ability" to work, but what may be missing is the "will".

Does it really sound nice? Do you really understand what a wonderful lifestyle being on welfare is? Do you envy it? Nothing is stopping you from giving up all you own, losing your automobiles, moving into subsidized housing, and living on mac and cheese. Go for it finally instead of always complaining how great it is for others. Go do it yourself. I look forward to many threads from you about how awesome being poor in America is.

"Mac and Cheese" you have no clue. My sister inlaws Fridg. is loaded with food stamp beef and anything else she wants less beer. They eat better or at least as well as most with jobs.

For pity's sake.

It's not the poor.
It's not the rich.

It's freaking WARS. We spend a billion dollars a day on wars. We train, train, train their people. We build schools, hospitals, new infrastructure; we provide medical care, and more training. We pay soldiers to be there, we pay for all the things necessary in war-making,trying to prevent entire nations of people from killing each other, in the hopes that some day it will prevent them from killing us.

What is wrong with you? And no I'm not talking about you petty "I saw someone in an Escalade at the welfare office", rediculously small minded people. I am talking to the actual thinkers.

It's like someone has terminal cancer, and they are dying. They know they can't do anything about it, so they go into massive denial and begin to blame the bunion on their foot.

"If I could just rid of this bunion, I'd be okay". They direct all their money and time to the pedicurist and podiatrist.

Isn't this what we are doing? We're floundering, trying to figure out how to preserve our tax dollars, and targeting the poor, as usual. What else is there?

Your tax dollars are not wasted on feeding dependent children. Your tax dollars are wasted on WARS.
This is the cancer you are not acknowledging .

reply to post by orbitbaby


Hmmm, lets see how this works. The State of Michigan has its own State Tax that is far too high and Unions that put a strangle hold on competitive business, causing companies to look for cheaper states or countries to do business in. This causes people to become unemployed and get on welfare. This then puts a burden on the state to pay for this welfare and the state then has to raise taxes to cover the outgoing welfare. If this is not a cause and effect situation I don't know what is.
Lower the taxes and dump the Mafia style Unions and business will return.

At first, I thought this was a good idea. I mean, hell, FOUR YEARS of sucking off the government tit should be ample time for ANYONE to achieve at least an Associates degree. But, the more I think about it, I'm a bit worried. These leeches will be fleeing Michigan to neighboring states now. They'll be going to states that love giving money to bums, and unfortunately, I live in Colorado that has John Hickenlooper as the Governor. Johnny boy loves giving money to bums. So, I'm afraid that even though this is excellent news for Michigan, the Michigan tax payer, and the Michigan budget, it's horrible news for people in the remaining 47 continental states. I just wish Obama had his bullet train already built from Detroit to Los Angeles, and these bums could be given a free pass to ride the rails to the Utopian society on the left coast.

So! if they pay Out less.
then they will need less.
so they can Drop the Tax
that pays for this. yes!
or is this just a way to raise tax?

Originally posted by beezzer
In 48 months, you can get an Associates, a Bachelors, find a job, start a business, invent and market something. . . . or just sit around and wait for a government check.

Personal responsibility.

Cant do any of that with a poor education

Originally posted by A-Dub
So many people on this thread "Id just work at a fast food restaurant or two"

You REALLY think its still that easy?

you must not live in michigan.

so many people are trying your exact ideas that it doesnt work anymore, you better be high school age , and not even have a resume when you apply otherwise you're not getting that job these days.


and as said already even if you do find a "job" these days its most likely minimum wage, and good luck living off that, michigan barely has public transportation, and the cost of upkeep on the car to drive you to work alone can cost your minimum wage.

and before you flame I did go to school and got an IT degree in networking, I never found a new job, never got a call for an interview, and am now stuck paying $3-400 a month for student loans. To kick it all off, if I manage to get my foot into the IT industry just as tech support, I get to take a $3-4/hr pay cut!

College is such a solution isnt it?

And my current job is "temporary" so if I get fired im going to be on that welfare list with everyone else

edit on 8-9-2011 by A-Dub because: (no reason given)

Student loan payments are based off income, just so you know. Friend of mine is over 100k dollars in student loan debt, and only makes the minimum 50 dollars a month payment because he makes under 20k a year(or around that figure). College is a good idea if you plan on entering a field that is in high demand. Public health, Engineering, business administration/finance; just to name a few.

What those fields all have in common is that they are very difficult compared to most other degrees. I started out in IT as well(networking, coincidentally), and it was ridiculously easy compared to my current major.

Unfortunately, completing the more difficult degrees take a lot of time dedicated to studying, and if you are already in your adult years and having to work for a living, then chances are you would not have enough time to balance graduate school and studies.

America ranks in the 20's out of the top 30 countries in math and science. We are behind most developed countries and even a surprising number of developing countries. Some of our social values are chasing the dollar, watching American Idol, playing xbox, and self-entitlement. Until values such as those shift, we will continue to graduate uneducated kids that are convinced the world revolves around them, and these same kids will be destined for flipping burgers or relying on welfare. Then these same people have kids and raise them with similar values. It is a sad cycle.

Go ahead and look at the job market, and you will notice plenty of jobs. The catch is, most of those jobs require a master level or higher education in fields that require a significant investment of time. The other catch is you will likely have to move to a city where your respective field is in high demand.

If you really want a job with decent pay and excellent security, and does not require a high level degree, then PLEASE go for nursing. The country is in desperate need of good nurses.

reply to post by beezzer


Starred brother, could not have said it any better. Maybe we will see a mass migration out of Michigan to Texas or another state with more opportunities. What ever happens Michigan needs to get business back into their state.

I applaud the Governor, and think he really wants whats best...you cannot say he is not doing what his base put him into office to do, very few would have the guts and morals to do what he is doing whether you agree or not...he is doing what his the people who elected him into office expects from him...

sniper

Originally posted by orbitbaby
This is going to be interesting. Michigan has one of the highest
unemployment rates in the country. Where are these people
supposed to get jobs?

Either McDonald's or go off grid. I prefer off grid living.

lol michigan i sense a racial protest in 3,2,1

Top corporations are sitting on MORE CASH than ever.

The "we have no money" chant on the TV News -- means; "we do not have the WILL to take the money."

We have the WILL to invade Iraq and Afghanistan under false pretenses. We have the WILL to covertly help some group in Libya overthrow YET ANOTHER TYRANT -- who is so awful, we used to pay him to torture our prisoners of war. LINK

WE approve torture -- and lying to invade a country. And LOOK -- it just so happens that Libya is the BEST place to get Oil in the Middle East that doesn't buy boat loads of weapons or want to keep trading in US dollars like our good friends in Saudi Arabia. THEY are not a tyranny, you see, because,... we are talking about Libya,... [cue people in nice suits sounding reasonable to explain it to us]. Libya TORTURES people, you know? Like the WMDs that Iraq USED to have because Donald Rumsfeld sold them to Saddam. See how evil Saddam was -- I mean Gaddaffy?

>> But getting back to the IMPOSSIBILITY of having money to pay for people NOT getting tortured or blown up... The rules of business are merely so that businesses can operate without destroying each other. Without a Federal Government -- you have no currency to trade and keep track of who gets what -- and without Law Enforcement, you can't penalize those who cheat, or have corporations sue each other over Patent disputes all day.

Don't you think it costs MORE money to fly someone to Libya and torture them than it does to give them Welfare or Unemployment benefits? MAYBE,, we could be really smart, and do a secret deal with Syria -- everyone who is really hard up, would pretend to join Al Qaeda -- the CIA would ship them to a camp in Syria (as usual), and when they got there, they'd just be let go. Syria would then split the money they get from the Black Ops budget with the "terrorist sympathizer" and the Hard Up American would keep their mouth shut.

A future conversation for Welfare POWs;

"Sure, we pulled out his fingernails and used a drill on his kneecap today...."

"We certainly appreciate your attention to detail and work ethic here at the CIA."

"No problem -- Mr. Homeless Guy was really forthcoming today -- and he informed us that Gaddaffy had spies everywhere."

"Um, Mr. Homeless used to live in Minnesota."

"Right. Gaddaffy had spies in Minnesota -- trailing Jessy Ventura."

[scribbles in pad]

But INSTEAD of addressing this problem, perhaps by raising the COST of unemployment insurance on corporations who pay almost no taxes (and in the case of some Oil and Banks -- get more BACK than they spend), the Koch Brother's Governor, decides to find another RULE to exclude people from the "limited cash."

We INCREASED costs of government by going to war and DECREASE revenue by giving away tax money to the top 2% -- of COURSE there is a revenue shortfall. Were businesses collapsing during the '90s? No? Then why did we trade reasonable prosperity, for "Oh my God -- the world is going to end!" Just so someone who already has a Lear Jet can have 3% more to put into his Chinese stock portfolio?

If we don't stand up for these people -- there won't be anyone left to stand up for us when we are kicked out of our homes. And unless you are a multi-millionaire and CONNECTED to the abusers of this system who receive Corporate Welfare -- don't kid yourself; YOU are on the menu.

Originally posted by DanUKphd
reply to post by TXRabbit

 

Personally- I have no problem with this bill as it does not affect me

Of course it will affect you. If you live in any state that enacts this sort of bill then chances are you'll get robbed. On the 1st of October your chances of being mugged, burgled, goes up by 10,000 to one. Actually it's more than 10,000 because some of those who get their benefits cut will turn to drug dealing to make ends meet, and the more addicts there are the more crime needs to be committed to support their habit.

>> I think I stumbled upon WHY we've had such an increase in kids getting recruited into Gangs across the USA; wherever Union's or the protections of average people are diminishing -- Gangs grow as a result.

Remember the movie; "Gangs of New York?" If the police don't protect you and you have no stuff worth stealing -- well, why not join a gang?

When I worked at a Trade Show in Los Angeles a couple years ago, a buddy I worked with "negotiated" with a local representative of the Crips so that "nothing would happen" to our gear -- and in fact, nothing was stolen. The gangs made sure that their members DON'T steal from companies that contracted for protection, and that they don't get fired by the company.

So, while if you go to Chicago, people MOAN about the Unions charging so much to do a trade show -- you go to LA -- you deal with the Crips or the Bloods, or your stuff goes missing and you might get mugged.


>> Treating working people as a bargain-basement commodity that can always be traded for the younger, cheaper model -- is GOING to result in desperation once it reaches a point. Is that really how we want to live?

I'm sure this is a wet dream for SOME people in power -- but I'm also sure, that there are plenty of successful people who DON'T want to hire private body guards with Uzis and hide behind armed estates to avoid having to ransom back their children on a regular basis as is common in a lot of third-world nations.

I live in Michigan.

I got a job last week. They are avaliable. I'm 17, and it took what, a month?

Originally posted by ladyinwaiting
For pity's sake.

It's not the poor.
It's not the rich.

It's freaking WARS. We spend a billion dollars a day on wars. We train, train, train their people. We build schools, hospitals, new infrastructure; we provide medical care, and more training. We pay soldiers to be there, we pay for all the things necessary in war-making,trying to prevent entire nations of people from killing each other, in the hopes that some day it will prevent them from killing us.

What is wrong with you? And no I'm not talking about you petty "I saw someone in an Escalade at the welfare office", rediculously small minded people. I am talking to the actual thinkers.

It's like someone has terminal cancer, and they are dying. They know they can't do anything about it, so they go into massive denial and begin to blame the bunion on their foot.

"If I could just rid of this bunion, I'd be okay". They direct all their money and time to the pedicurist and podiatrist.

Isn't this what we are doing? We're floundering, trying to figure out how to preserve our tax dollars, and targeting the poor, as usual. What else is there?

Your tax dollars are not wasted on feeding dependent children. Your tax dollars are wasted on WARS.
This is the cancer you are not acknowledging .

edit on 9/8/2011 by ladyinwaiting because: (no reason given)

I thought world war 2 got the USA out of the great depression?

Maybe it is WW3 TPTB want?