"Tea Party GOP Drives US Towards Catastrophic Default, World Panic"

reply to post by civilchallenger

The article you point out is really interesting, so thanks for bringing that up. However, I take serious issue with the interpretation of the following

Take a look at what I said in the second POST near the bottom.

Ms Maxwell's bias is very very obvious in the second article she wrote based on her poll. As a Quality Engineer with a passing knowledge of statistics and polls it makes me want to lose my lunch.

Shifting Support for Democratic Party among American Elderly

On the heels of the 2010 mid-term elections, the Diane D. Blair Center of Southern Politics and Society, together with Winthrop Rockefeller Institute, conducted a comprehensive online national poll of political attitudes and behaviors.

....
2012 Battlefield

Overall, the results of this survey indicate that the traditional base of support among older voters that Democrats have relied upon since the partisan realignment following the New Deal continues to weaken. While older voters continue to vote in high percentages, compared to younger cohorts, clear support for the Democratic Party is confined largely to African Americans. While older Hispanics generally favored the Democratic Party, they showed substantial willingness to vote for Republican Senatorial candidates in the 2010 midterm election.

Further, the traditional Democratic support among older Caucasians continues to decline, particularly among older Caucasians living in the South. If these trends continue, the 2012 presidential election will require the Democratic Party to continue to bring young, and often unreliable, voters to the polls. Further, the Democratic Party must continue to make inroads into the growing Latino/Hispanic population. If the GOP is able to maintain its grip on older voters in the South, that tend to not only vote at high rates, but are also overwhelmingly conservative, Republican and willing to support GOP candidates

the Democratic presidential campaign strategy will be forced to continue building winning coalitions without the assistance of most of the southern states. With growing populations and over one-third of the Electoral College votes needed to win the Electoral College, losing support among the elderly is an important trend that scholars must continue to monitor....

I understand where you are coming from and that is my view too. "Entitlement programs" aimed at a select ethnic group or color is extremely RACIST.

In the above quote Ms Maxwell even admits to the need of the Democratic Party to focus on BUYING the Latino/Hispanic vote:
"Further, the Democratic Party must continue to make inroads into the growing Latino/Hispanic population."

So much for the actual views on equality by the Democratic Party, it is all about BUYING VOTES!

reply to post by inforeal


I agree with everything you are saying, but at this time, with all the ignorance, I coming to the conclusion that default on all payments, first thing to shut off should be banking bailout.

First and most important is to make sure the funds are there to bring the troops home, SS and Medicare should be the next priority.

I hope our military is making preparations for withdraw of troops.

At this point in time, I am rooting for the default. I hope enough people in Washington have what it takes, and let this happen.

reply to post by rebeldog

1. Cut every single program that sends any money or aid to foreign nations!!
2. Do not send one dime to Africa, Israel, Haiti, etc...
3. Bring every foreign stationed troop home within 30 days. Shut down all foreign bases, plastic the furniture, drain water lines, lock them down and 'winterize' them.
4. Cut every form of 'entitlement' to anyone who can't verify a 3 generation lineage in america (bye, bye, anchor baby mama welfare)
5. Cancel all immigrant worker visa programs, give them all 30 days to go whence they came
6. shut down ALL FORMS of immigration. there are enough americans out of work to do every job available!!
7. reduce all the slime in DC to $50,000 a year salaries with strict expense accounting
8. PUT EVERY CEO on wall street in jail awaiting trial, every SEC supervisor too.
9. prosecute the cases Eliot Spitzer compiled (before he was destroyed by hookergate)
these above should be tried before anything else

I could go for this plan.

I would add,

Nationalize the banks
End all foreign ownership of U.S. land.
Property taxes on estates.
Property taxes on closed down plants. Identify the principle owners of the property at the time of plant closure, and hold them liable for the property, cost of cleaning up the property to make it suitable for sale.

Hopefully the DOW drops below 1,000 by the end of the year.

A thought just occurred to me.

Given Ron Paul's support from the military and elderly, ESPECIALLY given the loss of elderly support for the Democratic Party as noted in the above Article/poll I wonder if that was the reason behind Obama threatening to cut off the checks to the elderly and to the military - RETALIATION anyone???


Obama's not bluffing: Social Security and military checks are in danger

Why does the left keep saying tax the rich when GE paid 0 in taxes and in fact got $1.1 billion in tax benefits? Oh thats right, they were a big contributor to the Obama campaign. The rich already pay almost 33% in income taxes while the rest of us only pay 18.7% in income taxes. How about hitting up the other half of the country for their share of the tax burden since they aren't paying incomes.Likewise, alot of our representatives have been doing really well for themselves since they have been in office. I haven't heard not one of them on the left or right forfeit their income as our representatives to help with the debt crisis. If the government would quit spending money on stuff like wheelchairs for turtles, we would have the money to pay the bills. The left is using scare tactics by saying SS, disablility, and vet benefits won't get paid. In order for that to happen, these things listed better happen first; no foreign aid would go out, national parks would be closed, everyone in Washington wouldn't get a paycheck, Universities wouldn't get grants to study idiotic stuff like the effects of sex on freshman. I'm sorry liberals but if we cut spending and hold those accountable for wasting tax dollars, then we will have a balanced budget. If you give the government more money, they are just going to waste it. Its just like having a kid(the government) and give it $20 bucks(taxes), the kid(goverment) is more likely to blow it if they(government) know it can always come back to mommy and daddy(you and me the taxpayers) for more money. Can't get much simplier than that my friends.

reply to post by crimvelvet


I also agree with most of what you have said, but in this chart, I think you should look at some different years.

research.stlouisfed.org...
Monetary supply
1960-01-01 50.661,
1968-01-01 67.698,
1976-01-01 112.109,
1980-01-01 156.175,
1988-08-01 274.882,
1992-01-01 333.060,
2000-01-01 605.108,
2008-01-01 831.053,
2009-01-01 1711.661
2010-01-01 1994.818
2011-06-01 2648.005

www.dol.gov...
Min wage
JAN. 1, 1978 $2.65 for all covered, nonexempt workers
JAN. 1, 1979 $2.90 for all covered, nonexempt workers
JAN. 1, 1980 $3.10 for all covered, nonexempt workers
JAN. 1, 1981 $3.35 for all covered, nonexempt workers
APR. 1, 1990 $3.80 for all covered, nonexempt workers
APR. 1, 1991 $4.25 for all covered, nonexempt workers
OCT. 1, 1996 $4.75 for all covered, nonexempt workers
SEPT. 1, 1997 $5.15 for all covered, nonexempt workers

Gold
www.nma.org...
1960 35.27
1970 36.02
1977 147.84
1978 193.40
1979 306.00
1980 615.00
1981 460.00
1982 376.00
1990 383.51
2000 279.11
2005 444.74
2006 603.46
2007 695.39
2008 871.96
2009 972.35
2010 1,224.53

I don't have time to make comparisons, but clearly minimum wages earners have been screwed, most of whom are young people starting out, and students and such.

The boomers have done a good job of screwing over young people.

Just think of what college tuition fees look like.

The canard of the Tea Party and Republicans about the deficit is all propaganda. In-fact Bill Clinton easily balanced the budget in the 90’s by merely raising taxes on the rich that produced a surplus.

www.factcheck.org...

The huge tax cut for the rich by Bush in 2001 and his illegal and immoral Iraq war and his bailout of Wall Street in 2008 is the reason for the deficit now. He, Bush, ruined the economy after being left on economic solid ground.


Post by

Just the fact Man, Inforeal!

Originally posted by inforeal
The canard of the Tea Party and Republicans about the deficit is all propaganda. In-fact Bill Clinton easily balanced the budget in the 90’s by merely raising taxes on the rich that produced a surplus.

www.factcheck.org...

The huge tax cut for the rich by Bush in 2001 and his illegal and immoral Iraq war and his bailout of Wall Street in 2008 is the reason for the deficit now. He, Bush, ruined the economy after being left on economic solid ground.


Post by

Just the fact Man, Inforeal!

So the bailouts had nothing to do with the deficit then? Good to know.

Nor the collapse of the housing market, employment... all of which were taxed for revenues and were lost. . . . LoL I get your point but you are obsessed with taxing the so called rich.

I think you mean the wealthy that already posses a lot of things not those that are high earners.

If you want to really grab a lot of cash then raise the capital gains tax as that is where most of the wealthy folks keep their loot.

Seriously go to your graphs and see the disparity between capital gains income vs hourly/commission and then come back here with your raise income taxes BS.

reply to post by MasterGemini


Who said anything about raising taxes?

No you are wrong, remember, this is “just the facts man, inforeal” therefore I must say that Bill, (the democrat) Clinton and his repeal of the glass-steagel act also contributed to the overall economic problem. But precisely that relates to the bailout and the banksters looting of the treasury under Bush and the housing banking crises.

reply to post by wardk28

I haven't heard not one of them on the left or right forfeit their income as our representatives to help with the debt crisis.

What about Ron Paul???

Congressman Ron Paul is an original cosponsor on legislation proposed by Representative Harry Mitchell (AZ-5) to block Members of Congress from receiving the automatic pay adjustment scheduled to take effect in 2009.

“With all the waste going on in government, the dollar losing its purchasing power, the collapse of the housing bubble, the economy is really struggling. We Members of Congress should not be padding our pocketbooks when our constituents are tightening their belts,” stated Congressman Paul.

The bill was introduced yesterday and so far Congressman Paul is the only cosponsor. Congressman Paul famously returns a portion of his congressional office budget to the Treasury. He recently estimated he would be able to return $75,000 from last year’s office budget. He also refuses to participate in the lucrative pension program that Congress has awarded itself.
www.reasontofreedom.com...

reply to post by poet1b

I don't have time to make comparisons, but clearly minimum wages earners have been screwed, most of whom are young people starting out, and students and such.

Oh I very much agree with you and have done posts on that in the past. I was just trying to be a bit more brief - not one of my normal characteristics

How is this???

In 1976 A typical American CEO earned 36 times as much as the average worker. By 2008 the average CEO pay increased to 369 times that of the average worker. timelines.ws...

The CEOs are not about to get fleeced with the rest of us! Minimum wage to keep up with price inflation should be about $45.00/hr!

reply to post by inforeal

The huge tax cut for the rich by Bush in 2001 and his illegal and immoral Iraq war and his bailout of Wall Street in 2008 is the reason for the deficit now. He, Bush, ruined the economy after being left on economic solid ground.

It is a heck of a lot more complicated than that. It has been a long term plan by the CFR and CED, since WWII and before.

Regan's, Hostile takeovers of decent US companies was a good part of it. LINK

The real death blow, Clinton's Free Trade Agreements and his PRO-BANKING laws: LINK

ALL the idiotic wars from WWI on were also fabricated to siphon funds into the bankers pockets. Days of Infamy

If you would ever bother to really look you will see that Washington deserves to be called the District of Criminals. Traitors all with few exceptions.

LOOK at the chart please it shows the distribution of the tax burden and the individual is geting "Progressively" SCREWED!

TAX IMPORTS NOT WAGES!

Tax on imports = excise tax, see graph:

reply to post by crimvelvet


Oh come now, we all know Ron Paul isn't a real politician, with his crazy theories of following the constitution.

reply to post by wardk28

Oh come now, we all know Ron Paul isn't a real politician, with his crazy theories of following the constitution.

ROTFLMAO

That is a great come back
(Now I have to clean my computer screen)

I believed that Ron is a good guy at heart. But all he is thinking now is only a narrow view - politics. I also believe the tea party truly thinks that they are acting on the interest of the whole, but they also have another narrow view - taxes.

The debt problem is far more larger than any specific view, for its impact will be akin a comet hitting earth. Politics, economics and socialogy, which WILL affect our daily life should the wrong decision be made.

Let's look at these 2 analogies, relevant in our world at these times.

1. If a clerk earning only $2000 a mth, somehow chalks up debts to $100k through multiple credit loans, there is a high chance that there is NO way he can pay off that debt, and may commit detrimental stuff. Let a human live. Better the banks write off that 'investment'. Human lives are more precious than money, and the bank should bear responsibility for giving such unconscionable loans in order to make money. This is an analogy of city states such as greece and ireland.

2. If a professor of economics earning $10k/mth and chalks up debts to $1million, he would be able to pay it back, because of his profession, which can ensure he can earn it back either in public or private sector. What he needs is time, and someone who believes in him, and as an act of charity based on his sincerity to pay off the loan, to avoid harrassment by other mainstream standard pricing creditors, focus on his job, and in time, pay back that amt of charity which means below standard loan rates. It would be a waste if he commits suicide when he can contribute further to society due to loan harrasment, This professor is USA.

There can never be a 'one size fits all' solutions to any problems. Each have to be carefully considered and acted upon.

USA is a huge nation with human and resource capital to repay those loans as well as to honestly use the time in between to fix structural faults in the system to ensure it would not happen again to this or the next generations.

If that loan is not taken, it will be USA committing suicide, akin to germans in 1918 whom had to pay massive reparations debt for WW1. We knew how that turned out - end of democracy, rise of dictatorship by opportunists, suffering of the masses and almost end of humankind later.

This is not fear mongering, but only facts that had happened before when a great nation defaults, and will happen again if we do not look beyond single problems, partisan politics, and self interest. With our current high tech level in accelerated reponse WMDs as reactions by both creditors and debtors come pay up time, it will only be mths and not years when everything will be over. No humankind or living species will left on earth. This is how serious the matter is.

We are annonymous. We are legion. We all fight for the right of humanity to exist in peace, prosperity and equality. This fight had long began, but at this crucial period, is the critical debt to be undertaken, and accepted beginning with you and me, and later to EVERYONE in our social network beginning with the closests. We came into this world with nothing, and will leave with nothing anyway. Debt is but only money, along with legislation which over time what is lost or not correct can be earned back and corrected. But precious human lives once lost, is gone forever....Time is no longer on our side...

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by inforeal

 

*yawn*
Blaming the Tea Party for the financial mess we're in is about as effective as blaming the fork and spoon for a lousy meal.

It's pathetic, seeing the left run around placing blame for Obama's over-spending and poor mis-management of the economy on everyone BUT the person responsible.

Indeed. Almost as equally pathetic as Republicans calling themselves part of the 'tea arty' and pretending that they have not contributed greatly to our current spending situation, while attempting to lay all the blame solely at the feet of the Democrats.

reply to post by inforeal


In regards to the headline, spoken like a true socialist loving democrat. By pushing this debt ceiling higher, you are delaying the inevitable burst of the financial bubble initially created with the Bush stimulus. Its going to happen. The thing is, the longer we put it off, the worse it will be for us poor folk. All the preaching and drumming going on in washington is for the benefit of the rich to stay rich and the government to stay in dictatorship.

Originally posted by GeorgiaGirl
The Tea Party agenda has nothing to do with "no taxes for the rich". That's absurd. I'd sum up the agenda as more like "stop spending so much money and then trying to fix it by raising taxes". or "stop mortgaging our nation's future by spending us into bankruptcy".

Really? So which members of the tea party have been pushing to bring the troops home from that incredibly expensive and unconstitutional war in Afghanistan besides Ron Paul?

How ANYONE can still pretend the vast majority of those under the 'tea party' banner are not just the same old republicans as always is beyond me.

It's as pathetic as those people who vote for Democrats thinking they are anti war. Get a freaking clue!

The 'tea party' for the most part is nothing more than a whitewash for the GOP to pretend they are not the EXACT SAME #ING PEOPLE who got us into these #ing wars in the first place!

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds

Originally posted by GeorgiaGirl
The Tea Party agenda has nothing to do with "no taxes for the rich". That's absurd. I'd sum up the agenda as more like "stop spending so much money and then trying to fix it by raising taxes". or "stop mortgaging our nation's future by spending us into bankruptcy".

Really? So which members of the tea party have been pushing to bring the troops home from that incredibly expensive and unconstitutional war in Afghanistan besides Ron Paul?

How ANYONE can still pretend the vast majority of those under the 'tea party' banner are not just the same old republicans as always is beyond me.

It's as pathetic as those people who vote for Democrats thinking they are anti war. Get a freaking clue!

I believe it's true that many (most?) of the people who consider themselves "tea partiers" are conservatives who vote Republican. I'm actually a Libertarian, but I vote Republican (lesser of 2 evils). I'm not really sure who you think is pretending that the tea partiers are not Republicans. HOWEVER, we are not "the same old Republicans", as you categorized us.

Guess what...many of us tea partiers are also critical of George Bush's decisions and policies. The difference between tea partiers and "the same old republicans" is that we know the current path our country is on is unsustainable. And this has been the case for more than just the Obama years.

I didn't mention troops in my earlier response. Again, guess what....I am a HUGE fan of bringing the troops home.