"Tea Party GOP Drives US Towards Catastrophic Default, World Panic"

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by incrediblelousminds

 

I'm old enough. i am also old enough to remember what carter did to us and the savings and loan failure as well. At what point do you say enough and stop the spending? At what point? Really, that is the whole crux of the matter. If you don't draw the line in the sand it will never change. Sometimes doing nothing gets attention, as it has the Tea Party. Everyone is so afraid their entitlement will get cut that they are not willing to force our reps to do the right thing and reign in spending. They will cause the collapse by increasing the debt anyway.

Not raising the debt ceiling is not the way to address spending. That is like setting your house on fire because the foundation needs repair. Now you have no house to live in!

If the tea party is ACTUALLY concerned about spending, they would present REAL solutions, not just pander to social conservatives who want to see cuts to social infrastructure (or think they do) while ignoring how much we spend on foreign wars, and in pork barrel subsidies to multinational corporations.

reply to post by incrediblelousminds


I don't mean to drag this on, but...you do realize that the 87 freshmen got elected by their majority because they opposed raising the debt ceiling, right? So in my book that reflects the will of the people. So you have to cut spending...immediately...and thereby you evade default. It's no different than running your home or a business. Yes you sometimes need credit or a loan. But making it a lifestyle so you can spend more than you make is ludicrous.

reply to post by haarvik


But again, you are conflating cutting spending and not raising the debt ceiling. YES, spending should be cut. NO, we should not set the entire government into default in order to achieve that.

Originally posted by inforeal
reply to post by crimvelvet

 

If you have read any of my threads, then you would have known I denounce Obama more than I even denounce the Tea party!

I believe that Obama is a puppet and slave of the Bankster NWO agenda.

edit on 23-7-2011 by inforeal because: (no reason given)

Bush was a puppet of the rich and famous !!! you did not see reality man !!
Bush was the man to give famous tax cuts to the rich and famous ....
now your government has not the money to spend !!!
and you would like the poor to pay for the rich ???? you are a right wing man !!
you are a poor little human being, no human solidarity you only live for the rich and wealthy, but the poor children and families you never care about !!!!
Tea Party people are just innocent people MANUPULATED and not knowing the difference between fascism and democracy !!! you see, kind of prehistoric consciousness ....
Poor USA !! Poor Obama !! remember those nice guy Cheney ?? Rumsfeld ?? Rove ?? Puppet Bush ??
NO ??? So you are a little bit out of focus man !!!
of course, debt is NOT Obama's fault, debt is Reagan, and Bush !!! why do the rich have to pay less to the country they live in because big presents of Bush ???? And the money comes from where then ?? from the poor ??? Stupid USA, if the rich do not pay for their country any longer, who will pay ???
who did send troops to Iraq ??? Obama ? who did send troops to Afga ?? Obama ?? who has to look for solutions now ?? Yes Obama !! look at it the way it is, not the way they tell you man !!

reply to post by Sunlionspirit


Well, if the Democrats hadn't forced socialist programs on us, then we wouldn't have had to worry about the cuts now would we? Now we have a $14T debt which will go up another $1.7T in 2 years to pay for Nobamacare. So yes, we will be back at the dinner table yet again to pay for the liberal socialist programs that suck the life giving money from hard working Americans! If I could keep what I earn instead of "spreading" it around, I would have more to spend, which means I could buy more, which means more demand for products, which means more demand for labor, which means more jobs!

reply to post by haarvik

so man you do not like social programs ???
nice to hear it ! no solidarity, just you and the State, just you and YOUR BIG welfare !!
who pays for hospitals ? who pays for security ? who pays for prisons ? who pays for the US children ?
who pays for police ?? who pays for firemen ??
not you ?? you just pay for yourself, oh go to hell man !!
I want really your house to burn down and you loose your job !!! maybe then you will understand what it is all about !!
ok ? I am tired of those rich stupid guys not wanting to play solidarity !!
go to hell with your capitalist system, drink your tea in your garden and look at the world going down because of no human feeling left !
where is your solidarity ??
where is your human behaviour ?
have a rest, come back after your dreams came thrue !! No offense but angry anyway !
But I am European, big difference no ?

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by inforeal

 

*yawn*
Blaming the Tea Party for the financial mess we're in is about as effective as blaming the fork and spoon for a lousy meal.

It's pathetic, seeing the left run around placing blame for Obama's over-spending and poor mis-management of the economy on everyone BUT the person responsible.

I personally hope we do "default". Giving Obama a higher debt ceiling is like raising the D.U.I. limit to curb drunk driving.

you do not understand half of the half of the half of the half of the problem man !!
Reagan is the beginning of the problem and Bush with his tax cuts for the rich and wealthy and the war in Iraq and the one in Afga was the one who did diminish State INCOME money !!!
I think you up there do not really understand a lot about it !!!
Poor USA !
You better read a bit more about history ! then you would understand maybe, you Bush lovers !

you know, I am a little bit right wing because here in Europ we do not like islam to come and disturb our society ok ? BUt I am also a big anti-capitalist one because I do not want corporate power to run our world or Bush puppets # on my grass !!! But I like Obama, because he is IN reality, not outside ! he protects our system, not the one of the rich and famous, not the tea party stupids, not the billionaires world without taxes but only profit !!
take it or leave it, but you live now in reality or in dream/neverland !!!

reply to post by haarvik


SO now your claim is that this entire debt is solely the result of Democrats?

Seriously?

reply to post by incrediblelousminds


Easy, it started with FDR, LBJ expanded on it and so has every other democrat. Welfare, Food stamps, Nobamacare, social security just to name a few. prior to the great social experiment, society as a whole actually took care of their own. Old people didn't go to nursing homes, they lived with their children until they passed away. Remember the great depression history? People helped each other. It's how it is supposed to be. The government providing for it's citizens is what has led us to the brink of communism. Hatred of those who have more than you, blaming everyone else for your station in life. Life isn't fair, we are not born equal. Get over it. Move on and stop trying to babysit and provide for the world. let free enterprise and capitalism work the way it was intended to.

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by incrediblelousminds

 

Easy, it started with FDR, LBJ expanded on it and so has every other democrat. Welfare, Food stamps, Nobamacare, social security just to name a few. prior to the great social experiment, society as a whole actually took care of their own. Old people didn't go to nursing homes, they lived with their children until they passed away. Remember the great depression history? People helped each other. It's how it is supposed to be. The government providing for it's citizens is what has led us to the brink of communism. Hatred of those who have more than you, blaming everyone else for your station in life. Life isn't fair, we are not born equal. Get over it. Move on and stop trying to babysit and provide for the world. let free enterprise and capitalism work the way it was intended to.

yeah man, time evolves and capitalist system makes it less human and then you blame the poor ???
blame the rich greedy ones man !
come on, you work hard ? you pay for the poor ? you never pay solidarity with the children dying in Somalia ?
sure not even for the ones dying in USA ??
ok, ok, I wish your children the same ok ? no healthcare, no money for doctor, no future !
Go lick the a... of Bush and Cheney, they love children dying in this world !!
have a nice evening in your private saloon world with no taxes to pay !!!
let the poor pay in your place !!! Have a beer, go to hell !

reply to post by haarvik


So your contention is STILL that Democrats are SOLELY responsible for the current financial issues in this country Yeah, that doesnt sound blatantly partisan or anything.

Originally posted by incrediblelousminds
reply to post by haarvik

 

So your contention is STILL that Democrats are SOLELY responsible for the current financial issues in this country Yeah, that doesnt sound blatantly partisan or anything.

he will not respond man ! he is asleep and well, he did drink too much tea !!! lol
may he go to the big tea party, the one in hell !
you know, here in Europe we get very angry against capitalist system ! corporatism with all the power in their hands !! this makes us sick and conscious about the real confrontation in this sick world ! Love and peace anyway.
Anyway : Monsanto GMO and Tea Party brain manipulations : = just the same !!! lollollol but true !

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by incrediblelousminds

 

I don't mean to drag this on, but...you do realize that the 87 freshmen got elected by their majority because they opposed raising the debt ceiling, right?

They got elected for what? I do not even recall hearing any of them mention the debt cieling, let alone run on not raising it. Can you back that up with say...anything?

Originally posted by haarvik
reply to post by Sunlionspirit

 

Well, if the Democrats hadn't forced socialist programs on us, then we wouldn't have had to worry about the cuts now would we? Now we have a $14T debt which will go up another $1.7T in 2 years to pay for Nobamacare. So yes, we will be back at the dinner table yet again to pay for the liberal socialist programs that suck the life giving money from hard working Americans! If I could keep what I earn instead of "spreading" it around, I would have more to spend, which means I could buy more, which means more demand for products, which means more demand for labor, which means more jobs!

What socialist programs are you talking about? Are you saying healthcare reform that has not gone into effect cost 14 Trillion dollars? We were in great shape when Obama took office, then healthcare, then this? Maybe you should take a look at what Bush's nonfunded medicare D, two wars, and tax cuts actually did to that number. Come back with some data and see if your rant still makes any sense.

reply to post by Sunlionspirit

Bush was a puppet of the rich and famous !!! you did not see reality man !!
Bush was the man to give famous tax cuts to the rich and famous ....

Oh good grief!
The whole mess started with Wilson and Aldrich, a Democrat and a Republican, and we have had NOTHING but TRAITORS in Washington DC for the last hundred years with the exception of FOUR men. Lindbergh, McFadden, Patman and Gonzalez.

Have you any idea of WHY we have taxes????

...Given the previous hyperinflation, clearly there was ample reason for currency revulsion. So you can consider this argument a necessary but not sufficient precondition.

What makes the universal acceptance stick is that government accepts its own money to expunge liabilities to it. In plain English, fiat money has value because it is the only money you can use to pay taxes.

....The fact that this money is also the medium of exchange only entrenches its use. So the tax liability is a necessary pre-condition for fiat currency to work, something I will return to....
www.creditwritedowns.com...

No wonder Amendment 16 - Status of Income Tax Clarified was Ratified 2/3/1913, a couple months after the Federal Reserve Act.

And to make sure the fiat money STUCK Roosevelt made it illegal for US citizens to own gold and GAVE the gold to the PRIVATE bankers who shipped it out of the country!


The Socialist hero of the "New Deal" had a new deal alright THEFT of the wealth of an entire nation!

Originally posted by Jezus

Originally posted by poet1b
The fault lays squarely on all the morons who continue to support free market economics after they have been proven to fail so consistently.

What do you mean fail?

They did exactly what they were meant to do.

Centralize social power and physical resources.

Create a smaller plutocracy and a larger under class.

People seem to forget that "the rich" and "the government" have always been one group.

Originally posted by RRokkyy
The Rich are the Government.

The Rich is the Military, Pharmaceutical, Prison industrial complex paid
for by the middle class and poor.
Imperialist wars and drug wars
butter their bread.

How come it is ALWAYS the fault of the Republicans but mention a Democrat and his feces don't stink according to the Libs who quickly jump to the defense.

How come EVERYONE ignores the fact that Bill Clinton was elected in 1992, NAFTA,the North American Free Trade Agreement, was ratified in 1993, the World Trade Agreement was ratified in 1995 And Clinton worked HARD to bring China into the WTO.

China joins the WTO - at last
...The key turning point came in November 1999, when the United States and China signed a trade deal that was narrowly endorsed by the US Congress....

Now OBAMA has place the SAME "Free Market Traitors who served under Clinton in charge of the USA "Economic recovery"

Obama has reshuffled his staff, bringing in a trio of free trade advocates ...
.... as head of the National Economic Council, Obama brought in Gene Sperling, who held the same position in the Clinton administration. ... Chief of Staff ... the president brought in the former mayor's brother, William Daley, a former Clinton administration official and banker. And to top it off, General Electric CEO Jeffery Immelt was tapped to lead a newly created Council on Jobs and Competitiveness.
[BARF GAG cv]

..... Sperling worked behind the scenes to secure the passage of the North American Free Trade Agreement.

"He supported fundamentals of the Clinton administration policies which were really wrongheaded," Dean Baker, co-director of the liberal Center for Economic and Policy Research, told The Washington Post.

...Sperling ...as working on China’s entry into the World Trade Organization, an event which caused millions of manufacturing jobs in U.S. to be permanently lost.

Sperling also played a major role in repealing the Glass-Steagall Act, which separated commercial and investment banking. Many observers credit the act’s repeal with causing the financial crisis that brought the economy to its knees.

Daley too was instrumental in the passage of NAFTA and China’s entry into the WTO. ..., he served as a special council to the president. His only responsibility during that time was ensuring that the trade deal passed.

After delivering the trade pact that cost America 20 percent of its manufacturing jobs in just 14 years, Daley moved on to serve as Clinton’s Commerce Secretary from 1997-2000. During that time, he helped pave the way for China’s entry into the WTO....



Immelt, .... has consistently supported the same failed trade policies that have cost America millions of jobs. As the leader of one of the world’s largest companies, he has been at the forefront of the outsourcing movement.

“You would have difficulty finding a company that has outsourced more jobs and closed more American factories than GE,” Scott Paul, Executive Director of the Alliance for American Manufacturing writes....

... Immelt was a vocal supporter for China’s entry into the World Trade Organization. He also spoke out against the proposed “buy American” provision.

Immelt, Daley and Sperling certainly do not represent the “change” the president was fond of referring to in 2008. In fact, all three represent more of the same - failed trade policies that result in the loss of millions of jobs. www.economyincrisis.org...

CAFTA was ratified on July 27, 2005 by Bush and Reagan was responsible for the leveraged buyout feeding frenzy. So they were just as much at fault

reply to post by incrediblelousminds

Many who claim to be part of the 'teaparty' caucus have, yes.

Many are just old school Republicans looking to cash in on constituents short memories.

Unfortunately for them many people have woken up and are paying a lot closer attention to the shenanigans in DC.

That worked in the past but now there is the internet and an economic crisis - different ballgame.

Originally posted by poet1b
reply to post by civilchallenger

 

From your own source.

Under the hero of free market repubs everywhere, under that silver tongued con artist Reagan!

U.S. Gov debt tripled, over a 300% increase.

And Reagan being a con artist makes Clinton less of an idiot how? Oh, it doesn't. I just proved that the budget was not impressive in any way under Clinton. The budget being even less impressive under Reagan does not take away from the facts.

You, and the tea bagger wackos you support, are calling for more of the same that tripled our nations debt, while complaining about an increase in debt under Clinton, of less than 30%.

Tea baggers are people who oppose the tea party's idea of less government debt. And yes, they are wackos because they seem to want the USA to be converted into a 3rd world country through anti free market policies.

So if you really cared about U.S. debt, then you would choose the policies that reduced the debt in relation to GDP, higher taxes for the rich, and stronger regulation of the economy.

Wrong, because the problem with US debt is excessively high government spending, not excessively low taxes. Clearly you don't know that Federal, state, and local governments spend a total of 47% of all money spent inside the US according to USdebtclock.org Look it up! Should people have their money stolen from them to support wars and aggression, and fake charity programs that don't really do much for poor people, regardless of how rich they are. (Fake in that the people run them live like kings while everyone else suffers.) No.

And you're right, I don't care as much about the US debt very much any more because I've resolved not to pay any of it. The hardcore statists like you can pay my share for me since you like taxes so much. No facts are on your side for crushing free market policies. I've never seen a single study suggesting a policy contrary to the free market way of doing this results in an improvement. Lets see your non-existent evidence against the free market, poet.

Originally posted by civilchallenger
Tea bagger are people who oppose the tea party's idea of less government debt. And yes, they are wackos because they want the USA to be converted into a 3rd world country through anti free market policies.

Oh, you get to just make stuff like that up do ya?
Who are these Tea Baggers you refer to that oppose the Tea Party? Can you point me to a webpage or something? I am pretty sure you just made that up. It was bad enough they called themselves Teabaggers but to try and turn around and pretend they never did is just cowardly.

"Teabag them before they teabag us" -original Teabagger chant

Originally posted by Jezus

Originally posted by poet1b
The fault lays squarely on all the morons who continue to support free market economics after they have been proven to fail so consistently.

What do you mean fail?

They did exactly what they were meant to do.

Centralize social power and physical resources.

Create a smaller plutocracy and a larger under class.

People seem to forget that "the rich" and "the government" have always been one group.

Originally posted by RRokkyy
The Rich are the Government.

The Rich is the Military, Pharmaceutical, Prison industrial complex paid
for by the middle class and poor.
Imperialist wars and drug wars
butter their bread.

Originally posted by crimvelvet
How come it is ALWAYS the fault of the Republicans but mention a Democrat and his feces don't stink according to the Libs who quickly jump to the defense.

I agree, the democrats allowed this to happen as well.

They simply give the masses the illusion that someone is fighting for them.