The Undebunkable Video: Eliminate The Impossible

This is basically the Hard evidence that 9/11 was an inside job, When will people except the hard scientific facts, It is about time people realise what their government are prepared to do, and what lengths they will go to do it.

Originally posted by kro32
Nobody has ever answered why they would go through all the trouble to stage 9/11 and at such great risk to exposure when something far simpler would have achieved the same results.

Why would the government go through all this trouble and complexity just for an excuse to invade Iraq or pass the Patriot Act when a simple plan would have acheived the exact same results with a far less risk of something going wrong?

A single Al-Quieda man setting off a dirty bomb or something along those lines would have given America all the reason they needed.

If the government asked you to create something that would mobilize the American people is 9/11 what you would come up with? There are 1000 different things that have to go perfectly right for this to be pulled off. The amount of people with knowledge is far too large for comfort.

Look at the history of government cover-ups and how successful they were.

Gulf of Tonkin, Johnson couldn't even keep one little bombing incident secret and it was leaked through the pentagon papers.

Bay of Pigs. A disaster by Kennedy that didn't involve nearly the complexity of a 9/11 operation, totally blown

Watergate, Nixon couldn't even hide 2 people stealing files yet our government is gonna pull off something involving 4 jetliners and 100's of people?

Get serious and look at the big picture. Alot of people get hung up on details and do not see the forest through the trees.

What you and almost everyone who dis-believes that it was a government planned and military executed event, is that these buildings HAD to come down, they were falling apart due to galvanic decomposition. With the aluminum siding and the metal substructure and the electricity running through them, they were like an anode and a cathode, decomposing at a very rapid rate. There was a construction company brought in to estimate the repairs, they would have had to put up scaffolding around both buildings all the way to the top and rework all the rivets and windows. There was a ton of asbestos inside them that would need to be removed. They were not up to code and it was estimated to be about 5.6 billion dollars to rework the both of them. This estimate was made in 1985 or so. I can not remember now the construction company but the records were destroyed and the construction company was threatened into silence. So, we have 2 buildings which will fall if not repaired, and the Bush administration and the world elite needed an event to justify war. Let's see, what is more likely to be true?

Insert your deductive reasoning here___________________.

Originally posted by nyk537
reply to post by TupacShakur

 

Don't derail your own thread my friend.

If you want discussion then discuss whatever is brought up. Swatting away comments that don't align with what you want will get you nowhere.

Try to stay focused.

he isn't derailing his thread one bit...He actually was attempting to bring the thread back on track to all the evidence he posted and having THAT be the TRACK of HIS thread I don't see how wanting to focus on that is in any way de-railing his own thread?

Also to KRO...because something is "complex" doesn't make it impossible or impractical. In fact I could just as easily argue that the intent was for complex over simple because they knew people like you would come and debunk the hardest evidence possible SIMPLY because you think its too much effort...this SAME through process is just as bad as what you are accusing "truthers" and the OP of...just in the opposite direction...while they are focusing on details you are ignoring them and that puts YOU on the other end of that spectrum...

reply to post by TupacShakur

What about putting a theory to the test using an experiment is useless? Would it be better to not test NISTs theory and just take their word?

Yes, when the theory is that the material may inlcude a combination of unknown contributors then the only appropriate "experiment" would be to include all possible materials in all possible permutations and every possible temperature within a very large range - in other words you can't design an experiment that would eliminate all possibilites.

Originally posted by TupacShakur
reply to post by heineken

 

you must unite and protest until you get the truth...no more no less

go to the streets and demand the truth

Like these people?:

People ARE protesting, you just don't see it on mainstream media outlets because they're controlled.

edit on 20-7-2011 by TupacShakur because: To edit my post

no..fail..

like these people



Blood for truth...not for oil

Well there is all the evidence you need OP.

I look forward to the lawsuit and shakeup in Washington your undebunkable evidence will bring.

Originally posted by kro32
Have you ever thought in your head about what you would do if the government asked you to create an event that would trigger the Iraq war and the Patriot Act without getting anyone involved caught? Serioiusly sit down and think about it and tell me if you would have come up with something as intricate as 9/11.

Think about how you would start going about this. How many people are you going to have to contact to be involved on all levels for this to work. How are you going to begin contacting them and making sure they don't leak your plan. What are your security concerns.

Not one single person other than terrorists have been connected with this and the only proof people have is things like what color the molten metal is.

The odds of this actually happening with no one getting caught are astronomical. But as I said I won't argue your guy's proof so i'll just have to leave it at that.

Thanks for the lively debate though

Actually... if YOU think about it...

a few people highly trained in not getting caught is all it would take. You can see events like this happen all of the time. It's called a movie. Everyday on tv shows criminals do stuff that never get pieced together, or maintain the secrecy until the end of the show. Go watch Lucky Number Sleven for one good example. It's a movie involving a HUGE detailed plot that doesn't clear up until the end, and only involves 2 key players.

Originally posted by kro32
Did you read my post?

I debunked the whole thing by declaring it implausible that the government would do such an extreme thing when something simple would have worked. This is the main reason why it probably wasn't a government plan.

I also mentioned that getting hung up on things you can't explain is not looking at the whole picture. I've seen a tornado wipe out every house on a block except for one bathroom wall that had shelves and those shelves had knickknacks and those knickknacks didn't move a milimeter.

Can you explain that?

Neither can I but it doesn't prove a conspiracy of any sort it just means that sometimes in crazy situations there are things that don't make sense. Because that one wall was standing is no evidence that that the tornado was staged.

This is exactly what truthers are guilty of. Focusing on the knickknacks on that bathroom wall.

The OP's point, which you seem determined to avoid, is that the government's fairy tale concocted in a failed attempt to explain what happened is not only implausible but impossible. The OS neither explains the event nor identifies the perpetrators. It merely perpetuates a mystery and allows the controllers of the government's activities to point its finger in whatever direction is most expedient for their agendas.

I agree with the OP that your post is off-topic and a deflection of the real issue being presented by the OP.

The OP has done a credible job of highlighting the flaws in the OS and showing, once again, that something stinks in the halls of power. 9/11 needs an independent open-minded investigation as to all its elements including motive, opportunity, and method. Who-what-when-where-how-why.

Are you one of the legion of pointless debunkers whose goal is to perpetuate the mystery or are you interested in discovering the truth?

people compare the government being involved in other events, Bay of Pigs, Tonkin, Watergate, etc... and say that because they were caught then, they would be caught now... especially with the advent of the internet and peoples access to information

however,they fail to note that the government has a huge interest in disinformation and cyberwarfare

this is why we have 'nutjobs' that are saying it was aliens or particle weapons from space that caused the buildings to colapse

rather than trying to hide the evidence that they left behind, they add false theories purposefully so to cloud the whole issue and make anyone that disagrees with the OS seem a bit crazy...

just my opinion of course, but the trail leads me to believe that they not only knew 9/11 was going to happen, they hastened it, ensured more damage/destruction, and used this event to further their agenda

PNAC says it all

Originally posted by CeeRZ
Very well put together. Thank you. I can understand both sides of the argument - but have progressively leaned towards the conspiracy. This thread has added to that progression. In regards to the question of why or how the government would do something like this without the truth coming out.... No, I don't think the gov could cover up something this large.... which is why there are so many holes... and why there is so much proof and speculation about it being an inside job. And for why? As others have stated - war. oil. politics. money. power. Who knows why the government does half the things they do.
And at the same time, the honest person inside me wants to continue wondering how and why....because it is too appalled at the scale of what I consider betrayal.

I like the way the OP focused his presentation on showing why the scenario painted by the OS is impossible rather than on whether or not it was a conspiracy. It seems to me that this is the proper focus. Show that the OS is impossible, that it explains nothinhg, and that this establishes a sufficient and compelling basis for a fresh, independent, fully funded investigation.

reply to post by hooper


ys light..

to drink a six pack and remain with your six pack dude


my point is quiet simple man...

youtube videos are pointless..

you have been attacked by your government..attack back cowards

thats my point

reply to post by dubiousone

I agree with the OP that your post is off-topic and a deflection of the real issue being presented by the OP.

I'm sorry but the respondents question is the first and only hurdle that needs to be cleared before any further discussion can even be considered.

You may present the most elaborate, detailed forensic study - repleat with Youtube videos galore, quotes of incredulity from persons with initials after their names and plenty of photos with arrows, circles and markings but they don't amount to a hill of beans if you can't explain why you think your neighbor burnt down your house in order to get his cat out a tree.

Originally posted by kalisdad
people compare the government being involved in other events, Bay of Pigs, Tonkin, Watergate, etc... and say that because they were caught then, they would be caught now... especially with the advent of the internet and peoples access to information

however,they fail to note that the government has a huge interest in disinformation and cyberwarfare

this is why we have 'nutjobs' that are saying it was aliens or particle weapons from space that caused the buildings to colapse

rather than trying to hide the evidence that they left behind, they add false theories purposefully so to cloud the whole issue and make anyone that disagrees with the OS seem a bit crazy...

just my opinion of course, but the trail leads me to believe that they not only knew 9/11 was going to happen, they hastened it, ensured more damage/destruction, and used this event to further their agenda

PNAC says it all

Those interested in moving forward toward uncovering the truth of what occurred on 9/11 really need to quit referring to the core of the problem in amorphous terms like "the government". That leads nowhere and just contributes to the contiunuing confusion, deflection, and deception.

"The government" is a huge organization consisting of countless agencies, departments, lines of authority, commissioners, officers, and worker beess, the vast majority of whom are just as interested in the truth as we are.

Originally posted by kro32
Nobody has ever answered why they would go through all the trouble to stage 9/11 and at such great risk to exposure when something far simpler would have achieved the same results.

Why would the government go through all this trouble and complexity just for an excuse to invade Iraq or pass the Patriot Act when a simple plan would have acheived the exact same results with a far less risk of something going wrong?

"Satanic" ritual. And They needed to take down the Towers anyway - building a scaffold to deconstruct it at millions of dollars - by 2007. And They could insure it and make millions. And They could destroy evidence. And They could gain access to the gold that was there. And it was spectacular enough to be known around the world. And it would motivate Americans to accept war and erosion of their rights.

In fact... What "simple" plan would score all these advantages?

A single Al-Quieda man setting off a dirty bomb or something along those lines would have given America all the reason they needed.

I doubt it. That would have been nowhere near as emotionally jarring. The division in reaction would have been much greater, leaving a much larger uncontrolled population.

If the government asked you to create something that would mobilize the American people is 9/11 what you would come up with? There are 1000 different things that have to go perfectly right for this to be pulled off. The amount of people with knowledge is far too large for comfort.

Well... I would if I knew My cronies were going to have to spend millions to take them down anyway. And if I knew I or one of My cronies could make big bucks on insurance. And if I knew that there was gold to be had. And if I knew that Enron and other evidence was housed in #7 and a demolition would take care of that for Me and/or My cronies. And, in fact, I would if I knew the Pres (one of My cronies) had relatives in security AND demolition... And if I was that brazen and egotistical. And if I knew I could tell the People anything in the media and most would eat it up in a major shock situation.

In fact, if I knew all that, I would plan it, yes. (Presuming I would plan such evil to begin with.)

Look at the history of government cover-ups and how successful they were.

Now there's an interesting idea. Look at all the conspiracy We HAVE uncovered. Now. Do We presume We caught every one, then? Or, as I suspect, We have seen only the tip of the iceberg. And so... I would guess that 90% goes undetected. Yeah, a 90% success rate - or even a 50% success rate, when the money We're dealing with is THAT much - is a pretty good rate of sucess.

Gulf of Tonkin, Johnson couldn't even keep one little bombing incident secret and it was leaked through the pentagon papers.

And how many other plans WERE kept secret? You make it sound as if, because We uncovered these plans, We have made sure no such plans escaped Our notice. Pretty naive, I say.

Bay of Pigs. A disaster by Kennedy that didn't involve nearly the complexity of a 9/11 operation, totally blown

The degree of the success of any plan has little to do with - heh! has NOTHING to do with - the planning and execution of any other plans.

Watergate, Nixon couldn't even hide 2 people stealing files yet our government is gonna pull off something involving 4 jetliners and 100's of people?

[sigh] Again, that this was planned and was found out does not mean that no plans will succeed. These plans We did find out about were either hastily devised (9/11 was NOT), poorly conceived (9/11 was NOT), sloppily enacted (9/11 was NOT), or poorly controlled (9/11 was NOT).

Get serious and look at the big picture. Alot of people get hung up on details and do not see the forest through the trees.

Yeah. I have noticed. They do things like believe that because some conspiracies were outed that ALL conspiracies will be outed, that no amount of time and detailed planning will escape being found out, and on top of that, suggest that physics don't matter because other plans have been found out so there could be no such plan, physics be damned.

The big picture is that We were duped, taken for a ride, and then raped repeatedly.

The government couldn't keep all the people needed in your scenario quiet. It's as outrageous as the people that think we never went to the moon!
I remember we didn't need such an elaborate "hoax" to get into the Korean or 'Nam, the government simply said "we are going to war to stop the spread of communism" and that was that, next I knew I was 1-A and getting ready to go to a war I didn't understand, no... the government will never have to stoop to such an elaborate hoax to go to war, they don't need to!
Experts at building demolition has stated when they wire charges to bring a building down there are wires and charges all over the place, they laugh at the suggestion that you could charge and wire a building being used in secret!
Besides, if all they wanted to do was retaliate why bring the buildings down? Simply crashing airliners into the buildings would have been enough.
Also, what about the 1st Gulf war? Bush Sr. sent troops to Iraq to prevent Kuwait from falling to Saddam, and the government (and rightly so) even said it was also to protect our 'interests' in other words, our necessary oil.
If you are going to use so much time (in your case an enormous amount of non-scientific 'tests') why don't you put your time to better use?

Originally posted by kro32
Nobody has ever answered why they would go through all the trouble to stage 9/11 and at such great risk to exposure when something far simpler would have achieved the same results.

Why would the government go through all this trouble and complexity just for an excuse to invade Iraq or pass the Patriot Act when a simple plan would have acheived the exact same results with a far less risk of something going wrong?

A single Al-Quieda man setting off a dirty bomb or something along those lines would have given America all the reason they needed.

If the government asked you to create something that would mobilize the American people is 9/11 what you would come up with? There are 1000 different things that have to go perfectly right for this to be pulled off. The amount of people with knowledge is far too large for comfort.

Look at the history of government cover-ups and how successful they were.

Gulf of Tonkin, Johnson couldn't even keep one little bombing incident secret and it was leaked through the pentagon papers.

Bay of Pigs. A disaster by Kennedy that didn't involve nearly the complexity of a 9/11 operation, totally blown

Watergate, Nixon couldn't even hide 2 people stealing files yet our government is gonna pull off something involving 4 jetliners and 100's of people?

Get serious and look at the big picture. Alot of people get hung up on details and do not see the forest through the trees.

ya so obviously because we cant think of a good reason for them to do it all the facts should be discounted, makes perfect sense

since i cant think of the point to life, then the fact that there are living creatures is irrelevant, its making more and more sense as i carry on

in the end who are you?

your probably just an average person whom is a bit more informed then the rest of the populace,

are you a military general, a financial elite, a dictator, president, monarch, intelligence agency director, a part of a cabal of the most powerful people on the planet???

im going to guess not, so how could you ever believe that just because your mind cant conceive of a reason for an event that one doesnt exist in the minds of people whom have a vastly different reality from yourself, whom most likely know much more then you???

10 years later and some of you still haven't figured it out.

It doesn't take a genius to put this puzzle together.