Why God's Word The Bible IS Infallible!

reply to post by Glass


Note also - due to the abundance of plant life (vegetation), God created "monsters" or "dinosaurs" to control plant growth. Some of these "giant" animals are able to consume so much vegetation due to their huge appetite and sizes.

But why not just don't let the plant life not grow? Again - obviously it's the natural process of things that God is implementing as we've already covered. Once these creatures fulfilled their purpose - God simply put them to sleep. That's why we see evidence of SELECTIVE extinction rather than wide range extinction.

Besides many of these creatures are not meant to live with mankind (reminds me Jurassic Park).

BTW - a meteor hitting the earth will result in a wide range extinction rather than a selective extinction.
To explain it as a selective extinction one will need to come up with creative theories.

As for what you said next:

You mentioned a passage from Daniel at the end of your post. I looked up the chapter you quoted and read it. What do you think of the statue metaphor, and in which kingdom do you think we currently reside?

I'd like to comeback to this later...

This is a very important topic as it is RELATED to the current event's happening worldwide and besides it's also related to thread.


later...

reply to post by Glass


This is very important and I need to address it as clear as I can:

Glass you said:

Now this is the stuff that drives me away from your religion. This is the main reason I cannot subscribe to your closed belief system and false laws.

It’s not the intention of “my religion” to drive people away but to welcome them. That’s why we seek them even though they disapprove of us.

As for God’s Laws - they are not false laws but are a protection and a way to remain faithful to him.

“So again, it's the ACTS that is being CONDEMNED by God. If a person continues to steal, lie or pursue homosexual acts, flaunt and proudly proclaim it (privately or publicly) in the face of facts then that person has pretty much condemned himself in the face of God.”


You may know some people who have 'beaten' homosexual desires but you cannot ever know what it is like to live this way.

Yes you’re 100% correct. I will NEVER KNOW what it’s like because I’m not one but I can empathize with your plight. Jesus was never one of the people he talked with but he was very empathetic to their plight. He understood their situation. He understood their day to day, minute to minute, second to second struggles. And because of this he was welcomed by all but condemned by the religious leaders of his time. But as for willful wrongdoing he is unbending and very direct.

It was never a choice, I did not choose this, and yet it is.

On this matter it’s a gray area. Some say its nature but others say its nurture and some say both, that is, the environment in which a person was born in/from will influence a person’s or child’s character. But no matter what, bottom line is we are all products of IMPERFECTION and has imperfect tendencies in one form or another and express them to a lesser or greater degree.

So it’s not a simple issue but a complex one. But in spite of these imperfect tendencies as I’ve already mentioned some if not many were able to win the battle. And what helped them is their love for God and what he has done for mankind. Those are very powerful motivation in winning the battle and finally the war.

So essentially I am given three options; Remain closeted and miserable, Embrace it and be happy, or Pray your ass off until you die.

No. I disagree; God is NOT giving us OPTIONS but is giving us the STRENGTH to be free from whatever weakness we have. He just needs us to trust him as a loving Father because in the END he knows that the result will benefit us.

Pro 3:5
Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. – KJV

You do not know what it is like, to struggle to accept yourself, all the while hearing people talking about you behind your back, calling you unclean or an abomination.

This I do understand because I also have things that I struggle with/from day to day and the pain of hearing from others about it. And it’s a very depressing thing to face. But as for being called “unclean or an abomination” I’ve been discriminated also but not to the degree such as yours. That you’re 100% correct I will never know. But this I do know also that I don’t need to lose someone I love to experience the pain of losing one or to know the pain of isolation by experiencing it.


That is why I said this:

For Christians - the loving thing to do is not to condemn but to show mercy and the show promises of God - on how he will set matters straight in the near future - after all Christ died for ALL sinners. Those who are willing and want to change, there's help.

“But to say that "I can't change because that's the way I'm made" is not a valid excuse as I've already mentioned above. In fact some in the first century Christians some were at one time practicing homosexuals but changed their way of life.”

Typical. I've heard all this bull# before.

Fact is it’s been used as a justification by many to promote homosexuality as a lifestyle but the evidence also shows that one can be free from it if one chooses to be free – with God’s help. Alone it’s IMPOSSIBLE. It’s been proven time and time again.

Of course if one does not want to change then none can be done. If one views homosexual acts (lifestyle) as normal then nothing can be done about it.

You know what I think about this? I think that some people just don't want anything that offends their delicate sensibilites getting into Heaven, regardless of whether it is morally relevant. Some people simply cannot stand expressions of love that fall outside of their tunnel-vision world view.

That I agree, some or many think like this because of lack of understanding of the situation, they are quick to condemn. Christendom has not helped in this situation but made it worse – as many priests and religious leaders committed acts against innocent children. But for what they did they will pay for it in one form and another.

Sexual Orientation has no moral bearing whatsoever. There is absolutely no logical reason for God to declare consentual relations between adults immoral. To place homosexuals in the same league as theives and liars is insulting.

On this point, God’s word is direct and it can’t be and must not be watered down as some religious organizations had done. In God’s eyes wrong is wrong. Immorality whether it is bestiality, adultery, homosexuality or fornication – ALL immoral acts in God’s eyes are wrong.

As the Creator of human – he knows the consequences of such immoral acts and wants to spare anyone from the heartaches and struggles that will confront such individuals. So along with the much needed help a warning is given and its consequences.

Like the expression – “there’s no soft pillow in the world other than a clean conscience”. God wants us to enjoy life in the best possible way and homosexuality in his eyes is NOT the way. After all he is the (spiritual) Father to all.

So anyone who is contemplating to be become Footsteps Followers of Christ, in short a true Christian, one must recognized his laws. True Jesus made the Mosaic Law obsolete by folding them into two laws or one but the principles of the Mosaic Law remained intact.

For if you love God and your neighbor you will not do anything that will hurt them. No other law can be above this because it’s founded on principle.

Jesus said: “If YOU observe my commandments, YOU will remain in my love, just as I have observed the commandments of the Father and remain in his love.” (John 15:10)

As for the death of the individuals who were put to death for homosexual acts in the days of Moses and others – God had warned the Nation of Israel about it. The nation knew that the penalty for INTENTIONALLY violating God’s Laws is dire – death. In time though, they began to abandon the laws of God, the result God abandoned them and their enemies were able to vanquish and kill many of them. Only when they repented from their wicked acts was when they were rescued. What happened to them taught them a vital lesson of trust and obedience and most of all love for their God. Also since the Messiah was to come from the nation of Israel, it’s important that they remain separate from the nations around them. They must remain a holy nation. Sadly they failed to do so.

And as mentioned when Jesus came he fulfilled the Law of Moses and thus was able to replace it with a principle law (based on the Mosaic Law)

If this is truly God's decision, to ban all gays from heaven simply because they're gross, I will face damnation. I will consider it a form of protest against an unjust, uncaring, evil God.

I humbly must disagree. Please do not confuse the PERSON with the ACT. Just as an alcoholic has to battle his/her weaknesses we need to recognize and differentiate the two because there’s a BIG difference between weakness and wickedness. If one commits immorality due to weakness then he/she can seek help and forgiveness from God. But of course if one is deliberate then it’s counted as wickedness and has already condemned himself/herself in God’s eyes.

On a side note, here’s a brief excerpt from a life experience by a fellow Christian who is happily serving God in spite of the struggles:

…
You have heard it said, as I have: “Once a homosexual always a homosexual.” But it was not that way with me. I quit, once and for all. Even so, I still have to work on changes in my life pattern. How reassuring it has been for me to bear in mind Jehovah’s all-embracing understanding of my problems! I have grown to realize that he alone knows individual circumstances and backgrounds and takes into consideration damage caused by environment and in other ways as he lovingly gives guidance through his holy spirit.
There have been many times when I felt I would have to give in to the pressures. Yet I knew that I had benefited in so many other ways from the truth. After all, sexual desire is not all there is to one’s life. There is so much more to living, and I found that, having the truth of God’s Word, other avenues opened up to me, helping me in my desire to see changes in myself. Yet, problems take time to resolve. Homosexuality is no exception.
When the apostle Paul wrote his letter to the Corinthians he mentioned homosexuality as a gross sin, but he did not particularly underline it as the only one, or as being worse than the others mentioned there. He listed it along with other serious human failings, and surely if we fail in any one of those it means coming into God’s disfavor. But I have found that, when we try to conquer our weakness, Jehovah strengthens us. To expect to get any instantaneous cure would be wrong. But with Jehovah’s spirit helping in the exercise of self-control, I have learned that it is possible to work on in the way of the truth and manifest Christian endurance.—Rom. 5:1-5.
It is humbling for me to know that Jehovah has been able to use me, and despite my imperfections he continually strengthens me.
Many of my Christian brothers have been so very encouraging and kind. I am truly grateful for the loving opportunities and guidance Jehovah has given me through his Word, his spirit and his Christian congregation. It is my heartfelt desire to conform to the life-giving Christian personality and live to bring increased praise to his name.—Eph. 4:22-24.

In the end of course none of these matters if one chooses not to recognize the Bible as the word of God.

reply to post by edmc^2


Maybe you might show us all where Jesus condemed homosexuality?

Since you want to ignore my other questions that is...

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by edmc^2

 

Maybe you might show us all where Jesus condemed homosexuality?

Since you want to ignore my other questions that is...

I have a vague memory of having read somewhere, that 'vigils' initially were a way of ensuring that the dead really were dead and stayed dead.

If you don't mind, I will join you here in your vigil for truth on this thread, maybe it will revive after all, having survived the present bout of non-answering method exchanged with intensified semantics and sermons.

Everybody have ofcourse the right to come here and make postulates (even in sermon form), refuse to answer inconvenient questions and somewhere along the line appoint themselves referees on what's 'intelligent' etc., I'm all for the openness in such a system.

It ALSO allows me to say to the thread author: "Why do you not answer questions?"

Is it: "Because"?

But all this is between you and me A; don't tell anyone.

A reference to homosexuality in the scriptures:


RO 1:21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

RO 1:24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. Amen.

RO 1:26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

RO 1:28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.


From the words of Jesus himself:

MK 7:20 He went on: "What comes out of a man is what makes him `unclean.' For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. All these evils come from inside and make a man `unclean.' "

reply to post by XplanetX


Aaaaah XplanetX,

your post came as an answer to my non-prayers to the possibly non-god the flying spaghetti monster (it's all a bit zen, but nonetheless I'm a legitimate pastafarian, owning a spaghetti strainer and a holy manual I write along the way).

Where our esteemed thread author tries to make the issue(s) somewhat clouded with a lot of semantic smokescreens, you are at least openly acknowledging the homophopia of this 'god'(s)........ (I'm unfamiliar with your interpretation of trinities etc), .......you believe in.

Now I may be unfair, trying to paint you into a corner by calling this/these 'god'(s) 'homophobic' from a secular perspective. So I will gladly join a discussion on what theists call it and justify it as instead, and I'm even prepared to have christian apologetics served still another time.

You MAY bring some light to the (imo ofcourse) opaque position of edmc^2, and should it happen, TFSM forbid it, that you interpretate the bible different from him, I will make the offer of sitting on the fence and from a rational position act as referee on the rational points.

I have little competence in cherry-picking the bible, so if I'm best out of the way in the present direction of this thread, intensified cherry-picking is to be recommended. Unless anyone contradicts him/herself ofcourse....such happens for even the best.

Originally posted by bogomil
reply to post by XplanetX

 

Aaaaah XplanetX,

your post came as an answer to my non-prayers to the possibly non-god the flying spaghetti monster (it's all a bit zen, but nonetheless I'm a legitimate pastafarian, owning a spaghetti strainer and a holy manual I write along the way).

Where our esteemed thread author tries to make the issue(s) somewhat clouded with a lot of semantic smokescreens, you are at least openly ackowledging the homophopia of this 'god'(s)........ (I'm unfamiliar with your interpretation of trinities etc), .......you believe in.

Now I may be unfair, trying to paint you into a corner by calling this/these 'god'(s) 'homophobic' from a secular perspective. So I will gladly join a discussion on what theists call it and justify it as instead, and I'm even prepared to have christian apologetics served still another time.

You MAY bring some light to the (imo ofcourse) opaque position of edmc^2, and should it happen, TFSM forbid it, that you interpretate the bible different from him, I will make the offer of sitting on the fence and from a rational position act as referee on the rational points.

I have little competence in cherry-picking the bible, so if I'm best out of the way in the present direction of this thread, intensified cherry-picking is to be recommend. Unless anyone contradicts him/herself ofcourse....such happens for even the best.

edit on 16-8-2011 by bogomil because: grammar

Homophobic suggests fear and paranoia. Contrary to your view, God loves homosexuals but condemns their behaviour.

reply to post by XplanetX


You wrote:

["Homophobic suggests fear and paranoia. Contrary to your view, God loves homosexuals but condemns their behaviour."]

Thanks for your clarification from the theist dictionary, apologetics and psychology (both divine and mundane), which ofcourse is completely legitimate as a theist approach, perspective and methodology.

Against this stands a secular use of the word 'phobia', which also includes such strong aversions, as to leading to irrational consequences. Such as killing individuals (who in consentual contexts, without hurting anyone) apply 'moral' values different from your own,

I am now overdoing an example to profile the positions. Later I will be more reasonable:

"He looked at me in a funny way". According to the interpretation from militant pastafarians (such sadly also exist. Militants are everywhere in different disguises) the holy noodle manual says clearly: "For he who looks at another man in a funny way will be reborn as a fire-and-brimstone christian". Well, agree or not, that's what it says; I just wrote it, so I should know. And according to this a militant is helping a pastafarian dissident on his way to re-incarnation; by killing the dissident.

You have added valuable information on (at least ONE) christian position on homosexuality. Now I suggest we use this information for returning to thread-topic, which basically is a postulate of all this bible-material (allegedly scientific, moral etc) being 'objective' (unless someone comes up with a better word). So we move from 'answers' to 'perspectives' (i.e. methodologies etc).

That is unless the thread stays on sermon or: "Yes, no, yes, no, yes"-level. But with some good will, we may be able to find some common reference-points on a few months with the present speed, avoiding such a blind alley.

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by edmc^2

 

Maybe you might show us all where Jesus condemed homosexuality?

Since you want to ignore my other questions that is...

Since your Q has already been answered - I'll move to the next Qs - your long cut and pasted list which I believe you haven't even looked at.

Since it's a long list it'll be a while to get to all of them.

Any more to add?

reply to post by bogomil



This is what I don't get. You ask a question WHY but when answered with BECAUSE it's not an answer to you.

SO I guess there's no amount of explanation that I can provide then as long as the answer to the question WHY is followed by BECAUSE.

Originally posted by XplanetX
A reference to homosexuality in the scriptures:


RO 1:21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

RO 1:24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. Amen.

RO 1:26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

RO 1:28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.


From the words of Jesus himself:

MK 7:20 He went on: "What comes out of a man is what makes him `unclean.' For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. All these evils come from inside and make a man `unclean.' "

Thanks XplanetX for providing the Scriptures - hopefully this should settle the 'homophobic" issue with Akragon.

Originally posted by edmc^2

Originally posted by Akragon
reply to post by edmc^2

 

Maybe you might show us all where Jesus condemed homosexuality?

Since you want to ignore my other questions that is...

Since your Q has already been answered - I'll move to the next Qs - your long cut and pasted list which I believe you haven't even looked at.

Since it's a long list it'll be a while to get to all of them.

Any more to add?

Considering this is an insufficient answer....

From the words of Jesus himself:

MK 7:20 He went on: "What comes out of a man is what makes him `unclean.' For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. All these evils come from inside and make a man `unclean.'

I will still be waiting for your answer, if you have one that is...

Notice this particular version of the bible says "sexual immorality".... It is not immoral when two consenting adults engage in sexual activity, regardless of their sexual preference.

Perhaps your bible considers it immoral, but again....God didn't write the bible.

Homosexuality exists in all species in nature, just as it occurs and always has in our species.

Typical bible/God fearing garbage..... again similar to the witch trials of the 16-1700's... If you're not like us, we don't like you, Nor does our God.

BTW...."Believe" whatever you like, thats only a part of the list....which i have went over, and theres plenty more to come.

And you still haven't answered my innital question....

Biblical justification for mistreatment of ANY individual is not Gods way according to Jesus... Perhaps it is with YOUR God... but not the one Jesus spoke of.

What say you....

Originally posted by edmc^2
reply to post by bogomil

 

This is what I don't get. You ask a question WHY but when answered with BECAUSE it's not an answer to you.

SO I guess there's no amount of explanation that I can provide then as long as the answer to the question WHY is followed by BECAUSE.

My 'why's have been rather specific. VERY specific actually, and if you want, I can make them even more specific down to the last punctuation sign.

I expect equally specific answers to my specific questions, which answers DON'T include

a/ Answers to other people on similar questions

b/ 'Theories of everything'....... created by you or JW manuals (and for the duration not from anybody else for that sake).

reply to post by Akragon


Let's take this one. You said:

Biblical justification for mistreatment of ANY individual is not Gods way according to Jesus... Perhaps it is with YOUR God... but not the one Jesus spoke of. What say you....

We'll that's according to you but the Scripture say:

ASV

Psa 145:8 Jehovah is gracious, and merciful; Slow to anger, and of great lovingkindness.

Psa 145:9 Jehovah is good to all; And his tender mercies are over all his works.

Psa 25:4 Show me thy ways, O Jehovah; Teach me thy paths

Psa 25:5 Guide me in thy truth, and teach me; For thou art the God of my salvation; For thee do I wait all the day.

Psa 25:6 Remember, O Jehovah, thy tender mercies and thy lovingkindness; For they have been ever of old.

Psa 25:7 Remember not the sins of my youth, nor my transgressions: According to thy lovingkindness remember thou me, For thy goodness' sake, O Jehovah.

Psa 25:8 Good and upright is Jehovah: Therefore will he instruct sinners in the way.

Psa 25:9 The meek will he guide in justice; And the meek will he teach his way.

Psa 25:10 All the paths of Jehovah are lovingkindness and truth Unto such as keep his covenant and his testimonies.

Jesus said:

Luk 6:36 Be ye merciful, even as your Father is merciful.

Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life.

As for The Lord Jesus The King Of kings and Lord of lords will do in the near future.

KJV:

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

Rev 19:12 His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

Rev 19:13 And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

Rev 19:14 And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Rev 19:16 And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Those with understanding know what these scriptures mean.

reply to post by bogomil


In this case then, the answers will be direct quotations from the Bible without any explanation.

that'll do.

Originally posted by edmc^2
reply to post by bogomil

 

In this case then, the answers will be direct quotations from the Bible without any explanation.

that'll do.

Meaning that 'infallibility' in the bible is demonstrated by the bible 'proving' the bible? As usual.

It'll maybe do for you, but not for me, and unfortunately YOU are the one to PROVE a positivistic (socalled 'gnostic') postulate, which in standard logic isn't possible through circle-arguments.

So shall we 'regress' the argument even further and end with one of those definition-quibbles so often happening, when christians try to (mis)use standard logic. In this case what DOES 'infallible' mean, now you come to think about it.

Originally posted by edmc^2
reply to post by Akragon

 

Let's take this one. You said:

Biblical justification for mistreatment of ANY individual is not Gods way according to Jesus... Perhaps it is with YOUR God... but not the one Jesus spoke of. What say you....

We'll that's according to you but the Scripture say:

ASV

Psa 145:8 Jehovah is gracious, and merciful; Slow to anger, and of great lovingkindness.

Psa 145:9 Jehovah is good to all; And his tender mercies are over all his works.

Psa 25:4 Show me thy ways, O Jehovah; Teach me thy paths

Psa 25:5 Guide me in thy truth, and teach me; For thou art the God of my salvation; For thee do I wait all the day.

Psa 25:6 Remember, O Jehovah, thy tender mercies and thy lovingkindness; For they have been ever of old.

Psa 25:7 Remember not the sins of my youth, nor my transgressions: According to thy lovingkindness remember thou me, For thy goodness' sake, O Jehovah.

Psa 25:8 Good and upright is Jehovah: Therefore will he instruct sinners in the way.

Psa 25:9 The meek will he guide in justice; And the meek will he teach his way.

Psa 25:10 All the paths of Jehovah are lovingkindness and truth Unto such as keep his covenant and his testimonies.

Jesus said:

Luk 6:36 Be ye merciful, even as your Father is merciful.

Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life.

As for The Lord Jesus The King Of kings and Lord of lords will do in the near future.

KJV:

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

Rev 19:12 His eyes [were] as a flame of fire, and on his head [were] many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

Rev 19:13 And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

Rev 19:14 And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Rev 19:16 And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

Those with understanding know what these scriptures mean.

Psalms was written by many people who were "inspired" by God...None of which were Jesus

Though i won't deny the message, it has nothing to do with that statement which i asked you to at least comment on... It speaks about "jehova" being merciful/kind as he is, and keep his word etc etc...

Its says NOTHING about doing harm to anyone...

As for the quotes from Luke and John....... exact same situation. It says nothing that has to do with what i was talking about. This my friend is called "cherry picking".... And a horrible example of it considering as i've said, it has nothing to do with this....

Biblical justification for mistreatment of ANY individual is not Gods way according to Jesus... Perhaps it is with YOUR God... but not the one Jesus spoke of. What say you....

I will even agree with you that "A" God that is spoken about in the bible is just and kind. Is that what you're trying to say?

But!

Your God from the bible is NOT just/kind/merciful/caring

And i have plenty of examples...

Also realize that the only reason im putting you through this is because of the title of this thread.

Heres a quick definition...

in·fal·li·ble   /ɪnˈfæləbəl/ Show Spelled[in-fal-uh-buhl] Show IPA
adjective
1. absolutely trustworthy or sure: an infallible rule.
2. unfailing in effectiveness or operation; certain: an infallible remedy.
3. not fallible; exempt from liability to error, as persons, their judgment, or pronouncements: an infallible principle.
4. Roman Catholic Church . immune from fallacy or liability to error in expounding matters of faith or morals by virtue of the promise made by Christ to the Church.

The last one is interesting eh...

Those with understanding know what these scriptures mean.

Ahh revelations... Please enlighten me as to what these scriptures mean. I love hearing from those with "understanding" honestly...

reply to post by Akragon

...it has nothing to do with that statement which i asked you to at least comment on... It speaks about "jehova" being merciful/kind as he is, and keep his word etc etc...

Of course it does. Even Jesus recognized that God CANNOT do such a thing that you’re claiming. Only those who have hatred for God will say that.

But if you insist that God is wicked then you’re basically saying that Jesus is lying because:

“. . .Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good, except one, God.” (Mark 10:18)

“Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good, except one, God.” (Luke 18:19)

Does Jesus know who God is? Of course he does!

“. . .This one was in [the] beginning with God. 3 All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence. . .” (John 1:2-3)


“So now you, Father, glorify me alongside yourself with the glory that I had alongside you before the world was.” (John 17:5)

What say you? Are you claiming that you’re correct and Jesus is mistaken? That you know more than Christ Jesus?

In other words when Jesus said:

“Continue becoming merciful, just as your Father is merciful.”—LUKE 6:36.

You’re saying that he (Jesus) was mistaken because you said that the –

God from the bible is NOT just/kind/merciful/caring

So who is telling the truth here? And who's mistaken?

Should I believe the Lord Jesus or YOU?

Originally posted by bogomil

Originally posted by edmc^2
reply to post by bogomil

 

In this case then, the answers will be direct quotations from the Bible without any explanation.

that'll do.

Meaning that 'infallibility' in the bible is demonstrated by the bible 'proving' the bible? As usual.

It'll maybe do for you, but not for me, and unfortunately YOU are the one to PROVE a positivistic (socalled 'gnostic') postulate, which in standard logic isn't possible through circle-arguments.

So shall we 'regress' the argument even further and end with one of those definition-quibbles so often happening, when christians try to (mis)use standard logic. In this case what DOES 'infallible' mean, now you come to think about it.

No need to define "infallible" as everyone knows what it means but by what standard or criteria do you want the Bible The Word Of God to proven Infallible?

Since I can't use any logical reasoning, evidence or the Bible itself - what is left to say then?

reply to post by edmc^2


Though I try to stay out of, when the bible-citings start, I couldn't resist this one.

You wrote:

["Should I believe the Lord Jesus or YOU?"]

What anyone not sharing your premises will read is: Shall we believe the Lord Jesus AS EDMC^2 BELIEVES HIM TO BE, or shall we believe Akragon?

I would put my money on Akragon.

Not least because you, edmc^2, are using a kind of 'logic' which could 'prove' square wheels superior to the round ones. Whereas I have come to know Akragon as being rather rational.

Maybe we also need a return to earlier parts of the thread to brush up on logics.... as one of our small detours.