Muslims are taking over the West!!!

Originally posted by mehforfun

ROFL not once have i had any muslim try to force feed me halal. you have a choice buy it or not.

Do all of you know what Halal meat is? Apparently not, because you're describing it like it's some kind of unique dish that is easily recognized. The only difference is the way the animal is killed. The throat of the animal is slit while leaving the spinal cord intact, this is to ensure that the animal stays alive while it is being bled to death. It sounds barbaric because it is barbaric, and if you people think it should be allowed just to pander to Muslims then you're seriously deranged. Muslims in Michigan are pushing for Halal meat to be served in McDonalds, and McDonalds is doing it. You may already have eaten Halal meat and didn't even know it. This is not an issue to be made light of.

Originally posted by sheepslayer247
See how easy it is to play that "my God is better than your God" game? The real question is....how do you know? Since you don't, why do you take it upon yourself to judge another Man's beliefs? Is that what Jesus would do?

In fact Jesus spoke out often about the false christs and messiahs of the End times. He specifically warned us to watch out for them, so the answer to your last question is an emphatic "yes".

reply to post by sheepslayer247


Well when you are being stoned or whatever else they do against christians or non believers the result will be the same would it not? Have a look at what is happening they are colonising the region then starting to bring their laws to those ares. Hell in France there are places government services dare not go into this is the future of that region.

Yes Immigration is good every country had it but those immigrants assimilated into yours and my cultures they didn't demand we live by theirs big difference.

reply to post by confreak


i started reading the OP and the full tread 12 hours ago
now i am back

to the OP: it took me a while to understand what you really wanted to state. the sarcasm turned the OP into something hard to evaluate, unless one takes the time to go into details.
anyway, thanks for posting!

reply to post by SavedOne


Do you just scan read an article in the hope that everyone else does to miss out the obvious contradiction to your point?

The article clearly states that sales of the Halal version are higher than the normal version, therefore emphatically proving that both are on sale and you have a choice of which to order...

Sensationalist posts do nothing to further the growth of this site.

reply to post by Truth_Hz


May be stating the obvious but in a McDs where primarily Muslims go - it's no real shocker that Halal products outsell non Halal ?!
In McDs in non Muslim areas - that is not the case is it.
I think he is referring to the fact that Halal process is not in line with te UK/US regulations on slaughtering animals - so why should it be allowed?
I don't see what point your making?

reply to post by confreak


Woah wait hey, hold up there.

Halal meat should be banned. Along with rice cakes, clover sprouts, and other tasteless roughage that some goofball is trying to pass off as "food." Even devout Muslims should be freed from the chains of hideously bland food!

reply to post by facchino


I was clearly addressing the sensationalist claims that "you may have already eaten Halal and not even know it"

The only way that this is possible is if a mistake was made at the restaurant, it was not forced upon the purchaser as many have already implied.

In response to your point however. In the UK, and straight from the DEFRA Website

There are long-standing provisions in our law which, subject to specific requirements, permit the slaughter of animals without stunning to meet Jewish and Muslim religious requirements. Whilst the Government would prefer that all animals were stunned before slaughter, it recognises the needs of certain communities and accepts the importance which they attach to the right to slaughter animals for food in accordance with their beliefs. Religious slaughter must be carried out only in approved red meat slaughterhouses or, in the case of poultry, in approved or other officially regulated slaughterhouses (see guidance about religious slaughter for the Muslim community). We attend regular meetings with representatives of the Muslim community to address any areas of ongoing concern. These meetings are chaired by the Food Standards Agency. We also hold occasional meetings with Jewish organisations.

And from the US Humane Slaughter Act of 1958:

7 U.S.C.A. § 1902. Humane methods

No method of slaughtering or handling in connection with slaughtering shall be deemed to comply with the public policy of the United States unless it is humane. Either of the following two methods of slaughtering and handling are hereby found to be humane:

(a) in the case of cattle, calves, horses, mules, sheep, swine, and other livestock, all animals are rendered insensible to pain by a single blow or gunshot or an electrical, chemical or other means that is rapid and effective, before being shackled, hoisted, thrown, cast, or cut; or

(b) by slaughtering in accordance with the ritual requirements of the Jewish faith or any other religious faith that prescribes a method of slaughter whereby the animal suffers loss of consciousness by anemia of the brain caused by the simultaneous and instantaneous severance of the carotid arteries with a sharp instrument and handling in connection with such slaughtering.

So actually they are well within their rights to perform these "Ritual Slaughters"

reply to post by SavedOne


Actually, you just described kosher butchery, too. Frankly, I haven't seen a method of animal butchery that isn't barbaric. Cut the buzzwords, you'll sound smarter.

What makes halal different from kosher is that halal meat is, well, extra-drained. All the blood is squeezed or soaked out of the meat. Kosher considers letting the meat drain by gravity fllowed by a bit of time in a salt bath to be enough.

By the way that's why it's called kosher salt; because it's used in the kosher process, not becuase the salt itself is kosher.

reply to post by Truth_Hz


Well he has a point - there have been recent instances where Halal meat is not clearly labelled.
Secret Halal

As to the regulations - I admit I stand corrected - despite the fact the same site states UK meat slaughter should be carried out humanely - religious exemptions do exist.
To be honest - this is just another example of exceptions made for other religions - not just Islam but Jewish as well - that contravene the legal standing that affects the rest of the population.
There also can be no denying it is a barbaric process that along with things like stoning - belong in centuries gone by.
Animals should be treated as humanely as possible, stunned and slaughtered - not allowed to bleed to death in agonising pain in the name of "religion"

Originally posted by Viking9019
reply to post by listerofsmeg

 

Uhhh this is the Islamic revolution......a takeover and these people deserve no rights at all.
I hate people like you who tolerate these things and bring up a racial aspect to it when its not needed but then again,its what a brainwashed left wing person would say.

As I mention before, people are not ashamed of bigotry any more, and I have argued before that in UK it is actual normal and in fact cool to harass Muslims.

What you are saying is the purest form of bigotry, not racism, but another form of racism.

You are asking the West to implement different laws governing Muslims, an apartheid rule, but I only see this attitude prevailing in ATS and it really does make me wonder why.

What you are suggesting is different rights for Muslims compared to non-Muslims, just like South Africa there was different laws for black and white. So when I see so many ATS members openly admit that they want an apartheid rule in the West, I see a conspiracy.

Hey, let's ban Muslims from participating in the government, because they are taking over the West.
Hey, let's ban Muslims from reproducing, because they are taking over the West.
Hey, let's ban Muslim culture, because they are taking over the West.

See, it is asking for different laws governing Muslims and non-Muslims, how about we just create a concentration camp and send Muslims in there then slowly kill them all, wouldn't that be the ultimate solution. That is what it is leading to isn't it?

reply to post by confreak


Just stopping the massive immigration and ensuring laws of the country are actually followed and enforced even in already existing isolationist muslim ghettos, in reality, not just on paper, would be enough. No apartheid, racist laws or discrimination is needed, noone is asking for that, you are making a strawman.
Stopping the huge immigration is all what people want.

reply to post by facchino


So according to your logic Muslims must be taking over the West for eating halal meat?

This is the insanity which some are trying to make us feed, but the absurdity never seems to amaze me. Halal meat isn't illegal, and businesses selling halal meat isn't illegal either. Businesses want to move toward halal meat not because Muslims are taking over the West, but because it is more profit for the business, hence more customers (Muslims). Yes, Muslims must be taking over the West because they eat halal meat, solution => ban halal meat.

Originally posted by facchino
reply to post by Truth_Hz

 

Well he has a point - there have been recent instances where Halal meat is not clearly labelled.
Secret Halal

As to the regulations - I admit I stand corrected - despite the fact the same site states UK meat slaughter should be carried out humanely - religious exemptions do exist.
To be honest - this is just another example of exceptions made for other religions - not just Islam but Jewish as well - that contravene the legal standing that affects the rest of the population.
There also can be no denying it is a barbaric process that along with things like stoning - belong in centuries gone by.
Animals should be treated as humanely as possible, stunned and slaughtered - not allowed to bleed to death in agonising pain in the name of "religion"

I totally agree with you with regard to the slaughter of these animals, it should be done in a humane way. it does not detract from the fact however that Halal meat is not being forced upon us like many claim.

The story you posted above has certainly not come from an unbiased / reliable source... christianvoice.org.uk and unsurprisingly the only places I can really find reference to this story is various christian websites / blogs. The Daily Mail and of course the website of the EDL.

but for the sake of argument lets suppose the story is true, it is based mainly around New Zealand Lamb, apparently 70% of New Zealand Lamb is slaughtered in the Halal way (although I will come back to this)
A very quick piece of research (I am at work at the moment) shows that Sainsbury's only sell 3 or 4 New Zealand Lamb products the rest is from the UK. There is a small chance that in your weekly shop you might buy Halal meat - That I will concede..

But is it actually Halal?

The New Zealand lamb is actually not killed to the "proper" Halal way, it is stunned first, and although this complies with the HFA's rulings the HFA is widely regarded in the muslim community as not worth the paper it is written on.

And so we appear to have hit a grey area. The meat may have been blessed but it is not actually Halal in the true sense.

Originally posted by Maslo
reply to post by confreak

 

Just stopping the massive immigration and ensuring laws of the country are actually followed and enforced even in already existing isolationist muslim ghettos, in reality, not just on paper, would be enough. No apartheid, racist laws or discrimination is needed, noone is asking for that, you are making a strawman.
Stopping the huge immigration is all what people want.

I'm not against that, but why are you trying to incite hate against Muslims when immigration laws haven't been created by Muslims? This is the big problem that I see. And most did mention halal meat then relate that to how Muslims are taking over the West. Then they talked about reproduction rates (including you) then relate that the Muslims taking over the West. Then they talked about Muslims exercising their rights and participating in the government, then relate that to Muslims taking over the West.

Muslims and non-Muslims have the same rights, some are insinuating that since Muslims are actually exercising their rights, they must be taking over the West.

This is illogical and irrational fear mongering, if not intentional attempt to incite hate which is against UK laws.

reply to post by confreak


And can't you see that by your logic and allowing Muslims their own seperate sharia law - oh are in fact allowing the seperation you are criticising others for wanting!?

reply to post by confreak


Ok - I see whats happening. You latch onto 1 small part of the topic, not any of the points I made in reference to your other post showing flaws with your arguments.
Nice sidestep.

reply to post by Soldier of God


Is that so ? Examples please ?

reply to post by Truth_Hz


Slitting of throat is proven to be as humane as other forms of animal slaughter. Those who claim it is not are ignorant of the fact that animals fall unconscious within seconds when their necks are sliced.

An experiment has already taken place to see whether the claim of bigots is true, that the slitting of throat is animal brutality:

2. Slaughter in the form of ritual cut

A. Calves
After the bloodletting cut loss of reaction (loss of consciousness) occurred with high probability within 10 seconds. A clear reaction to the cut could not be detected in any animal. For 7 animals a zero EEG was recorded no later than after 23 seconds. Cramps occurred in the animals regularly only after the brain currents had stopped.

B. Sheep
After the bloodletting cut loss of reaction (loss of consciousness) occurred after 10 seconds the latest. A clear reaction to the cut could not be detected in any animal. The zero line was recorded no later than 14 seconds after the cut. Cramps only occurred after the zero line had been detected and were much shorter than after captive bolt stunning.

The slaughter in the form of ritual cut is, if carried out properly, painless in sheep and calves according to the EEG recordings and the missing defensive actions.

--source--

Funnily people who support bombing and invasion of countries causing extreme suffering and horror are all of a sudden humane and worry how animals are slaughtered. It goes to show, bigotry has no boundaries, anything can be used as an excuse, and there is surely no shame.

reply to post by confreak


Yes, muslims are taking over the west, and they have a right to do so if we let them immigrate and become citizens. Nazis also took over Germany by democratic means (they were elected). You are talking like taking over the west could not be accomplished just by exercising their democratic rights if the huge immigration continues, or like that would somehow not count as a takeover. But those are not mutually exclusive. And that is the core of the problem - once we let them in, they can take over just by exercising their democratic rights, just like nazis did - in democracy, the power is only in numbers. Even the power to institute undemocratic regimes.

The only solution compatible with rights is to stop the imigration before extremists become a substantial political force, altrough if that oppotunity passes due to stupidity of our leaders, I would agree with more drastic measures - its OK to breach human rights in order to protect human rights and freedom, if its necessary.

I dont blame only extremist muslims, but also those responsible for immigration laws. Primarily those.