What the heck is wrong with San Francisco? Nanny state gone wild!!

Nanny state?

More like Nazi state.

But really the correct terminology is Totalitarian and Authoritarian.

And I thought Church vs State were not suppose to mix.

How can the government ban circumcision? It's a religious practice....

Originally posted by newcovenant
Again...letting the TSA feel up your wife or the government checking out what you say on the telephone and where you travel, what books you check out of the library is fine as long as they as let you have the happy meals? I don't get it.

WHERE ARE YOU GETTING THIS STUFF? You are right, you don't get it.
WHERE on earth did you get that I think the TSA is fine or the the library is fine or whatever?
You are making things up and deflecting. Seriously ... very odd.
Oh ... and the TSA can't 'feel up my wife' ... I'm a happily married WOMAN.

You let the Patriot Act pass ...

Again ... WHAT are you talking about?
I ... ME ... I 'let the patriot act pass'??

What the feds are doing is a subject for a different thread. It's the subject on MANY threads here. I'm sure if you dig through them you'll find my comments about those things on THOSE threads .. where they belong. This is about San Francisco .. they are banning the sale of goldfish .. banning pet sales ... banning banning banning ....

You may trust all these big corporations over and above "the big bad government" but I don't

Again with the off topic assumptions about what I think .... seriously dude ...

Puppies. What 3 year old doesn't want one? Thats what I mean by unsuspecting public. Taking advantage of children and ignorant purchasers who do not know the facts of animal abuse and over population.

And there you have it .... the typical far left San Francisco attitude ... people aren't smart but the government is and therefore people are incapable of taking care of themselves so the government has to step in and control everything. ABSURD.

San Fransisco has always been a little ahead of the curve.

yeah ... okay .... I get it ... unicorns and rainbows ....

Let's see...we have the following statements in this thread:

I am convinced that San Francisco is the nerve center of Bizarro World. Its sole purpose is to push the extremes that you described in the OP just to see how far they can go without much/if any resistance from the majority of lemmings who live there. I don't think these people even care or are even aware of what's going on.

After living in the bay area for a few years, I am confounded by their lack of interest in what happens to the huge amount of homeless people there, but let's save the goldfish!

Move to San Francisco. It's all set up for you...Soon - you won't even have to think for yourself anymore...A whole lotta' sheeple depending on the gov't for everything.

San fran is a nasty place...If you live there.....I have to ask why?...The mere act of living in such an ignorant city is basically giving the morons who ru it your seal of approval

I have a friend who has been living in SF for about seven years now. He recently came to visit me for about five days. It was five days of hell for me. I learned that everything I do and think is WRONG.

OK, folks. I just can't stand by and watch my beautiful city and its inhabitants being unfairly trampled by such generalizations. I have lived here for 5 years. I didn't vote for Pelosi, and I don't agree with everything that the government is trying to pass, including the items that the OP originally posted. Yes, our local government is imperfect. But that does not make the city's inhabitants "bizarro, uninterested, condescending sheeple morons!"

One reason that I moved here was because the outstanding public transportation system allowed me to sell my car and lower my carbon footprint. When I walk out my front door every day, I see people commuting on scooters, bikes, skateboards, and other self-propelled vehicles. How many of you SF bashers drive a car or--gulp--a big ol' SUV by yourself to work every day?

There are many homeless people here. I give to them regularly, buy their goods, and support the programs that support them. We regularly take a homeless dog to get his shots and tags so that he and his owner can stay together without the pound picking him up. I work with a church program that provides meals to the homeless in the worst areas.

I could go on about what's right with San Francisco, including its progressive hi-tech community, the fact that it is the best walking city in America , the gorgeous geography and neighborhoods, and -- hello -- does anyone want to talk about our baseball team??? but the point is that generalizing about the inhabitants of anyplace based on some laws that some legislators are trying to pass reflects pretty poorly on the person who does it.

Stick to the point. This thread should be about the crazy proposed legislation.

And, for the record, I am much of an awake, unsheeplified, open-minded, concerned, government-paranoid conspiracy theorist as anybody in the room!

My father always warned me to stay away from California. I see why now. While it is there rights as Americans to pass legislation like this I worry more about the domino effect than San Franscico giving up their freedoms for the "greater good."Although I love my country and my fellow Americans, sometimes we get bowled over by flashy pictures and pretty words. I mean come on look who's in office.The supposed man of change. Onlu change I've seen is the change I'm gathering to pay for gas. But I degress,I'm worried that the ignorant masses with eat these spoonfed travesties as means of being "progressive or enlightened." As in the past though such tight regulations only lead to chaos and maybe that's what they're going for but what do I know. In my opinion if you don't want these type of laws in your kneck of the woods, become pro active in your communities. Stop relying on people to inform themselves and actually do something. Pay attention to people not parties and know that there is no greater good only the good of your family and friends. Due what's right by them and everything else will fall into place.

Originally posted by muzzleflash
Nanny state?

More like Nazi state.

But really the correct terminology is Totalitarian and Authoritarian.

And I thought Church vs State were not suppose to mix.

How can the government ban circumcision? It's a religious practice....

So you're justifying female circumcision? As a religious a practice.

Or maybe if I kill a dwarf or someone who's into witchcraft, because its a religious practice?

reply to post by graceunderpressure

Cheers neighbor. Couldn't have said it better myself.
2nd line.

Male circumcision SHOULD be banned the same as any other crime, and the same way female circumcision is.


It is a violation and destruction of the integrity of an individual's sovereign body and is absolutely inexcusable.


If you say that circumcision is a choice and not to allow it is to limit freedom, that's like saying that by not letting Obama be a dictator you are taking away his freedom.

Why are people going to extremes?

One side is for banning circumcision entirely and the other side is for getting everyone circumcised. WTF?!

How about we postpone circumcision to a later date where a person is mature and ready enough to consciously decide if he/she wants to have it or not. When they day arrives you simply give her all the pros and cons of the operation and she can freely decide if she wants to go through with it or not. It's that simple.

I mean why does it have to be either everyone or no one? I don't understand...

reply to post by FlyersFan


What they are banning is a distraction here. To me the real topic is what this stems from in the first place. San Francisco is the testing ground of the Progressive agenda and how life under a Progressive system really is. The world has seen this many times and it always ends the same way. Two classes, the elite and those the elite rule over. No middle class but there is a pseudo-middle class that here is taking shape in the form of Unions.

Unions that are supposed to be the voice of the workers, instead take marching orders from the State. In the old USSR they called the Union "The Party" but it is the same no matter what name. Union members (Party members) have no voice at all, but are conditioned to think they do.

The end game is a single Party, ruled by the established elite from the Progressives and complete control of all aspects of the citizens lives.

We elected a hard core Progressive and now we are seeing the tip of the iceberg in San Francisco.

It's not really about toys in junk food or circumcision at all. It is about removing religion, and conditioning the population to be controlled by the elite. You simply cannot have religious freedom and a progressive state at the same time. One won't allow for the other. To have this progressive state, God must be removed at all costs. You have to believe all your rights are gifts from the State and you cannot believe you were born with them.

You need only spend a couple of days experiencing San Francisco to see the fruits of it all. Really sad as it is such a beautiful city. The middle class is about gone there and the real estate costs reflect that. It is what everyone should expect if you back the progressives. The poor should expect to be poorer and have to jump through more and more hoops to get their handouts from their new Deities.

We are right now watching the new Royalty form. What we left Europe to escape will be mimicked here with this new Royal Family in charge. Good news is the Left is waking up now and seeing they have been used. Question is, did they wake up soon enough to stop it?

I'd feel for the people of San Francisco, except they keep backing this and appear to be fully conditioned to be controlled. Now they have no choice but to continue backing this removal of their freedoms to save face and sadly people will give up freedom just to be part of the elite. It's the same mentality that makes everyone wear trendy clothes they can't afford.

Originally posted by 0001391
Male circumcision SHOULD be banned the same as any other crime, and the same way female circumcision is.


It is a violation and destruction of the integrity of an individual's sovereign body and is absolutely inexcusable.


If you say that circumcision is a choice and not to allow it is to limit freedom, that's like saying that by not letting Obama be a dictator you are taking away his freedom.

edit on 6/23/2011 by 0001391 because: typo

How the hell does not letting Obama be a dictator compare to not letting someone have the choice of getting the operation or not? Two totally unrelated things...

Liberal policies do not work. I can't believe the OP is being bashed because she chose not to complain about the patriot act and the TSA in her original post. Everyone is fed up with those issues, if you want to attack her for that you might as well attack every single thread in ATS! Anyways, this is Pelosi's plan for the rest of the country in a sense. We should be outraged because this will not only be the problems San Francisco has but the problems that will soon be facing this country. The Left does not believe in states rights, they believe in a strong, overreaching federal government! So, you should be looking at this and realizing "oh ****, this will not stop there but rather spread EVERYWHERE" that is unless we draw attention to the issue and let others who are not paying attention in on the crazy. Tell your friends, family, loved ones. That is what the OP is trying to do and she is right in doing so.

Originally posted by muzzleflash
Nanny state?
How can the government ban circumcision? It's a religious practice....

They can't do it legally. I don't think that matters though. The Ninth District, you know Pelosi's buddies, have had something like 80% of their decisions overturned and still they will uphold this. SF can count on the Ninth to do whatever they wish. The Ninth ceased to be a real court long ago.

And this is surprising how??? San Francisco and the whole of California is the most screwed up state in the union. we should slice it at it's border and push it out into the pacific. And we should make sure Pelosi and JAne Fonda are at home there when we do it. California is a fine example of how liberalism is simply another version of communism.

Be afraid, be very very afraid!!!!!!!!!!!! What happens in California spreads to the rest to the country sooner or later. Almost every bad thing there ever has been in this country started in California first. It is like California is a TEST AREA of some kind. I feel sorry for the people that have to live there.

I'm sorry but anyone who thinks circumcisions leave a long lasting negative impact or psychological damage to a man is a complete and total moron.

reply to post by newcovenant

So exactly how many "people" felt circumcision was an important enough issue the city govt should use the force of law to encourage or prevent it (3?). No I didn't read the article it's absurd on it face.

I'm sure those three radicals forced their ideas onto the city. Perhaps nobody cared about it enough to marshall an opposition.

Defend it if you want; we all recognize typical liberal: "I love a legal mandate" activity.

reply to post by Observer99

However, I am appalled that in this day and age, circumcision is still practiced. It is a wanton mutilation of the male genitals, it severely stunts the pleasure the male can receive from sex and all without consent.

I'm circumcised and I can't ever really undo that. I had no choice in the matter. I'll never know what I'm missing. That's worse. I've read stories of men who had it done later in life, and later literally wept at the lost sensation.

You must have some personal issues. I'm cut, and I got an erection from a stiff breeze my entire repro life.

Look at the difference in pleasure men and women get from sex and there is no comparison. The government stepping in and saying "let people make their own choice" is actually good in this case.

Maybe a therapist would better help you instead of petitioning the goverment to give you pleasure? Seriously. I would never consider a gov solution to my sexual issues.

reply to post by newcovenant

reply to post by FlyersFan

Again...letting the TSA feel up your wife or the government checking out what you say on the telephone and where you travel, what books you check out of the library is fine as long as they as let you have the happy meals?
I don't get it.
You let the Patriot Act pass and until you return those and the 4th amendment violations to our constitutional rights I don't think you should be fighting for the right to endanger local species including the people. Just my opinion about what you got going down there in San Francisco. I think that's the topic.
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Where are you getting this bullcrap from? You're really talking out of your a$$, bunky. You have no idea what FF's stance is on these issues you are manufacturing. You really sound silly, you know.:shk:

I really can't believe all the hate on San Fran here. I've been there before and personally I think it's a really cool city. The people were friendly, the food was delicious, and I experienced no problems.

The thing of it is there are a lot of studies to suggest that circumcision is unnecessary and has damaging effects such as loss of sexual pleasure for example.

I am circumcised. I will never know what pleasures I am missing be having been circumcised. When I have kids, I don't think I will get them circumcised. If they want to get circumcised later in life, that is their choice.

As for the banning of happy meal toys and pet sales, I also think this is a good idea. For one, every year hundreds of puppies and kittens are killed and suffocated to death because nobody buys them. By eliminating the animal trade the city is trying to kill less puppies and kittens (not to mention other, more exotic, animals imported from overseas). I didn't see any law banning the adoption of pets, so I imagine people could still go to the shelter and get a dog or cat if they wanted one. That's where my pets come from.

Banning happy meal toys is also a good idea in the long run. The toys create a psychological attachment between the child and mcdonalds. The child thinks toys are cool, and thus because mcdonalds gives him/her a toy with the happy meal the child learns to like mcdonalds as well. There's so many fat people in this country. We don't need more, it's disgusting. Please let's care about the health of our children.

Also as was mentioned these are ballot measures that can be voted on by the city. If San Franciscans want these laws in place is that not their right? Does the city of San Francisco not have the right to self-governance? Pardon me, but I thought the right self-governance was a right in this country. It's disgusting to see people disagree just because the people of one city disagree with you.

reply to post by Jepic


I am not up for banning anything anyone wants to do with their own body, but I absolutely stand firm that everyone has the right to a natural, unmutilated unaltered body and that it is nothing short of a crime against humanity to allow people to destroy a part of someone else's body without their permission. I am continually astonished that people can decry what goes on in Africa and yet hypocritically allow it under some concept of religious freedom in the USA.

I believe in total freedom to do with your body as you see fit, but zero freedom for other people to do anything to other people's bodies without their consent.