Are You One of 23,000 Defendants in the US' Biggest Illegal Download Lawsuit?

Originally posted by Cygnus_Hunter

I think I.T Crowd says it best.Piracy laws are completely looney when they chase the little guy.Almost reminds me about a war on something else...

Who else are they going to chase?

People like myself who are capable of disassembling their code and deciphering their algorithms?

Yea, right! Good luck with that!

or big business who quietly uses their pirated s/w of course courtesy of their IT dept to reduce budget cost?

They better be glad that I am not into keygen'n or cracking anymore, no money in it! and the risks out weigh the rewards!

You are better off going online and spending a few bucks playing safe!

and with the cloud platform you are going to need programming skills, for now they want to run ALL apps on a certified VM!

reply to post by Agit8dChop


How about you tell me what you do for a living so that I can decide for myself what people like you are worth?

I'm all for copyright reform, in fact -- I'd cap it at 14 years, period. It's not great shakes to me, as I can always write more songs.

What I am not for is taking the output of someone else's creativity, drive, passion, determination and hard work, just because they can, and because they think they are "due" and because they don't believe they should have to pay for it. It's a BS argument.

90% (or more) of the people that worked on that horrible movie got paid "scale."

If enough people steal the movie, there won't be any work for them the next time around. That's BS, and wrong. Don't like the price? Don't patronize. Taking it because it's "too expensive" is never the answer, because -- if it is -- none of us deserve to get paid, ever.

Originally posted by 0zzymand0s
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Thats a BS argument. I was a professional musician all throughout the late 80's and early 90's and the most I ever made in a single year was about 60K. That was for nearly 300 days, at 10+ hours a day.

99% of all musicians, actors, artists and writers make less then a middle manager at a major corporation.

That's why I chose not to do musicianship as my main job
It's more fun as a side practice, it brings in absolutely no money unless you sell out.


Somewhat off topic: If I finish recording my CD, it'll be free for download for anyone. I'll never charge money for anything I make and it'll be all online/downloadable.

Originally posted by alphabetaone
reply to post by Agit8dChop

 

Oh I see. It's just your particular preference not to pay $30 for a DVD, Ok that does make sense.

However, I think what I was suggesting was that the further step has been taken; where others agree with that wholeheartedly and they simply have decided "well then I just dont want to pay anything, screw em".

I see it like this, that someone goes to an auto showroom, see the price tag on a new auto, cant afford it/wont afford it, and instead asks someone else to steal the car for them, as opposed to having an intermediary somewhere that sells the auto at wholesale.

For all intents and purposes, that is precisely whats happening isn't it?

Problem there is once the car is stolen its no longer sitting in the showroom.

It would be more like someone being given all the parts of the car and then assembling it from a blueprint before finally stealing it and again leaving the blueprint/parts behind so someone else can assemble it and steal it again. The cycle of course would be endless and at that point the people that made the car arent ....making the car anymore?

reply to post by 0zzymand0s


I work in IT.
What I do i wont say, but i work hard and get paid for my results.

If I earnt millions of dollars for my job, already owned 5 mansions, 20 sports cars and had a bank account the size of everest.. i'd be nothing but a greedy prick complaining that someone was downloading my movie, that I made x amount of years ago and earnt millions off.

Now your obviously going to criticise my pay for my job, purely because from your first reply to me its obvious you cant debate without getting personal, thats fine.

But like I said, Music is a different aspect.
Music is a real art, its a real passion and people struggle to get made.
People like Billy Joel, Fleetwood Mac.. these bands that really struggled... I' own their dvd's, blue rays and cd's. They are quality..

People like Britney spears, Beyonce etc etc.. I would download that over buying any day ( not that i listen to that )
But they arent real musicians, they are technology aided brats.

But like I said before I believe musics a universal thing, no matter what ones taste there should be a price.

If I had a massive online repository that required me to pay a yearly subscription to download what ever i wanted, id pay it in a heart beat.

reply to post by 0zzymand0s


Nah, that's asinine.

The problem is that the artists usually get screwed by the same big-music production companies. THEY are hording the wealth and causing the prices to be so damned ridiculous.

We see this, so understand it's actually ethical to deviate from the system in place.

To use a by now tired quote, "Resistance is futile." Once things went digital the genie was out of the bottle and the rise of torrents and file sharing was inevitable. So sorry studios and music biz-should have kept things analog if you wanted to maintain your monopoly over distribution.

reply to post by AndrewJay


exactly.
steal a car, its not in the showroom. Someone else cant buy it.
youve stolen the money the car maker recieves.

This is entirely different from music.

I download a song, its still there.
The cd's still for sale in the shop
There's still people buying it.
They still get paid.

Put it this way.

I steal a million cars..
There's a million x price of car the car maker wont get.
I sell the million cars, I become rich.

Where as I download a million songs.
Theres still a million songs for sale, for download.
I cant sell the songs, Because any man in a hat can do what I did, yet still leave the real merchandise for sale.

Originally posted by autowrench

Originally posted by maestromason
It really is a simple matter of securing your h/w, 128 bit encrypted firewalls work wonders for holding down a secured platform.

Avoid clinking on links that you do not know

Opening email from suspicious sources.

Do not visit websites of dubious natures.

Trust no pirated s/w for they are re-authored and could hold malware or exotic code.

Just be aware of your digital surroundings and if you torrent...

Well for the sake of our audience, let me say, Don't Do It! It is against the law and just plain wrong.

Against US law, perhaps. US laws do not apply to every Nation in the world, friend.
And we know the US government, and Microsoft is attempting to get everyone not to use torrents, but what you say simply is not true. I have downloaded hundreds of Linux distros using a torrent downloader, and never once got a virus.....but then, Linux doesn't seem to be affected by Windows viruses.

I live in the US so of course I am not talking about anywhere else, is that how you start an educated argument?

Two totally different architectures Windows and Linux, where did you learn that from?

Linux is not 98% of the market, Windows based OS's is 98% of the GLOBAL MARKET!

and my last line was said in sarcasm, so I see that went straight over your head.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by alphabetaone

 

A car is a physical Item.
I walk in, steal it, thats a physical thing.
Music is software.
I take it it is just reproduced, copied, cloned for FREE.

there's a massive difference between stealing a car and stealing a mp3.
As was said above im not stealing it anyway, im sharing it.

edit on 10-5-2011 by Agit8dChop because: (no reason given)

Ok, well a "service" isn't a tangible item either.

How do you feel about people who are jailed for theft of service? It can carry a mighty weighty jail term depending on the particulars of the offense.

In the legal arena, that is considered stealing, yet no tangible item to show for it. Whats your thoughts then on that?

reply to post by NuclearMitochondria


Sell out? *chuckle*

Look -- in 97 I went to work for the biggest telecommunications company in the world. I gave them 7 years and was a top transport tech, After my team put NYC back together (in the 4ESS and 5ESS sense) I was laid off in 2003 (low seniority.) I went to work for BearingPoint, won kudos and accolades for my work on their employee secure ID program. But they decided to close up shop and send my work overseas to India. They even talked me into training the Indians, and I did it cheerfully, in exchange for a wonderful letter of recommendation. That got me a job with Microsoft, which lasted 6 months until they too outsourced my work.

Since then, I've gone back to school and worked tech support for various companies for less and less pay each year. What can I say? Our records are all on vinyl with a free download coupon, and we charge about 12 bucks for those, new. I make less doing this than a most fast food assistant managers.

I still deserve to get paid. Your mileage may vary.

That's a long list. WOW.
I'm not on it. I think my hubby downloaded it though he was probably bouncing off someone else's signal probably at a hotel, where he was working. Thank God!!!! I'd kick his rear if he got me on that list!!!!

reply to post by alphabetaone


Stealing a service?
Can you elaborate?

Something like a plumber come around, doing his job, and you not paying him ?

I personally believe that downloading intellectual property that is for sale in other avenues is wrong. No matter how you slice it, you are stealing. Even if it is not a tangible item. Those people lost revenue from their creation because someone decided to obtain their work without paying.

BUT... it does get to the point where the lawsuits are obscene and frivolous. You hear about some mother of three from Ohio getting sued for $5 million dollars at $250,000 a song for downloads she made for her iPod.

That is pretty ridiculous.

Not sure about this current suit. Sounds like it will be in the courts forever with that many defendants. What they could do is pool funds between the 23K of them and obliterate the accuser with an awesome legal defense.

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
reply to post by alphabetaone

 

Stealing a service?
Can you elaborate?

Something like a plumber come around, doing his job, and you not paying him ?

No not like a plumber LOL that's kinda funny though. Although that TOO could fit as funny as it is.

No, Theft of service is an actual crime here in the states, as an example, someone grabs a couple alligator clips, snaps em onto your phone line and start making thousands of dollars worth of overseas calls to others. If they get caught, the crime is theft of service.

Theft of service is defined by state laws, which vary by state, but typically define the crime as knowingly securing the performance of a service by deception or threat, diverting another's services to the actor's own benefit, or holding personal property beyond the expiration of rental period without consent of the owner.

Intent to avoid payment may be presumed under certain circumstances, such as failure to pay for an applicable rental charge within 10 days after receiving written notice demanding payment. Such laws generally classify the crime as a misdemeanor or felony according to the value of the services stolen. Specific amounts vary by state. Local laws should be consulted for specific requirements in your area. The following is an example of a state statute dealing with theft of services:

"(a) A person commits theft of services if

1. the person obtains services, known by that person to be available only for compensation, by deception, force, threat, or other means to avoid payment for the services;
2. having control over the disposition of services of others to which the person is not entitled, the person knowingly diverts those services to the person's own benefit or to the benefit of another not entitled to them; or
3. the person obtains the use of computer time, a computer system, a computer program, a computer network, or any part of a computer system or network, with reckless disregard that the use by that person is unauthorized.

(b) Absconding without paying for hotel, restaurant, or other services for which compensation is customarily paid immediately upon the receiving of them is prima facie evidence that the services were obtained by deception.

Link for Above

It looks like anyone on a dynamic IP address is safe unless they can prove you were the one using that ip address at that exact time.

I noticed they did not catch anyone using Mediacom cable.
As a Mediacom residential customer you have a dynamic ip address.

With my setup if i plug from my modem straight to the onboard plug on the motherboard of the computer i get one ip address.
If i go from the modem through a NIC card i get another IP address

If i go through my modem to my router then to any of my computers i get another IP address.

I found out about that a couple years ago and have used it since.

Originally posted by AshleyD

BUT... it does get to the point where the lawsuits are obscene and frivolous. You hear about some mother of three from Ohio getting sued for $5 million dollars at $250,000 a song for downloads she made for her iPod.

This is in particular, the reason I stand on both sides of this issue. The remuneration NOWHERE fits the crime in a lot of instances, and where do these corporations come off as supposing that they can elicit those kinds of funds for such a small crime?

So, yea, I'm at a personal stalemate.

reply to post by Agit8dChop


Nope. IT is pretty much what I do, though at a much lower level then you, these days. Best of luck, and -- for what it's worth -- I apologize for being personal. It's a very touchy subject with me, and it pushes my buttons.

Be well.

Originally posted by ANNED
It looks like anyone on a dynamic IP address is safe unless they can prove you were the one using that ip address at that exact time.

I noticed they did not catch anyone using Mediacom cable.
As a Mediacom residential customer you have a dynamic ip address.

With my setup if i plug from my modem straight to the onboard plug on the motherboard of the computer i get one ip address.
If i go from the modem through a NIC card i get another IP address

If i go through my modem to my router then to any of my computers i get another IP address.

I found out about that a couple years ago and have used it since.

There is almost NO ISP that allows for static IP's to residential customers except in very rare instances.

At first this was because the Class C's were getting devoured at an incredible rate. They would have run out of potential IP Addresses to assign.

Just because you obtain a lease and a new IP Address (which isnt the case for most as, even though they turn off their machines, they arent cycling their routers) doesnt mean they are left without a way of positively identifying YOUR equipment as the one attached and committing the crime with at the time. When the leases are obtained, the MAC address of whatever piece of equipment is providing the WAN ip to you is filed away for just such emergencies.