Obama's NEW Birth Certificate proven to be fake hours after release

Originally posted by Annee

Authenticity of documents can not be determined on line. Period!

I think most of the people in this thread are not commenting on the validity of the *original* document because we haven't seen the original document. This thread is about the digital copy publicly available from the whie house web site.

DRUDGE REPORT has picked up on the layering and linked to here which is some poor guys blog that has crashed due to the load.

As to whether this can authenticate the original, no - because there isn't an original; hence the need to compose one from scratch from layers.

Told you - blow back is a ...

reply to post by Aim64C
If it doesn't make sense then there is a reason,it seems they wanted people to find the mistakes and that is the question why did they want us to know it was a fake??Is there someone or a group of people wanting this to come out?I can't help but feel there is so much more to this than releasing the birth certificate.

The big Deal for me is the fact that this is one layer, and within this layer you can see the three most important things were kept and at the bottom. The signatures of Local Registrar and Attending Doc and half of Obama's mothers sig.



This image provides that they fill in the REST of Obama's Mom's signature




So what I don't understand is why is Obama's mothers half signatures in two different layers of the image. Technically it should be in one.

Originally posted by rogerstigers


I think most of the people in this thread are not commenting on the validity of the *original* document because we haven't seen the original document. This thread is about the digital copy publicly available from the whie house web site.

But that's the point Annee and I are making, just because someone suspects that the document put online is a layered scanned copy.......doesn't and cannot be "proof" that it, or indeed the original document are faked in any way.

Originally posted by Bonified Ween
The big Deal for me is the fact that this is one layer, and within this layer you can see the three most important things were kept and at the bottom. The signatures of Local Registrar and Attending Doc and half of Obama's mothers sig.

So what I don't understand is why is Obama's mothers half signatures in two different layers of the image. Technically it should be in one.

edit on 27-4-2011 by Bonified Ween because: (no reason given)

This is what is leading me to believe it was some wonky artifact of the way it was scanned or generated. It's way to odd of an anomaly to be explained as a "blatent forgery". A blatent forgery would be a blank form with a layer of text.. that's not what we see here.

reply to post by allprowolfy

and since this one is already exposed as original.there is no need to break it down,no stamp equals not legal document.question to all,is your birth certificate stamped?

reply to post by Annee



You have just proven yourself to be a liar, you are no graphic designer, otherwise you would know that the layering and editing is done on a computer, it is not about testing the original document, it is about teh image purporting to be a scan of the original. besides he has not released the original document has he...

What he has released is an alleged scan of his BC, this scanned document is a fake, it has been altered in some graphic editing package, most likely Illustrator. It is undeniable, the only way a scanned document can have layers is to be edited, to have the layers made from the original scan or added later. No scanned document comes with layers EVER they have to be added

Originally posted by Logical oneBut that's the point Annee and I are making, just because someone suspects that the document put online is a layered scanned copy.......doesn't and cannot be "proof" that it, or indeed the original document are faked in any way.

Yeah, that's why I won't say it is "faked" as yet. I draw the line at "curious and strange".

Originally posted by Rising Against
So people continually ask for the Obama Birth certificate and then when It's produced, It's still rejected.

Sigh.

The people asked for the "real" Obama Birth certificate, not some digitally altered lie. Why are there any anomalies at all? If there is nothing to hide then address why it looks the way it does. Who's Barry Soetoro then?

reply to post by Logical one


I agree, it being edited is in no way proof that the orig. doesn't exsist or that he was not born in Hawaii. What this document does prove though is that for whatever reason it has been edited. It is not just someone suspecting it was edited, it WAS edited. Maybe it's the correct info, maybe not...there is no proof either way. Why was it edited is a big question.

Originally posted by WildWorld
reply to post by Logical one

 

I agree, it being edited is in no way proof that the orig. doesn't exsist or that he was not born in Hawaii. What this document does prove though is that for whatever reason it has been edited. Why?

That's a valid question........but it depends what type of editing was done......."editing" does not simply mean changing of text which some here seemed to concluded already!( I'm not saying you have WildWorld)

reply to post by Bonified Ween

I say to you good job,something very sinister is taking place and I believe this going to go nuclear.We know they are smarter than to release a document that is obviously a fake,who is behind this?Someone in high places wants this whole thing to blow wide open,the question is who?and why.I have never been someone to prophesied,but I think this is the beginning of the end for Obama.

reply to post by PrinceDreamer


A scanned document output as a PDF can have layers when opened in Illustrator. It just depends on the scanner setting and if you tell it to scan image only or include text. But as I said in my previous post, every scan I tested that included the setting of text made the text editable.

With that said, I still think what they released had been edited. And I wouldn't be surprised if the edits were OCR related.

You people do realize this PDF was created by the Hawaiian Hospital, not the WH, right?

You do realize that Hawaii switched to electric BC records in 2001, right?

You do realize that the hospital uses OCR scanning ( which may require 2, 3 passes[layers] especially with hand writing) on old vaulted originals from before 2001( printed on plain white paper) and places the layers onto new current print stock, right?

You can NEVER obtain your original BC. They will only produce copies( using graphic software or photo-copying, etc. depending on the state procedure) that are designed to meet CURRENT legal requirements ( tamper proof design, watermarks, etc.).

If anyone is at fault, it's the technician at the hospital who didn't flatten the image and then passed it on with the new print out, BC package.~ETA~ or the post below may explain why people are getting layers in Illustrator, I get no layers in Photoshop CS5....

Do you really think that if this conspiracy is real, with all the power that people attribute to it (i.e. numerous people lying, ads in newspapers 50yrs ago, etc.) They would release a doc that can be questioned?

~ETA~ In other words, this is how they make BCs in Hawaii now.......

God this crap will never end.......as the world sinks into oblivion

From the source several weeks ago:

On behalf of Adobe Systems Incorporated ...



Adobe Illustrator is not, repeat not, and repeat yet once again not a general purpose PDF file editor. Opening any arbitrary PDF file in Adobe Illustrator other than PDF files saved in that version of later of Adobe Illustrator with the editability option (which saves the Illustrator document editing data as private data within the PDF file) may result in content loss or corruption.

___

PDF layers are part of an overall feature known as optional content in PDF and are conceptually very different than Illustrator layers. Since PDF optional content features in general are very much a superset of Illustrator layers (PDFMaker for PowerPoint uses optional content to handle certain slide build features, for example), there would be no easy way for Illustrator to readily pick and choose what optional content features to support and translate. As such, don't expect this to be "rectified" in any way in future Illustrator releases.



(To make things even more interesting, both PDF and Illustrator layers are very different than Photoshop layers which allow for defined interactions between layers such as masking!)

Dov Isaacs

From the adobe forums.
Basically, scanning in PDF = immediate wonkification and pseudo-layers if opened in illustrator if I am grasping what this is saying.

Which means the whole open in illustrator or use illustrator in general at any step of the process = wonkyness abound.

Take it for what you will.

add: Source of that clip

Originally posted by rogerstigers
This is what is leading me to believe it was some wonky artifact of the way it was scanned or generated. It's way to odd of an anomaly to be explained as a "blatant forgery". A blatant forgery would be a blank form with a layer of text.. that's not what we see here.

This I agree with. Different equipment and programs - - generate things differently.

There is a Republican elected official - - who went to the actual health department in Hawaii - - saw the long form herself - - and has verified its existence. I can't remember her name. That works for me.

I can't believe the White House released it in several layers!

That has to be deliberate. If TPTB wanted a forged birth certificate, it would have been perfect.

For those who don't understand about layers, trust me, this is really really sloppy.

Too sloppy.

Whoever released this knew full well this was going to be discovered.

This is what Trump had to say about it being released:

"I am really honored, frankly, to have played such a big role in hopefully, hopefully getting rid of this issue."

As for the actual document, Trump added, "We have to look at it, we have to see ... is it real? Is it proper? What's on it? But I hope it checks out beautifully."

www.tmz.com...

He knows full well this is going to be discovered. Mark my words, Trump will jump on this.

I think this is all done by TPTB to gain public support for Trump. They're rigging the next election.

Originally posted by Logical one

Originally posted by WildWorld
reply to post by Logical one

 

I agree, it being edited is in no way proof that the orig. doesn't exsist or that he was not born in Hawaii. What this document does prove though is that for whatever reason it has been edited. Why?

That's a valid question........but it depends what type of editing was done......."editing" does not simply mean changing of text which some here seemed to concluded already!( I'm not saying you have WildWorld)

edit on 27-4-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)

No one can say that the actual text/wording of the document was changed or not. But it being edited at all in any way is highly suspicious and should make people question what was edited and why....birther or not.

Originally posted by Annee
There is a Republican elected official - - who went to the actual health department in Hawaii - - saw the long form herself - - and has verified its existence. I can't remember her name. That works for me.

No source = didn't happen.

2nd line