Brain vs. Mind: Are they indeed two separate entities?

I believe that the mind and brain aren't really separate - the mind is the consciousness created by the brain.
From a spiritual perspective, I believe that the soul is the self, and when we die, the soul dies. What powers the body, the spirit, is not an entity but a living force. So I don't think the mind/consciousness is the result of soul or spirit.
Just my 2 cents on the topic

reply to post by yic17


In your OP you asked for personal examples. I only briefed the replies so far and for the most part I am seeing that everyone is more or less giving you their view of the initial inquiry in the title of your OP. Not that I am discounting or otherwise criticizing any of these replies in the slightest. None the less, I would like to give you two personal experiences as to why I feel there is most definitely two separate functions occurring, or as you have stated in the title, "two separate entities".

First, keep the phrase "Mind over Matter" in your "mind" as this holds prevalence to what I am going to share.

The first example seemingly only happens to me, because I have informed people in the past of this peculiar occurrence and I have been met with "no that hasn't really ever happened to me that I am aware of" so this may in fact be just me and the way my "mind" and "brain" work against each other.

Periodically, in the mornings as my alarm is going off (mind you I am sooo not a morning person), I, or what I feel is my "brain" immediately creates a dream scenario where by the alarm sound somehow way shape or form is incorporated into the dream and is passed off as a nonchalant and meaningless sound in the dream.

For example, the alarm (which is on my cellphone and set to the traditional ringing alarm clock sound) is interpreted by my "mind" as something usually insignificant in nature and is otherwise disregarded by my "mind' as to the level of importance that it should represent. I feel that my "brain" is the culprit in that for all intents and purposes it just isn't ready to stop sleeping and to convince my rational "mind" of this, it creates the aforementioned.

So this is the first example of why I feel they're separate. My "mind" knows full well that if I don't get up I'll be late for work, which could get me fired, which would prevent me from paying my bills, eating, and otherwise maintaining my quality of life. Why would my "brain" create a scenario like that just because it feels that my body requires more rest? Because, they are in fact two separate entities working simultaneously imo and sometimes against one another.

The second example, is addiction. I am addicted to nicotine and smoke cigarettes at the frequency of maybe a pack every day and a half. My "mind" knows that they are unhealthy, that they could potentially cause me all kinds of medical issues, that they stink and are unpleasant in virtually every aspect. However, my "brain" has built a chemical dependence to them.

If you've ever tried to quit smoking you can most likely attest to this fight between the "mind" and the "brain". Therein lies the relationship to "Mind over Matter". When in actuality, and more so in line with addictions, it should be "Mind over Brain" as the same aspect is prevalent in the previous example in that the "brain' goes out of it's way to convince the "mind". The hard part for most people is forcing their "mind" to virtually outsmart the "brain" and if one can prevail the "brain" will usually reluctantly submit, but can still, even years later, try the same tricks to get what it wants.

So per your request in the OP this is my two personal experiences of why I firmly believe that we as humans operate on two separate levels. This is commonly referred to as Conscious and Sub-Conscious if my knowledge serves me correct. Thank you for allowing me this opportunity to share my experiences and I hope that I may have at least somewhat gave you food for thought on the two actually being "two separate entities'.

S&F for your thread!

Respectfully,
UberL33t

reply to post by yic17

Woe, O woe unto thee. Knows’t not what thou hast done?

By meddling in dark and secret matters beyond thy ken, thou has opened a Door Between Worlds through which dark and terrible entities such as the fearsome Michael Cecil will enter thy thread and plague thee and thy fellow-posters for endless, futile pages.

O rash and foolish one! Thou’t doomed!

reply to post by UberL33t


Hello. Reading through your post certainly makes me think of conscious and subconscious. It seems like you call your brain the subconscious and your mind the conscious.

Which I do believe they do exist - conscious and subconscious.

But I guess what I am wondering is .. do they exist inside of your brain? Or do you think there is something else that exists beyond your brain? Perhaps something people call the "soul"?

reply to post by yic17


Well, effectively, that question could be a thread in of itself. To answer you though, yes, in so many words. However, I feel it is more an energy as opposed to a spiritual mechanism. I believe that energy is constant despite the physical body it inhabits or does not inhabit. This, leads us into a whole new topic from the question in your OP.

reply to post by yic17

So without the brain, will I still have consciousness?

I know there are people pointing me to remote viewing and astral travel.

However, can one remote view or astral travel without the brain?

"Astral travel" is the natural mode of operation in the astral region. You cannot take your physical body to the astral, so no, you don't need a brain.

However, if you are still alive in the physical body, then naturally you need your brain to maintain the life of your body, so if you wish to astral travel, you still need your brain.

Originally posted by yic17

Even the brain I see - is only an illusion created by my own brain. Why can't the brain see itself? Am I missing something here?

So I'm not sure how the mind/consciousness is not within the brain. I still can see that it is the brain that creates the mind/consciousness.

Thank you.

edit on 24-4-2011 by yic17 because: (no reason given)

Not wanting to go off topic, as you are having so much fun, I just want to point out my view that the brain or everything else by that matter, actually is. It is not an illusion. It is real. We don't create it, it is.

The illusion is our perception of the existing reality. The brain is there for that. To perceive.

Hope I added to the confusion.

S&F

The brain is a hugely complex organ comprising many billions of neurons and hundreds of billions of synaptic connections. The brain is the centre of the nervous system and controls the body. It is true to say that we don’t fully understand the mechanics of the brain.

The mind is somewhat vague and is a function of the brain. The mind is intellect and consciousness. I think that it is true to say that we don’t fully understand what the mind is.

You cannot have a mind without a brain. Although no expert in this complex subject, I suspect complex brains (e.g. of mammals) have varying degrees of complex minds. Whether a dog has a mind that expresses intelligence is not really questioned, but whether a dog has a mind which can express imagination would be somewhat more difficult to demonstrate. The human brain produces a mind which does so much more than any other animal.

The human brain is surely the most complex “thing” we have discovered because it has the capability to produce consciousness and intellect, as encapsulated by the term “mind”. I think the mind is merely a function of the brain, or rather, mind is part of the brain.

Regards