Reduction in chemtrails, are they done?

Originally posted by Iwinder

Originally posted by cushycrux

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by DONTBEIGNORANT

 

Sorry......here, you posted information (fascinating as it is, but....) about meteorites??

Them rudely demand that people "wake up" (??)

Want to get back to the subject?

Hey friend after 17000 stars you should learn to take it easy. If a brain don't want's to know, you have no chance to "win" - peace and love bro, it's easter time.

Stars have nothing to do with this thread, let's try and keep this on the rails.
Regards, Iwinder

Stars and Stripes maybe

like i've said before. i work at atlanta airport. so...i see a lot of airplanes in the sky. funny, though, cuz they don't all make these trails. i will see planes for hours and no trails. then, i'll see a plane laying a chyemtrail and all the sudden, i see 2-4 planes laying chemtrails, all in line formation, back and forth and across. then, UNDER these chemtrail planes, i will see other planes flying by. yes...under. i see them fly under the chemtrails and land. i see them fly under the chemtrails and fly through. so yeah...it seems, to my untrained eye, that the chemtrail planes are flying higher than reguler air traffic and that there is a definite relation to seeing a chem trail and then seeing mayn vs. seeing regular airplanes all day.

i've witnissed this at different times of days, different seasons, different temperatures, different cloud cover and pretty much every other variable. yeah...the chemtrail planes and their "exhaust" break all the other standards. the chemtrail planes are the variable. hmmm...contrails? on CON TALES?

reply to post by ICEKOHLD


Key words here:

...it seems, to my untrained eye...

What you've described, firstly, are typical patterns of airplanes passing by your airport (ATL) and not landing. The ones that are arriving/departing will not form contrails, of course.

Really....since you say you "work" at the airport....there is no excuse for you not seeking out a pilot, and asking.


Delta Airlines, of course, the biggest dog there....Air Tran has a hub as well (soon to merge with Southwest, though).

Do this: I can link for you to online sources showing the aeronautical navigation charts, to begin to give you a better picture of what's going on...but, nothing is better than having the actual charts in your hands, for convenience of reference.

Ask some guys (and gals) if they have any Jepps (Jeppesen) revisions to do.....each revision cycle, many charts and plates are thrown out....but, charts only update every few months, in a staggered fashion, as needed. You want to get the "High" number 7/8, by Jeppesen.....to cover the Atlanta area, and the south and north east USA. If you can get the "1/2" also, will be bonus.

Now...online, Jeppesen doesn't give away their stuff for free....(subscriptions to their revision service are quite expensive...).

BUT, the US government has the same information, in their versions, and you CAN see current information online.

skyvector.com...

A VFR chart will open up....seems to be a random selection, for a first time visit to the site. It will leave cookies, and take you back on future visits, to your searches.

If you take some time, all of the charts have decoding legends, on the end panels, to explain and decipher the symbols.....you can teach yourself that way....or, just ASK a pilot.


Look along the top, left....is a globe....hover over that. A drop-down menu of charts appears.

Go to the tab saying "Enroute High". Click. The High Enroute charts will display, for the US coverage...the gov't NOAA charts have different numbering system....you want "H-9" for Atlanta. You can see how they overlap slightly, where they join.

The "High" charts are larger coverage, smaller scale when printed....to be manageable size, since jets are much faster in the High sectors....

All of those black lines? Jet Airways. See, they are numbered. Those are routes that will be travelled by airplanes simply passing by Atlanta (in your case) and not landing there.....so, you can instantly see all the various directions possible, and WHY the contrails look "haphazard" to you, viewed from the ground.

You need to learn......

reply to post by weedwhacker


"you need to learn"
We all need to learn Weedwhacker thats why most of us are here.
Just don't appoint yourself and your ego as the all knowing teacher here.
Believe it or not there are a lot of folks here at ATS who know how to think and post their thoughts as they see them.
Regards, Iwinder

Originally posted by Iwinder
Where do you figure these "raised levels" are originating from then? From what I have read, these raised levels are quite alarming. Does Barium and Aluminum just march across the Continent all by itself?

And as I've already stated three times now in this thread, if planes were "spraying" chemicals with aluminum and barium, those chemicals will be on every single inanimate object outside. EVERYTHING. Your house, car, kid's playset, dog house, swimming pool, bushes, lawn, trees. Anything and everything outside under the sky will have these chemicals on them.

If believers in "chemtrails" want to prove once and for all that planes are spraying chemicals, the above objects need to be swabbed and tested in the lab for aluminum and barium. If the tests come back positive, you have a case. If not, this "chemtrail" disinformation goes quietly into the night and you all can get back to some sort of real life instead of the BS fear-mongering.

Originally posted by kahunausa
prop planes running on gasoline do not form contrails and could not fly high enough anyway

Weedwhacker owned you on this, but I still wanted to comment anyway.

Gasoline engines do leave contrails. You can view those contrails from something as simple as your car in the winter time:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/850f984a4b0f.jpg[/atsimg]

It's the actual warm/hot water vapor in the very cold air that makes the contrail. It doesn't matter if the engine is a gasoline or jet engine, all of these engines expel warm water vapor.

If you could drive your car at the altitude of a plane, you would leave a contrail across the sky just exactly like a plane does.

Originally posted by kahunausa
I am a pilot with 40 yrs.

I very highly doubt that. Especially after reading the above, and this:

Originally posted by kahunausa
chemtrails stop and start

You mean CONtrails. And what do you think the advantage would be of flipping a switch on and off, on and off? Hmm? What's more likely is that the plane is skimming part of the atmosphere where contrails can form and where they don't

I have a flight simulator that does the exact same thing. When you get to a certain altitude, the CONtrail goes on and off until you get a little higher where the contrail is persistent.


As a pilot, you must've only flown Pipers or something at low altitude because any pilot that flies at an altitude that would produce contrails, would say that everything you've said is absolutely false. And it was proven false by a real and known pilot.

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD
i see a lot of airplanes in the sky. funny, though, cuz they don't all make these trails.

It's also funny though, because not all planes fly at the same altitude, and thus all planes are not flying at an altitude that produces contrails.

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD
the chemtrail planes are flying higher than reguler air traffic

That's because the higher the plane, the colder the air and the better the chances of contrails forming.

Originally posted by Iwinder
We all need to learn Weedwhacker thats why most of us are here.

But most people aren't here to learn. Most "chemtrail" believers in this thread have used attacks and name-calling to try to impose their views onto those with opposing views. Furthermore, most "chemtrail" believers in this thread alone are all spouting about "chemtrails" as if they're definitive and factual, when there really is no real provable scientific evidence to suggest as much.

Whatever people are here for, there's two things that should, by now, be completely obvious.

1) Alert posts considered to be trolling.

2) Never answer to trolling, since it makes moderating all the more work.

Carry on

Originally posted by _BoneZ_

Originally posted by Iwinder
Where do you figure these "raised levels" are originating from then? From what I have read, these raised levels are quite alarming. Does Barium and Aluminum just march across the Continent all by itself?

And as I've already stated three times now in this thread, if planes were "spraying" chemicals with aluminum and barium, those chemicals will be on every single inanimate object outside. EVERYTHING. Your house, car, kid's playset, dog house, swimming pool, bushes, lawn, trees. Anything and everything outside under the sky will have these chemicals on them.

If believers in "chemtrails" want to prove once and for all that planes are spraying chemicals, the above objects need to be swabbed and tested in the lab for aluminum and barium. If the tests come back positive, you have a case. If not, this "chemtrail" disinformation goes quietly into the night and you all can get back to some sort of real life instead of the BS fear-mongering.

Thanks for the reply there BoneZ but you neglected or forgot to address my question of " where these elevated levels" of barium and aluminum are originating from?
I am serious here and not knocking at your post I really want to know why we have this problem and where it is being produced?
Why then is there no study going on to find out why we are being on-slotted with these chemicals?
I figure a good way to make money is to buy a few thousand acres and start mining Aluminum and Barium and sell it to the defense department or what -ever alphabet agency you choose.
Barium and Aluminum should not and cannot increase in the amounts we are seeing here.
Regards, Iwinder

Originally posted by Iwinder
Thanks for the reply there BoneZ but you neglected or forgot to address my question of " where these elevated levels" of barium and aluminum are originating from?

Contrary to popular belief, I don't know everything. And, thus, I can't answer your question because I don't know and it doesn't concern me very much at this time.

But, as I've stated, if planes really were spraying anything, and especially leaving behind elements such as aluminum and barium, those elements would be on every single possible thing outside, not just the ground. Do you agree with that? If planes are spraying, those chemicals aren't just going to be found on the ground. They'd be found on every single thing outside in the open air.

Originally posted by Iwinder
Why then is there no study going on to find out why we are being on-slotted with these chemicals?

Another thing I can't answer. But I can tell you this: if I was a believer in "chemtrails", I would surely spend some of my own money to get as many swabs from objects outside as possible and have them tested in a lab. All just to shut the debunkers and skeptics down and rub it in their faces.

But there is nobody stepping up to the plate and taking the initiative to finally produce some repeatable scientific evidence to shut the skeptics up. Instead, all we have is a bunch of new people signing up to forums and attacking, demeaning, and calling the debunkers and skeptics names instead of sticking to the topic and evidence (or lack of).

There's no better way to discuss a topic or try to get your point across and convince others of your beliefs, than to attack them and call them names. What happened to grown-up civil debates and discussions?

Originally posted by Iwinder
Barium and Aluminum should not and cannot increase in the amounts we are seeing here.

And those amounts should be present on every single object outside if it's coming from planes. If not, then another study should be undertaken to see where it's coming from in the ground since it won't be coming from planes.

Originally posted by colbyforce
reply to post by Tygart

 

It's been radioactive raining here for weeks. I haven't seen the sun since the 8th in Salt Lake City.

What with April being the wettest month in SLC and all...??

But even with that you've either been inside to much, or you're not quite being truthful....

www.weather.gov...

Daily weather for SLC - cloud cover was 1.0 (full cover) on only 1the 8th and the 18th, mostly it's 0.6-0.8, with a few .9, .5, .4 and .3.

Sorry to burst your belief system with facts

reply to post by stars15k


Dude! (or Ma'am). As per a response by an ATS forum member regarding said photo of mine, I didn't make up that word "triangulated". Might have been sacarsm for all I care.

Anyway, thanks for the "heads up". I'll try to use whatever is left of more rational thought processes regarding what I see in the skies.

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD

i see them fly under the chemtrails and land. i see them fly under the chemtrails and fly through. so yeah...it seems, to my untrained eye, that the chemtrail planes are flying higher than reguler air traffic .

It is almost axiomatic that planes flying lower will not leave contrails - that doesn't make hte lower ones "regular air traffic" and the higher ones something else.

air traffic flies at all altitudes. For jets the higher the better - they are much more efficient at high altitude.

However on shorter routes they might not have enough distance to climb to very high altitudes - near here there is a jet route that is only 200 miles long - the jets flying it (A320's & B737-300's) only get to about 25-26,000 feet. Turbopros on the same route are even lower.

Unless you have the data on temperature and humidity at the altitude they are flying you really can't say anything more than what I've said above.

Chemtrailers often say "Trust your eyes" - well that's just nonsense. Your eyes cannot tell you what the conditions are at 30,000+ feet any more than they can tell you how much iron, aluminium, fluoride or cyanide is in a glass of water. You need proper tests to do so, and constantly saying "trust your eyes" is jsut an excuse to ignore science because they know that there's no scientific evidence at all - it's purely an appeal to emotion instead of evidence.

reply to post by _BoneZ_


Thanks for the reply and for being honest about not knowing or pretending to know where all this Barium and Aluminum is coming from.
It really needs it's own thread I think, but it would probably bounce right back to the chemtrail thing.
I think rightly so but that is just my opinion.
Though I do think you should be worried about the Barium and Aluminum and rightly so as I know your not stupid and I know you do research.
Anyone can Google either and see that they are both very very toxic indeed.
Regards, Iwinder

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD
like i've said before. i work at atlanta airport. so...i see a lot of airplanes in the sky. funny, though, cuz they don't all make these trails. i will see planes for hours and no trails. then, i'll see a plane laying a chyemtrail and all the sudden, i see 2-4 planes laying chemtrails, all in line formation, back and forth and across. then, UNDER these chemtrail planes, i will see other planes flying by. yes...under. i see them fly under the chemtrails and land. i see them fly under the chemtrails and fly through. so yeah...it seems, to my untrained eye, that the chemtrail planes are flying higher than reguler air traffic and that there is a definite relation to seeing a chem trail and then seeing mayn vs. seeing regular airplanes all day.

i've witnissed this at different times of days, different seasons, different temperatures, different cloud cover and pretty much every other variable. yeah...the chemtrail planes and their "exhaust" break all the other standards. the chemtrail planes are the variable. hmmm...contrails? on CON TALES?

edit on 4/25/11 by ICEKOHLD because: (no reason given)

edit on 4/25/11 by ICEKOHLD because: (no reason given)

Yes ICEKOHLD, it's pretty obvious isn't it when you personally view these intentional cloud building and seeding efforts, that the robotic stock replies of the bunktoids here posted over and over and over really don't explain what you see. I think it says alot about your ability to see through the intentional smoke and mirrors of those who attempt to stand in the way of people looking into these programs.

Don't know if you have ever read 'Clouds of Secrecy' by Leonard Cohen, it's a good place to start to see just what people are up against attempting to learn about these clandestine type programs. One can just imagine the robotic bunkster crew here (if ATS had been around decades ago), attempting to shill for the chemical and biological open air tests that were reportedly carried out over hundreds of cities and millions of people, saying 'got proof', no 'that' doesn't porove it, no 'that' doesn't prove it, all the while more alert and perceptive people made the connections despite the lies and coverups.

We still hear from some of these bunktoids using their simplistic thinking 'Hey that CAN"T be happening they wouldn't spray chemicals over themselves too,,," yada yada, when of course their minds can't seem to grasp the reality of not only known open air chemical and biological tetsing but validated nuclear testing that spread isotopes over nearly all of the U.S. without a seeming care in the world of who it might affect. Now days I suppose the stock reply is "well we don't do THAT anymore.... 'got proof'....'no that doesn't prove it',,, no 'that doesn't prove it' over and over and over, they have to be spoon fed by someone in 'authority' before they can admit or ever see what is so plain and obvious to so many of the rest of perceptive and aware people.

Don't ever let them sway you, keep looking up, watching, filming and sharing when possible, on youtube and on every board you go to, and perhaps if you really get interested join the few that are collecting actual samples. Eventually these programs just like their predecessors will become known in time, hopefully it will be before too many effects are felt by the population. Every day I see more references to these atmospheric engineering programs on now many MS media sites, tons of white papers out there, many scientists and some politicians getting the public warmed up to it, though not ready to come fully out of the closet yet, so awareness grows despite the attempts of those to slow it. Now bunkies give us your stock robotic replies, I'm sure someone somewhere will believe you,,,,maybe.... for a short while.

Originally posted by Iwinder
Thanks for the reply there BoneZ but you neglected or forgot to address my question of " where these elevated levels" of barium and aluminum are originating from?

What elevated levels? Tell us exactly, and what typical levels would be.

Originally posted by firepilot

Originally posted by Iwinder
Thanks for the reply there BoneZ but you neglected or forgot to address my question of " where these elevated levels" of barium and aluminum are originating from?

What elevated levels? Tell us exactly, and what typical levels would be.

and why there isn't inches of aluminum and borium on the ground after years of spraying and why everyone and everything isn't dead by now....

reply to post by Tecumte


So what you're saying is that yuo are relying upong decades old tests as beign evidene that something competely different is happening today?

Sadly that is typical of het chemtrail religion.

Lacking anything factual the beleivers resort to emotional connections - they kept secret testing from us 40-50-60 years ago so OF COURSE they are keepign it from us today.

sorry - that's jsut bravo sierra.

If the "spraying" you say is happening was true then you'd be able to measure it.

There is much better communication, easy public access to sampling equipment and labs, a world side network of the faithful, better telescopes, cameras everywhere. there are peace activists keeping any eye bases all around the country, more wealth in the hands of "ordinary people" to enable them to band together to accomplish the more expensive aspects.

Conditions for secrecy are nothing at all like they weer 5- years ago.

If there is anything in the atmosphere it is easy to get samples and find what it is.

Why don't you get together and hire an aircraft to go take samples?

You could prove this thing instantly if you did so and there was "something" there.

What's more if you did so then I'd beleive you - and so would most other rational science types - because it would be REAL EVIDENCE.

Instead you keep up with the non-evidence "look up, trust what you see", and as you aahve done - " they did "it" 50 years ago so they must be ding ot today" bunkum.

It's just nonsense. And I reckon you KNOW it's nonsense too - but you've given up trying facts - because they don't support you and you know it.

reply to post by UrgentInsurgent


I missed your post, conflicting timezones I guess:

What does the term aerosol mean in that context then?

Why not be clear, since you have all the answers...

Well....I have some answers, because have looked into this, and been seeing the same bogus claims made, for a long time now. People not fully comprehending he science, NOR the intent, of these many papers they cite.

In terms of the paper HERE ("osti", from page or so back) it is quite evident, if you care to read it carefully again.

Despite the (woefully incomplete) dictionary description posted by someone else...(YES, of course the term "aerosol" can be applied to underarm sprays, and pressurized paint cans, etc) but, it omitted the fact that the term "aerosol" will also refer to NATURALLY OCCURRING mechanisms in the atmosphere...as described in the item linked above. THAT was the misunderstanding, when reading the word "aerosol", and what it was referring to. The paper was studying HOW aerosol particles behave in Nature...how they move around the planet. (This is ALL, yes, precursor work and study to understand better, if SOME DAY....IF the concepts of geoengineering being talked about are ever implemented....).


atmospheric aerosol sources

The atmospheric aerosol is a complex and dynamic mixture of solid and liquid particles from natural and anthropogenic sources. The natural background aerosol is present in the absence of human activity, while the urban aerosol is dominated by anthropogenic sources.

"anthropogenic" sources means "man-made". AND, this is generally due far, far more to ground-based sources than anything in the air. Airplanes pollute, of course....no argument. The exhaust is a result of burning hydrocarbon fossil fuels...so, of course, this is a pollutant.

Oh, and the list, form the next page, above linked paper:

Source

Natural:

Soil dust

Sea salt

Botanical debris

Volcanic dust

Forest fires

Gas-to-particle conversion

Photochemical

******
Anthropogenic:

Direct emissions

Gas-to-particle conversion

Photochemical

(eidted list, see the paper for more data)....

But, the paltry numbers of airplanes in operation, compared to 100s of Billions of cars, trucks, buses, trains, lawnmowers, etc, etc...?? Pfffft!