Focardi & Rossi E-Cat: First Cold Fusion Power Plant to be built in Greece. Next one in USA!

If this is such big ground breaking news then why isn't it on MSN or in any of the main stream newspapers?? probably because this is a very good hoax, none of the reputable science websites are reporting it either, they allways report on ground breaking stuff.

Hoax/BS

Originally posted by boncho
reply to post by Arken

 

Is it not better to advertise as much as possible this discovery and spread the official tests and experiments made in public and official laboratories of Phisics (University of Bologna) in front of dozens and dozens of phisics Phds., scholars and very, very skilled researchers in this field?

He has been paying the University to run labs there. He invited specific people to his demo. It was not an open invitation, and there have been offers by many researchers to validate his work. No, advertising is counter-productive. If he had laid out ironclad proof, then it would be very productive.

edit on 13-4-2011 by boncho because: (no reason given)

Boncho/Gheddafi... Boncho/Gheddafi... Boncho/Gheddafi...
Your tricks with words don't impress me

Or
1) You are not aware of the entire stuff...
Or
2) You came from OZ...

1 or 2 ?

Originally posted by Itop1
If this is such big ground breaking news then why isn't it on MSN or in any of the main stream newspapers??

Stay tuned....Stay tuned....

Originally posted by Itop1
If this is such big ground breaking news then why isn't it on MSN or in any of the main stream newspapers?? probably because this is a very good hoax, none of the reputable science websites are reporting it either, they allways report on ground breaking stuff.

Hoax/BS

Yeah because we all know it if it is not in the MSM it must not be true... Sigh!

And to the mentally challenged who are whining about it being proprietary, ah yeah we all know how well that worked for Pons and Fleischmann when they discovered cold fusion, they were ridiculed and targeted, now most think CF is snake oil despite it being reproduced many times since then as Dr. Storms verifies confirms home.netcom.com...

Rossi is smart to keep this proprietary till he has it in operation Considering what happened to them. And it is just good business sense for a world changing invention. Despite the suspicion cast on his background he sold everything and invested it all in this and is not asking for any money. And has said he knows it is do or die with this. He has no motive for fraud here. Otherwise why would he waste his money if he knew it did not work? He would be fleecing investors for money if that were the case. If it does work he stands to make a lot of money then and only then.

With the prominent Scientist who have confirmed several things about this it is looking very promising so far. Scepticism is good but lets not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

Originally posted by hawkiye

Originally posted by Itop1
If this is such big ground breaking news then why isn't it on MSN or in any of the main stream newspapers?? probably because this is a very good hoax, none of the reputable science websites are reporting it either, they allways report on ground breaking stuff.

Hoax/BS

Yeah because we all know it if it is not in the MSM it must not be true... Sigh!

And to the mentally challenged who are whining about it being proprietary, ah yeah we all know how well that worked for Pons and Fleischmann when they discovered cold fusion, they were ridiculed and targeted, now most think CF is snake oil despite it being reproduced many times since then as Dr. Storms verifies confirms home.netcom.com...

Rossi is smart to keep this proprietary till he has it in operation Considering what happened to them. And it is just good business sense for a world changing invention. Despite the suspicion cast on his background he sold everything and invested it all in this and is not asking for any money. And has said he knows it is do or die with this. He has no motive for fraud here. Otherwise why would he waste his money if he knew it did not work? He would be fleecing investors for money if that were the case. If it does work he stands to make a lot of money then and only then.

With the prominent Scientist who have confirmed several things about this it is looking very promising so far. Scepticism is good but lets not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

edit on 13-4-2011 by hawkiye because: (no reason given)

If this was true it would be breaking news on several science websites and most likely in some of the newspapers, but it isn't, the only news is from blog sites or similar.

reply to post by Itop1


It has received mainstream coverage in Greece? Sort of...


I don't see it being picked up by other mainstream outlets though, because the evidence provided to support that it is real, is inadequate.

*Note* I'm actually not sure if you can consider tvradio.ert.gr... mainstream....

reply to post by hawkiye

Rossi is smart to keep this proprietary till he has it in operation Considering what happened to them. And it is just good business sense for a world changing invention.

I thought he already had demonstrated a working device? It actually doesn't make any sense to keep it secret. Who is going to stop people from copying or eventually even patenting it? His top priority should be to get it patented and get the scientists to confirm the effect.

reply to post by hawkiye

Despite the suspicion cast on his background he sold everything and invested it all in this and is not asking for any money. And has said he knows it is do or die with this. He has no motive for fraud here. Otherwise why would he waste his money if he knew it did not work? He would be fleecing investors for money if that were the case.

Mills has fleeced investors for 60 million over the years but has never produced anything that can go to market. Not a bad deal really.

He has no motive for fraud here.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/fd326df9748b.jpg[/atsimg]

Something like 200million is supposed to go into Defkalion. A company connected to three unknowns with gmail addresses. Most people don't use gmail for business, just so you know.

Rossi was already convicted of tax fraud and money laundering. So you are going to take his word that he isn't making money because he claims to have signed a contract with a fly by night company....?

With the prominent Scientist who have confirmed several things about this it is looking very promising so far.

The a... "prominent scientist" has not confirmed anything of value. Did you want to point out to me where they monitored flow rate through the entire experiment?

It should be noted that no error analysis has been done but according to Giuseppe Levi, a 5% error in the measurement of the water flow is a conservative estimate.

1

They are deducing their energy production on the amount of steam created without taking proper temperature measurements, correct me if I am wrong.

The heat of vaporization is 630 Wh/kg. Assuming that all water will be vaporized, the
energy required to bring 1 kg water of 18 °C to vapor is 95+630=725 Wh/kg. To heat up the
adjusted water flow of 6.47 kg/hour from 18 °C to vapor will require 725 6.47=4.69 kWh/hour. The power required for heating and vaporization is thus 4.69 kW.

reply to post by boncho

Something like 200million is supposed to go into Defkalion.

Something like 70 Billions Euros (not dollars) for the last Nuclear power plant in FINLAND by now.

But the last report says that they need OTHER 36 BILLIONS Euros. And it is not finished yet!

The beauty about science, is that there is good science and bad science. It is not a character attack to say that a scientist is doing a piss poor job. They are supposed to follow a scientific method. Any scientist, no matter their character, can provide great results as long as they follow the method. This is to eliminate error, and is one of the main reasons for blind studies.

You really do come across as a knee-jerk skeptic, boncho - I've seen so many like you in all the forums/blogs I trawl and I have to say that it pisses me off how quickly you guys jump on stuff and label it scam without having done the least amount of investigation. For this topic in particular, take a look at the vortex mailing list and see lots of, likely, smarter guys than you giving Rossi the benefit of the doubt. To be clear regarding Rossi, the title Ing. stands for engineer, not scientist or professor. Not that being an engineer means that you don't work methodically, or in a way to document what you're doing for reproducibility, but, to a large degree, engineers (my university degree, too) are driven by practical concerns and apply science to make real things now (as opposed to years from now) and are less concerned about the need to publish in "reputable" papers.

On the vortex list you will find skeptical discussion as well, but in general the minds you'll meet there are as open as they should be.

Cheers

reply to post by tangan

On the vortex list you will find skeptical discussion as well, but in general the minds you'll meet there are as open as they should be.

Funny that you bring that up. Seeing as Vortex is has been one of my main starting points for every investigation I do on this story.

Rothwell, who is a staunch supporter of Rossi, himself can't figure out why the guy has been so secretive. There are plenty of researchers on that list that have offered to validate Rossi's work but he has no interest. In fact, since he has found the amount of discussion that is being done it seems like he is cutting off the information supply to these guys.

Either that, or just giving nonsense answer. Look for where Rossi was questioned about the Cu Isotopes and replied in turn about Ni isotopes. No one made much sense of that. But of course, no one has made much sense of anything Rossi has said.

You really do come across as a knee-jerk skeptic, boncho - I've seen so many like you in all the forums/blogs I trawl and I have to say that it pisses me off how quickly you guys jump on stuff and label it scam without having done the least amount of investigation.

You want to quote me where I said it was an out and out scam? I think there may have been one thread I have done it in, and if I have then please post and I will retract that statement. As I have said, until Rossi does some independent studies or lets someone inside of his machine, the conclusions are inconclusive.

To be clear regarding Rossi, the title Ing. stands for engineer, not scientist or professor. Not that being an engineer means that you don't work methodically, or in a way to document what you're doing for reproducibility, but, to a large degree, engineers (my university degree, too) are driven by practical concerns and apply science to make real things now (as opposed to years from now) and are less concerned about the need to publish in "reputable" papers.

Woah, woah, woah. Rossi got his diploma from a diploma mill. Are you saying you have a fake diploma too? Have you read any of my posts?

I have done a lot of research into this. Rossi's fake diploma, a dead person on his adviser board, a misrepresented blog that mimics a journal, someone who claims to be working DOD who also claims to spy on CF... also on his board-no scientific background btw (that guys wife, a writer who pretended to be a hooker to write a book, now marketing cold fusion), bad methods, past fraud including environmental damage, money laundering and tax evasion....

Are you comparing yourself to him? Just curious....

Originally posted by Arken

reply to post by boncho

 

Something like 200million is supposed to go into Defkalion.

Something like 70 Billions Euros (not dollars) for the last Nuclear power plant in FINLAND by now.

But the last report says that they need OTHER 36 BILLIONS Euros. And it is not finished yet!

And it was one single person setting up that company? There were only a few handful of people standing to profit. I'm not sure what your comparison is supposed to project...

reply to post by boncho


Boncho/Gheddafi.... Boncho/Gheddafi...

I'm sure now, you came from OZ!

reply to post by boncho

Woah, woah, woah. Rossi got his diploma from a diploma mill. Are you saying you have a fake diploma too? Have you read any of my posts?

I have done a lot of research into this. Rossi's fake diploma, a dead person on his adviser board, a misrepresented blog that mimics a journal, someone who claims to be working DOD who also claims to spy on CF... also on his board-no scientific background btw (that guys wife, a writer who pretended to be a hooker to write a book, now marketing cold fusion), bad methods, past fraud including environmental damage, money laundering and tax evasion....

It's all hearsay, you haven't done any real research. You found a couple websites that make these claims and repeat them as if they are the gospel truth. YOU CAN'T PROVE ANY OF IT! You just attack attack attack the mans character. You are a liar as you claim he has been convicted of fraud too, but have no proof just a couple of websites with unsubstantiated claims...

Double post

Originally posted by hawkiye
It's all hearsay, you haven't done any real research. You found a couple websites that make these claims and repeat them as if they are the gospel truth. YOU CAN'T PROVE ANY OF IT! but have no proof just a couple of websites with unsubstantiated claims...

Funny how exactly the same applies to Focardi and Rossi's claims!

There is zero proof, no evidence, just claims on a website. We have heard so many similiar stories before, all turned out to be fake

Steorn and their Orbo
Bearden and his MEG
Stanley Meyers' water fuel cell
Guido Franch, Louis Enricht, John Andrews and Ramar Pillai and their "gasoline pills"
John Bedini etc etc etc.

But gullible people keep believing them and giving these frauds money

reply to post by dereks


None of these guys have an agreement with the Naval Research Laboratories like Rossi.

Originally posted by Arken
None of these guys have an agreement with the Naval Research Laboratories like Rossi.

Care to show on the "Naval Research laboratories" website exactly where that agreement is posted? Unless....

Originally posted by dereks

Funny how exactly the same applies to Focardi and Rossi's claims!

There is zero proof, no evidence, just claims on a website. We have heard so many similiar stories before, all turned out to be fake

Steorn and their Orbo
Bearden and his MEG
Stanley Meyers' water fuel cell
Guido Franch, Louis Enricht, John Andrews and Ramar Pillai and their "gasoline pills"
John Bedini etc etc etc.

But gullible people keep believing them and giving these frauds money

I'm skeptical of Rossi's claims too, but I don't think it's fair to compare him to known scammers; at least not quite yet. So far, Rossi has not asked for any kind of money. In fact, everything has come out of his own pocket thus far. He's even paid to have the tests conducted on his device. Usually the motivation behind a scam is material wealth, but so far I have not seen any clear indications of this with Rossi. I think it's more likely that he is honest, but wrong in his assertions.

Assuming Rossi has a legitimate technology here, it seems he is doing his damndest to invoke skepticism. Many of his methods for trying to prove this technology are at best unorthodox and at worst very suspect. He's not following the scientific process for an extraordinary claim which assuming this is real, will hamper mainstream acceptance of his claims.

Last thoughts: If this is real, then Rossi is undermining his own efforts by having questionable methods of proving his assertions and not following the scientific process. If it's a scam, then it's the strangest one yet since the scammer does not appear to have a motive. We'll know for certain in October, but don't hold your breath.

reply to post by hawkiye

You are a liar as you claim he has been convicted of fraud too, but have no proof just a couple of websites with unsubstantiated claims...

Let's take it from the horses mouth shall we, in Rossi's own words (third person):

Those 56 prosecutions, for which he was incarcerated, end up with an acquittal of all processes for tax reasons, derived from bankruptcy by the closure of Omar and Petroldragon, 5 of them ended with a conviction, which would justify the period of preventive imprisonment for the accusations that led to the arrests. All other requirements ended up in acquittals.

So Rossi admits to five convictions but doesn't exactly say for what....
Rossi's site
Whois on his site

Registrant Contact:

Andrea Rossi ()

Fax:
Via Carlo Ragazzi 28
Bondeno, Ferrara 44012
IT

As for the rest, and information you think I put forth that isn't backed properly, let me know I and will post more to support it.

More on Omar-Petroldragon here and here.