The Five Most Ruthless Police States in America

Originally posted by MrWendal
Anyone else notice the very bottom of the article in the OP where it breaks down the type of offenses people are incarcerated for? It is all you need to see to understand some of the policies that are in place.

The number 1 reason people are incarcerated according to the OP's article... a whooping 51% are drug offenses.

Thats Federal Prisons, which it mentions in the article.

State prisons hold the vast majority of American prisoners and around 50% are violent offenders.

The fact the article twisted the data like that shows it has an agenda.

reply to post by MikeboydUS


That's not what I'm saying at all. What I am saying, is that the actual drug "offense" is not a crime that produces a victim. If someone is serving time or they are arrested for a drug offense, then they are not arrested for a crime that produces a victim. However, if someone is arrested for shooting someone else (over a drug deal lets say), then they have obviously committing a crime which does produce a victim. You have to seperate the two. If someone is arrested for a crime that does not initiate force against anyone else, such as dealing drugs to willing participants, then they aren't arrested [incarcerated] for a crime that produces a victim. Just because someone deals or uses drugs, does not mean that they commit actual crimes which initiate force on others. Kind of the same way that driving a car does not mean that you are driving intoxicated.

--airspoon

Originally posted by DaddyBare
reply to post by Jinglelord

 

Gotta love Twain so very insightful....
but that was then this is the 21st century and to give you one of my quotes.... The new golden rule is:
He who has the gold makes the rules... dont like the rules we have now??? go get yourself some gold and change em

I've read most of the greats From Homer to Heinlein and for my money Twain knew how things really are better than any of em.

I disagree on the gold... and we all know the old golden rule is more of a guideline most people break anyway.

While there is little doubt Twain helped shape modern America as almost every President lists Huck Finn as their favorite book. If we want to know how to change the Penal system we should look to someone who has successfully changed the world for the better:

"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has."

Margaret Mead

reply to post by Yankee451


I can't see ANY content on Beore It's News.

I've allowed any cookies from their site ... Allowed java scripting from all of their scripted domains (even Google-Analytics.com !!!! I hate that site!) and I still get mostly blank page.

Perhaps there is another source of this story???

also the informational link added by don'ttreadonme doesn't work.

edit on Wed Apr 6 2011 by DontTreadOnMe because: IMPORTANT: Using Content From Other Websites on ATS

WOW, I am surprised Florida isn't on the list. Locking people up is bigger than orange juice here in FL! They also enjoy giving DUI's for just about everything. Had a beer before stepping on skateboard? DUI.

reply to post by Yankee451


No surprises here. I was hoping Virginia wouldn't make the list, but I know it must still be up there. Especially with all the federal presence, they crack down on people in this state, that aren't even from this state.

I knew a guy from Tennessee that drove to Maryland to pick up a prescription that doctors in Tennessee couldn't fill. He used to race motorcross and was all tore up, missing three toes, back problems, etc., and the amount of pain medicine he needed exceeded what doctors were allowed to prescribe in Tennessee. So he drove to Maryland to get a different prescription. Well the feds found out and became convinced that he was getting all this pain medication, not for personal use, but to take back to Tennessee and sell (which as far as I know, wasn't true; he was eating it all himself because of all the health issues). Anyway Virginia State Police were watching for him, and swarmed his car on one of those trips. He spent I forget how many months in jail before his case was even heard before the jury. I still don't understand how people think extended imprisonment before even getting a hearing is constitutional.


This whole country is a police state.

reply to post by bsbray11


"Anyway Virginia State Police were watching for him"

I'm not saying this is a fabrication but could you clue us in on why they were watching him in the first place?

Originally posted by PsykoOps
Thing is hars punishments don't reduce crime. The condition of the society itself is what is most imporant factor imho. I'm Finnish and we're pretty nutorious for a leanient system. Even though we're 'soft' on crime it is not rampant here. Our prisons are comfortable and safe. Sentences are sometimes ridicilously light. Even for the harshest criminals. Still we have a low crime rate and justice isn't about revenge or punishment. It is about rehabilation and second changes.

PsykoOps i agree that harsh penalties do not reduce crime. Here in the USA there are a huge amount of police & crime TV shows. Any viewer sees similar cases repeatedly, week after week, year after year. In high crime area where people disappear from the street to life behind bars not many take it as a warning.

I think we have as much crime in the USA as we do because TPTB prefer to let hooligans wreak havoc as an excuse for the overzealous, aggressive police departments being fully staffed around the clock. The enforcers are always there "to protect and serve" their masters. FYI, 'to protect and serve' is a slogan commonly read on police cruisers.

If the leaders of America wished to lower crime rates we would have programs to educate and guide the public. Instead of meting out punishment in the form of imprisonment or monetary fines we would focus on rehabilitation and maybe vocation opportunities. Instead our government is slowly making most everything illegal so they may arrest us at will.

Originally posted by DrMattMaddix
reply to post by Yankee451

 

I can't see ANY content on Beore It's News.

I've allowed any cookies from their site ... Allowed java scripting from all of their scripted domains (even Google-Analytics.com !!!! I hate that site!) and I still get mostly blank page.

Perhaps there is another source of this story???

also the informational link added by don'ttreadonme doesn't work.

edit on Wed Apr 6 2011 by DontTreadOnMe because: IMPORTANT: Using Content From Other Websites on ATS

edit on 4·6·11 by DrMattMaddix because: (no reason given)

edit on 4·6·11 by DrMattMaddix because: frustration

Sorry, I can't find it anywhere else...it must be exclusive to Before Its News.

Edit: I am a member of Before It's News, so I don't know if the full article is available to non members.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Feds probably tipped them off to BOLO. There's some strange dealings going on in VA at the moment. I'm guessing that's due to proximity to DC.

DHS is trying to "coordinate" local forces everywhere and incorporate them into the fed machine, and in effect "Federalize" local LE, together with this "see something say something" campaign, it's not a very good package for the average citizen. They likely got a description of the vehicle and plates from TN, then passed it on to the VSP and told 'em to watch and apprehend, most likely on the return trip when he was loaded.

Ref: DHS "Fusion Centers". Better keep an eye on DHS overall, rather than just concentrating on the FEMA water-carriers. They're up to no good, and you can take that to the bank. Too much power, and it's too centralized. Starting to snowball now, and trying to gather in even more agencies.

Back in the day, the Feds would get slapped down by locals for interfering in matters that were local and not federal, but lately they've been trying to make EVERYTHING a federal matter, right along with the de facto federalization of local agencies.

Watch what I'm telling you.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
"Anyway Virginia State Police were watching for him"

I'm not saying this is a fabrication but could you clue us in on why they were watching him in the first place?

Because doctors apparently keep some kind of records that they cross-check every now and then, or someone cross checks them, because "they" knew he was getting prescribed a large amount of medicine in Maryland, and they knew he was going back to Tennessee with it. It's hard for me to say exactly who was keeping tabs. Like I said, there is virtually every federal agency you can imagine in the Northern Virginia/Washington DC/Maryland area. The actual charge was something like conspiracy to traffic prescription medicine across state lines, and they were saying it was illegal for him to cross back into Virginia with medicine from Maryland or some crap like that, but in the end they dropped it and were all bluster. (His lawyer also pointed out that the police broke several laws over the course of indicting and arresting this man.) Too bad you can't sue for wrongful imprisonment. I still don't understand how holding someone for months before they even get a hearing, is constitutional. The Bill of Rights still exists, doesn't it??

reply to post by bsbray11


reply to post by nenothtu



I wasn't trying to start an argument just thought the way it was written sounded a bit cryptic is all.

Thanks for clearing that up...

Originally posted by bsbray11

Because doctors apparently keep some kind of records that they cross-check every now and then, or someone cross checks them, because "they" knew he was getting prescribed a large amount of medicine in Maryland, and they knew he was going back to Tennessee with it. It's hard for me to say exactly who was keeping tabs.

I'm betting dollars against donuts that DHS was heavily involved, per my addition to my post above. They're getting to be pretty octupus-like.

Now I'm a marked man for putting the finger on that, eh? Nothing new...

This is for all my friends at DHS:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/142c3a04c7ab.jpg[/atsimg]

No thread on the American move towards a police state is complete without it!

I am SO going to hell for that!

Note: "hell" is how an old hispanic girlfriend of mine pronounced "jail"...

reply to post by nenothtu


I don't know about DHS, but it was my own thought that some kind of federal police investigation agency actually looks directly through medical records themselves looking for out-of-state prescriptions being filled or things like that.


Just imagine if someone went around to each state and got a separate prescription for the same thing in each state, and got tons of pills that way. I can't imagine that someone, sitting in some office somewhere, isn't keeping tabs on things like that. It's just a shame that they'll take someone legitimately trying to get one prescription filled, and throw them into jail for months before even hearing their case. And btw, he told me that while he was in jail, he was the only one who the jail was still giving all the same medicine, because he was easily able to prove his need for it to them, on account of his tore up back and missing toes and all of that. The jail was complaining because he was running them up about $1000 a month just for his medicine. Oh, the irony.

What I'd like to know is why it costs over $50,000 per year to incarcerate someone in NY yet Social security will only pay just over $12,000/yr for someone who is disabled.
I'd get better medical care in prison than I can on social security and would certainly eat better and would probably have nice cable tv and a gym too.
Only in America

Hey Airspoon, glad to see you back!

Originally posted by DaddyBare

Originally posted by airspoon
Many people don't realize this but the US has more people incarcerated than any other nation (even most countries combined). We have more people behind bars than the USSR at the height of their reign or even Nazi Germany. Sadly, most of these people are incarcerated for what basically amounts to political crimes, "crimes" that do not produce a victim.



--airspoon

edit on 6-4-2011 by airspoon because: (no reason given)

Know why that is???
because here we have due process... in other words our citizens are entitled to a fair trial, not a summary execution in the streets, like we see in other nations....
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/7b1682654255.jpg[/atsimg]
Of course one could argue bullets are cheap compared to a life sentence

edit on 6-4-2011 by DaddyBare because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-4-2011 by DaddyBare because: (no reason given)

Give me liberty or give me death.

Instead, I moved to Mexico. Problem solved.

There is not one reason in the world I want to cross the border ever again.

Originally posted by bsbray11
reply to post by nenothtu

 

I don't know about DHS, but it was my own thought that some kind of federal police investigation agency actually looks directly through medical records themselves looking for out-of-state prescriptions being filled or things like that.

Probably DEA, which DHS ALSO has it's tentacles... err, I mean "hooks"... into (right along with FEMA, BATFE, FBI, ICE, and a host of others). Pharmacists also report to them. Years ago, before there even was a DHS, I knew a guy (since deceased) who was writing his own scrips locally, and filling them at multiple pharmacies to elude detection. One fine day, DEA was sitting there waiting for him when he walked in to pick one up, in what should have been a local bust. No state line were crossed.

It's just a shame that they'll take someone legitimately trying to get one prescription filled, and throw them into jail for months before even hearing their case.

Sort of negates the Constitutional guarantee of a "Speedy trial", doesn't it?

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
What I'd like to know is why it costs over $50,000 per year to incarcerate someone in NY yet Social security will only pay just over $12,000/yr for someone who is disabled.

I'd get better medical care in prison than I can on social security and would certainly eat better and would probably have nice cable tv and a gym too.
Only in America

Hey Airspoon, glad to see you back!

Yeah. Since Social Security is going insolvent, and I've already been guaranteed that I'll never see the first dime of mine even if it doesn't, that's my backup plan for a cushy retirement. All expenses paid, and all of that.

Now you see WHY I don't mind pissing off Napolitano and company!

reply to post by airspoon

airspoon, as I understand it, the ability to easily reach around to your nether region and pulling things out at random may thrill your proctologist - but it doesn't cut mustard here.

Political prisoners? More than the Soviet Union? You really need to show some data on that.

Your dislike of the US is perplexing. An avatar that suggests you served, but all comments indicate otherwise.