Paul The First Heretic

reply to post by Akragon


You sure of that?

reply to post by awake_and_aware


Absolutely...

That is unless someone attacked me first... in which case i may have responded.

I don't attack unless provoked

reply to post by Akragon


Well then how can you comment on people's attacks when, in their eyes, they believe you attacked them first.

I just see hypocrisy.

Also, i've heard you rant and rave about Christ, even though you don't believe in religion - Wasn't his message to "turn the other cheek", to "love thy enemy?"

Not something that i agree with - but it's hypocritical to attack someone as response to their attack. An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

Well then how can you comment on people's attacks when, in their eyes, they believe you attacked them first.

I just see hypocrisy.

Also, i've heard you rant and rave about Christ, even though you don't believe in religion - Wasn't his message to "turn the other cheek", to "love thy enemy?"

Not something that i agree with - but it's hypocritical to attack someone as response to their attack. An eye for an eye makes the hold world blind.

edit on 7/5/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)

Whats wong with commenting on peoples attacks. And you won't find a single post on these forums where i attacked anyone first. By all means look through my posts...

Yes i do rave about Christ, what does that have to do with religion?

but it's hypocritical to attack someone as response to their attack

Im not Christ my friend, and as i've stated many times...im still learning. Im not the type to back down from a fight either. Unlike Christ and his followers, i hit back when attacked.

Still....please try to find any post where i attacked anyone for thier beliefs. Clearly you haven't read many of my posts other then the ones to yourself....in which i also do not attack

reply to post by Akragon

Yes i do rave about Christ, what does that have to do with religion?

Christianity.

reply to post by awake_and_aware


Im not christian though...

Just because i've read, and understand the bible doesn't mean i belong to any religion my friend.

Christ came to the world, not to the jews, not to start christianity.

reply to post by Akragon


Christ is part of the dogma of Christianity. Even if you disagree with the main abrahamic dogma, but still believe in Christ, it's still Theism, your still claiming that Christ exists, and is true, and is true of the word of "GOD".

You're a deist who claims to know the objectivism of the God of the universe (through Jesus Christ) Quite contradictory. Deists can't make any claims as to the defintion of God.

Either you believe in a God through faith (Deism), or you agree with the dogma of religion, or some of it.(Theism)

Which is it?

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

Christ is part of the dogma of Christianity. Even if you disagree with the main abrahamic dogma, but still believe in Christ, it's still Theism, your still claiming that Christ exists, and is true, and is true of the word of "GOD".

You're a deist who claims to know the objectivism of the God of the universe (through Jesus Christ) Quite contradictory. Deists can't make any claims as to the defintion of God.

Either you believe in a God through faith (Deism), or you agree with the dogma of religion, or some of it.(Theism)

Which is it?

Amazing how you think i need to pick one of your options.....its neither actually.

Christ wasn't God in the flesh like many christians believe. He wasn't a deity, he was a man that understood God in the purest form. I would even agree he was sent from God.. he is the spirit living in all of us....so yes he is alive and well.

If christ isn't, wasn't God...that eliminates your thieism arguement. I believe in God through experience and study. Through which i found faith. I've also explained to you exactly what God is....which eliminates your deity arguement.

Any other questions?

reply to post by Akragon


You would have never heard of Christ if it wasn't for the dogma of of Christianity.

Where's your evidence for Christ ever existing? And thus, your reasoning for believing? Faith, right?

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

You would have never heard of Christ if it wasn't for the dogma of of Christianity.

Where's your evidence for Christ ever existing? And thus, your reasoning for believing? Faith, right?

This is very true actually... If the bible never existed i would have a completly different view. About 8 years ago i was just like you... i had no belief in God. I believed only in what is provable or even visual.

Again through study, meditation, and experience i gained my belief.

I have no evidence that Jesus existed other then what we know in scripture. This is still not historical fact so even the bible isn't evidence. On the other hand...Jesus's words were revolutionary in his time. Never before had a man came to the world with his ideas on how we "should" treat each other. Now IF God is all loving all careing, then theres no doubt IF he existed he came from this love.

My reason for believing is much more then just faith my friend. I've told you before, i have no doubt what so ever in the existance of God. It goes beyond faith, which is why i no longer have the need to search the scriptures for answers. I have my answers, from here its just learning the path.

reply to post by Akragon

Again through study, meditation, and experience i gained my belief.

Hahaha, good one.

Laters.

I think i'm going to meditate so i can find Jesus.

I believed only in what is provable or even visual.

I don't. I believe in quantam mechanics.

I believe that the more we know, the less we know about things - The essence of education. With that in mind, i still find no compelling reason to believe in a deity, or Jesus.

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

Again through study, meditation, and experience i gained my belief.

Hahaha, good one.

Laters.

I think i'm going to meditate so i can find Jesus.

I believed only in what is provable or even visual.

I don't. I believe in quantam mechanics.

I believe that the more we know, the less we know about things - The essence of education. With that in mind, i still find no compelling reason to believe in a deity, or Jesus.

edit on 7/5/11 by awake_and_aware because: (no reason given)

Thank you, perhaps instead of judging what i tell you, you might actually attempt meditation. You say you enjoy education right, well heres your chance to educate your spirit.

You laugh now, but with practice you'll be supprized at what you discover within. Though i believe you're lying about attempting to meditate.

Its pointless trying to find jesus if you don't understand his teachings(which you don't) Meditation will definately help you on your path, but with your closed mind. It won't help much...

Good luck

reply to post by Akragon


I didn't say anything about meditation. I never mentioned whether I've tried it before, or practice is regularly.

Oooh - Is that an assumption to go with your belief that Jesus was sent by God, and your other assumption, beign that God actually exists?

I think so

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

I didn't say anything about meditation. I never mentioned whether I've tried it before, or practice is regularly.

Oooh - Is that an assumption to go with your belief that Jesus was sent by God, and your other assumption, beign that God actually exists?

I think so

Those were your words my friend... It was said sarcastically so yes....i assumed you've never tried or practiced it.

I'd say thats a safe assumption honestly. Why would you meditate to find Jesus anyways?

You can read about him if you want info about him.

reply to post by Akragon

Why would you meditate to find Jesus anyways?

You said you gained your "knowledge" through various means, one of which was meditation. Other than the bible (religion) ,which you think is controlling, there are no other means of finding Christ - His words are written into the abrahamic doctrine, of which CHRISTianity is a part.

I have meditated before, and i do from time to time to clear my thoughts - I live in the country side so there are plenty of quiet spots for me to think, or free thoughts.

See how it can be nice when we remain civil? Atheists have hearts too.

You can read about him if you want info about him.

I've read about Jesus, It's not until the New Testament, not until the "gentle Jesus - meak and mild" is introduced to we get the concept of Hellfire, and eternal damnation.

I don't like the concept of Vicarious Remeption (sacrifice on cross) because it teaches absolvement of responsibility. Tribes used to do this, scapegoat the "sins" of the tribe onto an animal, and lead it to die in the wild.

Jesus also taught people to leave their families, to follow him. Sick dying families who need look after? Come follow me, or you're not doing the "Lord's" work.

Believe what you want to believe, but make sure you are clued up with the ethical and moral teaching that Jesus pushes.

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

Why would you meditate to find Jesus anyways?

You said you gained your "knowledge" through various means, one of which was meditation. Other than the bible (religion) which you think is controlling. There is no other means of finding Christ - His words are written into the abrahamic doctrine, of which CHRISTianity is a part.

I have meditated before, and i do from time to time to clear my thoughts - I live in the country side so their are plenty of quiet spots for me to think.

See how it can be nice when we remain civil? Atheists have hearts too.

hahaha, you're funny...we remain civil here but not in other threads right?

You can find the teachings of christ in many other religions as well. Some believe he learned the path in his travels through india, and tibet. Budda(s) taught the same thing...So did Krishna er whatever they call them.

As well as tons of new age "teachers"...

The only reason i use the bible for quotes is because i enjoy how they're phrased, its elegant and almost universally known.

SO...theres many ways to find "Christ" You don't even have to know who he was to understand the idea behind his lessons.

reply to post by Akragon


I give what i get, and you try to also.

Again, not very Jesus like - but i'm not preaching Jesus.

You can find the teachings of christ in many other religions as well. Some believe he learned the path in his travels through india, and tibet. Budda(s) taught the same thing...So did Krishna er whatever they call them.

Why do you associate yourself with Christ over any other "label"?

Not saying your a CHRISTian, but you're preaching "CHRIST" which is of the CHRISTIAN doctrine. Why not BHUDDA, why not KRISHNA, why not ODYSSEUS, why not ROMULUS? why not ZOROASTER?

Why do you have to give it a name?

I mean, i really shouldn't have a name for my Atheism.

I don't have a name for my lack of belief in fairies, or infinty, or unicorns...It doesn't need a name, and i don't think i should have one for my lack of belief in other "myths".

Originally posted by awake_and_aware
reply to post by Akragon

 

I give what i get, and you try to also.

Again, not very Jesus like - but i'm not preaching Jesus.

Hey what can i say, im learning.

And im not preaching Jesus either....at least not at the moment

reply to post by awake_and_aware

I've read about Jesus, It's not until the New Testament, not until the "gentle Jesus - meak and mild" is introduced to we get the concept of Hellfire, and eternal damnation.

I don't like the concept of Vicarious Remeption (sacrifice on cross) because it teaches absolvement of responsibility. Tribes used to do this, scapegoat the "sins" of the tribe onto an animal, and lead it to die in the wild.

I agree actually, churches don't teach what Christ taught for the most part.

Jesus also taught people to leave their families, to follow him. Sick dying families who need look after? Come follow me, or you're not doing the "Lord's" work.

Just lack of understanding of the passage you're refering to....