Freemasons - I have a few questions.

Originally posted by ILovePeace
You may be able to join freely, regardless of background to some groups but this is again part of the charade. The idea is to leave it open to everyone and then pick the ones of ideal mindset who will truly advance. You may very well be 'a mason' and a good person trying to better yourself but there are ALOT of people who use these fraternities to advance personal and global agendas.

Okay, here's your shot: how does the pyramid work? So far, no one's been able to tell us how the organization we belong to runs without serious factual errors that expose shallow research.

Originally posted by Magzoid
If freemasonry "makes good men better" then it makes "bad men" what?

Nothing. We try our hardest not to admit bad men, and expel them when we find out they're not good men.

reply to post by getreadyalready


Yes this may be what people are openly told that freemasonry is based on but do you really think that these beliefs are upheld at the highest points in the organisation? It is like the church. We have lots of money, knowlege, power and influence that spans the entire globe, but we just cant share these things with everybody....

Come on, you dont need to be part of a club to be a good human being that strives to better him or herself and the community around them. And to be part of something you claim helps people be this way but closely guards the secrets is ludicrous! (I am not talking about the silly handshakes that we can all see world leaders and bussiness men engaging in).

In your post before this you say:

"I don't think I have ever sought out a leadership role, I have always been invited. I didn't lobby to be Master of my Lodge, but I was nominated and served, I didn't lobby to be a Mod, but I was asked and I accepted, I didn't lobby to run my team at my current job, but I was suggested as a candidate and I won the interview and position"

So, these accomplishments you have made, congratulations. Maybe it is because you hold high morality, steadfast and are a natural leader. On the other hand it could also be that maybe a mason invited you to these positions because after all, masons are brothers.

OK, I have another question - just out of curiosity again.

Lessons are taught and learned via ceremony, and presumably some form of moral tale to go with it.
Is the tale taught as fact? Or is it open to interpretation? (Story and tale sound somehow patronizing, but I can't find a better word!)

I'm curious - as there seems to be a lot of mentioning of the journey/experience being more important than the final moment of obtaining the knowledge.

Do the lessons and the overall progression/structure in Freemasonry remind any of you of this at all?


If not - then it's just me, I admit I don't know much at all about Freemasonry - so it is rather easy for me to make incorrect assumptions.

reply to post by OnTheLevel213


How are 'bad' men expelled? Are they voted out by the lodge members?

reply to post by SecretSky


There are disciplinary hearings held. Once a Mason is expelled, he can never join another Lodge.

reply to post by SecretSky


They sacrifice him for the better good of the lodge of course.

reply to post by SecretSky


Many of the symbols, myths and stories are from the deep mists of the past and many of their true meanings are lost. They are used as pointers in order to mould our moral values and are therefore not to be taken literally.

reply to post by ILovePeace


I do honestly believe that the leaders at the tip top of Freemasonry hold the same morals and qualities that I do. I also happen to know a couple of Grand Masters, and a many 33rd degree Masons, and if anything, they are even more dedicated and charitable in their actions than the rest of us. That is not a party line statement, that is my honest opinion from my experiences.

And, for the record, I don't think I have ever worked for or with another Mason. For whatever reason, most of my bosses have been female, so maybe it is just my good looks!

The one place that Masonry did have a quick and solid influence recently was the Tea Party in Tallahassee. The original members of the Tea Party here in this town were all Masons from my lodge. The party quickly grew into something much bigger, but I have to admit that Masonry did have a major impact on the development of that party here locally. I think that is a great thing, but I'm sure the opponents could find some fault in that.

Originally posted by SecretSky

How are 'bad' men expelled? Are they voted out by the lodge members?

Yes. If someone is accused of unmasonic conduct, a trial is held in the Lodge. If found guilty, the member can either be censured, suspended, or expelled, depending upon the gravity of the offense.

In most constitutions, if a Mason is found guilty of a felony, or of a misdemeanor involving moral turpitude, in a secular court of law, then he stands automatically expelled from the fraternity.

Originally posted by ILovePeace
Come on, you dont need to be part of a club to be a good human being that strives to better him or herself and the community around them.

I agree with this. However, when trying to make a really big difference I think a group is needed:

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. -Margaret Mead

Originally posted by SecretSky
OK, I have another question - just out of curiosity again.

Lessons are taught and learned via ceremony, and presumably some form of moral tale to go with it.
Is the tale taught as fact?

No. They are taught as allegories.

Originally posted by Nobama
reply to post by SecretSky

 

They sacrifice him for the better good of the lodge of course.

haha!

reply to post by Dajjal

I wish I could answer but I honestly don't know the answer.

reply to post by getreadyalready


Funny that, I have always fantasised about have a woman boss. LOL
Lucky bugger you.

Originally posted by raiders247
Heres my opinion from what I have found out:

Lower ranking free-masons usually get together for harmless fraternal activities and such, while the higher degree masons congregate in secrecy for World domination.

Ugh...this...again?
Of course...because non-members always know more than the boys who actually are members.

OK Freemasons - my curiosity has been reignited by some of the previous posts!

Why aren't women allowed? Is it simply tradition? And if so, is that tradition simply because at that time women were disqualified from most things? (voting/education etc.).

Are you happy that there are no women in your lodge?

reply to post by SecretSky


Wow, good question. I always thought it was due to tradition, being a fraternal order.
How do I feel about it? Well, there are women's Lodges in existance so, not too bad really. However, I am sure that in the future, women will probably be integrated.

P.S. Then again, if women are allowed, then our wives would join and find out that we are really just a bunch of sad old farts. LOL

Originally posted by SecretSky

Why aren't women allowed? Is it simply tradition? And if so, is that tradition simply because at that time women were disqualified from most things? (voting/education etc.).

Freemasonry is a fraternity, fraternities being male organizations (just as sororities are female-only organizations).

Are you happy that there are no women in your lodge?

Yes. Freemasonry can be seen in one aspect as a type of male bonding, deriving from the more primitive cultures where young men undergo initiatory ordeals into manhood, being initiated and instructed in the religion, ideals, and culture of his people.

reply to post by SecretSky

Lessons are taught and learned via ceremony, and presumably some form of moral tale to go with it.
Is the tale taught as fact? Or is it open to interpretation? (Story and tale sound somehow patronizing, but I can't find a better word!)

I'm curious - as there seems to be a lot of mentioning of the journey/experience being more important than the final moment of obtaining the knowledge.

Neat graphic! I don't think it applies to Masonry, because there is no real adventure or struggle, except for your personal troubles and vices that you bring in with you.

Ther is no "final moment of obtaining the knowledge." It is kind of like "practicing" medicine. You practice Masonry. The parables, ceremonies, lessons, tales, symbology, and other modes of learning are just to help illustrate a moral code that we already know in our hearts. No one imparts knowledge upon you, instead they just illustrate a moral way of living, and then make themselves available to help you along on your own development. They serve as mentors and examples. Once in awhile we mess up, even as mentors we mess up, and luckily there is a group around you to help you get through it.

Case in point. Last year we initiated a young man that was struggling with personal issues. He almost didn't get admitted, because he was young, tattooed, and a little erratic, but he seemed genuine, he attended several of our meals, and his mother actually called a couple of Masons and asked that we mentor him. After a rousing talk by the investigative committee, we voted to bring him through the degrees. He did great, he attended lodge, he learned things quickly, and he was progressing along nicely, and then one day his mother called to say he was dead. Apparently his ex-girlfriend had gotten a hold of him in the middle of the night, and some old haunts came back, he was all alone, and he shot himself. We were shocked, saddened, disappointed in ourselves, etc. It all changed when his mother approached each Mason at the funeral and said the previous few months had been the best months of her boys life. She was thankful for the time he got to spend with us, and she had seen him become a much happier man over those months. It still saddens me that he didn't reach out more, or that we didn't notice how deeply his troubles were ingrained, but it was nice that his mother appreciated his time as a Mason, instead of looking for a scapegoat like so many would have done.

We all make mistakes, Masons are not immune to real life's troubles, but we do have a support system, and we do have a moral code we strive to live by, and we do have a high caliber of men that choose to join our ranks.