Just My Opinion on Believers

As Jeffrey Bennett (top notch credentials) points out in his book "Beyond UFOs," there are only 3 possible solutions to Fermi's paradox:


1) We are alone.

The we are alone implies that throughout the universe, we are the first to ever attain some kind of self-awareness. We are the first to venture into space and build radio telescopes. Now let's look at the numbers... all the stars in the universe would be equivalent to the total numbers of grains of sand on all Earth's beaches put together. Does it honestly seem reasonable to assume (given those numbers) that we are the only game in town?

2) Civilizations are common but so far no one has conquered the "vastness of space problem."

This is a scary thought because it would imply we are doomed to be wiped out by a natural disaster or by ourselves (i.e. nuclear war). Unfortunately, given the current tensions in the world, it becomes depressingly easy to believe this could happen. However, we hope this is not always true.

3) There is a galactic civlization, but we have so far been unable to discover its existence.

Now........ behold why the answer to Fermi's Paradox will be the most profound transformation since the club.

The first solution makes zero sense if you view it from an unbiased scientific perspective. The second, while plausible, is not what we want to believe in now is it. This leaves us the 3rd option and is supported by a ton of evidence. And as Jeff Bennett points out, it can only mean one thing: If we successfully navigate the adolescence of our civlization, there's a universe full of grownups awaiting our arrival.

Originally posted by AtruthGuy
reply to post by ChaosComplex

 

god bless america

edit on 28-3-2011 by AtruthGuy because: (no reason given)

Do you believe in God?

What an extremely bitter and poorly written rant.

Originally posted by AtruthGuy
I just want to address some of the more common arguments believers make. Its getting quite annoying hearing the same BS over and over again, when it does not make sense. Atleast not opinion.

Before I post the following I am open minded that aliens MAY exist some where in the universe. I do not believe they are visiting earth. I also doubt they are reptillians, or lion people.

This first argument drives me insane.
"Aliens Must Exist Cause God Does Not."
First for you teenagers going through "Secret Internet Atheist when mommy and daddy's not home"stage, A good amount of people have gone through that stage before noone cares and you don't have to post "There's no god..lol" in every topic. Samething applies for the kids going through the "gothic (skulls,zombies, snakes, satan everywhere etc) kids."

To you real grown up and mature Atheists. I just feel its a bit Ironic. To yell there's no god but believe in little magical gray and reptillian creatures flying in spaceships, and they have these magical/fairy, and pyschic powers is a little bit ironic.

I'm not a big tough "Internet Religous guy."

Another argument is everyone wants to link the
"Drake Equation."

So far it has yet to be proven right. In fact correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe any part has been proven correct. I mean don't think we have found any civilizations yet because to the drake equation. (I know we havent.)

Another Argument.
"Skeptics just don't want to accept that we are not alone."

Its not a point in "wanting to accept" it's more of "wanting to know".
This goes back to people who "want to believe" they will believe everything hoax or not. They ignore all opposite of their belief. Those on this site with "I WANT TO BELIEVE" in their avatars and signatures,
and have names like "humanhybrid, alienman, galaticpeace etc" ( I don't believe these are actually members of the site this is just examples of types of names here, )
will never accept anything other then aliens exist...because THEY WANT THEM TO EXIST...

They will go around calling people "trolls". I'm sure I will be called one in this thread.

Skeptics want proof we don't care for incredibly bias TV shows, Books, stories...Terribad youtube videos.
We want legit proof.

Another Argument
"The aliens are already here"

My response is prove it.

Show us a real StarGate
Show us a real Alien
Show us a spaceship.

I don't care if you believe you was a alien in a previous life, if you cant prove it then it's BS. And I don't care for internet "roleplay."


And lets not get into the Jerusalem UFO lol.
I still think it was a weak attempt to start a UFO cult. Especially with the "The aliens dropped off a baby jesus topic." That people took seriously.


Thanks for reading.

edit on 17-3-2011 by AtruthGuy because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-3-2011 by AtruthGuy because: (no reason given)

Could you be anymore purposefully insulting? You making this thread automatically makes you worse than the kid just saying "no god here" in every post. And for every no god here type of poster, there is most certainly a holy devout "Let JESUS cleanse you" type. Guess what? They usually aren't children.

I'm an Atheist, and no -- It's very much two different things.... bleiving in Aliens vs God. For you see we have proof that Aliens are possible. If there is a god, there would still most likely be aliens -- even if they too, were created by him.

The proof that Aliens are possible is that we exist. We know of atleast one planet in the universe with self developing life on it. We don't know of any god's creating universes however.

Furthermore, we use probability to suggest Alien life exists. Every stone you pick up has an infinite probability to exist, so an Alien existing is no more improbable to exist than a pebble in your driveway. There is presumably infinite planets, and with infinite planets is infinite potential that life exists. If the potential is infinite, then the amount of planets that would contain said alien life, would be infinite in quantity as well. With planets existing for an infinite amount of time, it's also increasingly probable that we wouldn't be the first intelligent sentient space bearing scociety.

Following this logic, there is infinite potential for an alien scociety to have reached our current tech level an infinite number of years ago. All of our electronic technology is less than 200 years old. Imagine what we would have in a trillion years... You couldn't, because we as a whole couldn't even conceive an imagination of what we would be capable of.

Further along this line of logic, there is infinite potential that there would be intergalactic traveling aliens, which you yourself agree may be a possibility....

So if they exist, which we know they must inevitably, why is it such a stretch that they are using Earth? I refuse to say "Visiting" because we don't know why they are here. If they are here, there is no way to determine if they are here because we are, or just because the Earth has something they want/need.

I will never accept anything other than Aliens exist... and it's not because I want them to exist, I really could careless -- we as a people have way to many problems as it is. I KNOW Aliens exist, because we exist, and we are 1 planet, 1 sun, 1 solar system, out of infinite. If it exists once, it will exist twice, three times, 100 million times, as there aren't even enough number classes to even visualize how many planets and stars and solar systems actually exist.

It would simply be illogical for there not to be, and hence the reason why my stance will never change.


I've also seen a UFO, at sub 30 feet. No I can't prove that I did, but then again -- I'm not trying to convince you either... I know what I saw (if you saw one in mega real life detail less than 30 feet away from you, you would know too), you don't need to have seen proof for this statement to be true. You may however, need proof for YOU to recognize that it IS the truth.

/rest

Most who believe in Aliens do so because of something they have witnessed firsthand.

Myself, I am still a sceptic. I made fun of my mate for even thinking aliens existed. Then I witnessed a few UFO sightings and am now more open minded on the subject. Admittedly, I read several posts on ATS suggesting there are "Reptilians" and so forth but I find these to be so farfetched my mind can’t help but dismiss them.

We have very little evidence other than personal firsthand accounts.

Take mine for example. I saw a UFO at Stone Henge on a Sunday afternoon. Due to its unusual movements I believe it to be controlled by an ET. Would my friends or family believe me? God no. They haven’t seen it firsthand.

Even if there was an Alien & UFO on the front page of newspapers worldwide we would not believe it until seeing it with our own eyes.

Personally I have never seen anything in the sky that can't be explained,
nor have I had crazy dreams about Et or anything else outrageous to orate here,
what I do have though is the power of reason.

Wherever you look in the Cosmos, it is mostly made out of the same "stuff".
That "stuff" locally has produced us, look around you,
we do exist, amazing complexity which can adapt and morph to suit habitat over time,
along with all the other life on earth.

Take a couple of hundreds of billions of stars in our Galaxy,
multiplied again by a couple of hundred billion Galaxies that we know about,
try and comprehend the scale of that enormous figure,
and then have the arrogance to presume, or even suggest, that we are unique as the only
sentient creatures in existance anywhere?

It is the height of absurdity and stupidity to even entertain such a thought.

There is life out there IMHO,
beautiful sentient gentle creatures,
and others that would make Hitler look like a choir boy,
and no doubt many variations between these 2 extremes,
all trying to survive and get on with their thing.
But the scale of the problem of detecting it is enormous.

Maybe interstellar distances can't be conquered? This one I doubt though.

Maybe the fact that SETI has not had conclusive proof that there is something transmitting out there,
is indicative that it is highly dangerous to do so, much what Stephen Hawking advocates.

Maybe all the EM energy we are leaking out into space is an indication to others
that we know diddly squat about the reality of what is out there,
and could be putting us and our decendants in dire peril in the near future?

The bible thumpers have had our brains in a vice for centuries,
don't think,
do what you're told.

Use what GOD gave you and think this thing out.
The Galaxy is teeming with life, reason dictates it.

Maybe we have alien visitors, maybe we don't.
But if I were they,
I would most definitely stay as elusive as we presume they do.

Would you give a loaded sub machine gun to a 3 yr old child to bring to school?
That is probably how they perceive us,
not to mention the endemic corruption in our societies.

In general, We are not ready.

As for me,
I am content in my own mind that I know when I look up at the night sky,
there are probably many eyes looking back,
I don't feel lonely.

Would I like to meet a benevolent ET?
There is nothing more that I would like to do.
It's unlikely to happen,
but if it does
with their permission
you will get the best detailled account
I can provide

Originally posted by Logical one

Originally posted by M0bstar


Haha do you think our military and or government would let "Joe Public" go ...public with his finds of a "alien body, bone, or skin tissue"? And as for "Dr. Lier", has found something that is made from material not of this Earth, well...let me put it like this...you go study to be a doctor in college for years, get your degree, IF you did have something...would you risk going public with it?

Hmm have you not been watching the news lately?

Those guys in Tunisia, Egypt and even Libya are getting stuff out on the internet that before was being brutally repressed and hidden.
In this age of the internet it's a lot easier to get stuff out in the public domain long before the governments can do anything about it.....just look at the Wikileaks stuff.
Times have changed so that government suppression line no longer washes any more.

As for Dr. Lier......he's already come out and said that he has extracted "Alien implants" that are made from non earthly materials, and made it public knowledge, but he seems reluctant to put his claims up for independent and verifiable testing.
A little odd, that he doesn't try to save his reputation by simply getting one of his "implants" independently tested.......people already think he's cuckoo.
What's more he's still quite healthily alive and kicking........the government doesn't seem in any rush to get their hands on Dr.Lier's implants, or silence him any!

edit on 28-3-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)

Yea well I think aliens/ UFO's don't really compare to Libya and all of that. As a matter of a fact (this may sound "un-American" but I don't care) I could careless about what is going on in Libya, so no, I don't pay attention to that, IMO, it's just about our greedy government trying to get their hands on the oil fields over there. Yea things probably do come out from "over there" that probably shouldn't, but what does that have to do with getting proof out about extraterrestrials? That's the middle east..NOT E.T.'s...totally different subject. I'm not getting into that, this is not the thread. I guess you haven't seen the MILLIONS of hoaxed videos being posted online every day have you? Yea I agree, it would be easy to get something out online, BUT, it would be easier to find you if you in fact posted things like that online, and how would it be taken as credible when you have all of the hoaxes online. And what happened to the Wikileaks guy? They branded him false and said his stuff were nothing but lies, but for lies and false info, they sure took it serious. And "Dr. Lier"...where is he?? Who is he? Maybe the "Dr. Lier" your referring to could of been planted out there to throw people off and give less creditability to people who may actually have something? Now, my mind is open to both sides on this subject, but all of you people who have the words "logic" or "logical" in your names on here, come on here with YOUR ways of thinking and try to push it on others as if it were THE ONLY way to think. Think and believe what you want, but as everyone has been saying, all of you "logical debunkers" still have no "proof" of all of your claims to disprove anything. All you have is your "logic"..and I'm sorry, but your "logic" is just that..YOURS...more like your OPINIONS. I know I speak for a lot of people on here, but I think this site has enough "logic"-based people on here. You people should start you own site and sit around and pow wow with each other about "logic" and what's "logical" because YOU think that way. YOUR way is not THE ONLY way to think or believe, nor is mine. I just look at both sides with an open mind. And no, I don't believe EVERY thing I see about aliens/UFO's to be real. But I don't just sit around and debunk and talk $h!t about everything that comes around because "it's just not logical" that these things could be real. If you ask me, people like you, who obviously don't put ANY research into ANY of this, are too afraid to believe in something that your "logic" can't explain..so you believe what ever you want, and I'll believe what ever I want, but don't sit there and try and push YOUR "logical" ways of thinking on to people who believe in something you don't or your afraid to believe in.

Originally posted by AtruthGuy
reply to post by BRITWARRIOR

 

When you say "research" you mean watch incredibly bias ufo / alien shows on the history channel or read
bias scifi books, or playing video games and getting ideas from that.

Why don't you try READING something sometime...you might learn something...and to be honest, the shows on HC are just opening up new possibilities to things. Seriously, get a life, go find some other people to mess with. You obviously have no life if you come on to a site like ATS and sit here and just bash on other people who have different beliefs than you do, and who open their minds up to other things, things your "logic" can't comprehend. "Oh yea look at me..Mr. Logic! I come onto a site that has people who believe in extraterrestrials and bash on them with my "logic"! Dude get a life...seriously...wtf is it to you if others believe in something that you don't? And at least the people who "watch the 'bias' UFO/Alien shows on History Channel" and who read "bias" books, are actually putting in SOMETHING rather than just sitting back and bashing other people and talking $h!t as you are doing. Do you get like some kind of ego-trip from it or something? What a douche...

OP i think this is a great thread but you did leave yourself open to spankings. ATS is the mother ship for many alternative thinkers to gather and share. Diversity of thought, topic/subject seems to be the foundation of ATS. Like pigeons coming to home to roost, this is a strong magnet site for a plethora of disturbed, scared and fringe mentalities.

There is a sense of entitlement in too many posts I've read. A lot of people will lay claim to their opinion as if it is fact. If you reply not agreeing with their opinion (which they hold as factual) they come back saying you are close-minded or the like. If someone is going to make claims, I agree with the OP, a little back-up goes a long way.

"..only thinking makes it so.." is fine for defining personal morals and standards. Simply declaring a thought does nothing to lend it credibility.

So you can't even share a debate with this type, or exchange differing POV's; they've convinced themselves their viewpoint is 'gospel' and that's that. Who is the close-minded one, really?!

On the overall the Internet seems a showcase for poor behavior of all sorts. ATS just enjoys a much higher doosh factor than most of the virtual world.

reply to post by M0bstar


Lol!
So I guess that is what you call research. Watching and reading bias media.
Lol like I said this post is my opinion. Despite who's president, I still live in america, where I'm free to express it.

Maybe you should look in the mirror, you bitching with everyone who has a different opinion or agrees with me, makes you sound like someones spoiled child.

Who knows when you grow up you will see the purpose of having a fair and balanced conversation...who knows maybe everyone who has a different opinion isn't a troll..or you wont grow up and will forever be inyour mothers basement..

Anyway I'm done with you. Atleast till you grow up.

Originally posted by Laokin
Could you be anymore purposefully insulting? You making this thread automatically makes you worse than the kid just saying "no god here" in every post. And for every no god here type of poster, there is most certainly a holy devout "Let JESUS cleanse you" type. Guess what? They usually aren't children.

I'm an Atheist, and no -- It's very much two different things.... bleiving in Aliens vs God. For you see we have proof that Aliens are possible. If there is a god, there would still most likely be aliens -- even if they too, were created by him.

The proof that Aliens are possible is that we exist. We know of atleast one planet in the universe with self developing life on it. We don't know of any god's creating universes however.

Furthermore, we use probability to suggest Alien life exists. Every stone you pick up has an infinite probability to exist, so an Alien existing is no more improbable to exist than a pebble in your driveway. There is presumably infinite planets, and with infinite planets is infinite potential that life exists. If the potential is infinite, then the amount of planets that would contain said alien life, would be infinite in quantity as well. With planets existing for an infinite amount of time, it's also increasingly probable that we wouldn't be the first intelligent sentient space bearing scociety.

Following this logic, there is infinite potential for an alien scociety to have reached our current tech level an infinite number of years ago. All of our electronic technology is less than 200 years old. Imagine what we would have in a trillion years... You couldn't, because we as a whole couldn't even conceive an imagination of what we would be capable of.

Further along this line of logic, there is infinite potential that there would be intergalactic traveling aliens, which you yourself agree may be a possibility....

So if they exist, which we know they must inevitably, why is it such a stretch that they are using Earth? I refuse to say "Visiting" because we don't know why they are here. If they are here, there is no way to determine if they are here because we are, or just because the Earth has something they want/need.

I will never accept anything other than Aliens exist... and it's not because I want them to exist, I really could careless -- we as a people have way to many problems as it is. I KNOW Aliens exist, because we exist, and we are 1 planet, 1 sun, 1 solar system, out of infinite. If it exists once, it will exist twice, three times, 100 million times, as there aren't even enough number classes to even visualize how many planets and stars and solar systems actually exist.

It would simply be illogical for there not to be, and hence the reason why my stance will never change.


I've also seen a UFO, at sub 30 feet. No I can't prove that I did, but then again -- I'm not trying to convince you either... I know what I saw (if you saw one in mega real life detail less than 30 feet away from you, you would know too), you don't need to have seen proof for this statement to be true. You may however, need proof for YOU to recognize that it IS the truth.

/rest

edit on 29-3-2011 by Laokin because: (no reason given)

Excellent post. Pretty much my thoughts exactly!!
Thank you.

First off. You must distinguish between belief based upon popular opinion and belief in what you truely find most pluasible.

Since childhood I was told, in church, we were made by God in his image. As I grew older I began to wonder how anyone could look like so many different people.

Of course I believed this and that we on earth were special.

Then one evening I saw something which did not fit into anything else I had ever been told. Then another evening I saw another totally different thing which also did not fit.

Since then I have come to realize that we on earth are not that special after all. I have not seen an alien life form, as such, but what I saw does not match up with anything else I know of that man has made.

Based upon these events I do believe we are not alone, but I do not have any idea about what our visitors look like.

Sorry to jump into this thread, I've read most of the arguments and I feel it would be a waste to specifically counter the few of them. I just want to suggest a few generalizations on this matter.

An extra terrestrial life form may as well be to the equivalent of an amoeba living on a distant planet. I think the notions of these aliens visiting earth is quite surreal whereas we are fixated to assume that these life forms are more intelligent than human beings. We grow up with a vast and bottomless pit of knowledge and a dreamer can often forget the most basic principles and discoveries of mankind and the universe. We have invented things on this planet that have never existed prior. Our desire for knowledge as people pushes us to indulge in curiosity for observations greater than ourselves. Whereas someone solely educated in science would suggest we place our interest not in whether aliens have sustained life here, but rather if WE can sustain life out there.

The only real theories that matter are the ones that push our own boundaries a step further. In my opinion at least.

Cheers,

17.

Originally posted by M0bstar. I just look at both sides with an open mind. And no, I don't believe EVERY thing I see about aliens/UFO's to be real. .

Well it sure doesn't look like your open minded on both sides!

You've put yourself firmly in the "I believe" camp.

When I gave pretty valid reasons why I didn't think there was any solid proof that ETs were visiting Earth.....,you just outright refused to take on board what I was saying.

Now that ain't open minded mate.....that's a downright defence in believing that Earth visiting ETs do exist.

But I'll ask again.........show me the evidence, and if you can't, then how can you be sure there is any?

Originally posted by oooothegovernment

ahhh, but you fail to address the Starchild Skull, proof that aliens have been here over 900 years ago.

And what proof is there that the "Star child" is a hybrid ET?

Originally posted by LiberLegit
What's your take on the Bob White artifact?

I've seen the Bob White artefact on tv, and it is an interesting object, but whether it is from an ET spacecraft is debatable

Testing with Colm Kelleher, Institute for Discovery Science (NIDS) found that the object.was a aluminum-silicon alloy.

Here's the conclusion of his report:

Results from the analysis of sample #2 are quite conclusive. The specimen is an aluminum-silicon alloy, with a substantial amount of variety of impurities, including iron, calcium, sulfur, chlorine, sodium, magnesium and others. The composition is one that could be used as an aluminum casting alloy. The closest commercial material has the trade name "360 alloy" [Lyman, 1961]. This is a die casting alloy used in applications where excellent castability and resistance to corrosion are required. It is used for miscellaneous thin-walled and intricate castings. Since this type of alloy is very close to the eutectic (lowest melting) composition, it has excellent fluidity at relatively low temperatures.

The microstructure of the sample is one to be expected from the composition: second phase eutectic silicon particles in a matrix of aluminum solid solution. However, due to a few undesirable structural characteristics, it would be regarded as a poorly cast aluminum alloy when compared with published micrographs of commercial materials [Lyman, 1972]. The large amount of porosity would certainly lead to a decreased strength and decreased corrosion resistance. The presence of porosity together with the apparent flow lines suggests that uncontrolled cooling took place. The significant amount of impurities like sodium accounts for the fineness and rounded nature of the silicon particles, rather than the larger, longer, more angular particules usually observed. Dislocations (planes of slip caused by plastic deformation) appear to be decorated by silicon particles. In many cases, these dislocations follow the flow lines. This suggests some forced flow during solidification of the melt (in the range of temperatures 600 degrees C to 575 degrees)


And testing was also done by a Geologist:

Joe W. Fandrich Planetary Research Geologist, Mesa State College, Grand Junction, CO

His conclusions:

Conclusions--A Summary of Probabilities and Possibilities
This unusual aluminum object was discovered on the Earth’s surface. How it arrived at the surface or how it became the property of Bob White is not important to this investigation. However, it is important to note that this object has been severely altered from its original shape by high velocity atmospheric friction and formed into the tear-drop shape we observe today by passage through an atmosphere. Probabilities of the history of this object range from the purposeful distruction of an off-course test missile from the Green River Missile Range, Green River, Utah, to the atmospheric breakup and frictional disintegration of an Earth-orbiting staellite. These scenarios would explain the 360 aluminum casting alloy as well as the description of Bob White’s observations during the object’s discovery. The possibility that the object is the product of a failed high-voltage electric transmission line has been suggested, however there are no such transmission lines in the area where this object was collected by
Bob White (i.e., the area described by Bob White near the Utah/Colorado state line on Highway 6 and 50). The radiation emitted by the object is not considered unusual as most objects in our universe emit radiation, including the human body. Whether or not this object is the result of other than a primarily terrestrial event is only to be entertained as conjecture. At this time and with the results of this and prior research, it is possible to state that this is a manufactured object hat does not exist naturally and that is the product of an explosion and/or high temperature velocity passage through an atmosphere, probably Earth’s, with frictionally induced alteration and associated exterior ornamentation (i.e., “feathered” tails)

Respectfully submitted April 26, 2004 Joe W. Fandrich.

So whilst an interesting object, it's not necessarily an artefact from ET.

Originally posted by Laokin With planets existing for an infinite amount of time, it's also increasingly probable that we wouldn't be the first intelligent sentient space bearing scociety.

Following this logic, there is infinite potential for an alien scociety to have reached our current tech level an infinite number of years ago. All of our electronic technology is less than 200 years old. Imagine what we would have in a trillion years... You couldn't, because we as a whole couldn't even conceive an imagination of what we would be capable of.

Further along this line of logic, there is infinite potential that there would be intergalactic traveling aliens, which you yourself agree may be a possibility....

So if they exist, which we know they must inevitably, why is it such a stretch that they are using Earth? I refuse to say "Visiting" because we don't know why they are here. If they are here, there is no way to determine if they are here because we are, or just because the Earth has something they want/need.

I will never accept anything other than Aliens exist... and it's not because I want them to exist, I really could careless -- we as a people have way to many problems as it is. I KNOW Aliens exist, because we exist, and we are 1 planet, 1 sun, 1 solar system, out of infinite. If it exists once, it will exist twice, three times, 100 million times, as there aren't even enough number classes to even visualize how many planets and stars and solar systems actually exist.

Laokin you make some valid points which in general I agree with.
The vastness of our own Milky way let alone the Universe seem to point to the fact that there surely must be life and some intelligent life out there somewhere.
Lets say for argument's sake man devise a machine that could scan the universe and tell us point blank if other life exist elsewhere.......and the results came back negative........and Earth was the only planet with any intelligent life.......that would be pretty mind blowing!
Is life common in the Universe.....well that's the $64,000 question.
It's not even a simple case of planet being in the "goldilocks" zone of it's Sun....not too close.....not too far......but equally evidence suggests that our own Moon is instrumental in both getting life started and maintaining life, so that means other planets would also need something similar to our own moon before life could take hold.

The question that isn't so easily answered is whether it would really be possible for ET to travel the vast distances to get here, most scientist don't believe it is possible as it would require some bending of the laws of physics to achieve......even for ET.
You can counter that argument by saying that ET would be much more advanced and capable of somehow overcoming the distance/speed barrier than we humans can even currently conceive.

Lots of people have reported seeing lights in the sky, and fast moving objects........but there are so many things both natural and man made that can easily be misidentified as an ET UFO.

I too saw a couple years back a bright ball of light streak across the sky, my friend saw it too, and we were speculating as to what it was.....because it appeared much too fast to be a plane and looked much more solid than any meteorite we had seen.
For a few years we still had no idea what we saw.........until one day I decided to really find out what it was.....It turns out that what we actually saw was the International Space Station!

Indeed just a few months back the BBC were doing a live outside broadcast about star gazing, some eagle eyed viewers saw a light steak past in the sky...........and there were calls into the BBC claiming that they saw a UFO........but it eventually turned out to be a meteor.

The increasing trend of releasing Chinese lanterns has also led to numerous UFO false alarms, even appearing in national newspapers and tv news.

And then there are the unusual natural phenomena that have relatively recently been discovered in Sprites, elves & Blu jets, scientist didn't even know they existed before 1989.

In my local home town newspaper I was intrigued to see strange vertical lights in the sky being photographed and reported on.......again some concluded they must be ET in origin.........it turn out that they were a natural phenomena called Ice crystal pillars!

Then there are the man made objects, like satellites and space debris and Top secret aircraft.

So to me there is just far too much out there in the night sky of natural and man made origin to confidently conclude that the lights that someone saw in the night sky must be UFOs of the ET variety.

There are lots of people that claim that ET is here, based on the lights in the sky they saw, but therein lies the problem, most people don't know what else is actually in the sky....much less seen the phenomena that I referred to earlier.
So whilst people claim to see Unidentified Flying Objects.......many cases would probably be only "unidentified" by the observer at the time......had they had a scientist in natural phenomena with them......they may well have identified the flying object.
Just like a strange looking animal in the Amazon jungle, which me or you could swear is a brand new species
a biologist could identify easily enough.

So do I think we are being visited.........on the current evidence available I have to say no.

Originally posted by Logical one

Originally posted by M0bstar. I just look at both sides with an open mind. And no, I don't believe EVERY thing I see about aliens/UFO's to be real. .

Well it sure doesn't look like your open minded on both sides!

You've put yourself firmly in the "I believe" camp.

When I gave pretty valid reasons why I didn't think there was any solid proof that ETs were visiting Earth.....,you just outright refused to take on board what I was saying.

Now that ain't open minded mate.....that's a downright defence in believing that Earth visiting ETs do exist.

But I'll ask again.........show me the evidence, and if you can't, then how can you be sure there is any?

edit on 29-3-2011 by Logical one because: (no reason given)

See if you actually read what I had put, you would of seen that I did state that I DO NOT BELIEVE EVERY thing that comes out as a UFO or alien encounter. By being open minded, means I look at things from both sides, yea I do believe they are visiting Earth...how ever I DO NOT believe every person who says they have seen UFO nor do I believe EVERY VIDEO/ STORY online. I look at things from my own point of view and take my own opinions about things. And all you did was pretty much state what EVERY OTHER "skeptic"(logical person) states...you people say the same $h!t over and over. To be honest, what I believe is mine to believe, I don't have to sit here and show/explain "evidence" to convince some "logical" skeptic about anything. You people believe what you want, and let others believe what they want. And none of you have answered my question either: Why do you feel the need to come on to a site like ATS with your "logical" ways and skeptic points of view and try to push them on people and stir up $h!t on here? You people talk about "show me proof they exist"...well show me something that DISPROVES their existence...just like most of us who do believe and don't have SOLID PROOF that they exist..neither do you have SOLID PROOF that disproves their existence. So how are you going to tell me that I'm not open minded, because I believe? Well then, your not open minded either if you solidly disbelieve everything. Like I said I look at things WITH AN OPEN MIND...and make my own decision and judgement about things, as I said I DO NOT BELIEVE EVERY THING THAT COMES out to be UFO/alien related. I have been reading your replies and posts...seems when someone does present you with something, you push it off as "oh THAT does not prove anything"...I hope you don't call yourself "open minded"...you seem a bit closed minded to me. Like the "star child" skull..that could seriously be caused by a number reasons why that skull is the way it is,...so no I don't believe that is proof of extraterrestrials or do I think it is even extraterrestrial related. And that is just one of MANY stories that I DO NOT BELIEVE...so how can you say I have just thrown myself into the "I Believe" camp...if I was in that "camp"...then I would be one who believes that as well as EVERY SINGLE story about ANYTHING alien/UFO related....witch I don't...so yea...

Well seems to be more proof on UFO's/Aliens than GOD....Cant recall ever seen proof or evidence of GOD...And if he does exist he got a lot to answer for.Me personally i do believe in a higher being,i just cant bring myself to call it GOD.