Don't Respond to Obvious Trollery, Just Alert It

reply to post by masqua
Ok, I admit I might be being a bit cheeky by saying that. However, persistent offenders are still on here.

OK, I will U2U a name to you. Look at their posts and explain how that member has not been banned (if you are even allowed to U2U me an explanation). Every member I have contacted about this character agrees with me. Lots of us have alerted staff and from what I can see they haven't even had a posting suspension.

U2U to follow.

reply to post by Pimander


There are various levels of trollery.

Dumb trolling, which obviously contravenes the T&C's and gets posts removed quickly if alerted
Mediocre trolling, which usually requires some mild staff interactions in the hopes of turning things around.
Intelligent trolling, where the T&C's are consistently adhered to and the language used remains vague,

Intelligent trollery is the most difficult to stop simply because they never say anything which may be pointed at and found to be a troll post. Usually, these individuals will come onto a certain topic, like 9/11 and say the same thing over and over but never answer to anything which puts their opinion at risk of debunking. We all see them wherever we go. They are one-trick ponies who, when you see that they posted in a thread, you already know what they're going to say. A severe case of blinkers.

Originally posted by Pimander
Every member I have contacted about this character agrees with me.

Why would you feel the need to do that?

Lots of us have alerted staff...

You DO know that forum gangs are not allowed on ATS, right?

...and from what I can see they haven't even had a posting suspension.

And you wouldn't. That is not posted on the board. It's between the member and the staff.

reply to post by masqua


Good points. I got zinged with an extreme T&C yesterday because I lost my cool with a troll, or, internet liar I would say. My bad. I have to remind myself sometimes that the anonimity and distance on the internet does not give us the right to be jerks. I was a jerk to a jerk and I lost. Lesson learned.

CJ

reply to post by ColoradoJens


sometimes it helps to remember if you have them hitting below the belt you have them on the ropes

reply to post by ColoradoJens


And that's why staff doesn't just ban everyone that 'loses it' in a thread. Frustration can set in easily at times and does not reflect on their overall demeanor on the boards. The staff response is equally graduated to the number of times uncivil responses are posted by any particular member.

Personally, and as is also the case with other staff, I also try to discern what it was which prompted that bit of flaming. Sometimes it's not so simple, but often it is obvious. Using a 'Reply to' from somewhere deep in a big thread makes it easy, while a quote can require a lot of searching.

reply to post by masqua


It's appreciated more than you may know. Without understanding the innerworkings of the mod structure/workloads etc, it is impossible for y'all to be omniscient as some seem to believe.
In my own case, I believe every action taken against me has been legit. All my own doing.
Sometimes I get too comfortable in the environment, sometimes I am in a bad mood, whatever.
A nudge now and then to tone it down should not be taken personally, hopefully instead retrospectively.

I for one appreciate the fact I am still here - on numerous occasions, without some cooling down and thinking on my part, ATS could have(can) banned me, but instead they have given me numerous chances to make good. Thanks for that real world approach. That said, can I have my 500 points back from yesterday? Pretty please?

CJ

reply to post by iforget


True. My issue though was simply frustration over the inanity of the posts. There was no discussion/argument, just posts that added nothing. I guess I mistook my regular jeans that day for Supermod jeans and took it upon myself to get all uppity. Just shows a lack of control on my part, but hey, I realize I did it and it wasn't the right thing to do - all's fair in love and war?

CJ

I let God be the judge of man, and not man be the judge of man. If we could understand this point I think our society would be a lot more tolerant.

Peace and blessings.

reply to post by filosophia


That's a great philosophy which is, unfortunately, ignored by far too many.

reply to post by intrepid

There has been no gangs.

I have contacted a few users when they have been trolled to say alert the post and don't respond. They frequently already had. There was also some amazement from a couple of members that the member hadn't been banned.

Nothing sinister. I'm a big boy and can look after myself.

Edit: Oh yes, if they had had a posting suspension then I imagine they would have had a break - which I don't think has happened.

reply to post by ColoradoJens


Ah sorry

have you ever had a mosquito buzzing in your ear as you try to fall asleep, try to swat it and it comes back after a moment

occasionally I overreact to those

The problem that I have discovered is that even though you might not say something intended to insult someone, you say it and someone translates it as though you insulted them. Then that person rants quick shots that you don't see because 15 posts just flew by from their post to yours and they demand that you answer them and you can't even go back to find their post.

Sometimes they clip quotes and then you respond to the wrong person and then that person gets upset. It gets confusing sometimes when people post triple quote replies.

It is hard for me to report someone as a troll. I don't like to tattle-tale, unless a person makes a racist comment then I might report it. I try hard to construct what I am going to say in a post, and monitor what I say, but sometimes people are out there just ready to pounce on any idea that they don't like to begin with, sometimes it seems as though they are post predators with an agenda.

I really try hard to post effectively without insulting anyone, but sometimes just the nature of the thread title is enough to set them off and they are predators. Sometimes you can't even say something innocent like "I like green" without someone flipping out about green and telling you why you are stupid because you don't like red.

The Common Defense

Originally posted by WarminIndy
It is hard for me to report someone as a troll. I don't like to tattle-tale, unless a person makes a racist comment then I might report it.

Maybe I'm misreading this, but what this suggests is that you would rather not let the staff know about most cases of trolling, except for racism, even though the bulk of your post describes how much of a problem it can be to face these things on your own.

The implication is that we would respond inappropriately to cases you don't think are quite so bad, but I don't think it's really fair to assume we have such poor judgment. We get a lot of complaints that we investigate and, if we don't see a violation of the T&C, take no action.

Some people criticize us for that and accuse us of negligence or apathy, some assume we're biased/paid off/lackeys/etc following a sinister agenda, some try to use us as weapons against members they disagree with, some simply like seeing if they can get a rise out of us, and please be assured, we've seen it all.

And while we don't see everything, we do see a lot, and for every post we do take action on, there are hundreds that are perfectly fine, express just about every point of view imaginable, and represent the kind of diversity of thought that makes ATS worthwhile.

An important part of being a mod is knowing when to take action, and knowing when to leave things alone. Sometimes things get worse if we don't intervene, sometimes intervening makes things worse. Developing a sense for which is which is an art subject to constant refinement and prone to error, but is at the heart of what we do.

I know, especially on a conspiracy site, there will always be a tendency for members to assume the mods are evil, on a power trip, controlled by The Government, Aliens or the New World Order, or otherwise out to abuse the membership, but the truth is that we're members too, we came to ATS for the same reasons most members do, and we want the same thing most members want: a better ATS.

When you ALERT us to a problem, please don't think of it as "tattling". Although the decision to issue an alert is always yours to make and is always optional, there's really no good reason to look the other way when you see something wrong.

Let us know when you see a problem (alerts are discreet and we don't divulge who makes them) and we'll do what we think is best, which doesn't necessarily mean jumping all over someone just because we got an alert.

Give us a chance. Work with us on this.

I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Originally posted by Majic
The Common Defense

Originally posted by WarminIndy
It is hard for me to report someone as a troll. I don't like to tattle-tale, unless a person makes a racist comment then I might report it.

Maybe I'm misreading this, but what this suggests is that you would rather not let the staff know about most cases of trolling, except for racism, even though the bulk of your post describes how much of a problem it can be to face these things on your own.

The implication is that we would respond inappropriately to cases you don't think are quite so bad, but I don't think it's really fair to assume we have such poor judgment. We get a lot of complaints that we investigate and, if we don't see a violation of the T&C, take no action.

edit on 11/1/2011 by Majic because: (no reason given)

I meant this, that sometimes a person may not intend to be a troll and their intent can sometimes be misconstrued. Sometimes they are just passionate about a certain thing or they just like to be heard. Those are the ones I would rather leave alone than report because a lot of times, people will be feeling in a certain mood when they post a reply and a few hours later they may feel differently.

The mods here do a wonderful job considering the mass of threads they have to monitor, which I think can be a tough thing at times. The mods are people too but still do a great job. I don't think the mods have poor judgment, but I also know sometimes posters are reported over minor things the reader just did not understand in the reply.

The mods have always been very helpful to me. I enjoy ATS because it is a positive environment and that is due to the hard work of the mods.

The Course Of Human Events

Originally posted by WarminIndy
I meant this, that sometimes a person may not intend to be a troll and their intent can sometimes be misconstrued. Sometimes they are just passionate about a certain thing or they just like to be heard. Those are the ones I would rather leave alone than report because a lot of times, people will be feeling in a certain mood when they post a reply and a few hours later they may feel differently.

Ah, okay. Thanks for clearing that up, because I did misunderstand, and do agree that often it is indeed better to let some things slide rather than make a big deal out of them.

I have to say, one of my favorite things to see when I read a thread is when two members knock heads, maybe get a bit rude, then ultimately have second thoughts, apologize and carry on with newfound mutual respect.

It would be nice if the head-knocking part wasn't necessary, but sometimes you gotta break an omelette if you want to make some eggs.

Ok. This needs to be bumped every day until the end of time. Of all the time I spend on this site, 1/2 of it is used skimming and skipping posts by those who enjoy getting a rise out of others, and the responses to said posts. You are hurting the community whether you're initiating, or trying to "one-up" them with a retort. Thanks.

a reply to: inkyminds

Yes, the broken record players that bury the good info, take up bandwidth... why are they not banned?

I deal with trolls by providing enough perspective for other members who get it to realize this person is probably just trolling and then i end the conversation.

There are a few members here who ONLY troll the forums but are let go by staff because they tip toe around the TNC's.

Very clever they are and very old members they are...

Ive always wondered what they are getting out of it?

a reply to: onequestion I have read over threads as to what a troll is and I'm still confused..am not trying to be cute here... someone purposely being negative to insight anger? What if it is a natural feeling or experience that someone disagrees with?
Just curious if sharing a true thought or feeling on something is Trolling.
I feel like I am a troll, because half the things I say or do won't make sense to most folks...and it is harsh to deal with, when somethings you can only experience for your self to know it is true.
Any advice is welcome.
I'll leave if necessary.
Thanks.