Muslims want children excused from music, mixed phys-ed classes

Originally posted by eletheia
Issues arising from other races and religions would not occur if they respected the rules

and laws of the country they were visiting or intending to live in. Just as i pointed out in an

earlier post when families visit others the visitor RESPECTS the visited........

That's not true.

Look through a number of threads relating to sensationalised stories about Muslims in the West, and you'll see that much of the rage from people is at ''Muslims'', rather than the country of origin of the Muslims.

Most of the anti-Muslim stories in the British press are about British Muslims, not people from another country.


This is why I find it hard to believe that the anger from many on this thread is to do with their religion, not the fact that the Muslims, in this case, are not from Canada.

Originally posted by mobiusmale
[When in Rome, do as the Romans do. When in Manitoba, do as the Manitobans do...or keep on "migrating" until you find a country and a system that is entirely to your liking.

And good luck with that...

Resist this madness Canada...resist!

Manitobans freeze there buts off this time of the year. Same thing happens in Alberta they make there own schools and then get special dispensation to not have to follow the provincial curriculim.

reply to post by destination now


In the US, if there were extacredit classes.. Like PE and Music are considered.. then they can be placed out of them.

Where do they go? There's already detention rooms. The rotating schedules allow them to be placed in other classes.

If I lived in another country I would not expect the schools to make special amends for my children. In addition if I desired to live there I want my children to know the culture, join in the music and participate with others.

Originally posted by inforeal
Holmes is right.

Most of you people are just bigots looking for an excuse to bash Muslims.

And the ignoramus who said that Muslims throw acid in children’s faces is a certain ignorant bigot.

Sorry to burst your little bubble inforeal...but stating the facts about the Taliban version of Islam does not make me a bigot. These are facts about extremist Islam you might prefer to remain hidden, not talked about, but...

...2008...No students showed up at Mirwais Mena girls' school in the Taliban's spiritual birthplace the morning after it happened.

A day earlier, men on motorcycles attacked 15 girls and teachers with acid.

www.msnbc.msn.com...

Kandahar was the headquarters for the Taliban during its five-year rule of Afghanistan and was home to Taliban Supreme Leader Mullah Omar.

During that time, girls were forbidden to attend school. If they tried to get an education, they risked beatings by the religious police, or worse. Parents and family members were threatened, and sometimes killed, for allowing their girls the chance to be educated.

articles.cnn.com...:WORLD

And I guess I should not have limited my comments to acid attacks...these "Holy Warriors" sometimes use poison gas against students...or just burn girls' schools down.

...girls' schools are routinely torched or closed in areas where the insurgents hold sway

...90 Afghan school girls rushed to hospital yesterday unconscious and vomiting, possibly victims of a gas poisoning attack on their school in Mahmud Raqi village...of the 90 girls from the Qazaam school admitted to hospital, at least five slipped briefly into comas...

www.alternet.org...'taliban_gas_attack'/

But don't let the facts about what can happen when certain Islamists get control (or try to gain control) of the education system of a Country. Just call the messenger an ignoramous and a bigot...because that is easier than having to actually defend the actions of the followers of this mad religion.

Anyway, let's back off of the murderous tactics of the Taliban for a moment...and let's just say that in Canada certain Muslims decided that, for religious reasons, their female children should not have to attend school of any kind. Then what? We should allow these children to grow up without even a basic education...just because some religious cult says that females should not be educated?

In Canada, physical education and music training are an important part of education...as is reading, writing, math, science, etc.

This is the slippery slope I mentioned in my original post...today it is music class...tomorrow it is insisting that Muslim children be excused from other - or all - instruction.

Why is it that you feel justified in calling me and others "bigots" when we simply state the facts about what the parents of Muslim children are doing to their kids in the name of their faith? It is what it is.

Originally posted by JohnnyTHSeed
The law guarantees freedom of religious expression etc.. So these parents have decided these school programs would undermine their religious beliefs. Removing their children from these courses harms no outside party.

The overwhelming response in this thread is that these people should move to a different country, respect the laws of the land (which they are - as the law guarantees religious freedom), and a multitude of other less than respectful opinions.

The problem with this argument is that all freedoms are limited. You are not allowed to enjoy your version of a freedom, if your expression of that version of a freedom will do harm to yourself or another individual.

You have freedom of speech...but you may not not utter hate speech.

You have freedom of religious expression...but not if that expression limits the other rights and freedoms of other citizens (or guests) of the Country, or especially if it harms them in any way. Taking away your child's right to an education (or parts thereof) does harm to the child...which society has an obligation to protect.

People's "beliefs", religious or otherwise, do not give them the right to inflict damage on other people in our society.

Otherwise, this argument could be used to manufacture any kind of insane "belief system" and then use that framework to inflict pain, suffering and mayhem on anyone...with impunity.

As other posters have pointed out on other threads here, there are certain archaic elements of the Jewish and Christian Bibles that call for stoning of people for certain offences. Does this mean that Christians should be allowed to stone people under the protection of "freedom of religious expression"? Of course not...and I do not believe that there are any Christians in Canada calling for this right.

However...there are elements of the Muslim community in Canada, who are calling for the use of Sharia Law within the Country...which code does explicitly mete out this punishment (and is used to this day in many Islamic Countries around the world).

Canadians should...as citizens of the United Kingdom have now come to realize...resist forcefully these attempts to derail our system of laws, and the attempt to give "special" rights and freedoms to people (from a religion or not) who feel that their beliefs place them outside of the law.

Just stop it in its tracks now...

I'm confused? So by Muslim logic, it's immoral to have your child in gym or music class? But it's ok to follow Mohammads standard that you can marry a girl at any age as young as 1, and fvck her by atleast 9 years old? What kind of a twisted logic is that? Muslims: spitting in the face of logic since the beginning.

P.S I don't really care whether or not they want to exclude their child from a couple electives. I don't understand why, but that's their business; just as long as it doesn't interfere with the lives of others.

O.k., they want their children excused from required classes at school? Then fine. Ship their butts back to where ever they came from. I am so sick and tired of hearing about how these people come to a new country looking to better themselves, and then decide, NOPE, we don't want anything you have to offer, you must bend to our will. B.S. If it is a required class, then the child must take that class, unless of course the citizens of that country overturn that rule. When I was in middle school, I had to take P.E. Even though I had a note from the doctor stating I couldn't for my own personal health. It was required in my country. So I took an F (Failure) for the entire course. But when my health improved in high school, I was always ready to lift those weights, run that track, or just plain ole out have some sort of physical activity. Religion should have no place in school. If there is a course you must take to pass, then take it. Stop being a baby!

reply to post by mobiusmale


Until the muslims have a reformation, the religion will have to be eliminated in all western societies. Its not a race thing. Foolish white people convert as well.

Why cant they just go the route of the Sufi's? THAT should be what TRUE ISLAM is about.''


Damn shame really. The only religion that I cant stand. Maybe one day I wont have a reason to feel it.

If they allow these children a special concession to not participate in pe or music classes, then the school district will more than likely have to accommodate their needs by hiring an extra teacher to look after them. What will they do? Sit in a class room doing homework or looking at the wall for two class periods out of the day? I am not big on public schools but I do feel it's wrong to come in and expect them to rearrange everything for them. It's not racist either to say .... we don't want to accommodate your children. These parents need to take them to a private school or homeschool.

Like I said in another thread.

If they don't like the way a country works, then they can go back to their own #ing country.

I'm sick of hearing of this crap, and wouldn't have one problem telling it to the face of any Christian, Muslim - Jew or otherwise that when you move to a country, you work by that countries laws, NOT the other way around.

Muslims usually leave Muslim nations because they are really crappy places to live.

So the first thing they do is go to another nation.

And then start crapping that one up too, through their Muslim beliefs.

They DO love to spread their misery.

they should be deported...if you are trying to enter a country and force your culture on them, you should be declared an enemy combatant and sent packing...thats like us going over to their country and demanding that people stop eating dogs because it offends our delicate sensibilities...you cant force your culture on a foreign nation, plain and simple

You don't like the way my country (Canada) is, get the hell out and don't come back nuff said. So sick of all this crap. Enough of being PC, enough or catering to those who have no interest in being Canadian get the hell out, no more come, and don't let the door hit you on the way out. Your unwelcome if all you wanna do is change the way we have been for some hundred plus years....

This member (me) tries to be accepting of human differences, but this tale of bent-over (backwards) paralysis seems to have a strong rationale for denying the wishes of muslim parents to remove their kids from music and co-ed gym.
I assume they chose to immigrate to Canada because Canada represented to them a safe haven for their kids and families, but their behavior of rejection and self-exclusion is destructive to the very society they felt so safe immigrating to. The Canadian public education system is one of the best in the world. If those immigrants feel so strongly, and if Canadian law permits it, let them create their own private school system ... but with their own money. I would imagine that the Canadian govt will want to monitor those schools for teaching quality and to make certain their kids are receiving an education enabling the kids to function in the Canadian society.I also imagine if they were offered free tickets back to their country of origin they would refuse, loudly. To be sensitive to the parents, they have to adjust to the reality of their coming to a new country, but heck, Canada is willing to help bring their kids along quite well and safe.

I'm all for freedom of religion, but this is a situation where they are wanting their children excluded from certain mandatory classes and are going to create a situation that is onerous for the school.

Unless it violates a fundamental and widely-held tenant of their religion or specific sect, then demanding special treatment for their children is not strictly against their religious beliefs; it's simply the parents trying to strong arm the schools to comply with their non-Western cultural traditions.

Originally posted by Maslo
This is crazy and over the top. If those subjects are compulsory for all, than their request is completely without merit and borders with attempted child abuse IMHO. Just imagine you would want your children excused from maths, because you deem numbers immoral, or from biology, because your crazy fundamentalistic religion is not compatible with evolution.

There should be no comprising with such requests.

I don't have to imagine that because they are not asking that their kids be taken out of math. Music and Gym aren't on a high school equivalence examination. If you don't think people should be allowed to opt out of them for religious reasons, then why aren't you campaigning to ban home schooling of any child? During home schooling, a child doesn't have to be put through the gym and music but only the major subjects that may be touched upon by the GED.

Must be Opposite Day if the neocons are begging for greater power and control by the government.

They want their kids excused from some classes...man thats crazy. What a bunch of evil scum. Of-course this in no way affects anyone else, but what does that matter. How dare they make a request of a school system which is paid for in part by their tax money.

Sad to see the level to which people have been programmed.

Odd that so many main stream establishment mantras are so prevalent on a website whose motto is to "deny ignorance".

Originally posted by Sherlock Holmes
What on earth has the fact that they're Muslim got to do with anything ?

This is a case of some parents, for one reason or another, complaining about having their children forced to being taught something that they don't agree with or that they don't want their children to take part in.

It's amazing when so many people pull out the ''freedom'' or ''government intrusion'' card when it suits them, they apparently ignore the fact that these parents are objecting to the State forcing their children to learn something that they do not wish to.

Islam is a religion of the Sword. That is very relevant. I suggest people look up what happened to the Byzantine Christians when they made the mistake of trusting the Islamic Turks.

reply to post by mobiusmale


Well then they moved to the wrong country. if they had moved to America, they could have enjoyed the fruits of the American conservative movement's tremendous efforts to strip anything of cultural or intellectual value from our school systems.

Come, crazy Muslim goobers! Come, New York is just a short drive from Quebec. Come, and bask in the bright light of bubble-tests and only having enough funds for football equipment!