UFO over Jerusalem: CONFIRMED HOAX

Originally posted by Kali74
We've been waiting a long time for exhibit-A, something governments could not turn a blind eye to, we thought we had it, how can blame any of "us" for wanting to make damn sure beyond any doubt that it wasn't?

Well that is all well and good... BUT other than merely stating what you believe or want to believe... what exactly are you and the other believers doing to PROVE that these are real? Where is the investigation to support your side?

To just say I want to believe and use that as an argument is NOT enough. If we don't learn to separate the hoaxes from reality, we will NEVER see any truth... because the next hoaxer will take lessons from this case and do better next time . The more people that support a hoax, the more the hoaxers are encouraged to keep it up

There comes a time you have to say... "not buying this one, too many holes" and move on. When even a believer tells us "there is 95% evidence for a hoax" it is time to stop flogging the dead horse and move on to better evidence.

No, that's wrong.

People can disagree with you, people can say they don't trust the source of the debunking and they think elements of what's gone on hint to a possible cover up. That's not unreasonable. It's probably wrong. But really not much in life is that black and white.

Originally posted by hootlj
I mean guys for all we know, this is all a big elaborate hoax planned by the government to get us ignoring something else that's going on or some other legit UFO, haha.

Im with you there, I suspect this hoax could be psy-ops for something. Some think blue beam, some think because of Egypt is meant as a deterrent. A false rapture? The tin foul hat conspiracy nut part of me suspects a 3rd party may have funded and organized the hoaxers. The catholic church, Islam the Hebrews would all benefit in this event. People start to believe again because this has so many religious undertones. After all a god fearing society is easier to control.

I know that's silly!

Not really, after all this is ATS



Agendas within Agendas or it could be all for the LULZ,

Yeah, I guess it's just like I was thinking hypothetically. If there was a big UFO sighting that threatened the ongoing cover up from Roswell, you know, what would happen. Would we ever figure it out? I wonder! I wonder if the only way you'd ever crack a case like that is to keep asking questions and investigating, even when you have doubts. That's all. I just don't want us to miss out on the next opportunity. I think this was one of those early on, but probably the horse is finally dead now.

reply to post by Unknown Soldier


Ya, I've posted in there a few times now. I've seen a UFO personally too. I gave credit to the debunks but with flawed technology I pushed and pushed until I was sure. I may not have a degree in video analysis but I trust my critical thinking. I'm aware of the amount of hoaxes and charlatans out there, but it doesn't jade me and never will, I may have to admit to be wrong on occasion (like this case) but I'm perfectly ok with that. I just wish people were not ridiculed for pushing the issue, if there's frustration in having to make your points over and over then don't open the thread lol. Giving up because someone tells you to and not because you have been satisfied isn't being true to yourself, and no one should ask that of anyone else.

Originally posted by Kali74I just wish people were not ridiculed for pushing the issue, if there's frustration in having to make your points over and over then don't open the thread lol. Giving up because someone tells you to and not because you have been satisfied isn't being true to yourself, and no one should ask that of anyone else.

Precisely my point.

I just wish ONCE the believers who 'push' it would actually work just as hard as those showing it to be a hoax to back their side. Then maybe the frustration would be less

No one expects you to give up because someone tells you, but it is reasonable to expect you to show evidence to support your claim that it is real other than you believe

reply to post by zorgon


A lot did.

Hey I have provided all sorts of stuff!! I can't contribute to the video analysis, but I've been digging and trying to do everything I can. I took screen shots of some of the new "what happened to the Jerusalem" thread when this one disappeared. I've told you about everything I've found so far. If anything, it helps you guys be sure this is a hoax...since I haven't found much. : )

Just in review, in case you don't believe me...stuff I shared here:
-Jerusalem UFO twitter tied to Space.com
-The UFO cover-up blog that mysteriously disappeared
-The witness testimonies featured on UFOEYEs
-Bringing to light the Michael Cohen stuff
-the article from iBlogger about Israeli Channel 2 getting an email from the apparent hoaxer (never a follow up)
-etc

I've searched Hebrew sites for forum/comment posting about the UFOs...I'm telling you, I'm really digging!

Sorry for jumping in here, but was there ever an explanation as to why this thread totally disappeared last night? I am trying to keep up but maybe I missed it. Thanks.

Originally posted by hootlj
I've searched Hebrew sites for forum/comment posting about the UFOs...I'm telling you, I'm really digging!

glad_to_be_His

apparently someone accidentally deleted it.

I have to say, I'd love to hear from paradigm again, haha, cuz he/she said they had details on case and was about to crack open...a bit before thread went down. Did they post after???

hahahah

Let me just say by the way I love this site. I'm so appreciative of the long-time ATS members who have made it what it was. I plan to participate in many more threads after this. This is just such a great use of the Internet!

reply to post by hootlj


Oh, OK..... thank you! I was wondering.

So has anyone done an analysis on the probability statistics of all of the coincidences that have been happening all around this "sighting?"

Like I said, this is what caused me to push the "cover up" hypothesis so hard:

-The odd media reporting from the get go...especially thee outlets that labeled it a marketing stunt right away (doesn't even add up -- sacred no fly zone in Jerusalem sighting?)

-The Jerusalem live can web footage not working for me like it did in beginning. Apparently tit's worked for others, though, so maybe it was just my comp. You guys can give it a go if you want:
www.02ws.com...

-The YouTube cover up blog disappearing without a trace - I'm literally the only one who caught this because I just happened to be on Twitter at time when post was still live.

-This very thread, the best one on the net about this by the way, vanishing last night for SEVERAL HOURS without explanation.

-Recent increase in wow-worthy UFO sightings, especially over the past week...Utah/Mexico/Peru/India/China, etc etc People are talking about this hoax probably more than those so far-legit sightings

-The @THEJerusalemUFO twitter account being tied to Space.com after getting created (Space.com being one of the best Hoax articles linked)

Not trying to ignite old debates, guys, just re-emphasizing what caused me to peruse cover up angle so hard - per poster's question. : )

I also think the lack of conversations among locals - haven't found barely any at all - is strange. hoax or not.

reply to post by hootlj


Is that a threat?

Thanks for the kind words, it really does mean allot and we're glad to have you at ATS.
[The following is not directed at "hootj" in particular]

Now to Zorgon's point about the "believers" pushing the skeptics...

If you feel the need to believe in a sighting like this for whatever reason, you've seen one yourself, you just KNOW "they" are here, you just KNOW the Government is covering up, whatever, you simply MUST bring more to the table than that if you want argue the case.

Arguing over beliefs that lack evidence to back them up is a dead end road.

Imagine how infuriating it would be for you if your coworker, your spouse, or anyone you know in life, walked up to you and said they KNOW you beat small puppies and steal candy from children.

You retort that with all sorts of evidence that proves you don't, but, like anything else you can't completely disprove a negative, so you are left with all the evidence you can muster things like, zero reports of you stealing candy, zero reports of you beating up small puppies, the fact you own a puppy and it's not beaten up, etc...

But your loving friend, spouse, whatever, keeps throwing that they KNOW you do in your face just pushing to "make sure" you don't.

How would that sit with you? How would you like it if they kept telling you that you are only denying it because you can't stand to face the reality that you are a puppy beating, child's candy thief?

Now if that same friend came up to you and said they HEARD A RUMOR you were a puppy beating, child's candy stealing thief and, allowed you to present your evidence against that without calling you a liar, closed minded, a disinfo agent, blind etc... You probably wouldn't get so frustrated would you?

Even if they wanted more details, still didn't believe you, but, were CIVIL and RESPECTFUL in their query, you would want to work with them to make sure they understood the truth right?

But, if they continued to disregard your evidence all the while presenting ZERO evidence of their own other than, "I just KNOW you are a puppy beating, child's candy stealing thief", you'd probably either walk away disgusted or smack them, right?

Now if after ALL that, they walk up to you a day or so later and say, well I thought about it and I guess you're not a puppy beating, child's candy stealing thief and the only reason I kept getting in your face about it was TO BE SURE, how would you feel about them then?

This is the interwebs, I get that some people have D-Egos that get the best of them, I also get that there are people who really, really, really NEED a sighting/video like this to real, that there people who have experienced things that they KNOW were beyond explanation and/or tend to think that if this were real it would be covered up.


I get all of that and everyone of them are WELCOME HERE as long as they can be civil and respectful in their debate.

Personally, I think this thread has been pretty good with regards to civility over a hot topic, compared to the rest of the internet at least (go read YouTube comments for an example), but still we have had "true believers" slagging the very people who are trying to help them avoid believing in something false. It's understandable that the skeptics get frustrated when they have explained the same thing several times but, because of a lack of knowledge, deep seated beliefs it's not accepted or, worse yet, they get accused of some ulterior motive.

If it's beyond your ability to comprehend or accept that something is a hoax that's fine, but don't attack the messenger, attack the message, if you can. If all you have is "I've seen something like this before so I KNOW IT'S REAL" or, "I KNOW the government is covering it up and therefore it's REAL" then don't expect much in the way of a positive response.


Springer...

Has anyone got a timeline of the event?

The first post of this thread states "On Jan 28th This first clip appeared on Youtube"

Then on page 4 we see from unexplaind mysteries.com
"Hello i am eliyahu, the person who originally uploaded the jerusalem ufo video
youtube.com/user/eligael
Myself and my friend filmed in the early hours of saturday morning (between 1 and 5 past 1am to be exact)"

This would be 01:05 on the 29th

So now time travel is also involved

Can anyone explain this???

reply to post by hootlj


You know, like you, I have been trying to look around international news sites and I can't believe the trouble I have finding stories on this! You would think considering the possible religious significance and the fact that this was for whatever reason so "mainstream" that you would find some more discussion on it among the regular folks not just ufosies

I applaud those who continued to ask questions and feel a bit nervous about the adamant calls to just shelf this thing possibly before its time. I realize that its time may well have come but still if people have questions this is supposed to be the place to go without ridicule and closed minds. I mean no offense to anyone as I really love this place but in the end we are all anonymous and if we start to not question things that don't add up simply because someone we think we respect tells us not to, then this place ceases to have value as it will become just like all of the other media. I for one want the opportunity to hear what everyone has to say so I can consider things for myself.

Originally posted by Springer

Personally, I think this thread has been pretty good with regards to civility over a hot topic, compared to the rest of the internet at least (go read YouTube comments for an example),

I'm all with you about those YouTube comments.....too much of a unrestricted free for all if you ask me.
And some of the foul mouthed language is disgusting! Why Google allow it is beyond me.
And the worst thing is YouTube is very popular with young kids, on a number of occasions , I've had to put my hand over the comments to prevent my niece and nephews from reading them.

Originally posted by glad_to_be_His


You know, like you, I have been trying to look around international news sites and I can't believe the trouble I have finding stories on this! You would think considering the possible religious significance and the fact that this was for whatever reason so "mainstream" that you would find some more discussion on it among the regular folks not just ufosies

The reason why "regular folks" aren't discussing this case much is because no one has been given the chance to analyse the original footage.
If the only "evidence" presented is YouTube videos then it's hardly surprising that "regular folks" aren't discussing this considering YouTube is a haven for hoax videos.