Assassin's politics lean 'left wing, quite liberal'

reply to post by Sinnthia


Actually, all I saw in this thread was the OP pointing to the tweets of this woman who claimed to know the killer at one time.

The defensive nonsense that came thereafter- essentially calling the woman a liar or mistaken is almost too funny for words.

reply to post by loam


Basically Sinnthia is saying (if I can be so bold as to reply on his/her behalf) is that the girl doing the tweeting knew him (the shooter) as a 14-15 year old kid. What kid that age doesn't hate everything - teen angst and all that? She wrote he "wanted to change the world" and had liberal views - which actually I think we all do at that age.

Not liberal as in "progressive taxation" or "health care" or "equal pay" liberalism. Maybe she'll clarify, but I don't know any kids that think along those lines at that age.

He sounded more like a kid that wanted to engage in active protesting, etc.

I would also caution that if the 23-year old who shot the place up turns out to have a mental disorder, like schizophrenia, that his mental state now compared to then may be completely irrelevant.

Claiming that he was a "liberal" at the ripe old age of 14 is little more than political muckraking. The real question should be what his political leanings - if he even had them, anymore - were at the time of the shootings. And I'm guessing it was the violent rhetoric from the right-wing that played a stronger influence on him that anything from his band-camp days.

We could blame Palin, Tea Party, talk radio, ATS (he was a member). . . . . . .

Or we can blame him. Palin didn't pull the trigger, neither did Beck, ATS, or the twinkies he ate.

He pulled the trigger. He shot and killed and harmed those people. HE did.

No one seems to be blaming the actual killer. What happened to personal responsibility? What happened to owning up to your actions?

When you finally get to the crux of the issue, he pulled the trigger. He is responsible for his actions, and he will pay the price.

Hey look.
Here is another one.
blogs.phoenixnewtimes.com...

reply to post by Blackmarketeer


Thank you. I guess it is late where I am too. You said it perfectly. It just seems odd to me to read "Hey, you cannot say he was right wing and blame Palin because.... He was left wing, this tweet says he was back when this one girl claims to have known him." He did a pretty good job of painting himself as equal opportunity crazy NOW so all that nonsense seems a distraction to me.

reply to post by Blackmarketeer

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
The real question should be what his political leanings - if he even had them, anymore - were at the time of the shootings. And I'm guessing it was the violent rhetoric from the right-wing that played a stronger influence on him that anything from his band-camp days.

See, here is the thing. It is apparently a lot more important to you, and others like you, to know his political leanings than it is for me, because without a demonstration of his right-leaning tendencies, you miss the opportunity to make the political point that others are to blame.

For me, the killer is solely responsible. Full stop.

Blaming his actions on the loose associations of political rhetoric from whatever source is just nonsense in my book. Where does such an analysis end?

Will my threads be scrutinized and later be determined to have incited the criminal actions of another merely because I vigorously defended or opposed some position?

This is dangerous territory, and absent EXPRESS incitement, sentiments like yours surely invite tyranny as easily as any other example in history.

Just sayin'.

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by Sinnthia

 

Actually, all I saw in this thread was the OP pointing to the tweets of this woman who claimed to know the killer at one time.

The defensive nonsense that came thereafter- essentially calling the woman a liar or mistaken is almost too funny for words.

edit on 9-1-2011 by loam because: (no reason given)

Actually I saw people you like claiming this is some sort of evidence of something when in actuality, all you have are some tweets from a girl who claimed to know a kid. Get it?

reply to post by Sinnthia


It is evidence. Testimonial evidence. I never said it was dispositive of anything. Assuming she's not lying, it's one woman's opinion.

You, on the other hand, seem threatened by her opinion, because I imagine it spoils your opportunity to make a different political point.

Get it?

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by Sinnthia

 

It is evidence. Testimonial evidence. I never said it was dispositive of anything. Assuming she's not lying, it's one woman's opinion.

It is weak evidence. It is one girl on twitter making a rather feeble claim. How good is that evidence really?

You, on the other hand, seem threatened by her opinion, because I imagine it spoils your opportunity to make a different political point.

Get it?

No, you seem pretty set on holding up these tweets about a high school aquaintance of proof that he currently has a political bent.

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by InvisibleAlbatross

 

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross
The shooter said he cannot trust the current government, ranted about the Constitution, saying his college was illegal under the Constitution. These are not the things left-wingers typically say

Are your kidding???? Please don't make me have to cite HUNDREDS if not thousands of posts just within this site where those precise things were asserted by democrats or liberals or just about anyone opposed to Bush and his administration.

God, it's frustrating how feeble and short minded everyone seems when it comes to politics.

That is the argument you are making. I am saying his just plain crazy. I am also saying that I do not just accept a tweet from a girl that claims to have known someone in high school as evidence of their political leanings today.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
Jerad (known as erad3 on ATS) seemed to have no real political affiliation. His profile lists he dislikes voting all together.

He seems out of the left/right paradigm and more in line with the crazy/nutcase style mindset.

edit on 8-1-2011 by SaturnFX because: (no reason given)

I don't know if Jared was on ATS .

I do contend that he was out of the left/paradigm simply because no lefty that I know of has read Mein Kampf. His politics stances also seemed all over the place. Again the inability to know their enemy in any conflict always seriously mars any attempt at counter insurgency.

reply to post by Sinnthia


See? Your post exactly demonstrates how you play fast and loose with the facts...

Quote me directly where I say these tweets are "proof of...a political bent."

You can't.

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross
It is weak evidence. It is one girl on twitter making a rather feeble claim. How good is that evidence really?

It's one woman's opinion. I never said anything beyond that. You're the one who seems to think she's wrong- just 'cuz you say so.

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by InvisibleAlbatross

 

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross
The shooter said he cannot trust the current government, ranted about the Constitution, saying his college was illegal under the Constitution. These are not the things left-wingers typically say

Are your kidding???? Please don't make me have to cite HUNDREDS if not thousands of posts just within this site where those precise things were asserted by democrats or liberals or just about anyone opposed to Bush and his administration.

God, it's frustrating how feeble and short minded everyone seems when it comes to politics.

That is the argument you are making.

Yes. That it is ridiculous to assert left-wingers don't say they don't trust the government and rant about the Constitution.

reply to post by loam

It is apparently a lot more important to you, and others like you

You don't have a CLUE what my political leanings are, and don't presume you do. If I call out some right-wing blogger or one of those vapid idiotic taking-heads on Fox for espousing lies, that doesn't make me a "lefty". If I or "others like me" want to hold dingbats like Plain or Angle responsible for the vitriol they spew, that doesn't make me anything, other than someone who get's sick of listening to their worthless prattle.

Maybe you'd like to take a shot at explaining just what Angle meant when she said "2nd amendment remedies" for Harry Reid? To me, it sounds like she wanted someone to get a gun and SHOOT him.

Clarence Dupnick has spoken out on bigotry and intolerance in Arizona.

I find it OBSCENE that People are getting partisan about this murder/attempted murder. It is clear that this guy was "troubled" and a loner.

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by Sinnthia

 

See? Your post exactly demonstrates how you play fast and loose with the facts...

Quote me directly where I say these tweets are "proof of...a political bent."

You can't.

Sure I can. Right here. Pay attention to the parts in bold.

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by InvisibleAlbatross

 

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross
The shooter said he cannot trust the current government, ranted about the Constitution, saying his college was illegal under the Constitution. These are not the things left-wingers typically say

Are your kidding???? Please don't make me have to cite HUNDREDS if not thousands of posts just within this site where those precise things were asserted by democrats or liberals or just about anyone opposed to Bush and his administration.

God, it's frustrating how feeble and short minded everyone seems when it comes to politics.

Perhaps you meant to argue a different point?

It's one woman's opinion. I never said anything beyond that. You're the one who seems to think she's wrong- just 'cuz you say so.

I just posted where you seemed to think any dismissal of her tweets as evidence of a lefty as a rather absurd thought. I never said she was wrong. I said I put practically no value in these tweets at all.

Yes. That it is ridiculous to assert left-wingers don't say they don't trust the government and rant about the Constitution.

Oh, I gotcha. These tweets are not indicative of him being a lefty, just lefties usually say stuff like that so well, you know.... Right. Gotcha. I dunno. To me it seemed ridiculous to put any value in these tweets, especially so early but since you point out lefties tend to rail on about the constitution, point taken.

reply to post by Blackmarketeer

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
You don't have a CLUE what my political leanings are

Never said I did. I was merely addressing your opinion in this thread.

Originally posted by Blackmarketeer
If I or "others like me" want to hold dingbats like Plain or Angle responsible for the vitriol they spew, that doesn't make me anything, other than someone who get's sick of listening to their worthless prattle.

Well, in my book, it does make you wrong when you insist upon splitting the culpability of a killer's actions and assigning it to the political rhetoric of another.

Like I said, where does such an analysis end? Will I be held accountable for the actions of another supporting the political positions found within my threads?

reply to post by Sinnthia


Honestly, I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt..but it ain't easy. *sigh*

You can't convert my disputing your point that "these are not the things left-wingers typically say" into a belief that I said Parker's tweets were "proof" of the killer's "political bent."

Really, how many muscles did you pull with those mental gymnastics?

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by Sinnthia

 

Honestly, I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt..but it ain't easy. *sigh*

You can't convert my disputing your point that "these are not the things left-wingers typically say" into a belief that I said Parker's tweets were "proof" of the killer's "political bent."

Really, how many muscles did you pull with those mental gymnastics?

Must be the same ones you pulled to try and claim liberals are the ones always talking about the constitution

Originally posted by loam
reply to post by InvisibleAlbatross

 

Originally posted by InvisibleAlbatross
The shooter said he cannot trust the current government, ranted about the Constitution, saying his college was illegal under the Constitution. These are not the things left-wingers typically say

Are your kidding???? Please don't make me have to cite HUNDREDS if not thousands of posts just within this site where those precise things were asserted by democrats or liberals or just about anyone opposed to Bush and his administration.

God, it's frustrating how feeble and short minded everyone seems when it comes to politics.

Maybe you meant this reply in a different thread about a different shooter to a different post disputing his left wing affiliations? Maybe left wingers are constitution nuts. Whatever you say, chief.

reply to post by loam


Only in America that people mistake liberlaism for leftism. Understanding this crime will be difficult for some that have no understanding of political terrminology.

reply to post by Sinnthia

Originally posted by Sinnthia
Must be the same ones you pulled to try and claim liberals are the ones always talking about the constitution

Again, fast and loose with the facts. I didn't say "always". I just pointed out they are just as likely as conservatives to wave the Constitution when it benefits them.

You really must have a short memory.... Do you happen to remember....'free speech zones'...'warrentless wiretapping'...'waterboarding'....'enemy combatant incarcerations'....'secret tribunals'...under the Bush administration????

I seem to remember much liberal Constitution waving, then-- much of it quite justified, I might add.

But I guess you don't remember any of that.

Must have interfered with episodes of LOST or something like that...

This doesn't surprise me. From my own experiences of people in the left, they are very odd. One minute they are all pally and wanting to be your friend, but the second you say something they don't like, they become extremely aggressive and confrontational, shouting you down with insults and faux intellect. The left are a dangerous breed.