Professional engineer Jon Cole cuts steel columns with thermate, debunks Nat Geo & unexpectedly repr

reply to post by pteridine


that's not what it was meant to do. it was meant to weaken all the stress points then let gravity do the rest.
the only reason anyone got to see anything was because the plane had damaged the outer structure and it gave away what was going on throughout the building.

I'm on the fence. I think Mossad did it, but I think they did it with planes alone.

I'm in construction and here in the UK we protect steel used in construction from fire by the use of either fire retardant paint or asbestos. If a post above is correct the the Twin Towers had asbestos.

If fire cannot weaken steel then why are we going to all this trouble? Steel is affected by heat and it twists and distorts. I would imagine that the intense fire from the jet fuel would cause this and the distorted beams would pop the bolts holding them in place.

Why molten steel in the ruins/crater? Well I reckon that would be easy to recreate, back in the iron age, intense heat was created with just charcoal set in mounds of earth, it just smouldered away getting hotter and hotter, hot enough to melt and extract Iron from the ore.

However, I'm impressed by those clips and part of me (the part that sometimes cuts down trees) thinks of how we cut a slice out of one side of a tree and then cut from the other side into that first cut to hinge the tree and get it to fall where we want. Maybe there was some thermite applied to the centre columns and an outside area, just enough to kill the towers?

Hijacking those planes and crashing them was a good enough stunt to get us to go to war, why go to the extra risk of dropping the towers with explosives or thermite? why risk getting caught? They would have been irreparable anyway.

What have Al Quaeda come up with since? Small car bombs, commando raids, nothing as awesome, they don't have the infrastructure, Mossad did it.

reply to post by tilpah


Building 7 was not hit by a plane.

Originally posted by wcitizen

Originally posted by skeptic_al

Originally posted by wcitizen
Excellent. I was surprised when I saw the same kind of smoke being created.

The debunkers are always asking for proof....well, now they've got some!

edit on 19-12-2010 by wcitizen because: (no reason given)

I'd even spot ypu a "Plausible" that the fire stream was thermite.

And that alone calls into question the 'investigation' into 9/11, and merits a new investigation.

Debunkers seem to take the position that 9/11 truthers must be able to explain everything and come up with the exact scenario of exactly what they believe happened. This is a false position because that is the job of a proper investigation. The 'evidence' in the OS has serious flaws. That is enough to warrant a second, proper investigation.

I still maintain it was caused by Terrorists for Political Reasons, and the US Government allowed or prayed to GOD if you like that the Terrorists would succeed.

If I knew somebody was going to Kill somebody and could prevent it, am I guilty for not stopping it?

reply to post by skeptic_al

If I knew somebody was going to Kill somebody and could prevent it, am I guilty for not stopping it?

Yes, but if you are Government or law enforcement, even more so...

But if that's the case, they didn't just stand by, they helped with the NORAD stand down etc..
That makes them al least complicit on a charge of treason....

Excellent video OP. Thank you. You are appreciated!

I've read a good amount of these pages and then a wicked thought occurred in my wee-mind.

Alot of the speculation is if thermite was used, how was it brought on site, or when...

What if the bolts used had been treated with thermite/thermate prior to installation?

The workers could have been told something like "it's the cutting edge of bolt design" or "the latest heat-treatment," who knows?

Would the workers question it? Is there a roster of workers names that we could locate a worker and ask about the bolts? Are all the workers dead?

I believe elements of the official story are correct as far as the physical elements involved (Buildings and Planes, not Holograms ad missiles) however the TS's post seems to provide a more than adequate alternative explanantion of events.

The assumption that a group of people with access to restrcited materials couldn;t achieve what this guy achieves with stuff from home depot is just plain stupid so although there is no EVIDENCE, at least this is a CREDIBLE alternative explanantion.

The issue with 911 for me is that we still seem to work under the assumption that the people (Governments, Intelligence agencies, terrorists, civillian contractors etc ) involved in preventing this event were:

A: Competent to do so in the first place
B: Not covering their own failures in the post event investigation


This imperfection (which is implicit to Humans) should be expected in all elements of the event for things like:

Were corners cut in the initial design/build of the WTC?
Was the damage from the 1990's blast properly remediated ?
Was the FBI middle east liason having an affair at the time of 9/11 which meant he/she was using work time for other activities?
Was the NORAD guy surfing Porn rather than watching his screen.
Did the CIA middle east liason have a messy divorce and was secretly an alcoholic therefore overlooking duties?
Is the effective communication between friendly intel agencies near to none existent due to one upmanship and ongoing disputes?


There are probably millions of issues that were covered up by indivduals/departments afterwards as they knew it would spell trouble for them as they would be found to be at fault.

The nagging doubt in all this comes from why, in a world littered with evidence of human imperfection, did those Hijackers manage to execute their plan so perfectly???

They were as fallible as the next human ( evidence of them as "believers" drinking in strip clubs prior to the event etc ) however everything seemed to not only just go right for them...it went beyond their wildest expectations.

It's almost comaprable to the JFK incident.....in a world where tried and tested proffesionals were failing at their duties left right and centre.... a random guy with little or no skill was able to circumvent all controlls to be the catalyst in an event that was so memorable it changed the physce on the western world....

No surprise to me that people think it's a lie as it just seems that the only competent people in these "physce changing events" are the perpetrators...which is possibly a pre -requisite in terms of establishing this in the common Physce as people like complex bad guys...not some noobs that seem to get lucky once but fail at everything else as thats not very frightnening is it ??

reply to post by backinblack


The Laws regarding the Military shooting down terrorists was changed prior to september, and the order had to come from the White House. So the Norad or the Military would have been following Orders and therefore not accountable.
Just like Area51, where the Military contracts out the Killing of Civilians by Any Means possible in order to protect the secrets. The Military can not be used to harm US Civilians, so they get some body else to do it for them. Brilliant, cause the Government achieves the result but has not broken any Laws.

Originally posted by skeptic_al
reply to post by backinblack

 

The Laws regarding the Military shooting down terrorists was changed prior to september, and the order had to come from the White House. So the Norad or the Military would have been following Orders and therefore not accountable.
Just like Area51, where the Military contracts out the Killing of Civilians by Any Means possible in order to protect the secrets. The Military can not be used to harm US Civilians, so they get some body else to do it for them. Brilliant, cause the Government achieves the result but has not broken any Laws.

Cheney with the order to stand down?

Mossad?

No laws broken?

Brilliant! Our leaders are incompetent in protecting us from foreigners, but they'll hire out-side forces to do their dirty work on the inside, to protect secrets...

Has anyone ever told you that you lack moral fiber?

More and more the evidence grows, only fools would believe the "Official Story."

This is a great video!

Originally posted by skeptic_al
reply to post by backinblack

 

The Laws regarding the Military shooting down terrorists was changed prior to september, and the order had to come from the White House. So the Norad or the Military would have been following Orders and therefore not accountable.
Just like Area51, where the Military contracts out the Killing of Civilians by Any Means possible in order to protect the secrets. The Military can not be used to harm US Civilians, so they get some body else to do it for them. Brilliant, cause the Government achieves the result but has not broken any Laws.

Yeah funny that..
The shoot down rules were changed just prios to 9/11 and then changed back not long after..
Another convienient coincidence??

Truth???
Well seeing as mossad agents were sent to record the WTCs collapse. As they admitted on live TV. Then what more proof does any one want? They knew it was going to happen. If they knew it was going to happen then it stands to reason that they were involved, in some way. Every jew on the planet is a member of mossad. Silverstein? just pull it. Good post op. Just more evidence to prove that the OS is a complete crock of chit. Another pearle harbour is just whats needed or another gulf of tonkin.
gw said god told him to invade iraq. so I guess god created a miracle to allow him to invade iraq the afghan and any where else that the `terrorists` were hiding. How could they put the thermate in place? Well the WTCs were closed down prior to 911. Security switched off and no dogs allowed in.

It's a good thread and I did like the OP. However, I would like to present a few comments:

a) sometimes, superficial similarity is just that. When watching some of the thermate test videos, one cannot help but notice some similarity to a volcano eruption -- violent ejection of hot material and "lava" flow. Really, at the level of discussion here, and assuming we knew little about volcanoes, one could surmise that a volcano is a huge slab of steel, upon which some mythical giants put a huge bucket full of thermate and set it on fire. Look, there is lava! Molten rocks!

b) it's not possible to guide an airplane within inches of planted thermate. The videos show the alleged flow of molten metal in the vicinity of impact point, not 20 stories up or down.

c) flows of metal in 9/11 videos could be anything, like melting siding of the building (sheet metal)

d) there is no way you can ensure that thermate burns synchronously as to ensure an instantaneous and uniform collapse. Just consider the time scale. High explosives can be synchronized, but continuous burning of a substance sticking to vertical columns... I think not.

Originally posted by loveguy

Originally posted by skeptic_al
reply to post by backinblack

 

The Laws regarding the Military shooting down terrorists was changed prior to september, and the order had to come from the White House. So the Norad or the Military would have been following Orders and therefore not accountable.
Just like Area51, where the Military contracts out the Killing of Civilians by Any Means possible in order to protect the secrets. The Military can not be used to harm US Civilians, so they get some body else to do it for them. Brilliant, cause the Government achieves the result but has not broken any Laws.

Cheney with the order to stand down?

Mossad?

No laws broken?

Brilliant! Our leaders are incompetent in protecting us from foreigners, but they'll hire out-side forces to do their dirty work on the inside, to protect secrets...

Has anyone ever told you that you lack moral fiber?

Yas and No

All they will need to say when painted into a corner is:
"We" allways were Protecting the US Citizens.
Even if that meant fighing a War against an Enemy or Threat that did no exist at the Tiiime.

And definately not Incompetant, Totally competant, they knew exactly what they doing. in the belief that they were Protecting the USofA. If a Perfect Crime is to do the Crime and don't do the Time, then Iraq was the Perfect Crime. The People in the backroom of the White House responsible, will never do any time or even appear in any court.

Originally posted by buddhasystemd) there is no way you can ensure that thermate burns synchronously as to ensure an instantaneous and uniform collapse. Just consider the time scale. High explosives can be synchronized, but continuous burning of a substance sticking to vertical columns... I think not.

Yes there is:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by turbofan

Originally posted by buddhasystemd) there is no way you can ensure that thermate burns synchronously as to ensure an instantaneous and uniform collapse. Just consider the time scale. High explosives can be synchronized, but continuous burning of a substance sticking to vertical columns... I think not.

Yes there is:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Here again we are wading in shallow waters of superficial similarity.

a) radio can be used to synchronize anything. What else is new?
b) nanothermites mentioned in your link are referred to as explosives, and that's not the process we are talking about. You can't cut a beam this size in a millisecond. That's nonsense.

Originally posted by buddhasystem
It's a good thread and I did like the OP. However, I would like to present a few comments:

a) sometimes, superficial similarity is just that. When watching some of the thermate test videos, one cannot help but notice some similarity to a volcano eruption -- violent ejection of hot material and "lava" flow. Really, at the level of discussion here, and assuming we knew little about volcanoes, one could surmise that a volcano is a huge slab of steel, upon which some mythical giants put a huge bucket full of thermate and set it on fire. Look, there is lava! Molten rocks!

b) it's not possible to guide an airplane within inches of planted thermate. The videos show the alleged flow of molten metal in the vicinity of impact point, not 20 stories up or down.

c) flows of metal in 9/11 videos could be anything, like melting siding of the building (sheet metal)

d) there is no way you can ensure that thermate burns synchronously as to ensure an instantaneous and uniform collapse. Just consider the time scale. High explosives can be synchronized, but continuous burning of a substance sticking to vertical columns... I think not.

And as far as I know, you can't set off Thermite with a Bomb. It has to be Naked Flame hotter than hell, like burning Magnesium. And setting fire to Magnesium needs a hot flame as well.

Thermite is also unpredictable, so the same question should be thrown at thermite theories.
How do you get all the Thermite on all the Columns to burn through at exactly the same time and rate to facilitate the perfect "Pancake"

I think that there could have been very advanced planning in the orchestration of the 911 events and subsequent propaganda. I mean honestly the same folks are running a +$Trillion covert program silencing grassroots free energy and sacred sciences for god knows how long now. Dont believe it? Well something similar has been at play one way or another however you want to view it is fine. The thing is that we shouldn't be focused on "where to point the finger" and blame with things like this 9/11 conspiracies for one.. As long as we are operating in that paradigm we are going nowhere. If you dont get what i mean then ignore my comment because all that really matters is that we expand and grow and do what we are here on earth to do.
It's funny that this has been posted before, but nobody seemed to notice. People who deny that the 9/11 Commission Report is flawed are just not seeing the bigger picture is all. There is much more to the story of the 9/11 attacks than simply a coy for money and power, it is part of a larger infrastructure of double sided global orchestration reaching throughout the corporate and military industrial complex and all "under the sway of the $ystem" it's got to do with our true sacred knowledge and human history, our birth rights as humanity heritage being suppressed and deluded. We choose what to adopt as our vibration registers our reality, everything is in accordance of the flux and flow just be still and know ye are god.

reply to post by buddhasystem


Really? Well you better tell LLNL their experiments and photo proof are wrong then!

www.llnl.gov...

It seems they cut through some PRETTY thick steel in 19.3 MICROSECONDS.

Micro is smaller than Milli just so you know...

Originally posted by buddhasystem

b) it's not possible to guide an airplane within inches of planted thermate. The videos show the alleged flow of molten metal in the vicinity of impact point, not 20 stories up or down.

Fair point .... but what if the thermite was working away inside the building and only spilled out where the plane struck ?