Why do Americans need guns? Rip UP the Second Amendment, problem solved.

reply to post by bobennenwevun


You do know that in 2005 the UN declared Scotland the most violent developed country in the world. In Scotland you are more than twice as likely to be violently assaulted as you are in the United States. Saying they are some how morally superior or more intellectual is absurd. There is no proof of that.

Wow!

People are still arguing of this, which is just a summary of my own personal views on American gun control.

Everyone needs to chill, these are just words on a page.

reply to post by kevinunknown


Don't expect to propose taking away our God-given and inherent rights and not piss a lot of people off. When you propose an idea to take away our rights as Americans you are undermining everything our forefathers and many generations and current generations have believed in and fought for. You are saying that we should just throw our Constitution and Bill Of Rights and be ruled by a socialist communist government!! Everything that makes America great and beautiful you are suggesting we get rid of and you yourself are not even an American!! What America stands for is Liberty, Freedom and Justice and you believe that we should undermine the very foundation of those most precious and valuable things. It is the God-given right that every man be free to live as he see's fit within a just set of laws. This is what America stands for. And you are proposing that we become slaves to some form of tyranny whether it be socialism or communism. Well I think I speak for every God-fearing Freedom-loving American when I say F**K YOU AND F**K OFF!!!

by god i will have my right to a gun so i can blow away the dumb*** who tries to invade my home or harm my family THAT is why we have the 2nd amendment


and the militia thing too but...

Originally posted by kevinunknown
Wow!

People are still arguing of this, which is just a summary of my own personal views on American gun control.

Everyone needs to chill, these are just words on a page.

Yeah, how dare people discuss and debate something posted on a forum that discusses and debates things.

Tomorrow, I plan to shake my fist at the sky for being blue. That mother#er. Who the hell does he think he is, being blue like that?

reply to post by kevinunknown


If you can tell me what the plan is to disarm criminals that wish to do people harm, I may give it more thought. Are they going to listen and adhere to that law that all firearms are illegal? I do not think so, it is illegal to speed and with such a basic simple law, the vast majority even break that law. On the other hand, all we hear about is the negative aspects of guns, what about all the stories where guns saved common citizens lives or their families? Why don't you peruse this site. There are several pages of stories. The Armed Citizen.

In the end, the second amendment was placed as a curb on an overbearing, some might even say tyrannical, government.

An armed, and politically savvy populous is very dangerous to those in power, or more specifically, those in power who seek to institute their own agenda at the cost of my, and just incidently, your freedoms.

They've begun to provide us with the "Bread and Circus'" to distract us from the issues, the next step, using their twisted logic, is to "Rip UP the Second Amendment" thus solving their problems.

i need guns because other people have guns! nuff said. i'll be darn if someone breaks into my home with a gun and im left with no way of defending myself.

Originally posted by kevinunknown
I got into this debate recently but it seemed a little bit of topic so I thought I would take a risk and write a thread myself asking the above question “why do Americans need guns?”

In all actuality here and now in 2011 its not just about 'need'...its about a constitional RIGHT.
Let me one up you here.

How about WE ask YOU why YOU need the right of freedom of speech?
I mean, you can question MY rights, how about I question YOURS?

Now to me I can understand why a farmer might own a few shotguns or a hunter might own a few hunting rifles but why does anyone need a semi-automatic, unless their objective is to kill.

Who are you to determine how I exercise MY rights?
Its not up to you to say that semi autos are only for killing, now is it?
Ive owned a lot of semi autos....never killed a single person. So I guess that shoots down your theory, doesnt it?

To me guns are inherently evil objects that have been designed to kill our fellow man

ah....so it isnt that the gun IS actually evil, being a piece of cold, unliving metal that is neither good nor evil...but it is YOUR perception of guns that is the actual issue here.
Thanks for your honesty.

and therefore are evil as is to use a gun to kill.

So youre saying a piece of steel is evil because it is used to kill.
So knives are evil because some nut used them to kill ?
Cars are evil because some nut ran down a few pedestrians ?
See where that logic gets us?

Further to this there have been a number of high profile shootings in America were a gun man has committed multiple homicide

I suggest you KEEP reading.
Knives and vehicles have been used in a NUMBER of multiple homicides.
We going to ban kitchen knives next like the UK seems to be heading towards?
Youd have us living in a little padded room apparently.

or gang warfare has resulted in innocents being killed. Now with that in mind how can you possibly say that the right to bear arms is justified? Yes some people need guns to do their jobs such as game keepers, farmers and law enforcement but why does Joe the plumber really need one.

Entirely removing the fact that criminals without guns KILL people and little old ladies CANT defend themselvse against these thugs with harsh words and sharp sticks....
Ohhh....riiiight.....you didnt SEE this one, did you?

84-year-old Woman Shoots Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Criminal element aside what about Pit Bulls and other nasty dogs ?
My wife and I were almost ripped into by a pit bull 10 feet from my front door last summer.
The law here says I can kill a dog trying to bite me...but again, what am I supposed to stop this dog with...harsh language?
And please dont waste time with some chemical deterant.
Ive talked to law enforcement here and they have instructed me to NOT waste my time. Pit Bulls will keep biting down EVEN if entirely blinded when they are in a fighting rage. They have to be killed and even then Ive seen stories where it was hard to get them off.

The argument is always that it’s for self defence, that way if someone pulls a gun on a knife on you, you can protect yourself. It’s a hard one to argue against, but surly if it were the case that gun’s were outlawed or heavily regulated it would lead to a overall reduction in the number of firearms owned and therefore the odds of someone pulling a gun on you would be greatly reduced therefore you wouldn’t have to own a fire arm and the odds would fall further. In any case you can never be sure it’s going to help your odds, if two gun men mug you or break into your house you’re already on the losing side. Now baring in mind that there are almost enough firearms America for every citizen the robbers are going to know you have a gun in your house, they are going to be prepared and have the element of surprise on their side.

Wow is this lady going to defend herself?

Women kills her returning rapist with shotgun
www.youtube.com...

See that?
Bad guy used NO gun...raped the woman and came back for seconds.
It dont take a GUN to rape a woman, friend.
It DOES take a gun to STOP the bad guy.
KNow how I know that fact?
Cause the COPS you call to come save your butt carry GUNS !

Now am sorry to spit on your 2nd amendment right,

I dont recognize your ability or authority to 'spit' on any of my rights...so no offense taken.

but for me self defence is not a valid argument for defending the 2nd amendment.

You'll have this point of view until you are raped and beaten beyond recognition.
And yes, there was a man here in my town who was raped by a gang of men and then murdered by them shoving a tree limb up his rectum.
Sound unpleasant?
Dont think it can happen to you?
Of course you dont...thats the reason you have no sense of reality here.

Also the ability to carry arms has been severely restricted by the Gun-Free School zones act of 1990 signed by Gorge H W Bush, which is ironic considering that 41% of republicans own a firearm compared to only 23% of democrats so kudos to Bush.

uh...actually friend...as long as we are picking up or dropping off a child we can pack our guns right into gun free zones where I live.
I think youd better research the facts.

This does mean though that as a law abiding citizen in a town or city you really can’t carry a gun knowing that you are not breaking a law. As such you would be better just not carrying one, so again if you get attacked by someone you shouldn’t have a gun to defend yourself in the first place because to be carrying said firearm you would be breaking the law.

You really dont know what youre talking about.
These gun free zones did absolutely NOTHING to stop us from carrying.
All they did was set up VERY small areas where no guns could be carried...but even that has been changed to allow picking up and dropping off of school kids.
Read some facts sometimes...you'll feel better.

The line that I love is this “we have places to keep people who can’t use their guns properly, they’re called prisons”. Very true, but you also have places called hospitals and mortuaries filled with the victims of the scum your keeping in prison, and thousands of homes full of grieving families. Would it not just be better to ban or regulate these guns out right that way no idiots going to prison and cheaper hospital bills and less tears.
Then we get to my favourite, the line that all gun loving conspiracy theorists loves. “ I need my guns to protect myself for when the government turn on its people and try to through us all in the FEMA camps”. If that is your reason for keeping a gun, then you shouldn’t be allowed to own a gun based on your sanity.

While Im not a conspiracy theory nut, youre logic...well lack thereof...is pretty telling.
So youve NEVER heard of a government turning against its people ?
Really?
Did you actually stay awake in world history class or what?

So can someone please tell me why you need a gun?

1. I dont have to have 'need' to exercise my RIGHTS any more than you do.
2. Dogs that bite.
3. Criminals that kill.
4. Just because I feel like it.

easy enough?

In the UK I know no one who owns a gun, and no one I know has ever been disadvantaged because of this why is it that the worlds “super power” is any different, Gun Laws are out of date, rip up the second amendment and join the 21st century .

yeah...and we just know how thats going for you folks over there.
I talk to people in the UK a bit and they are not happy with the crime rates in many areas.
And at least WE have some chance of self defense here.
While you will end up a statistic, I may save my families life with my four guns.


===Does having a gun make us 'safe'?===

Licensed Concealed Carrier stops criminal
www.youtube.com...

Carrying Concealed
www.youtube.com...

Woman Speaks Out After Shooting Attackers
www.youtube.com...

Man Stops criminal with his concealed handgun
www.11alive.com...

Women kills her returning rapist with shotgun
www.youtube.com...

84-year-old Woman Shoots Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Elderly Apartment Owner Shoots Invader
www.youtube.com...

Kentucky Homeowner Shoots Would-be Thief
www.youtube.com...

Armed Pastor Holds Crooks at Gunpoint for Police
www.youtube.com...

Kid Shoots Home Invader
www.youtube.com...

FoxNews: Pregnant Mom Holds Burglar at Gunpoint
www.youtube.com...

HOME INTRUDER IS FATALY SHOT 10PM
www.youtube.com...

89-Year-Old Fires Gun at Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Woman In Home Kills Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Man Shoots And Kills Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Gun Owner Kills Burglar
www.youtube.com...

Resident Kills Intruder, Wounds Another
www.youtube.com...

Chicago Elderly Kills Intruder With Handgun
www.youtube.com...

71-year-old homeowner shoots burglar
www.youtube.com...

69-Year-Old Shoots Home Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Armed Samaritan Thwarts Bank Robber
www.youtube.com...

Man Shoots Armed Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Woman Shoots Crazed Gunman at Mega-Church
www.youtube.com...

Ailing Elderly Man Shoots Robber
www.youtube.com...

Another 911 Caller Shoots & Kills Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Texas Father Protects Family, Kills Intruders
www.youtube.com...

Man Uses Handgun to Protect Home
www.youtube.com...

Houston Self Defense Shooting CCW
www.youtube.com...

Ambushed Dad Shoots Back at Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Security Video: Woman With Gun Shoots Robber
www.youtube.com...

Armed Customer Shoots Knife-Wielding Man
www.youtube.com...

Man at ATM Shoots Armed Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Houston Self Defense Shooting CCW
www.youtube.com...

Good reason to be armed...
www.youtube.com...

Armed Citizen Halts Liquor Store Robbery
www.youtube.com...

Good Samaritan Kills Woman's Attacker
www.youtube.com...

Clerk Shoots Armed Robber
www.youtube.com...

Liquor Store Owner V Armed Robber
www.youtube.com...

Robber killed by clerk, robber's accomplice charged with it
www.youtube.com...

Robber's Victim Pulls His Own Gun
www.youtube.com...

Man Uses Shotgun to Protect Home
www.youtube.com...

Man's Shooting Spree Thwarted by Armed Citizen
www.youtube.com...

Gas Station Clerk Fires Gun at Robbery Suspects
www.youtube.com...

Woman Uses Handgun to Shoot Invader
www.youtube.com...

Armed Citizen Shoots Violent Ex-Boyfriend
www.youtube.com...

Clerk Shoots Armed Robber
www.youtube.com...

Gunfight Caught on Tape: Store Owner vs. 2 Armed Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Robber Gets Shot By Clerk
www.youtube.com...

Having guns doesn't mean you can rob everybody
www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by seagull
In the end, the second amendment was placed as a curb on an overbearing, some might even say tyrannical, government.

An armed, and politically savvy populous is very dangerous to those in power, or more specifically, those in power who seek to institute their own agenda at the cost of my, and just incidently, your freedoms.

They've begun to provide us with the "Bread and Circus'" to distract us from the issues, the next step, using their twisted logic, is to "Rip UP the Second Amendment" thus solving their problems.

And you know they'll just die if we rip up the first amendment to keep them from speaking their minds.

Originally posted by kevinunknown Wow! People are still arguing of this, which is just a summary of my own personal views on American gun control. Everyone needs to chill, these are just words on a page.

EXACTLY!

You were just exercising YOUR 1st amendment RIGHT to free speech, as are we now.
Hmmm....but you seem to be a little perturbed.
Is it that YOU wanted freedom of speech for yourself, but dont like it when WE get to speak OUR minds?
I think so.

Words on pages are exactly what laws are...laws that give freedom..and laws that oppress.
So merely being "words on pages" doesnt necessarily negate danger in those words when you are talking about ripping out any part of the Constitution you dont like.
How about WE get to rip up anything pertaining to YOUR rights that WE disagree with?
Sound good ?

9/11 conspiracies Just An Excuse for American Weakness? IF you don’t read it you will remain intellectually constipated.

You know your America bashing it a bit irritating.
How about we bash Scotland for a bit?

reply to post by americansforgunsdotcom


If you can find something significant to bash Scotland for feel free, I don’t mind bashing it myself a little bit. You might want to read that thread and then comment on it.

PS: To you and the above users, I am also against absolute freedom of speech, I would quite happily utilise legislation to restrict your “natural rights”. But right now let’s take it one right at a time, this thread is about your pathetic right to arms. You all have this sad little fantasy that your guns can help you with TSHTF, that is laughable, there are people on this earth who could kill you without lifting a figure and you all think your guns will protect you. The only thing your guns will do is help you kill each other.

Originally posted by kevinunknown
PS: To you and the above users, I am also against absolute freedom of speech

No big surprise there.

I would quite happily utilise legislation to restrict your “natural rights”.

Which is why we have the Constitution and there really isnt a thing you can do about it.
It must be frustrating to be pissing into the wind as you are knowing you have no power, little man

But right now let’s take it one right at a time, this thread is about your pathetic right to arms.

Arms that your military uses to save your sorry ass from invasion.
Your able to speak your mind now, nimrod BECAUSE of weapons and lost lives that fought for that freedom, you ungrateful malcontent

You all have this sad little fantasy that your guns can help you with TSHTF,

I take it you didnt even both to watch the news video list I posted.
Go up a few posts..not sure how you could have had your eyes open and missed it.
I know your type, pal...you want to run off that foaming mouth but you wont allow yourself to be swayed by FACTS.
Not my problem and neither are you.
I own guns..I carry guns lawfully and theres nothing any worthless puke on the WWW can do about it.
I win, you lose...its that simple.

that is laughable, there are people on this earth who could kill you without lifting a figure and you all think your guns will protect you. The only thing your guns will do is help you kill each other.

Youre completely deluded.
No one said a gun makes me invincible.
I use a seat belt as a TOOL to save my life. Its not going to do sh*t if Im hit by a train or run off a cliff...ie an EXTREME case.
But in MANY accidents it WILL save my life.

Same thing with carrying a gun, pal.
There are many day to day crimes that CAN and DO occur where having a gun CAN save my life and my families life.
If we get nuked here, do you actually think Im going to worry about a gun?

You really need to get off the dope.

Originally posted by kevinunknown
You all have this sad little fantasy that your guns can help you with TSHTF, that is laughable, there are people on this earth who could kill you without lifting a figure and you all think your guns will protect you. The only thing your guns will do is help you kill each other.

Maybe you'll actually learn to click a link and use that melon for something productive like learning something new.
Heres the list again for your amusement with some additions.
Theres only this many because I got tired of the endless list of SELF DEFENSE with a GUN stories.

===Does having a gun make us 'safe'?===

Licensed Concealed Carrier stops criminal
www.youtube.com...

Carrying Concealed
www.youtube.com...

Woman Speaks Out After Shooting Attackers
www.youtube.com...

Man Stops criminal with his concealed handgun
www.11alive.com...

Women kills her returning rapist with shotgun
www.youtube.com...

84-year-old Woman Shoots Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Elderly Apartment Owner Shoots Invader
www.youtube.com...

Kentucky Homeowner Shoots Would-be Thief
www.youtube.com...

Armed Pastor Holds Crooks at Gunpoint for Police
www.youtube.com...

Kid Shoots Home Invader
www.youtube.com...

FoxNews: Pregnant Mom Holds Burglar at Gunpoint
www.youtube.com...

HOME INTRUDER IS FATALY SHOT 10PM
www.youtube.com...

89-Year-Old Fires Gun at Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Woman In Home Kills Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Man Shoots And Kills Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Gun Owner Kills Burglar
www.youtube.com...

Resident Kills Intruder, Wounds Another
www.youtube.com...

Chicago Elderly Kills Intruder With Handgun
www.youtube.com...

71-year-old homeowner shoots burglar
www.youtube.com...

69-Year-Old Shoots Home Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Armed Samaritan Thwarts Bank Robber
www.youtube.com...

Man Shoots Armed Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Woman Shoots Crazed Gunman at Mega-Church
www.youtube.com...

Ailing Elderly Man Shoots Robber
www.youtube.com...

Another 911 Caller Shoots & Kills Intruder
www.youtube.com...

Texas Father Protects Family, Kills Intruders
www.youtube.com...

Man Uses Handgun to Protect Home
www.youtube.com...

Houston Self Defense Shooting CCW
www.youtube.com...

Ambushed Dad Shoots Back at Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Security Video: Woman With Gun Shoots Robber
www.youtube.com...

Armed Customer Shoots Knife-Wielding Man
www.youtube.com...

Man at ATM Shoots Armed Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Houston Self Defense Shooting CCW
www.youtube.com...

Good reason to be armed...
www.youtube.com...

Armed Citizen Halts Liquor Store Robbery
www.youtube.com...

Good Samaritan Kills Woman's Attacker
www.youtube.com...

Clerk Shoots Armed Robber
www.youtube.com...

Liquor Store Owner V Armed Robber
www.youtube.com...

Robber killed by clerk, robber's accomplice charged with it
www.youtube.com...

Robber's Victim Pulls His Own Gun
www.youtube.com...

Man Uses Shotgun to Protect Home
www.youtube.com...

Man's Shooting Spree Thwarted by Armed Citizen
www.youtube.com...

Gas Station Clerk Fires Gun at Robbery Suspects
www.youtube.com...

Woman Uses Handgun to Shoot Invader
www.youtube.com...

Armed Citizen Shoots Violent Ex-Boyfriend
www.youtube.com...

Clerk Shoots Armed Robber
www.youtube.com...

Gunfight Caught on Tape: Store Owner vs. 2 Armed Robbers
www.youtube.com...

Robber Gets Shot By Clerk
www.youtube.com...

Having guns doesn't mean you can rob everybody
www.youtube.com...


========================================

Man with concealed-carry permit kills robbery suspect in Cleveland
www.dispatch.com...

teen robber shot by Wal-Mart shopper
www.poconorecord.com.../20080828/NEWS/80828002

Richmond Store owner grateful for man who shot robber
www2.timesdispatch.com...

Would-Be Robber Fatally Shot
www.wbaltv.com...

Pizza Delivery Man Shoots, Kills Robber
www.wsmv.com...

Man Shoots, Kills Robber
wsbradio.com...

Dunkin' Donuts robbery suspect dies after being shot
www.tbd.com...

Customer shoots, kills robber at L.A. Tan
www.chicagobreakingnews.com...

Clerk Who Shot Robber Acted in Self Defense
www.kmph.com...

Man who shot robber a hero
articles.orlandosentinel.com...

Diner owner shoots robber in self defense
www.examiner.com...

Clerk says he shot robber in self-defense
www.wcnc.com...

Church's customer shoots robber in neck
www.fox10tv.com...

Beach pizza shop owner fatally shoots robber, police say
hamptonroads.com...

They recently only just passed new laws in the UK restricting citizens from filming police activity. For example, protesters are no longer allowed to shoot video of the police using crowd control techniques, they can be charged for doing so. Scary stuff, the pigs can basically get away with anything. This coupled with the fact that big brother is always watching the citizens in London with the massive array of Camera's at the governments disposal... Do you honestly expect a populous of sheep that have stood idly by and allowed these types of human rights violations to be passed into law to understand the Second Amendment? It's pointless, they have been molded into what their government want them to be, a controllable populous who are basically defenseless against any kind of government tyranny, the entire nation is a write off in this regard.

I have quite a large extended family living in Manchester and I've traveled there on numerous occasions. You would cringe at the stories I could tell you.

I was at a citizenship ceremony here in the USA a month ago. There were 76 people from 25 countries. There were a handfull of middle aged men from England becoming American citizens. I asked one of them why he left England for America. I mean people all over ATS and the net keep telling me the UK is so much better than America.

His answer was, my government trusted me with a rifle when they wanted me to kill people around the world. When I finally made it home they refused to trust me with a firearm.

We had a short conversation. His point was very clear. If his government trusted him to be the bayonet point of empire abroad, but refused him a weapon at home, they must be afraid they were giving him a reason to use it. So, he packed his bags and moved to America. He said there are things he misses. In the long run though, he is willing to miss those things. He said the "opressive" nature of England's encroaching government was stifling. Our short talk was very enlightening.

Of the other countries represented there were some Canadians, Swedes, Germans, French, and English. I find it funny that these countries are held up as examples of what America should be, yet their citizens are imigrating here every day.

Originally posted by americansforgunsdotcom

Maybe you'll actually learn to click a link and use that melon for something productive like learning something new.

And Maybe you'll learn how to interact with people without resorting to
such petty and baseless insults directed at discounting their intelligence with smart assery a 5th grader would outgrow?

Originally posted by Chinesis

Originally posted by americansforgunsdotcom

Maybe you'll actually learn to click a link and use that melon for something productive like learning something new.

And Maybe you'll learn how to interact with people without resorting to
such petty and baseless insults directed at discounting their intelligence with smart assery a 5th grader would outgrow?

You should be more interested in the facts than my tone. Clearly you prefer to distract with irrelevance rather than examining and accepting those facts.

America is a Constitutional republic.
That means that minorities are protected from the majority by things like the Bill of Rights.
Those of you who apparently dont grasp this concept fail to comprehend that if and when the 2nd is torn down, the rest are equally fair game to be repealed.

The 1st and 2nd amendments are the core of this country.
WE THE PEOPLE have a VOICE and WE THE PEOPLE have the means to back up that voice if and when there would come a day when another Hitler came on the scene in the USA.
Sure it wont happen. Im sure the Germans and Jews believed the same thing. And then it did..

Those of you who dont like our Constitutional Republic are free to leave anytime. There are exit doors at every border.