Children should be protected from bigoted Christian foster parents

Well thanks guys. You've effectively killed this thread with outrageous rhetoric.

reply to post by sisgood

Had the OP been about bigots, and not directly targeting Christianity, I would be here nodding and agreeing.

Well start nodding then because the OP was about bigotry specifically christian bigotry in relation to the deity that they worship giving them the instruction that a child that is born gay is somehow repugnant and should either be put to death by people or will be killed and tortured for all eternity by its' alleged creator .

MY problem is that this entire thread is about demeaning one religion that has its crazy people, bigots

There's no demeaning it's outright condemnation so what ?

and a majority of good, loving, normal people just like all other beliefs.

What exactly, is normal about telling a child that if he has sex with a certain type of person he should be put to death or tortured for all eternity ?

reply to post by The Djin


Allow me to clarify something here. Yes, I believe that homosexuality is a sin but I do not believe that it merits that. The bible teaches (and this blows my mind) that to God, all sins are equal. Thus, to any GOOD Christian, non-bigoted parent, this should be about as bad as a little white lie or tripping little susie on the playground. Neither of which constitutes that kind of punishment.
I fully believe that you can be Homosexual and a Christian just like someone can lie and still be a Christian.

If you would just make this about bigots and NOT specifically target Christians we wouldn't be having this argument! I dislike the bigots and hypocrites of my religion just as much or more as you do. They give us a bad name.

I am a lot more concerned over the pedophiles child abusers who are foster parents than I am this.,but should their beliefs be imposed on a child that is not their own, probably not. If it was their biological child then they could teach that child what ever they wanted, but this is someone else's child whom will most likely only be in their home for a short while.

Just remember a child is 11 times more likely to be abused and 7 times more likely to die at the hands of a foster parent than their biological parent.

Originally posted by intrepid
Well thanks guys. You've effectively killed this thread with outrageous rhetoric.

Thats what happens when you invite Ideologues to bicker they go on an on about superfluities and miss the meat of the topic.

In reference to the OP, I do not think any children should be taught the dogmas of Christianity, or Islam either, for that matter. Both are steeped in FEAR and LIES, and both offer salvation for a few and eternal damnation for the rest of us. Curious this thread popped up, I was just watching on the evening news and saw this:

Atheist Ministers Struggle With Leading the Faithful

"I spent the majority of my life believing and pursuing this religious faith, Christianity," Jack said. "And to get to this point in my life, I just don't feel like I believe anymore."

"The more I read the Bible, the more questions I had," Jack said. "The more things didn't make sense to me -- what it said -- and the more things didn't add up."

Jack said that 10 years ago, he started to feel his faith slipping away. He grew bothered by inconsistencies regarding the last days of Jesus' life, what he described as the improbability of stories like "Noah's Ark" and by attitudes expressed in the Bible regarding women and their place in the world.

"Reading the Bible is what led me not to believe in God," he said.

He said it was difficult to continue to work in ministry. "I just look at it as a job and do what I'm supposed to do," he said. "I've done it for years."

abcnews.go.com...

It seems that when anyone, myself inclusive here, read the Bible, and I don't mean read a few passages on Sunday, but really read it. Cover to cover, and have a good Concordance handy, and preferably a Root Word Dictionary, do this, and you will run from the Church so fast the paint on the door will peal.

So what happens if you are pagan, or wiccan, and you lose your kids for a while to Fundamental Christians?
Or Christians who's children are placed in a Wiccan home for foster care?

Is the children's religion to be respected? Couldn't that be almost abusive in itself?

I don't know. Being pagan it was always something I wondered about.

Telling parents (or de facto parents) how they can and can not raise their children is a slippery slope. And one I want no part of.

reply to post by The Djin


The state has a duty to vet all foster parents.
And ensure that they are, fit for purpose.
It is failing in this duty if it allows religious people to adopt.
It doesn’t matter what form this religion takes,
Our children should come first.
And never be subject to the abuse that is religion.

Religion and our tolerance of it, has held us back for too long.
If we could only free our children from having this madness thrust upon them.
Politicians lack courage and desire to tackle this issue.
This is part of the insanity that surrounds us in the world today.

reply to post by sisgood

Allow me to clarify something here. Yes, I believe that homosexuality is a sin but I do not believe that it merits that.

Then clearly you don't agree with your own god that passed the penalty of death an torture for Fostered Child should he/she happen to have been born homosexual and acted upon his/her natural impulse?

Hey, I didn't make your rules but I have to take my hat off to you should you happen to find some of them as equally repugnant as "normal" people. Do I take it your not one of those "True Christians" that don't cherry pick your gods' instruction manual and only accept the bits which sit comfortably with you ?

The bible teaches (and this blows my mind) that to God, all sins are equal. Thus, to any GOOD Christian, non-bigoted parent, this should be about as bad as a little white lie or tripping little susie on the playground. Neither of which constitutes that kind of punishment.

The bibles (plural) teach a lot of repugnant disgusting stuff which make very little sense to a reasoning mind and to have a "Non Bigoted christian" would appear to be a contradiction in terms if one of the requirements of being a christian is accepting what the bibles teach.

The god yahwhe/jesus clearly finds the practice of of anal sex between men an "abomination" the penalty for this being death and torture for all eternity. If as you claim all "sins" are equal in the eyes of your god then this surely makes a stronger case for no letting a foster child come within 50 feet of a parent that believes what the bibles say.

I fully believe that you can be Homosexual and a Christian just like someone can lie and still be a Christian.

What you decide as acceptable rules for your club are are is up to you, perhaps there is a case for potential christian foster parents to sign a declaration of which parts of the bibles they disagree with so the potential threat to the child may be gauged ?

If you would just make this about bigots and NOT specifically target Christians we wouldn't be having this argument!

I
Again, I can't help it if the chrsitian instruction manual is fraught with bigotry, thus any individual professing to live their life by said manual accept bigotry by proxy.

dislike the bigots and hypocrites of my religion just as much or more as you do. They give us a bad name.

If this is true why don't you do something about it and perhaps start a movement to have the bibles edited in such a way that the repulsive and morally bankrupt attributes of the character yahwhe/jesus are removed and less likely to be emulated or set as a standard ?

reply to post by hadriana

So what happens if you are pagan, or wiccan, and you lose your kids for a while to Fundamental Christians?

Depending on the age and education of the child I could imagine this situation to be a possible emotional nightmare for some children and best avoided completely.

Or Christians who's children are placed in a Wiccan home for foster care?

I would imagine (but can't speak with any authority as I'm not that up on wiccary) that swapping one delusion for another is no less harmful than teaching child bigotry and homophobia.

Is the children's religion to be respected? Couldn't that be almost abusive in itself?

Good question, if as an Atheist, I fostered a christian child what should my attitude be towards the childs' indoctrination into a delusion be ? Sympathy ? Re education ? None ?

Food for thought eh ?

I don't know. Being pagan it was always something I wondered about.

Perhaps cases like this allow us all to think deeply about beliefs and what nonsense we teach kids .

reply to post by The Djin


You have said that you attack Christianity.
Do you attack other religions too?
What does the Koran say about homosexuality?
Should muslims be allowed to adopt?
Anyway homosexuality is only one issue among many.
The truth is religious people should not be allowed anywhere near children.
Or at least only under supervision!

reply to post by midicon

The state has a duty to vet all foster parents. And ensure that they are, fit for purpose. It is failing in this duty if it allows religious people to adopt. It doesn’t matter what form this religion takes, Our children should come first. And never be subject to the abuse that is religion.

Be careful my friend because many states are highly influenced by the very type of people you would protect the children from.

The chirstian agenda (conspiracy) is hotting up they will do almost anything to infiltrate our societies and have us kneel to their dogma

Church of England sees The Big Society as its Big Opportunity – to force itself into all our lives/ex]

The Church of England is making preparations to hijack the Government’s Big Society agenda to vastly increase its influence in all our lives. It says that The Big Society is “natural territory for the Church of England”.

Church of England’s first bid to run The Big Society – with a £5 million handout from the taxpayer.

The Church of England has said it wants £5 million of public money to sort out the problems of “social cohesion”. It claims that it is better qualified than the Government to combat radicalism among Muslims and to bring warring religious communities together.

www.secularism.org.uk...


Needless to say their jesus/yahwhe god wants our money again

reply to post by midicon

You have said that you attack Christianity. Do you attack other religions too?

Yes when they attack me or mine or try to impose themselves on us , I got big enough stick to cover most delusional religions.

reply to post by The Djin


“Yes when they attack me or mine or try to impose themselves on us , I got big enough stick to cover most delusional religions.”

You are already under attack the whole world is caught in the grip of this madness.
One way or another religion has shaped our society and continues to do so.
Why focus on Christianity alone on this thread when in fact Islam holds the same attitude towards homosexuality.
Both the Koran and the bible are full of the same godly injunctions and rhetoric.

We may be of similar mindset I can’t say, but why single out one religion over another?

reply to post by midicon

Why focus on Christianity alone on this thread when in fact Islam holds the same attitude towards homosexuality.

Because the foster parents in question happen to christian, if they were Muslim the same stick would apply, I've no doubt though that should that be the case then elements that appear to be intent upon causing disharmony would be creating an even bigger song and dance.

So the question you may well ask is, should the same reasoning apply to potential foster parents that happen to be Muslim ? Well of course if being a muslim is defined by what the Imams claim the koran instructs in relation to homosexuality bigotry is bigotry no ?

How do we know an individual muslim foster parents' attitude toward homosexuality ? Do we assume they all follow the quran ? The imams?

Indeed these are valid questions that need to be raised to protect children and perhaps no less valid than finding out the foster parents attitude toward smoking, alcohol, junk food etc .

The conversation can take us quite a few places it would seem but at least we've started dialogue, some people may not want to go there though

reply to post by The Djin


“How do we know an individual Muslim foster parents' attitude toward homosexuality ? Do we assume they all follow the quran ? The imams?”

How do we know an individual Christian’s attitude towards homosexuality?
Do we assume they all follow the bible, or ministerial interpretation?

I sense an anti Christian agenda running through your posts here.
Why quote the bible as if these quotes have any relevance to the subject matter.
If I am honest, and I always am, you sound like a pseudo atheist, anti Christian,
Muslim apologist.
Have you started any anti islamic threads, or is it just christians you target?

Regards Midicon.

So it begins... I wanna say you are right, but people got different views, alot of people. I wish the children can get adequate shelter and food, and education. What people teach under thier roof isnt my concern. Though I would expect anyone who willinglt states they cannot adhere to stipulations in the contract dont recieve that contract, whether it be a mortgage, adoption, or anything.

Originally posted by hadriana
So what happens if you are pagan, or wiccan, and you lose your kids for a while to Fundamental Christians?
Or Christians who's children are placed in a Wiccan home for foster care?

Is the children's religion to be respected? Couldn't that be almost abusive in itself?

I don't know. Being pagan it was always something I wondered about.

I hear you loud and clear, hadriana, I too am Pagan. I suppose a little deprogramming would be in order. I actually had to do this this recently with our 12 year old son. He, poor boy, has brain damage caused by a drug his Mom had to take while pregnant. The boy's IQ is something like 70-80.
We decided to let the boys go to church with their friends who live down the hill from us. The youngest one quickly had enough of church, and quit going, but the older one took to it like a horse to water, and suddenly he thought he could do anything at all, even disrespect his Mom, because that is the Christian way, and no matter what he does, Jesus will come save him. And, by the way, Mom and Pop, you all are Satan worshippers and are going straight to Hell.

It took a long time to expound the truth into his head, it was kinda like a de-programmer would do. I showed him on the internet where James Cameron found the bones of Jesus, his wife and son, and proof that the NT was written by a Roman family named Piso, and finally he came around. He is still confused about some things, but watching the History Channel has filled many of the gaps. For you who have not heard....

Titanic find: 'Christ's coffin'

The True Authorship of the New Testament

reply to post by autowrench

It took a long time to expound the truth into his head, it was kinda like a de-programmer would do. I showed him on the internet where James Cameron found the bones of Jesus, his wife and son,

Now you've opened a can of worms my friend, they'll be off "Ah but that's not our Jesus" or " Some fink xtian pastor claiming to be a scientist proved it's a fraud"

Thanks for sharing your kids story

I have a feeling that xtians will start avoiding this thread like plague in thier heart of hearts they really don't believe the nonsense they claim to have faith in.