NPR fires Juan Williams for Muslim remarks on Fox

There's probably going to KEEP being yaya about Muslims as long as incidents like the cartoon and South Park thing keep happening, and as long as Muslim journalists keep writing articles that say "Free speech BUT (insert whatever is offensive to Muslims here)."
We DO have a culture clash. There's a fundamental clash when these things happen that really emphasize how our belief systems and priorities can be different.

I guess I should be pc and stick my head in the sand and pretend it is ONLY a problem with radical violent terrorists, whatever religion they are, no matter who decided that they are terrorists and not just people with different opinions, and whoever decided they are radical and not just 'ok middle of the road half believe their own religion" people.

I'm not making sense but none of this makes sense either. Our press is as controlled as China's and the govt. doesn't even have to do it.

Originally posted by Megagrogan
to the people saying he was "just expressing what heaps of people were thinking", that doesn't mean it should be said. The company wants to keep an image of itself as a non-prejudiced company, and this remark was clearly prejudiced. All of this slandering of all muslims based on the actions of a few must stop. It just leads to more prejudice. No doubt a lot of you (if you're from the states) would call for someone to be fired if they were saying things like "every time i see an american, i feel like they are going to throw up on me, because americans are fat and eat too much".

In saying that, perhaps affirmative action needs to be taken to raise the tolerance level of people towards muslims? There has been (and still is) obvious negative propoganda spread about muslims (whether it is intentional propoganda or not is irrelevant). It seems to me that this is the modern version of White vs Black, the states needs a muslim MLK

Read what he said. his statement, on this page. He was referencing the need to not act on your fears, even if they are rational. That you still must remain civilized and treat people properly, as individual, painted with a small brush.

Click here for more information.

reply to post by PETROLCOIN



From what we have seen it is not the ones in traditional garb that have to be looked out for!

Anyway only in a free press which NPR is not can these things be said. NPR must take offical stands all the time....while we discuss the seperation of church and state under the no offical state church idea behold we do have an offical tax paied news source. I say screw them and pull thier funding. If they cant run the show in the free market then # them.

The worst part about political correctness is that it suppresses the very basic human survival instincts that keep us safe on a daily basis.

Unfortunately, all this political correctness is eschewing common sense survival in favor of "not looking like a racist." It will destroy our country someday....I think it has been for years.

Humans learn from past experience, and then we make changes based on those experiences. If we didn't, we wouldn't have survived all these millions of years...we would have died out with other species. Because we humans are so adaptable, and so able to learn from past experiences.... we are able to change our course of action when we sense danger. It is the basic human survival instinct.

So, when Juan said that he gets anxious when he sees Muslims on a plane, it is not bigotry...it is simple psychology and the basic human survival instinct. If you continually see Muslims blowing up planes over and over again on 9/11, and the shoe-bomber, and the underwear bomber... (even if it was orchestrated to seem like it was Muslims that blew up the planes on 9/11), then that has now become a pattern.

Humans recognize patterns, and those patterns get embedded into our basic survival resources. If we did NOT learn how to recognize patterns that were potentially life-threatening, we couldn't survive as a species, or as an individual!

So, the fact that Juan has that fear of seeing Muslims on a plane does NOT make him a bigot. It makes him human...he is learning from past experience, he is interpreting patterns he's seen played out numerous times, and he is adapting his behavior (increasing his vigilance) in case of any potential problems. That pattern recognition is basic HUMAN SURVIVAL...NOT BIGOTRY! Hell, I'd say it's not just human survival, but a survival technique for ALL animals! Self -protection!

It is the same thing as people from the midwest (like myself) learning how to recognize the signs and patterns of an oncoming tornado. If a tornado comes every time the sky turns green and still, and the birds and insects stop singing.... then after a while, we learn to fear (or at least increase our vigilance) when the sky turns green, the air gets still and the birds and insects get quiet. We learn to take cover when that happens. Why? Basic human survival instinct.

Political correctness suppresses our basic survival instincts (and our basic reproduction instincts, but that's another subject) and if we keep bowing down to PC culture, we will suppress our basic survival instincts so much, that we will not have any sort of country left to protect.

PC has not only made it impossible to speak the truth about radical muslims, but it has made it impossible to speak the truth about illegal aliens illegally crossing our borders. But no, that's racist.

Political correctness will ruin us if we continue to let it suppress our basic human instincts.

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
It is a pathetic shame that this man lost his job for those remarks. How dare he speak truthfully. Someone might get their feathers ruffled.

PC is a folly. It was not an innocent mistake. It was a truthful statement that represents the feeling of a large portion of Americans.

Otherwise, being told to be "more diligent" is just stupid lip service. This man got fired for discussing his "vigilience" against terror attacks.

edit on 21-10-2010 by bigfatfurrytexan because: (no reason given)

Ahh, going by the old mantra of "Not every Muslim is a terrorist, but every terrorist is a Muslim!"

It's people like Juan Williams who want rights for other Americans to be limited because of their skin color, or their religion, or their ethnicity...

Disgusting...

Originally posted by Mak Manto

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
It is a pathetic shame that this man lost his job for those remarks. How dare he speak truthfully. Someone might get their feathers ruffled.

PC is a folly. It was not an innocent mistake. It was a truthful statement that represents the feeling of a large portion of Americans.

Otherwise, being told to be "more diligent" is just stupid lip service. This man got fired for discussing his "vigilience" against terror attacks.

edit on 21-10-2010 by bigfatfurrytexan because: (no reason given)

Ahh, going by the old mantra of "Not every Muslim is a terrorist, but every terrorist is a Muslim!"

It's people like Juan Williams who want rights for other Americans to be limited because of their skin color, or their religion, or their ethnicity...

Disgusting...

It is people like Mak Manto who erect strawmen and ride the slippery slope for fallacious debate techniques.

The mantra is more, "Not every Muslim is a terrorist, so while it is ok to be nervous you need to not paint with a broad brush."

reply to post by nikiano


At the rate we're going, statements based upon personal observation, opinions and jokes about any group other than Christians or Jews, will become outlawed and subject to fine and/or jail time

If the Muslims had their way, it would be death by stoning.

Wait. Let me be PC. When the Muslims impose Islamic sharia law on the citizens of America, it'll be death by stoning. There.

An over the top reaction by NPR if you ask me.
Eventhough the statement reeks of cowardness and smallmindedness.
The only things I worry on a plane is if the plane doesn't plummet out of the sky or if we land on time.
Not if somebody looks like a Muslim.

Fox news has gone to great lengths to remind people "Muslim = terrorist"
The same day poor Juan gets fired for reinforcing that, he gets a big old RAISE from Fox. Coincidence? Sure. Everyone crying over his "loss" can rest assured he got paid quite well for saying what he said. I may or may not agree with the entire premise of his statement but considering that not one of the 19 9/11 terrorists were dressed in "traditional Muslim garb" it was actually a pretty stupid thing to say and he got rewarded for it.

Originally posted by Curiousisall
Fox news has gone to great lengths to remind people "Muslim = terrorist"
The same day poor Juan gets fired for reinforcing that, he gets a big old RAISE from Fox. Coincidence? Sure. Everyone crying over his "loss" can rest assured he got paid quite well for saying what he said. I may or may not agree with the entire premise of his statement but considering that not one of the 19 9/11 terrorists were dressed in "traditional Muslim garb" it was actually a pretty stupid thing to say and he got rewarded for it.

Welcome to our world and today.
People doing stupid shiz get paid the best.

Originally posted by Curiousisall
Fox news has gone to great lengths to remind people "Muslim = terrorist"
The same day poor Juan gets fired for reinforcing that, he gets a big old RAISE from Fox. Coincidence? Sure. Everyone crying over his "loss" can rest assured he got paid quite well for saying what he said. I may or may not agree with the entire premise of his statement but considering that not one of the 19 9/11 terrorists were dressed in "traditional Muslim garb" it was actually a pretty stupid thing to say and he got rewarded for it.

Welcome to our world and today.
People doing stupid shiz get paid the best.

reply to post by Curiousisall


Right you are - he got $2,000,000.00 today from Fox.

~Heff

reply to post by Hefficide


So he says he gets worried when muslims, in particular in garb or muslim traditional clothing, get on a plane with him? In all honestly I did not hear him claim that all muslims were bad, however he admitted he was uncomfortable. While I do see this as an indication of irrational fear I do not see it as bigotry necessarily. It is not comparable to when Bill O'rielly made the comment that 'muslims' attacked us on 9/11, as if Christians attacked us in Oklahoma.

Nevertheless the NPR fired him and I have no doubt it was not merely over that single statement. The fact he has made numerous comments and participated on fox often parroting the BS spewed out by the likes of O'reilly and Hannity, should have had him removed from the NPR long ago. They do not want to be associated with that kind of mentality. In anycase I do not see the problem with rightwingers and Mr Williams over this matter? Why doesn't fox give him his own show since he is on all the time? Does he have own show? This man is still making a tonne of money participating at other media outlets.

Originally posted by Hefficide
reply to post by Curiousisall

 

Right you are - he got $2,000,000.00 today from Fox.

~Heff

Awwwwwwwwwe. That is a real shame. I certainly hope some of the fine ATS members standing behind this poor man will set up some kind of fund so that I can send money and help. It must be tough. So let's review.
Juan said something pretty stupid.
No rights were violated.
Not a free speech issue.
He lost ONE OF his jobs.
He go $2,000,000 for his trouble.

Cry me a river, Juan.

Originally posted by ExPostFacto

Originally posted by sdcigarpig
this one group, is identifing themselves as Muslim first and a nationality second.

I agreed with most everything you stated except the quoted portion. Isn't it more likely that the people looking at these individuals as Muslims first and Nationality second are interpreting this based off their belief? Isn't it more likely that this is made up in their own head? I am not sure how a person could identify themselves by nationality first, and religion second based off the clothes they wear. Should Muslims be required to wear an American flag so that those people who cannot logically reason through their own opinions and bias can feel safe?

Having lived in various diverse cities around the country, and visited them, this is not a new or common thing, rather it happens no matter where you go, and especially in larger cities. People will identify themselves as a religion or a culture first and the nationality second. It is a simple question, when asked who are you and what do you represent. The clothing are a dead give away. But apart from that, apart from looks and appearance, and this I can speak from on a first hand account. I have lived in neighborhoods that had a very high muslim population. Most were friendly, waved and nodded as I passed by, however, if they saw something that may have been against their religion, oh lets say I had a bottle of wine or walking with my dog, it was frowned and the language, well, I do not speak farsi, but you can tell by the tone of voice and body language, as it would change. They did not seek to assimilate into the nation, nor do I think they want to. I have met both those who choose to be a part of the country idenitifing themselves as a nationality, and the reverse. I witnessed first hand harassment of a person, all cause she did not agree with the rest of those in an apartment building, and let her children play with my dog. So I would say the statement is true. There are articles out there, a few kind of makes you wonder, where the people who are so religious in faith, cause problems or a row at work, all cause they found something objectionable, or failed to let their employer know that there may be a problem with them doing the job for which they were hired to do.
Unfortunately right now it is those that are muslim.
But if you take religion out of it, and put in any other cultural group, there is the problem, as they often idenitfy themselves by that culture, rather than that of nationality. We all saw it during the debates over the law that Arizona passed, during the entire question on the new black panther party, and even when some well know figures, who are in the media, will speak, the first thing that comes out is that they happens to be that they are this, and a nationality second.
I believe that if they let go of the first, changing the idea that they are a nationality second and work to be such first, and the culture second, a lot of the problems that they claim, would no longer be substantial or valid, as then it would change the nature of such.
By living as a culture first, no matter if it is based on race or religion, they are living in the past, and can only be asked, are they doing it cause they are being polite to let us know that they are this or that, or is it being done to gather special privlidges, and to try to set themselves apart from the whole of society. More times than not, from what I have witnessed, and read, the answer is often the latter, trying to get treated special and be set apart, rather than trying to fit in.

The guy was being honest about how he feels. So let him be honest. He wasn't preaching that muslims are bad people. He just said that he gets nervous. A LOT of people do. SO WHAT? Heck .. even Jesse Jackson was honest and said he gets nervous walking down the street and seeing young black men walk towards him. People get nervous ... SO WHAT? They can't say how they feel? He wasn't passing it off as 'news' .. he was stating how he feels. IT IS ALLOWED. NPR =

Originally posted by FlyersFan
The guy was being honest about how he feels. So let him be honest. He wasn't preaching that muslims are bad people. He just said that he gets nervous. A LOT of people do. SO WHAT? Heck .. even Jesse Jackson was honest and said he gets nervous walking down the street and seeing young black men walk towards him. People get nervous ... SO WHAT? They can't say how they feel? He wasn't passing it off as 'news' .. he was stating how he feels. IT IS ALLOWED. NPR =

His job wasn't to be honest about how *he* feels, but to perform analysis.

NPR fired him because he had increasingly become more and more of a pundit and less and less of an analyst.

If you work for anyone, they always have the ability to fire you for things like this.

Just as Juan has the right to say what he feels, NPR has the right to fire him ;-)

That is the beauty of capitalism! And I support it 100%

Originally posted by Mak Manto

It's people like Juan Williams who want rights for other Americans to be limited because of their skin color, or their religion, or their ethnicity...

Disgusting...

That is perhaps the most inane thing that has been written on this thread. Juan Williams is a noted writer, mainly about Black civil rights issues.

# Williams, Juan
(1988). Eyes on the Prize: America's Civil Rights Years, 1954-1965. Penguin (Non-Classics). ISBN 0140096531. # Williams, Juan
(2000). Thurgood Marshall: American Revolutionary. Three Rivers Press. ISBN 0812932994. # Williams, Juan

(2003). This Far by Faith: Stories from the African American Religious Experience. Harper Paperbacks. ISBN 0060934247. # Williams, Juan
(2004). I'll Find a Way or Make One : A Tribute to Historically Black Colleges and Universities. HarperCollins. ISBN 0060094532. # Williams, Juan
(2005). My Soul Looks Back in Wonder: Voices of the Civil Rights Experience. Sterling. ISBN 1402722338. # Williams, Juan
(2006). Black Farmers in America. The University Press of Kentucky. ISBN 0813123992. # Williams, Juan
(2007). The Phony Leaders, Dead-End Movements, and Culture of Failure That Are Undermining Black America--and What We Can Do About It. Three Rivers Press. ISBN 030733824X.

I'm not a great fan of his politics, but he seems a decent man who speaks what he believes, and some people don't seem to like that much. That's very progressive of you.........................

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
His job wasn't to be honest about how *he* feels, but to perform analysis.

But the venue in which he was presenting was a venue that allowed for him not to perform like a robot but to express himself. I agree that a news analyst should just analyze and keep themselves out of it ... but the venue at that time allowed for him to be himself and to express his feelings. He never said it was analysis or that it was the official positon of NPR or that his nervousness represented NPR. He was clear that it was a personal feeling.