NPR fires Juan Williams for Muslim remarks on Fox

Well, as we can see from the flow of the dialogue, this will be a significant thread to watch.

While I have little use for 'produced' news and opinion shows; I am not one to say they should be engaging in the kind of controls they are exercising in recent years.

"Political Correctness" and "Free Speech" are two separate but not mutually exclusive concepts.

The baser concept behind "PC" is about sensitivity, and rendering repugnant stereotypes and memes ineffective by removing them from dialogue; yet it can be argued that such an approach to speech is counterproductive. Personally, I want bigots and ignorant people to identify and expose themselves; so I would rather refuse the license to censor or moderate such phrases even if they are offensive. The use of such words and ideas that reflect the bias or agenda of a person is a beneficial thing to those who wish to address the problem... Too much PC will simply leads to closet bigotry and the creation of cohesive 'hidden' agendas that cannot be countered openly without resorting to accusations that weaken the case of those who wish to dispel bias and bigotry from otherwise sincere people.

I remain steadfast in my opinion that if you think clearly, and reflect with a genuine desire to understand, you must be aware that no 'produced' media is meant to do anything other than generate revenue. The only people who should be outraged at Mr. William's statements are those who refuse to accept that a person should ever be 'wrong' about anything regarding perceptions they care about. Mr. Williams is hardly a catalyst to engender racial, or ideological hatred; despite the fact that he is a fixture of 'public' media.

People fear because they are conditioned to. What Mr. Wiliams confessed to was that he is no different. Is his fear misplaced? Almost certainly. But the fact that he spoke those words now makes him a target for the reactionary and sensationalistic media parasites of politics and social agendas.

In my opinion, he should not have been fired from an unrelated organization because of what he said. In a purely positive sense, what he said should evoke a response to rationalize the feeling and demonstrate both its source and its dubious base.

We must observe the 1984-like idea of changing speech. Speech is what it is, we produce it as a matter of course; do we really want people to lie and censor their feelings? What might that lead to? I can imagine a lot of bad things that could come from repression. I prefer to fight such notions directly, and without the childish security blanket of creating 'newspeak' to cover up ignorance that would otherwise remain unchecked.

There are many people who fear others because of how they look, carry themsleves, or speak. Let them say so. Only then can we educate, or at least understand, where that fear comes from. When the source is addressed we have a chance of dealing with it; when the source is hidden and the speaker attacked, you only silence and conceal it.

Good luck herein folks. Remember - address the OP, the subject, or yourself.... not others in the thread. Word of advice.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

I don't believe things like this happen on accident.

How would they stage this? They are in cahoots with NPR and CAIR?

reply to post by Hefficide


Okay I get where you are coming from that Williams comments are inappropriate, but I disagree that they are inappropriate. The opposite side of this issue states profiling Muslims as suspected terrorism is wrong and I agree. So in essence the argument is this, that some people and the government have inappropriately labeled Muslims as suspected terrorists. Now Williams comes out and says exactly what we all do at times, we label people in society based on what they wear, talk about, and group them into categories to make the world we interact with easier to identify, navigate, and deal with. We do this grouping subconsciously, taking note of possible threats in our environment and gauging the impact of interaction with said groups based off our beliefs. We avoid interactions with people we do not mesh with based off of physical appearances and behavior.

What Williams stated was what most of us do in our daily lives. When I took a plane trip recently I took note of those people that might jump up to hijack the plane. When I walk down the street at night I take note of people whom I pass that could pose a risk to myself. In a subconscious way I am developing a plan on how to deal with the perceived threat. Note that it is not a real threat it is only perceived. I know this of myself but I also know I have no reason to deal with said person in any other manner that would reflect they are threatening me.

What Williams described is the exact reason Muslims are targeted in airports. It is human nature. However, government policy should not be dictated by human nature when it comes to categorizing society. Our Constitution mandates equal treatment and application of the law for this reason...to prevent human fear from segregating a class of citizens to more stringent sanctions by the government. So CAIR is right in its argument...but the argument is inappropriately directed at Williams when it should be directed at Washington.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
BFFT, I didn't even think about the federal funding aspect. Good point.

In Wake of Williams' firing, Republicans want NPR Funding Examined

Mike Huckabee:

"It is time for the taxpayers to start making cuts to federal spending, and I encourage the new Congress to start with NPR."

What is worrysome to me is not only the federal funding issue. It is also that NPR seems to want to silence people speaking about Islam, while dragging their feet on dealing with a reporter that wished AIDS on an official and their grandchildren.

Also worrisome to me is a possible backlash. NPR funding is tied to funding for the arts. I would hate to see the arts being stifled because of a backlash to NPR. I do not pine for a Medievel America.

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

I don't believe things like this happen on accident.

How would they stage this? They are in cahoots with NPR and CAIR?

Perhaps Fox and Williams are in cahoots against what NPR and CAIR represent?

Like i pointed out earlier, what he said is nothing compared to the comments of another NPR reporter. Yet she is still employed.

Originally posted by sdcigarpig
this one group, is identifing themselves as Muslim first and a nationality second.

I agreed with most everything you stated except the quoted portion. Isn't it more likely that the people looking at these individuals as Muslims first and Nationality second are interpreting this based off their belief? Isn't it more likely that this is made up in their own head? I am not sure how a person could identify themselves by nationality first, and religion second based off the clothes they wear. Should Muslims be required to wear an American flag so that those people who cannot logically reason through their own opinions and bias can feel safe?

reply to post by inforeal
Vivian Schiller stated Mr Williams was fired not because of what he said,but because of repeatedly voicing his own opinion which is a big no,no at NPR.We like to have the guest's opinion shine,Sarah Palin called the show and said his first amendment rights had been violated,Mike Huckabee said he will no longer take interviews from them.There are alot of people backing Mr. Williams up.I have a feeling this is going to get alot more attention than NPR hoped for.

Nazi Public Radio - please donate to our agenda!

I haven't donated to NPR in many years, but almost did last week during their fundraiser. I'm glad they made me feel a lot better for not donating to them. I went from feeling guilty to righteous.

NPR shows its lack of tolerance for free speech.

I've listened to NPR on and off over the years. Most of the time they are telling a story about how bad the US is or how the US screwed up.

They certainly don't want people to hear one of their reporters express a view that is not politically correct.

To be on NPR, he would have had to say, "Every time that I'm on an airplane and I see someone dressed in Muslim garb, I'm overcome with giddiness for being on such a multicultural and inclusive flight?

I'd expect nothing less from NPR or CAIR. CAIR is a proven funder of terrorists as well as a professional extortion group. Of course a federally funded media source would bow to their wishes.....typical stuff for them.

On Fox, Mr Williams offers us some insight to his side of the coin:

Juan Williams: My Words Were 'Not A Bigoted Statement'

...Yesterday NPR fired me for telling the truth. The truth is that I worry when I am getting on an airplane and see people dressed in garb that identifies them first and foremost as Muslims...

...And I made it clear that all Americans have to be careful not to let fears lead to violation of anyone’s constitutional rights, be it to build a mosque, carry the Koran or drive a New York cab without fear having your throat slashed. Bill and I argued after I said he has to take care in the way he talks about the 9/11 attacks so as not to provoke bigotry...

And, to a more direct point about this situation:

I pointed out that I had not made my comments on NPR. She asked if I would have said the same thing on NPR. I said yes, because in keeping with my values I will tell people the truth about feelings and opinions.

Fox Source

As of about 20 minutes ago, NPR has actually hosted excerpts of this article, to their website, with the same headline.

Excerpts from the NPR site:

Update, at 2:20 p.m. ET: NPR CEO Vivian Schiller says Williams should have kept his views about Muslims to himself, "his psychiatrist or his publicist."

Update at 3:30 p.m. ET. NPR CEO Vivian Schiller just released this statement:

"I spoke hastily and I apologize to Juan and others for my thoughtless remark."

NPR Source

I have chosen these two specific entries for a reason... It appears to me that there may be a bit of a war of egos going on at NPR. At least it's a factor to consider. If you read the whole of the entries in the NPR "feed", at least to me, it all comes across kind of disorganized and, frankly, catty. Though the tone seems to be "evolving" on their end.

It will be interesting to see where this all heads. IMO Juan Williams is probably going to come out of this with a pay raise, one way or the other.

~Heff

reply to post by Hefficide


I totally agree with you that he should not have lost his job
However I think that what he said was completely out of line and I totally disagree with his statement

But I do not think that he should have been fired for speaking his mind
Just as I do not think that Rick Sanchez should have been fired for speaking his mind
About the media being controlled by Jews

Americans have willfully lost their right to free speech
I will say again that what he said reeks of Islamophobia
And is nothing short of straight up racism
But that is what I think
And I am thankful that I live in a country where I can say that
And not be detained and legally terrorized
While made to wear a black hood
With dogs threateningly close
And electrodes on my body
Being forced to engage in homoerotic positions naked

wait a minute.........

I can only think that Mr Williams is voicing a fear of the unknown, a what if situation, real or imagined, that he finds himself when in a 'plane and when there are real entity's to focus on, that is a fear, not an opinion, no different than someone who has a fear of flying itself. As for the events of 9/11 that is the rationale for this fear, it is hard to understand why it happened in the way that it did. If 9/11 had never happened, aircraft would still be an easy route for bringing makers of terror into the country, but then it still probably is?? in the meantime there is the encroachment on civil liberties for those of us going about our daily lives. Then there is the contradictory and rife opinion polls like, 42% of Americans think that 9/11 commission was a cover-up, 36% of Americans think that 9/11 was a false-flag operation, then the big one, 70% of Americans think that it is inappropriate that a Mosque should be built near ground zero?? how do you make any sense out of that I suppose it's easy to say oh yeah to any of those three in isolation, not so easy to agree with all three at once.

Juan Williams was fired because he is black and has a Hispanic first name.

Political correctness should cut both ways.

This story is moving FAST!!!

Fox hands Williams $2 million

Fox News moved swiftly to turn the controversy over Juan Williams’s firing to its advantage, offering him an expanded role and a new three-year contract Thursday morning in a deal that amounts to nearly $2 million, Matea Gold reports.

Source

Fox hiring a notorious liberal? Interesting. And, as I mentioned a bit ago, Juan Williams looks to be getting paid pretty well in this.

Liberals on Fox... what a strange world it's turning into.

~Heff

Originally posted by Hefficide

This story is moving FAST!!!

Fox hands Williams $2 million

Fox News moved swiftly to turn the controversy over Juan Williams’s firing to its advantage, offering him an expanded role and a new three-year contract Thursday morning in a deal that amounts to nearly $2 million, Matea Gold reports.

Source

Fox hiring a notorious liberal? Interesting. And, as I mentioned a bit ago, Juan Williams looks to be getting paid pretty well in this.

Liberals on Fox... what a strange world it's turning into.

~Heff

That story has been posted in the early AM 21st.

Originally posted by inforeal
Juan Williams, Fox news house negro, a supposed “liberal” commentator on Fox, known for sucking up to the notorious liar Bill O’ Reilly was fired from NPR [NATIONAL PUBLIC RADIO] for remarks he made on O’ Reilly’s show and for just being there:

Whew.... for a second there I thought YOU were a Bigot.

Definition of BIGOT : a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Uh oh..........

What do you people hate Islam or like Juan Williams so much.

I know you don’t much care for this half black half Latin man who is a LIBERAL

But you do care about SOMEONE FINALLY DEFENDING MUSLIMS LIKE THEY DEFEND JEWS AND OTHERS IN THIS CULTURE WHEN THEY ARE THE SUBJECT OF BIGOTRY

You folks might want to watch your own hearts for your own bigotry and hatred. It may be justified in the sense that you are frail fearful human beings caught in the grip of the greatest propaganda, lying machine in history—the American media culture, along with the psyop military intelligence that has the media in its grip.

Now all of a sudden someone FINALLY gets punished by the MSM for a bigoted remark by a commentator against Muslims and he is a hero and you’ll are all upset!

What about the billions of innocent Muslims in the world and country WHO DIDNT DO A DAM THING TO ANYONE!

WHAT ABOUT THEIR FEELINGS WHEN THEY GET ON A PLANE AND ARE STARED AT BY PEOPLE AND ATTACKED ON THE STREET

REMEMBER THEY DIED TOO IN THESE TERRORIST ATTACKS

SO THEY GET IT FROM BOTH SIDES.

Originally posted by dillweed
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

 

If we never hear from you again it will be too soon.

No need for that kind of talk, BH has always been civil with his debating. Just because you don't agree with someone doesn't mean you silence them. He speaks his mind, and stays true to it, I can admire that even if I disagree with his points some of the time.


An apology is in order.

reply to post by inforeal


I cannot speak for anyone but myself. Juan Williams is no hero. He is just someone who was wrongfully fired, in my honest estimation. If it matters, I am 100% for them building that Muslim cultural center/"mosque" in Manhattan. I am from a latino family. The color of skin is not what is being discussed here.

If a hijacking is going to happen, I am almost certain it will be a person who is Muslim, or at least is reported to be Muslim. It isn't my choice that this is the trend. I wish it weren't, honestly. It would be best if there were no trend. But the trend is, if a plane is to be hijacked, it will be Muslims doing it. The same with bombings. in recent history, it is almost exclusively a Muslim endeavor.

Now, my honest belief is that most of these are staged events, or people are manipulated, by the CIA and other world intelligence (the folks behind the scenes, running the show).

It is not racist to identify such an exclusive trend. To not do so is putting someone elses feelings in front of logic and truth. That is an atrocity, especially when lives are at stake.

It should be mentioned that I am very famliar with Muslim people. I have known many Muslims in my life, due to some of the work i have done. I also know lots of Hindu's and Buddhists, and can tell you the stereotypes for all three are complete BS. Hindu and Buddhist people are not always introspective and peaceful no more than Muslims are slobbering madmen. But I have yet to find Hindu or Buddhists hijacking planes, or setting off bombs on planes.

Is that PC? Not likely. But if PC isn't truth, it is a lie. And i have no time for lies and logical fallacies.