"Newborn child taken away because of a bagel"

reply to post by Xcathdra

Hmmm we both perceive that term differently. How about protective custody? The child is not an adult, and the parents can no longer make a decision for the child due to the accusations. The guardian ad litem is the legal counsel for the child.

Here is a better word KIDNAPPING!
No proof has to be given for a child to be removed from their family, only suspicion. Instead of the state having to prove guilt the parent has the burden of proving innocence. That goes against everything our legal system stands for.
Do you have any idea how traumatic it is for a child to be ripped away from loving parents based on suspicion? It is permanently damaging. Not to mention what the parent goes through.

@Hotbakedtater

Outrageous. This is flat out female persecution. A female comes to birth a baby safely, and the jackboots running the place DRUG TEST HER? I am 1000 times aginst routine drug testing, it is archaic and in this case, the mother will nevr ge tthose five days back. CPS can be sued, but good luck you need lots of money to evn attempt it. What kind of scum do we have working for our children's interests, when they are so rabid to find evil drugs (opium is a very mild natural drug, and rather harmless in pure form). Did the mom not get demerol for pain? What the hell was the drug test for? Most moms m birth with heavy heavy drugs not mild natural opiates. The dna base I suppose. I am furious for this poor woman right now. May be back later if I calm down.

It isn't often I agree with you on issues concerning our gender My sentiments exactly for this poor woman. Nice to know we can agree once in a while.

Also if the mother was using opiates there would have been symptoms of withdrawal in the baby. Did they not stop and wait to observe if this was happening?

If I had taken her baby because I had SEEN her smoking a crack pipe, I'd be under the jail for kidnapping.

CPS is the most defended agency I know of, and I really, for the life of me, do not understand WHY.

reply to post by Mary Rose


lol Seinfeld episode in real life.

but really, wait a day and retake the test. not that complicated.

reply to post by afterschoolfun






What in the world are you talking about?

Please....

CPS is the most corrupt government agency in existence...

Just so you know IT is a violation of due process and it is NOT excusable.

"Oh its for the children..."

How about this, take that line and violate T and C with it.....

You see what our good gestapo agent here has refused to mention is the following....

One absolutely no oversite...

The omnibudsman system is a joke.....

"We find that you live in a small town. Your bound to run into each other."

Person Filed multiple complaints against the agents nada... Seems the money flow is too good

Why dont you post what the state gets for each child siezed... In the example above...

try 3500 a month thanks to clinton... They get bonuses for the money (kids) they bring in...

the worker who took the kid gets a bonus for those few days you had to protect the innocent child from the big bad bagel eatin moma...

Yes i have a personal axe to grind... I am going to enjoy every minute yall are on the stand...

you not gonna tell em... I will...

You see right now there is a brewing case in federal courts... seems one of you protectors of the innocent got caught with her hands in the cookie jar.

Let me see multiple bribes...
put a hit on a military officer (rumor)
Fraudulent court documents
intemidating witnesses
blackmail...

get the picture

In fact it has cost the dallas cps main office thier bonus this next year... Seems they have to pay a few families off....



funny thing a PI can find out for you...

Just so you know you can tell dallas I am going after next years bonuses....


What gets me is the money is coming out of just next years bonuses....

I hope that woman plasters their face everywhere and owns the county offices in charge...

BTW so those of you who do not know each state has given immunity to CPS case workers in most situations

Originally posted by orange-light

Originally posted by Jezus

BUT doing heroin while pregnant can lead to drug addicted babies...and that is a serious problem.

that is surely true
but why testing as a routine?
is every pregnant woman suspect to take illegal substances while being pregnant?
in what times are we living?

It is hard to say if this is a product of our fascist drug policy or if it is simply the result of standard blood tests.

The disturbing part is that no real investigation took place before the baby was removed...

Not to be overly dramatic but I wonder what kind of psychological effect this might have on the child...

reply to post by Jezus



The tests most Hospitals run these days are standardized, meaning they will test for everything they can. A Blood sample will show any blood issues, diseases, any viruses (HIV/AIDS), opiates, benzos etc etc.

Since the medical field today has pretty much advanced the testing to the point of testing for everything, in a quick manner, at a cheaper cost. The thought process is just test it all now, rather than doing only 1 test, and needing to do more later on because the newborn is sick. Better to ensure a healthy child. Also, mothers can have disease that can transfer to the newborn.

As stated before medical staff are mandatory reporters. If they come across a newborn that tested for drugs, they are required by law to report because of the endangering the welfare of a child issue. And before anyone starts screaming about HIPPA this will fall under the exemption.

Double edged sword in my opinion. I am not keen on Hospitals playing morals cop, yet at the same time the testing they do will let you know if your newborn has any complications.

Tough call imo.

Originally posted by calstorm
Here is a better word KIDNAPPING!
No proof has to be given for a child to be removed from their family, only suspicion. Instead of the state having to prove guilt the parent has the burden of proving innocence. That goes against everything our legal system stands for.

In order for me to remove a child, there has to be evidence present that the child's life is in immediate danger if we were to leave them with the parental units. The times I have had to take protective custody of a child, the evidence presented to me by the Doctor was very specific (spiral arm breaks, hip bone / pelvis breakage, etc). Just because we are called doesn't mean we will take.

One of the other things we find is when we ask the parents what happened, they will give an explanation that is incapable of producing the injury. This is critical in the case of babies since they are mostly cartilage, which requires more force to break / damage / injure.

At this point in the investigation, you are making whats called a PC, or Probable Cause, case. Based on the information given, by the parents and medical, in addition to your questions and investigation, will give you either enough evidence to act, or vindicate the parents with no action taken. Its not like we get a report, show up, take the kid, leave, and then demand the parents to provide evidence to get their kid back. As a side note, kidnapping is not going to apply in this case, but I commend your creativity.

They are innocent until proven guilty.

Originally posted by calstorm
Do you have any idea how traumatic it is for a child to be ripped away from loving parents based on suspicion? It is permanently damaging. Not to mention what the parent goes through.

I do have an idea of how traumatic it can be, since I have had to take protective custody of kids. Again, its not suspicion, but probable cause. The suspicion part would be when a teacher, counselor, medical, etc call CPS to report a possible abuse case. Law Enforcement and CPS send people to investigate, and we go from there after we get all the info / evidence. It is a thorough time consuming process.

Originally posted by calstorm
It isn't often I agree with you on issues concerning our gender My sentiments exactly for this poor woman. Nice to know we can agree once in a while.

Also if the mother was using opiates there would have been symptoms of withdrawal in the baby. Did they not stop and wait to observe if this was happening?

The drug testing is a result of medical advancement that allows Medical Staff to run a blood test, that literally tests for everything at once (Disease, HIV/AIDS, Jaundice, deficiencies, problems, drugs etc). People are not being singled out or persecuted, but I can understand how it could look / feel that way.

@ the opiate question - It doesn't do that in all cases so keeping for observation might not show anything. Thats why they do the tests. If mom has done drugs throughout the pregnancy then you stand a better chance of the child showing signs of withdrawal.

reply to post by ripcontrol


Don't kid yourself because it's your living and you like to think you are one of the good guys.

It IS kidnapping, and it is "assumed guilty until proven innocent."

If someone comes in my house, and takes my child, against my will, I'm going to consider it criminal, whether it is the government or not, and I'm just glad my child is older now. CPS is enough to make me fear for my now older child's peace of mind when he has my grandchildren.

...and CPS destroyed the life of a certainly little boy I knew long ago, and his brother, who is now dead. Someone, somewhere, needs to LOOK at just how protected the kids are under CPS custody. It's sickening. The ones that have made it are starting to speak out about how bad it was.

I have to agree with the majority here, CPS is absolutely out of control!!

10 years ago My sister had her first child, she was 18 and single. She lived with my mother at the time but she had a history of running away (mostly from her "problems") as a teen and had a short criminal record. None of these issues should have been held against her at any time after she was 18 in the state of PA!

When the child was 8 months old, my sister moved out due to an argument with my mother and I took the child in while my sister got her ducks in a row. 2 months later she had found a place with friends where she had a room and bathroom of her own, as well as a job that paid enough to support her and the child. Less than a month after having the child back, she called me sobbing, a "friend" of her friend had also moved into the home where she was staying (which made her uncomfortable) and she would come home from work to find little things like bruises and scratches. The night she called me she was in hysterics!! This man, the "friend" had raped her and threatened to kill her and the child if she told anyone!

Of course we went and picked them both up immediately and we looked the child over when we got home. She didn't seem right and we decided to take her to the ER. At the ER it was discovered that the child had a hair-line fracture of the tibia and so the police and CPS were called. My sister was interviewed/interrogated for hours, as was I. They left us leave after 6 hours and gave her strict instructions to make a Dr.'s appointment Monday (this was a Friday night) with a Dr. they chose. They also told her to press charges against the man, but she was terrified of him, of course and said she couldn't do it until she was somewhere he couldn't find her. My sister and I had a very long weekend trying to find her a place to go that would be safe. We did, a friend of mine from high school and she went there Sunday evening. The paper with the CPS approved Dr.'s number was in my husband's car and he went to work Monday not thinking about it. Long story short, we didn't have cell phones back then and my husband worked as a security officer and could not be reached until his shift ended.

Before he even got home, CPS was at my friends door with two police officers (one male and one female) and told my sister that they were taking the child because she did not comply with their orders!

VERY long story short, my sister was so distraught over the situation that she went into a deep depression and did not complete her "plan" to get the child back!! This was over the course of many months and mulitiple road blocks put in place by CPS!! They never once asked me or my mother if we would take custody of the child, not once! When we both asked them, they gave us many reasons as to why. 1, I had 2 boys and lived in a two bedroom apartment, so I was no good! 2, my mother worked too many odd hours (as a CNA) and so that wouldn't work either. We were all made to feel incompetant and I was even made to feel that challenging them on ANY issue could result in my own family being put on their chopping block!!

2 years later, after her first child had been adopted by her foster parents, my sister had a second child and CPS waltzed right into the hospital the next day and took the baby!! Once again they stone-walled her and gave her an impossible plan in order to get that baby back! The second child was adopted by the same foster parents less than a year after she was born and my sister will NEVER be the same. She has a criminal record as a "child abuser" and can not get a job working with children or animals, two of the things she is the very best at!!!

There is a whole lot more to this story, but in the interest of forum discussion, I cut out as much as I could in order to get the point across and not take up too much space!!

CPS is out of control, especially in the state of PA due to my personal experience!!

Originally posted by Xcathdra
The tests most Hospitals run these days are standardized, meaning they will test for everything they can.

Any test the hospital does should be with the prior written consent of the patient or the parent of a minor child. That’s what liberty is about.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
As stated before medical staff are mandatory reporters.

I’ve heard reports of this being abused, as well. They’re being used to fish for and trick people into revealing information that can be used as a pretext to remove a child.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
In order for me to remove a child, there has to be evidence present that the child's life is in immediate danger if we were to leave them with the parental units.

“Parental units.” Very strange terminology. Why not just say “parents”? Parental units makes them sound like robots or something.

Originally posted by Xcathdra
As a side note, kidnapping is not going to apply in this case, but I commend your creativity.

What case are you talking about? The immediately preceding case of the infant with injuries?

Then the case this thread is about might be kidnapping; you’re not sure?

Originally posted by Xcathdra
The drug testing is a result of medical advancement that allows Medical Staff to run a blood test, that literally tests for everything at once (Disease, HIV/AIDS, Jaundice, deficiencies, problems, drugs etc). People are not being singled out or persecuted, but I can understand how it could look / feel that way.

This reminds me of what the government is doing with every single phone call we make: filtering them all with software looking for key words such as “terrorist” that they can then follow up on. This is not being done to keep us safe, but as part of the phony war on terror, which is part of the controller’s New World Order agenda.

The controllers of this world are eugenicists. They have their own agenda for testing humans without their permission.

reply to post by IrishCream


IrishCream,

Thank you for taking the time to share this story. This is probably the most meaningful, important post I've ever read.

reply to post by hadriana

First they take the children away from the coc aine users, next they will come for the children of the overeaters, the tobacco smokers, and the protesters. Do you understand the invasion of our soul is underway. They should not judge parenting skills by the chemicals in the parents body. Does anyone else see my point? Take the kids away when the parents fail to raise them right, not when they endulge in illegal chemicals. Why do I seem to be the only one who can conseptualize this?

Originally posted by earthdude
Take the kids away when the parents fail to raise them right . . .

We don't want to do this, either.

Originally posted by Mary Rose

Originally posted by earthdude
Take the kids away when the parents fail to raise them right . . .

We don't want to do this, either.

I was a little broad in that statement. I agree that parents should have more control. I have to deal with child protective services when a child tells me they have been molested. In a case like that, yes, I want the goverment to act. Raising children "right" should be up to the parent. We have a line drawn by our democracy and the agents of the government keep pushing on it.

What I really struggle with is the core assumption by the majority of our society that the SAFEST place for children is with the government, or where the government puts them.

DFCS swoops in and takes a child - ok, say the child has been abused, neglected...say they hAVE

and people are like "Whew, so glad that child is safe now."

What?
The kids that live next to me where in foster care for several weeks because they had lice and their parents, divorced, seemed to have difficulty getting rid of it in both houses at the same time - those kids are ok, but they tell me they never, ever want to go back to foster care. They love their parents and siblings and it was very scary to them, and they tell me that this lady that kept them fed them dinner right after school them made them stay in their rooms until the next morning. They say she never bothered to learn their names.

I have heard one person that fosters refer to the children as ' renters.'

When a child is molested, I want someone to call THE POLICE.

Originally posted by hadriana
When a child is molested, I want someone to call THE POLICE.

I'm worried about the police now as well.

A previous post says the police have the authority to remove children without due process.

Also, the police are being militarized now.

We're in a heap of trouble all the way around.

reply to post by Mary Rose


Yes, we are. The police though, they at least are supposed to follow the constitution. CPS was designed to totally circumvent it. I think that's why they came into existence- it was considered to be too hard, too time consuming- to do things
'right.'

There is a price for liberty for sure. People seem to think it is ok for a 17 year old soldier to pay it, but never a baby. All those 17-20something year olds are someone's babies.

reply to post by hadriana


I do NOT work for the gestapo......

I do not see how my post lead to that conclusion... I have to much of an ethical base to stoop that low as to get into the kidnapping children for money racket they have going....

reply to post by IrishCream


Irish creme I am so sorry to hear how the gestapo ruined your families' life...

fight cps.com

Do you want to step back into the ring with them....Or at the very least overturn the adoption... It can be done...

DO NOT GIVE UP.....

I have to make the statement That I am not a lawyer....

In the course of my research

First go over all their paperwork. Find out where the I and t's...

If your sister is willing, file the rape charges now...... If the person did it once they are likely to do it again and have... Your going to have to run their names... A private investigator is worth his weight in gold... A good one is...

Is the case closed, if it is they cant get involved.

where her rights terminated? where the fathers? Did they blood test for parentage?

if anyone of them is no, your back in the ring....

Fight good sir fight till the better man is left standing....

CPS targets those who do not have the resources to fight back.

Get a lawyer from out of the county this case is in. OUT OF COUNTY... this way he doesnt play ball with them...

Sue in federal court..

@ the gestapo agent

I know this is close to a t and c but i am curious.

Why have you not offered to help a fellow ATS'er?

You work for the enemy of freedom, cant you do something to help irish creme. Or is it going to be a laundry list of execuses that start with , its not my case. Or its out of my jurisdiction... ect

Prove to me me and the rest of ATS that your job is about the right thing and not the money...

Or is the money the state pays you to good... Lets not rock the boat by, doing the right thing.....


I hope you prove to be a human being and not the evil you act as and for.