Tea Party Candidate: Abolish Public Schools

While you guys in the United States rapidly destroy yourselves, could you please do so more quietly so that we can assume the role you are leaving behind in a more orderly fashion.

I understand you guys are tired and just want to give up and become subsistence farmers with the general education levels of a pack of rats, but seriouly we don't have enough people up here to assume control the old fashion way. It'd be real appreciated if you committed nation suicide quieter.

reply to post by The Sword

Even with unions, they're still underpaid and overworked

Thank you for posting that.

I needed a laugh today, and I got an awesome one out of that!

reply to post by Aeons

I understand you guys are tired and just want to give up and become subsistence farmers with the general education levels of a pack of rats, but seriouly we don't have enough people up here to assume control the old fashion way. It'd be real appreciated if you committed nation suicide quieter.

If this example of bifurcation is supposed to represent the level of erudition provided people by the state then it only serves as more evidence as to why government sponsored education should be looked at with a critical eye.

Due to the inability of many graduates to write and comprehend what they read, the High School diploma has been completely devalued. Just this morning, I listened to a report on the huge amount of money spent on college freshmen, whose HS education did not satisfactorily prepare them to begin college courses. Afterwards, I found this report. The report finds that 41% of Community College freshmen and 27% of State College and University freshmen lack the basic skills to begin their higher education.

State records indicate that a total of $154 million in state funds was committed to
developmental education at the community college level during the 2000-2001 academic
year

During the 2000-2001 academic year, the state committed $22 million to remedial
education at four-year colleges and universities.

What this says is that the taxpayer is paying for the same education, twice. And, these figures do not include increases in tuition and fees, to the students themselves.

It also, further examines the financial impact of the education deficit, on the State of Texas.

study concludes that Texas loses over $13.6 billion a year when students leave high
school but fail to acquire basic skills.

The financial impact on the state manifests itself in a variety of ways — lower earning
potential and poor productivity of workers, increased spending on social programs, direct
costs of remediation by institutes of higher education and employers, and personal losses
that may affect individuals for a lifetime and the state for generations.

So, in response to the OP, yes we do need to make drastic changes to our public education systems. They are a huge drain on our economy, which aren't working. But, taking into consideration your posting history, just go ahead and say that the only reason you oppose the idea is because it comes from someone aligned with the Tea Party movement. Everyone knows that anyway and you didn't offer anything in support of the current educational system.

I can recall filling out job applications, which required the applicant to specify if they had either a HS diploma or a GED. The diploma was considered more desirable to an employer, than the GED certificate. The GED was considered a last resort, if you will.

At some point, that changed. Now, one is only required to answer yes or no to possessing one or the other. Combining them into one question has made them equally acceptable.

Unfortunately, with the new plans to "make a college degree more affordable and attainable", the same thing will occur. If the standards are lowered, to enable more students to obtain a degree, those degrees will become completely devalued, as well.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


I thank you for bringing more attention to my post.

reply to post by SeventhSeal


A Great Idea ! Having gone to Private Schools my whole life , and realizing what a well rounded education I recieved there , it is now selfevident to me that I very fortunate to do so considering most of my friends who happened to go to Public Schools are now Complete Ignorant Fools . A Mind is a Terrible thing to Waste Indeed..........

reply to post by Curiousisall


Who said they weren't? If politicians want to give to the poor then more power to them. In fact, I believe they are more obligated to give to charity than anyone else.

That doesn't mean they should force everyone else to give.

Reminds me of a speech, allegedly, made by Davey Crockett:
www.juntosociety.com...

Originally posted by Curiousisall

edit on 10/19/10 by Curiousisall because: (no reason given)

edit on 10/19/10 by Curiousisall because: lack of interest

Yep. Lack of interest is primarily the largest problem with the public schools system. So many people want to defend it in principle, but when it requires more than just a pithy remark or meaningless and irrelevant attack on religion, suddenly a "lack of interest" takes over and what is left is a deteriorating and decadent bureaucracy designed to benefit the bureaucracy at the expense of both parents and students, not to mention everyone else taxed to protect the status quo.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


No, it is trying to have a real discussion about education and having to be constantly bombarded with religious ideologies that are not based in any kind of reality, IE abstinence only teaching, that makes me lose interest in discussing it with religious zealots. If people want to teach their kids the "science" of myths, they should do it at home. It is not lack of interest in education that is my issue. It is lack of interest in banging my head against the fundamentalist christian wall of ignorance on ATS that is my issue.

reply to post by Curiousisall


I'm not a christian, buddy.

The point was brought up and I brought it home. There's a difference between doing something because you want to and being forced to do it. If you can't accept that simple idea then there really is not point in arguing this because I'll just consider you a pinko.

reply to post by Curiousisall


The only zealot I have seen in this thread is you. There has not been any argument made about religion in this thread, except from you. Your zealotry is so profound you exclaim that mythology has no place in public schools. Mythology that has been with humanity since time immemorial, mythology that is universal in its structure and how it is embraced by people, mythology that continues to be used in modern times in literature, film, and especially comic books, apparently has no cultural or educational value to you.

Your attempt to frame those of whom you disagree with in this thread as being "fundamentalist Christians" reveals a knee jerk reaction by you that has nothing to do with any of the arguments that have been made that are critical of public schools in the U.S. today.

You claim you don't "lack any interest" in "education" but what you seem to advocate is an indoctrination where a specific religion is demonized. Far from being the only mythology existent on this planet, Christianity is so profoundly similar to Greek and Roman myths in so many ways, not to mention its Judaic roots in mythology, what is clear is that you have no understanding of what mythology is, nor do you understand its importance to the human condition, and this lack of understanding is most likely due to a public education that rammed you through the system and told you were "educated".

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
reply to post by Curiousisall

 

The only zealot I have seen in this thread is you. There has not been any argument made about religion in this thread, except from you.

Ok then. Apparently my posts are little more than empty garbage someone as special as you should do yourself the favor of ignoring then.

Your zealotry is so profound you exclaim that mythology has no place in public schools.

Oh, I get it. You are one of those kinds of Christians. Making stuff up does seem fun. That is not at all what I said. Try again.

Mythology that has been with humanity since time immemorial, mythology that is universal in its structure and how it is embraced by people, mythology that continues to be used in modern times in literature, film, and especially comic books, apparently has no cultural or educational value to you.

Super, now read what I actually said about myth and school and try responding to what I really did say and not what you wish I said.

Your attempt to frame those of whom you disagree with in this thread as being "fundamentalist Christians" reveals a knee jerk reaction by you that has nothing to do with any of the arguments that have been made that are critical of public schools in the U.S. today.

I would be happy to have this conversation with you when you can stop making things up.

You claim you don't "lack any interest" in "education" but what you seem to advocate is an indoctrination where a specific religion is demonized.

Oh? Can you try this post again including quotes from me to back up your story?

Far from being the only mythology existent on this planet, Christianity is so profoundly similar to Greek and Roman myths in so many ways, not to mention its Judaic roots in mythology, what is clear is that you have no understanding of what mythology is, nor do you understand its importance to the human condition, and this lack of understanding is most likely due to a public education that rammed you through the system and told you were "educated".

Oh boy. You might need to switch to decaf, get your reading glasses, and give this another shot. If you are interested in actually getting somewhere with your posts to me, lets have a conversation. Pretty much everything you just posted is pure fiction that cannot be backed up by one word I have posted in this thread. You let me know if you get honest.

Originally posted by Mr Headshot
reply to post by Curiousisall

 

I'm not a christian, buddy.

The point was brought up and I brought it home. There's a difference between doing something because you want to and being forced to do it. If you can't accept that simple idea then there really is not point in arguing this because I'll just consider you a pinko.

I never called you a Christian and whatever you think you brought home seems to be little more than confusion. The point I actually replied to was about a righty advocating social evolution so I asked a question. You jumped in by saying politicians should not be charitible or whatever which really had nothing to do with the point I responded to so...uh yeah.

reply to post by Curiousisall

Ok then. Apparently my posts are little more than empty garbage someone as special as you should do yourself the favor of ignoring then.

Or confront them.

Oh, I get it. You are one of those kinds of Christians. Making stuff up does seem fun. That is not at all what I said. Try again.

While you continue to attack Christianity and zealously assume everyone who disagrees with you is a Christian.

Super, now read what I actually said about myth and school and try responding to what I really did say and not what you wish I said.

This is exactly what you said:

If people want to teach their kids the "science" of myths, they should do it at home.

The fact of the matter is that there is a "science" to mythology, and all mythology follows simple basic structures that are shared by various cultures across the world past and present. If you meant something other than what you said, perhaps you should learn how to say what you mean, which would require you get past your obvious public school upbringing and actually learn how to communicate thoughts precisely.

I would be happy to have this conversation with you when you can stop making things up.

You don't want to have a conversation, you want to make a rant against Christianity, which is off topic in this thread, and not at all what is being discussed. The disrepair of the public school system is not in doubt. Returning education to a more effective standard is what this topic is about, or from the O.P.'s point of view, a return to the "stone ages", either way, religion, and specifically Christianity has not been discussed by anyone other than you. It is irrelevant in this thread.

Oh? Can you try this post again including quotes from me to back up your story?

edit on 10/19/10 by Curiousisall because: (no reason given) edit on 10/20/10 by Curiousisall because: (no reason given)

Who do you think you're kidding? If you can't even be honest about your arguments, what makes you think they have any validity?

Oh boy. You might need to switch to decaf, get your reading glasses, and give this another shot. If you are interested in actually getting somewhere with your posts to me, lets have a conversation. Pretty much everything you just posted is pure fiction that cannot be backed up by one word I have posted in this thread. You let me know if you get honest.

Right. Pure fiction, while you run back and edit your posts, and then disingenuously demand that I quote you. There is nothing at all fictional about your attempt to derail this thread and make it about Christianity. This is a debate on public schools and whether or not they have any validity under the current system they are operating, not religion, and certainly not Christianity.

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
Right. Pure fiction, while you run back and edit your posts, and then disingenuously demand that I quote you.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Which posts did I edit again? Just one? What did I change? Spelling errors. Sorry you feel lying is the best way to have a conversation but I am not going to entertain you.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


There is no science in mythology. Of course education should include exposure to religions, myths, beliefs, all kinds of made up stuff. Not in science class. I am doing none of what you accuse me of. You seem to have an issue because I asked about a Christian priciple in this thread. If Christianity is so far off topic and I am the only one talking about it then why are 3 different people involved in responding to my one comment about it? Get a hobby.

Originally posted by Curiousisall

Originally posted by Jean Paul Zodeaux
Right. Pure fiction, while you run back and edit your posts, and then disingenuously demand that I quote you.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. Which posts did I edit again? Just one? What did I change? Spelling errors. Sorry you feel lying is the best way to have a conversation but I am not going to entertain you.

You changed more than "spelling errors" and it is you that is lying. You can backpedal all you want. If you want people to believe it took you two edits to correct spelling errors this is fine, and only underscores the problem with public schools today.

reply to post by Curiousisall

There is no science in mythology.

Uh-huh, and I suppose Jung and Kerényi are just a couple of dimwits who had no idea what they were talking about when they collaborated on Essays on a Science of Mythology:

Essays on a Science of Mythology is a cooperative work between C. Kerényi, who has been called "the most psychological of mythologists," and C. G. Jung, who has been called "the most mythological of psychologists." Kerényi contributes an essay on the Divine Child and one on the Kore (the Maiden), together with a substantial introduction and conclusion. Jung contributes a psychological commentary on each essay. Both men hoped, through their collaboration, to elevate the study of mythology to the status of a science.

In "The Primordial Child in Primordial Times" Kerényi treats the child-God as an enduring and significant figure in Greek, Norse, Finnish, Etruscan, and Judeo-Christian mythology. He discusses the Kore as Athena, Artemis, Hecate, and Demeter-Persephone, the mother-daughter of the Eleusinian mysteries. Jung speaks of the Divine Child and the Maiden as living psychological realities that provide continuing meaning in people's lives.

I suppose Max Muller is just a dolt who had no clue as to what mythology really is when he wrote Contrubutions to the Science of Mythology, and I suppose Joseph Campbell's The Hero of a Thousand Faces is just the insane rantings of a deranged madman.

The ignorance you demonstrate in this thread is a remarkable indictment on public schools and just how guilty they are of dumbing down a populace.

Of course education should include exposure to religions, myths, beliefs, all kinds of made up stuff. Not in science class.

Nobody in this thread has argued that religions and myths should be taught in science class, this is your own fiction.

I am doing none of what you accuse me of.

Yes you are. From the get-go you have attempted to make this thread a debate about creationism versus evolutionism, but it is only you having the debate. Nobody has taken you up on your baiting game, and when someone attempted to ask you some valid questions regarding the forced taxation of the public in order to mandate public education, you made a post, edited out whatever your reply was, and gave for the reason a "lack of interest". Presumably, if you can't have your debate about creationism versus evolutionism you don't have anything else to say, and this is evident even now.

You seem to have an issue because I asked about a Christian priciple in this thread. If Christianity is so far off topic and I am the only one talking about it then why are 3 different people involved in responding to my one comment about it? Get a hobby.

No one other than you has brought up Christianity. That is a simple fact. No one has entered this thread and attempted to preach "Christian values", nor has anyone attempted to argue that Christianity needs to be taught in public schools, this is your delusion, and yours alone. Get a hobby.

reply to post by Jean Paul Zodeaux


I am not exactly sure what the damage is here but uh I am not trying to discuss creationism vs. evolution in this thread. I simply asked SOMEONE ELSE a question and the rest of you jumped all over it. I am truly sorry now that I bothered to engage any of you aside from the actual person I was addressing. I am sorry I let you intrude and take this that far off topic.

No, there is no scienc in mythology. You woefully missunderstand or missrepresent what you cite as rebuttals.

You are the one desperately trying to have a religious discusssion here. Yes I mentioned religion in my question to somoneone else but my intent was certainly not to wander off into Jesus land. I am sorry I induldged you. I have a feeling you are smart enough to know that what you just posted does nothing to change what I actually said and you know I meant about science and mythology. You seem to just be looking for a fight. I am not interested.