Looking for Video / Photos of WTC 1 Standing from Barclay Street, or Rear of WTC7 View

Hello All,

I'm trying to build a case for Mr. Jennings using photo and video evidence to prove he was trapped before
the North tower fell.

If you can locate any pictures showing WTC1 standing from Barclay street with a clear view of the north
facing rear wall of WTC 7 I'd appreciate it.

Also those stating the car fires locted behind WTC 7 were started due to debris shooting over WTC1 better
rethink their story. Here are three videos showing no visible debris, or fire arcing over WTC 7

www.youtube.com...

1:16, 1:42
www.youtube.com...

Lastly, If anyone can locate a credible time stamp of the video interview with Jennings on the street shortly
after his rescue, that would be of great help. I"m trying to locate an archive that displays some sort of
time stamp. If I find, I"ll post it!


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/8cfbe0f41469.jpg[/atsimg]

I take it you're looking for something that could identify the window they smashed out being broken? I don't remember any particular photos showing that but I will do what I can and have a look. This photo might show the 8th floor window but it's very low resolution: i.pbase.com...

I can't help you with video but it seems to me that the most reliable time which can be established for the Jennings/Hess experience is 0959. This is when the South Tower collapsed and the power was cut off to WTC 7. We know that Jennings and Hess were in the OEM on the 23 rd floor at that point. They went up in the freight elevator , when the power was on obviously , but had to find the stairs to go down.

Seems reasonable therefore that they sent off down the stairs fairly shortly after 0959. They went down 17 floors. Overwhelmingly likely therefore that they were trapped by the collapse of the North Tower at 1020 and falling debris damage to WTC 7. A demolition charge at this point, some 7 hours before collapse, seems vanishingly unlikely.

reply to post by Alfie1


I saw one of the new videos... IIFC it shows Jennings at the broken window.

Tino ~

I can not link to Youtube in my office, but what you can do is search on Youtube for IC911Studies Channel and look for their video entitled WTC 7 Burning. It shows Mr. Hess yelling from the broken window.

I will not know if this works until i get home:

Did NIST Edit WTC 7 Footage To Hide Evidence Of Implosion? , page 6
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Barry Jennings Uncut
blip.tv...

EXCLUSIVE: New Video of World Trade Center 7 Released Showing Michael Hess Calling Down For Help While He is Stuck in the Building > New World Order Report
Click this link.

WTC 7's compartmented demolition collapse sequence reveals human intervention.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

I think this all together makes it quite clear that Barry Jennings and Michael Hess were experiencing this stairwell explosion (watch my diagrams WHERE that stairwell was) before 09:59, and not spot on during that 59th second.
Barry was very clear about that : ""both towers were still standing! "".

And find my remark back about when the power to WTC 7 was shut off in the CON-ED station by their engineers.
A design flaw caused the emergency generators to kick in again, restoring some power to some floors.
But Barry and Michael both said they were going back up to the 7th and then the 8th floor in a pitch black stairwell filled with black smoke.

EDIT : look up also the link to prof Jones first thesis, somewhere in there, where you can see that first south side photo of WTC 7, with the Twin Towers both gone, but that south and east facade was bathing in sunlight, with a thin shade of whitish smoke at the base curling up, and no more.
No raging fires, no big gash in the center of that facade, all hogwash. Time of photo, about 11:30 to 12:00 a.m.

reply to post by LaBTop


LaBTop, with the power on until 0959 there is no reason why Hess/Jennings should have started down the stairs before that time. They went up in the elevator so the obvious thing would be to go down the same way.

Alfie1, please, next time, first listen carefully to Barry's own words I linked to.
There's btw also an early interview to be found on YouTube and many other video channels, with Mr Hess, who also explained why they had to take the STAIRS DOWN to meet the sixth floor's explosion.

Electricity did not work for the elevators anymore, that was just after the point in time that the CON-ED guys cut off MAIN power, but after that the emergency generators came in again, which they should not have done btw.
But these were only providing juice for those floor parts whose owners had pressed for back-up electricity power.
Think of back-up computer storages, server banks etc. Small units, compared to the whole buildings electricity setup.

And that did not include the elevators! Nor the overall lighting.

Would you be so kind to also have a look at the position of that most eastern stairwell of the two? In the center of WTC 7, just east of the elevator banks.
Do you then still want to hold to your idea that debris from the FIRST collapse, the South tower, could have impacted WTC 7 so damn deep that it demolished that stairwell at and under floor 6?

While the still erect North Tower shielded WTC 7 off? And that one collapsed at 10:28 a.m.

Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by LaBTop

 

LaBTop, with the power on until 0959 there is no reason why Hess/Jennings should have started down the stairs before that time. They went up in the elevator so the obvious thing would be to go down the same way.

Aha, that's your misconception.
That was the collapse time for the first, South Tower.
NOT the time for the power cutoff by the CON-ED guys!

You did not check my links. I had my hopes high for a decent, and thorough opponent, but I am severely disappointed by your lack of reasoning.
Please do better next time, I think you could become a fine debater, but then you must absorb the arguments of your opponents just as seriously as your own.
Which I try to do as best as I can. Ask around in my opposing circles.
If you can convince me of an error in my reasoning, or my arguments, I will gladly publicly admit it.

Hope you will be so polite to do the same.

reply to post by LaBTop


LaBTop, I am not going to treat every word from Barry Jennings as being carved in stone. After all, he was the one to talk of stepping over bodies in the lobby of WTC 7 which he later retracted.

However, to go back to 0959, I don't see any reason for Hess and Jennings to embark on a long haul down the stairs if the elevators were working. Which they were up until 0959.

You say some emergency power came on on various floors after 0959 but did not power the elevators so that, even if correct, is irrelevant.

reply to post by LaBTop


Ok, what time do you have for the power cut-off to WTC 7 ?

Thank you all for trying to help, even the non-truthers; I can feel the love!

I have seen much of this material already and tried to find a reference of time, but could not come up
with a definitive answer.

Exponent/ Alfie, my goal is to find a photo, or video that shows the smashed out window at the North-East
corner of WTC7 while the North Tower is standing.

Labtop, I have seen Jennings' uncut video testimony and I do agree by his explanation of the firemen running
away twice, that the stairwell was blown out prior to collapse of either tower Even if mistaken by one tower
falling (the South falling which could not have damaged the structure of WTC7), his supposed 'error in recall' (as
suggested by some) would not even matter.

Maybe you can find it amongst these.

reply to post by turbofan


Oh come on, how can you say they were going down the stairs prior to either tower falling ? Why did they find it necessary to go down the stairs at all ? They went up in the elevator. A sudden enthusiasm for exercise ?

Originally posted by turbofan
Exponent/ Alfie, my goal is to find a photo, or video that shows the smashed out window at the North-East corner of WTC7 while the North Tower is standing.

I've found nothing yet, I remember someone on JREF having a well categorised album of photos but I can't find it now. Nothing obvious in NISTs WTC7 report. Perhaps you could contact IC911Studies as they're the people who apparently got 3tb of data released from NIST.

Do they offer that for download anywhere? I haven't seen it.

reply to post by Alfie1


The Lobby of WTC 7 was used as a triage area, where DEAD and seriously injured people were laid on the floor after both planes impacted.
Most of them were dead bodies, from jumpers, people who got hit by jumpers or falling material after the first collapse, then the second collapse.

That's why the firemen helping Barry out (with his swollen knees), told him not to look down.
Because they knew it's not a nice memory, the smashed in pieces bodies of desperate people who let go from their handhold up in those towers, to fall to their death...... Or victims of steel and glass parts raining down all the time before the first, South Tower and then the second, North Tower collapsed.

reply to post by Alfie1

Oh come on, how can you say they were going down the stairs prior to either tower falling ? Why did they find it necessary to go down the stairs at all ? They went up in the elevator. A sudden enthusiasm for exercise ?

Alfie 1, answer this first, did you read and viewed all the links I gave you before I gave you my last answer? It seems as if you did not, or did not want to understand its implications at all.
Do you have speakers on your box? Did you listen to all the videos?

Is your only goal to "debunk and debate", or do you genuinely search for the real truth of the day of September 11, 2001 ? If so, you WILL have the URGE to read and view and listen to all the links we give you for nothing, no fees wanted. I do read and view and listen to all links, serious opponents of my own opinions offer me, I MUST! Since I am always afraid to miss a very important piece of that day's puzzle.
(That's how I found that most important mistake by NIST, the Cianca photo, timestamped!
That connected suddenly all seismic events time stamps from that day to the abundant video and photo time stamps, checked by NIST themselves.
And proved the WTC 7 seismic diagram was false, or the Cianca photo time stamp was false.
Because both time stamps are defended by NIST to this day.
And you know who gave me the link to that photo?
One of ATS its first day "debunkers". HowardRoarke. A very civic debater, most of the time.
After that he lost interest in ATS and moved on to other forums, with the same user name.
I however think he turns up here, now and then, under different names.)

To answer your second illogical question first.
They both spend some time walking around, in and around the OEM offices, Hess was absent for some time exploring other floors, I suppose. Then, when they were together again, they were told by some men that it was better to evacuate also (who were they?) and the logical thing to do is use the elevator you came up with. They did not.
They used the stairs. The logical reason why they did that?
Because that freight elevator did not work anymore! Of course!
If you were warned that you were in a very dangerous situation by serious looking chaps, would you opted to descend, by foot, 23 floors, or wait a few moments until the elevator arrived?
So, logically spoken, that elevator indicated that it did not work, by not arriving, by not showing any lights to push anymore, by still being on that same floor with still open doors, but all lights were out on the push button panel inside the elevator, by just not reacting to any move from people who wanted to use it, etc.

reply to post by Alfie1

Alfie1 : Ok, what time do you have for the power cut-off to WTC 7 ?

Now, to answer your first question. Did you read my links? Where you can find that answer in my own thread I first linked to!

I think you have to look and listen very carefully at my Blip.tv link I gave you, and there you will find all your other answers.
You probably have to install the MIRO video program.
But it says when you right-click on the video, that you can look at it with Adobe Flash Player.
And that's why I think you could perhaps not watch that video.
I did however exactly that again.
It's 20:45 minutes long, the first 9 minutes already you have all your answers. But don't miss the rest, where you get even more of them in more detail.

Especially watch his explanation why his later rescuers ran two time away, while they were shouting to him through the open window ( which glass he broke with a fire extinguisher ) on the 8th floor's northeast corner of WTC 7.
First time they ran when the South Tower collapsed, second time when the North Tower collapsed.
Both collapse times they were BOTH already long back on the 8th floor, after that huge explosion below the sixth floor blew them back up to the seventh floor again. And then they walked further up to the 8th floor, and went to the furthest eastern corner of it, where Barry smashed out the glass of that corner window.

So, I'll repeat it for you :

Barry arrives alone at WTC 7 before the second plane impact at 09:02:54.
He meets Hess there and both men go up to the 23rd floor by normal elevator, but can't enter, and go back down one or more floor to take the also working freight elevator which does bring them into the OEM office. Let's say it's 09:05 a.m. That office is bullet proof and sound proof too, it will be difficult to hear the second impact at all.

(Doesn't anybody find it strange that the usual normal elevators did not give entrance to the 23rd floor at that precious moments? A real emergency was unfolding! And the two professionals who were trained to react on such, came running to help, to the one position they were taught to come to, the OEM office. And you think they would not take a normal elevator, which as far as they knew, gave entrance to the 23rd floor? OF COURSE THEY DID. Because they knew that it was the normal, fastest way to reach that OEM floor!
That's why at last they thought of going down to the freight elevator and try that one.)

Lights and electricity are still on, but all huge TV screens are all off when they enter the 23 floor OEM office.
That whole huge space is empty , no people there. Let's still say it's 09:05 a.m.

That is for sure a tad bit strange, such an unbelievable EARLY full evacuation, so even the OEM office.
Which was built explicitly for that one event, an emergency like 911.

Hess apparently leaves him alone there for a short time, but comes back and others entering OEM tell them ""you have to go"" and that's the moment the freight elevator logically and apparently does not work anymore. Thus they are forced to take the eastern stairwells. Let's say it's 09:15 a.m.
When they reach the 6th floor, that's 17 floors down, let's say it's 09:30 a.m., the explosion blew them back up to the 7th floor, it's pitch black now, and then they walk up to the 8th floor.
There they go to the most north eastern window, smash it and start crying for help. Let's say it's 09:40 a.m.
He calls for help downwards, but then these rescuers ran away, that's the first, South Tower collapse at 09:59 a.m.
They return again, but have to run for their life again, when the more near, North Tower collapsed, at 10:28:31 a.m.

Barry hears later on, all the time additional explosion sounds. Can't be transformers, the electricity for the whole of South Manhattan WTC complex was cut off at that time.

The first gentleman (who saved them later around 12:00 to 12:15 p.m.) says he heard them cry for help and went for help from others.
He returned with those, but then they had to ran away since the first collapse, of the South Tower took place.
They came back later, but had to ran away again since the second collapse, of the North Tower took place.
Then they returned for the third time, went into WTC 7, had quite some trouble to locate the two men, but did find them in the end and lead them to safety.

turbofan, The "gentleman, as Barry called him", Barry lays his arm around, in the first minute of the Blip.tv video (Barry Jennings Uncut) is the one we should try to locate. He can testify to Barry's story. The first earliest part, the time that he first saw and heard both men leaning out of that 8th floor WTC 7 northeastern corner window. And he is also the same man who in the end came to rescue them around 12:00 to 12:15 p.m.

WTC Primary and Emergency Electrical Power :
sites.google.com...

These feeders are protected by 1200-ampere circuit breakers with protective relays to disconnect the power when a fault occurs. The feeders for Building 7 are tapped off of the Building 4 feeders; therefore, the substation relays protecting Building 4 also protect the feeders for Building 7.

The alternate electrical system does not provide electrical power to elevator or fire pump motors. Electrical power for these high- load motors is provided by the normal electrical system or by the emergency generators.

turbofan, Another possible solution would be to go find reports from WTC 4, if you can find any reports regarding the time that the main power was switched off for that building. Or that the elevators and the main lights stopped working.
That time is the same as when it was REALLY cut off (manually or by explosives) for WTC 7 also!

I will really keep my eyes open for any video/photo of the 8th floor broken window, together with BOTH towers still standing.
Since the fact that it is broken, will extra confirm Barry's story, together with those two towers still there.
But don't you think it's a bit overdone, when we have several interviews with Barry Jennings and Michael Hess? Since when do we have to act as the FBI? We don't have their resources, and STILL, we unearthed MUCH MORE than they could. Nice job!


Interim Report on WTC 7 2004.
wtc.nist.gov...

See figure L-12. Floor 6 plan. The stairwell the two men were in is on the right(east) side of the drawing, the little white square beneath the last eastern elevators.

Alfie1, your theory is based on the assumption that debris from the South Tower collapse at 09:59 a.m., could have avoided the North Tower which was still standing, the buildings 5 and 6 which were also still standing, then impacted WTC 7, slashed through two thirds of the building and cut the stairwell below floor 6 in two.
Floor 6 which was shielded by half the WTC 7 building, the whole WTC 5 and 6 buildings, higher than that 6th floor and the ones under it, where that explosion came from, and the whole WTC 1 North Tower which was 110 floors high.
That must have been an extraordinary piece of a kind of "guided missile" debris.

And those two men never said anything about such an event, simply said they experienced an explosion which threw them one floor up again. And then the stairs were gone, not half of the building......
You realize this is something you can never ever defend with a straight face in even a basic school, I hope.

So why do you propose such a ludicrous theory? And keep coming back with it?

Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by LaBTop

 

LaBTop, I am not going to treat every word from Barry Jennings as being carved in stone. After all, he was the one to talk of stepping over bodies in the lobby of WTC 7 which he later retracted.

However, to go back to 0959, I don't see any reason for Hess and Jennings to embark on a long haul down the stairs if the elevators were working. Which they were up until 0959.

You say some emergency power came on on various floors after 0959 but did not power the elevators so that, even if correct, is irrelevant.

New World Order Report, Hess in 8th floor window, LOTS of links to History Commons.org.

Barry Jennings, a City Housing Authority worker, and Michael Hess, New York’s corporation counsel, hear unexplained explosions inside World Trade Center Building 7, where they become trapped. [UPN 9, 9/11/2001; BBC, 7/6/2008] The two men went up to the emergency command center on the 23rd floor of WTC 7 after the first attack occurred (see (Shortly Before 9:03 a.m.) September 11, 2001). [Associated Press, 9/11/2001; Independent, 9/13/2001] At some point, the power goes out in the building. They then start walking down the stairs to get out. According to Hess, when the two men get down to the eighth floor, “there was an explosion and we’ve been trapped on the eighth floor with smoke, thick smoke, all around us, for about an hour and a half.” [UPN 9, 9/11/2001] Jennings will also recall hearing explosions. He will say: “I made it to the sixth floor and there was an explosion. The explosion was beneath me.” [Dylan Avery, 2007] He will add, “[T]he staircase that I was standing on just gave way,” and, “Then we made it back to the eighth floor, I heard some more explosions.” [BBC, 7/6/2008] Jennings says to Hess: “This is it; we’re dead. We’re not gonna make it out of here.” [Penn State Public Broadcasting, 3/1/2002] The National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) will claim the two men head down the stairs after 9:59, when the first collapse occurs, and then become trapped around the time the second tower collapses, at 10:28. [National Institute of Standards and Technology, 9/2005, pp. 109-110 pdf file] But according to the London Independent, they start heading down the stairs after the second attack at 9:03, which suggests the explosions begin earlier on. [Independent, 9/13/2001] Jennings will confirm this, saying that when he hears the first explosion, “Both [of the Twin Towers] were still standing,” meaning it occurs before 9:59. He says: “I was trapped in there when both [Twin Towers] came down.… All this time I’m hearing explosions.” [Dylan Avery, 2007] The cause of the explosions is unclear. Later on, firefighters will rescue Hess and Jennings from the building (see 12:10 p.m.-12:15 p.m. September 11, 2001). [National Institute of Standards and Technology, 9/2005, pp. 109-110 pdf file]

Notice that even Hess on 9/11 when interviewed, said that they were trapped by an explosion.

The interesting detail Hess added on 9/11, was that they were trapped on the 8th floor for about an hour and a half.
And when you count back 1 hour and 30 minutes from 12:00 to 12:15, you arrive between 10:30 to 10:45 a.m.
And the North Tower collapsed at 10:28:31 a.m.
So Hess did put the explosion in the stairwell very close before that North Tower collapse.

Since we could hear two very low frequency explosions in the "WTC 7 Burns" video, where Hess is shouting down from that window, I am getting highly interested in the damn TIMESTAMP of that video, which must exist on the FOIA requested video publicized by the New World Order Report website I linked to above.!

So turbofan, another way to decisively prove who is mistaken, Barry Jennings or Michael Hess, is to contact that website, which is easy, and ask them the time stamp on that video they released lately.
If the source, NIST, which provided them that video, did not use Adobe Flash Access to block those time stamps.
If it is between the first and the second collapse, Hess is mistaken.
It's reasonably sure after the first collapse, to see by all the dust and light debris on that street with the WTC 7 loading dock ramp visible.


Note that Barry Jennings is dead, (no death certificate to find, btw) while Michael Hess has become the only associate of former N.Y. mayor Giuliano's firm, started after he lost the mayor bet for another term, and that firm made, very fast, millions of dollars profit.

Originally posted by LaBTop
Barry arrives alone at WTC 7 before the second plane impact at 09:02:54.
He meets Hess there and both men go up to the 23rd floor by normal elevator, but can't enter, and go back down one or more floor to take the also working freight elevator which does bring them into the OEM office. Let's say it's 09:05 a.m. That office is bullet proof and sound proof too, it will be difficult to hear the second impact at all.

On the contrary, they could not have been in the OEM at 09:05am as an OEM manager was in the office at the time discussing whether to evacuate WTC7:

After WTC 2 and the Pentagon were attacked, an OEM manager had a conversation on the 23rd
floor of WTC 7 (OEM office) with unidentified representatives of the U.S. Secret Service, the
U.S. Federal Bureau of Investigation, WTC security, and other OEM officials, and he personally
ordered the evacuation of WTC 7, 15 min prior to the collapse of WTC 2.9 This corroborated the
tenant representative's statement, establishing the time to have been about 9:45. (By all accounts,
the building was essentially empty at this point, and he acknowledged that many had already self-
evacuated.)

Source: NIST NCSTAR 1-9 Volume 1 Page 317 (361 PDF)

There is little doubt from the timeline that the OEM was not evacuated before 9:30am, and as Jennings reported the room being empty with coffee or food still steaming and had met nobody on the way up then it's clear he arrived within a short period post evacuation.

Originally posted by LaBTop
reply to post by Alfie1

 

The Lobby of WTC 7 was used as a triage area, where DEAD and seriously injured people were laid on the floor after both planes impacted.
Most of them were dead bodies, from jumpers, people who got hit by jumpers or falling material after the first collapse, then the second collapse.

That's why the firemen helping Barry out (with his swollen knees), told him not to look down.
Because they knew it's not a nice memory, the smashed in pieces bodies of desperate people who let go from their handhold up in those towers, to fall to their death...... Or victims of steel and glass parts raining down all the time before the first, South Tower and then the second, North Tower collapsed.

Do you have a source for the lobby of WTC 7 being used as a triage area for dead and injured on 9/11 please ?

This video, from about 40 seconds in, shows the lobby that morning and two things seem clear from it. (a) there are no dead and injured there (b) its clearly not a place where you would put injured people.

www.youtube.com...