Dieting and Exercise Aren't Effective Fat Loss Tools

Shut the hell up???????
Come on guys this
"was" a good thread now its just a heap. can we get back on track before this thread is blown up?
How bout you guyz u2u

reply to post by MegaMind


Ohhhh I get it, so because YOU failed, than I am BOUND to fail.

I seeeeeeee! YOU dictate other people's success because of YOUR hatred for it. I see it all now.

What a great contribution you are.

"Nah...you'll be fat again because I am....been there done that.....pfffffffff"

Your whole tone is negative about it and you're trying to project your disappointment onto others by scoffing at their success. That's almost the very definition of TROLLING.

Berate someone till the cows come home dude. I could care less. But it's NOT WORKING for you now is it?

You say you've 'been there done that'? Then do it again. Copy what you did to get there, because I'm sure sitting at the comp berating people ISN'T part of a healthy diet plan.

Now excuse while I go hit my morning routines and take a shower.

You stay here and tell everyone how "they don't know what it's like", because THAT'S gonna help your cause.

reply to post by tommyb0y


That's what I do. Modified versions, of course.

They initially work by Excessive Post-workout Oxygen Consumption (EPOC); however, in the long term, they work by improving insulin sensitivity.

There's no doubt that exercise/calorie restriction works initially (usually because calorie restriction lowers serum insulin along with energy availability). What so many of you are disregarding is the body's uncanny ability to adapt. If you don't address the hormonal imbalance, you will eventually plateau and hunger/lethargy will win. It's physiological.

Originally posted by kbm12345
reply to post by MegaMind

 

Shut the hell up, my point was his family are fat and still fat because of there lifestyle choices. Greasy fkn food. For christmas one year he got a deep fryer and thought it was the greatest thing ever. He changed his lifestyle choices, but his family haven't because they obviously get greater satisfaction from eating junk food, and until they change they will remain fat.

Well obviously I touched a nerve. I'll "shut the hell up". He will struggle - forever. Period.

To all those saying these are excuses you have no idea what you are talking about. I have worked damn hard on losing weight and keeping it off. When you have walked a mile in a fat person's shoes maybe you can talk. Until then ...

Originally posted by Prove_It_NOW
reply to post by MegaMind

 

Ohhhh I get it, so because YOU failed, than I am BOUND to fail.

I seeeeeeee! YOU dictate other people's success because of YOUR hatred for it. I see it all now.

What a great contribution you are.

"Nah...you'll be fat again because I am....been there done that.....pfffffffff"

Your whole tone is negative about it and you're trying to project your disappointment onto others by scoffing at their success. That's almost the very definition of TROLLING.

Berate someone till the cows come home dude. I could care less. But it's NOT WORKING for you now is it?

You say you've 'been there done that'? Then do it again. Copy what you did to get there, because I'm sure sitting at the comp berating people ISN'T part of a healthy diet plan.

Now excuse while I go hit my morning routines and take a shower.

You stay here and tell everyone how "they don't know what it's like", because THAT'S gonna help your cause.

All I'm saying is that the title of this thread and the OP are correct. Real research needs to be done - watch that video i posted and good luck.

Adversely, I have a freind who has a REAL Thyroid condition and cannot lose weight for her life....but her case is RARE....way more rare than many of the so-called "I can't lose weight" people.

My Mother, who has had weight problems all her life tells me how hard it's been. But I go visit her once a week and when I sneak in her fridge I see cookies, cakes, pies, sodas, chips, pasta, bread. And she NEVER exercises.

God Bless my Mother and I love her to death...but usually when I hear people say "I can't lose weight"...there's a reason, aside from my friend who has BLOOD WORK to confirm she can't

Now I really gotta go hit the routines....good luck everyone.

reply to post by MegaMind


Yes you did touche a nerve, with your condescending tone and absolute ignorance. The nutritional industry is a wash with misinformation because of people like you, from which they make all there money.

I look at like this::
It's not a struggle to me its something I will have to work at the rest of my life. I am an alcoholic and although its something I'll have to work at the rest of my life it does'nt have to be a struggle if I looked at it that way I would be drinking. I use 12 steps in my overeating,gambling ect...
Even if you arent in a program you do not have to make it a "Struggle".

Devo,

Excellent post, my friend. This makes much sense to me. As a larger individual, I have struggled to lose that last 30 pounds of stomach fat that would keep me from looking my best. I was born very premature (2.5 months, and only 2 pounds), and I have a feeling that may have something to do with my large frame today. I've recently been reading up on premature babies and overall weight gain through their lives (I don't have the article in front of me, so if I can find it, I'll edit to link it. I read it about 3 weeks ago.), and the results found that something like 25-30% of premature babies at some point in their lives were overweight. That's not a huge number, but it does account for something.

I try to stay active by walking with my dog every night. I used to lift weights all the time, and that was when I was my healthiest. I couldn't get rid of the stomach fat, but my arms were well-defined, and my chest was getting there. I sustained a non-related injury and had to stop with lifting. My weight has fluctuated a lot in my life. I was a "built" kid throughout elementary school, but when puberty hit, something happened and I put on close to 40 pounds in a year, and of course, that turned into fat. I'm not very tall, so it destroyed the body that I had. Since about the age of 12 I have struggled with the weight gain. It wasn't until I got to college that I realized that I needed to do something to change the way that I ate/worked out/lived. My roommate was very supportive about all of this and we worked out quite regularly. I didn't eat anything fried at the commissary, and stuck with fish, skinless chicken, and salads (for the most part). I did lose weight (close to 40 pounds in a little over 8 months), but the second I sustained my injury, I gained it all back, and then some. It's taken me about 5 years to get back to a weight that I'm comfortable with. I still have a ways to go, but I'm glad that the muscle mass that I built up has stayed and that has helped with my efforts.

After the evidence and studies that you have linked, I may just try this experiment to see what happens. It makes biological sense to me, and I'm starting to see that the doctors that I have talked to about my weight problem have been either misguided or just plain wrong. If I could find the right nutrition plan for my particular body type, I think I could be in business. I have accepted the fact that I will not be a skinny person (nor do I want to be), but I'd rather lose the extra fat and gain some much needed muscle mass. If I'm going to be built like Gimli from Lord of the Rings, I'd might as well look good at the same time.

Sorry for the rambling, but this is a very personal topic for me, and the scientific evidence shows why many people who are obese have failed and/or resigned to a life of being scorned, because they just do not know how their own body works.

Thanks for this post, and I will be checking every link that you posted once I get home from work today.


Peace be with you.

-truthseeker

a lot has to do with the type of food you eat.
what made the sedentary kids become obese in the first place?
i always heard it was junk food and television/video games.

Originally posted by madhadder545
I look at like this::
It's not a struggle to me its something I will have to work at the rest of my life. I am an alcoholic and although its something I'll have to work at the rest of my life it does'nt have to be a struggle if I looked at it that way I would be drinking. I use 12 steps in my overeating,gambling ect...
Even if you arent in a program you do not have to make it a "Struggle".

I like your attitude.

--------------------------------

I just think that what the OP posted is worth looking at. Like the video I linked to on another page. Real research into this issue - not just calories in calories out.

I am never going to be a naturally thin person. It's an illusion. I can work hard on getting thin - become thin - like I've done before - and will do again - but I'm under no illusions anymore that it will ever be easy for me to get there or stay there. Naturally thin people don't have to work at it but I do. It sucks but thats the way it is. Not asking for pity just stating what is and what is not.

People who gain 30 lbs during their 30s or 40s are not really prone to obesity. People who gain 100 lbs by the time their 23 are definitely people with a nack for obesity. I have a good friend who lost weight with me during my last major effort (100 lbs, 290 to 190 lbs). He lost all his weight at 30 lbs - he is 56. He has been skinny his whole life until about the last 15 yrs when he slowly started putting it on. I have watched his eating habits and his exercise (very occasional walk of about 2 miles). Nothing special at all. I could not keep my weight off eating what he eats or exercising they way he does. I require much more stringent diet and exercise. We are fundamentally different in the way we react to food and exercise and He is older than me by about 20 years!

Look we are not all the same. We do not all react the same to diet and exercise. Researching this is all I'm calling for.

As you age your methabolism slows down. You generate less testosterone, which contributes to making fat avaiable for Energy. If you diet and work out you do burn fat, if you stay fat, you might be eating too much still. If you are 20, 2000Kcal might be a diet for you, if you are 40, it might be more than you need still.

reply to post by truthseeker1984


You want to lose weight? Try this:

Divide your meals into smaller portions and eat more often so instead of having 3 main meals a day, try and aim for 5 smaller meals.

Eat healthy, good food such as Chicken, Tuna, Pasta, Rice, Cheese, Fruit, Veg, Milk, Brown bread, Nuts, Yoghurt.

Engage in some form of intense cardio at least 3 times a day, try interval training or if you can't do that maybe go for games of football/basketball/badminton.

On the days you don't perform the cardio start weight training, split up the major muscle groups of the body.

Example workout plan:

Monday: 30 mins cardio
Tuesday: Chest/Back
Wednesday: 30 mins cardio
Thursday: Arms/Shoulders
Friday: 30 mins cardio
Saturday: Back/flexibility training i.e. stretching

Every day you do the weights workout do an abs routine at the end (look up on internet)

Example meal plan:

7:00AM - Two slices of brown toast, 3 scrambled eggs, glass of OJ

10:00AM - An apple and a handful of dry roasted peanuts

1:00PM - Chicken sandwich with lettuce, tomatoe and bacon. Glass of milk

3:00PM - Yoghurt, handful of nuts, granola bar

6:00PM - Cajun turkey breast with rice + veg

8:00PM - Glass of milk, other small snack such as a muffin

Drink plenty of water throughout the day, aim to at least get your 5 portions of veg and fruit.

Follow that routine as described and you WILL lose weight.

It reallly is that simple...

Other things can help such as take the stairs instead of the lift, do exercises at your desk (if your an office based worker), wear ankle/wrist weights, take a Boxing or martial arts class if it interests you.

Spices/herbs/sauces all help make food intersting and tasty, you just need to do a bit of research.

Hope that helps.

reply to post by Death_Kron


DK,

Thank you for that! That was actually the routine I was on until I sustained my injury (broke my patella in my left knee into three pieces and it took a long time of PT and hard work to be able to walk on it again). I am actually an instructor at a Peforming Arts Studio, and I'm always active with the students of the program. I play trombone, bass trombone, and tuba, and the workout with those horns leaves me feeling quite good once it's over. With the evidence shown in Devo's post, as well as your own suggestions, I'll have to try it all out and see what happens. I might even start a blog in this forum about my progress using the suggestions shown by both of you. Once I feel comfortable with the weight lifting again (I'm slowly getting back into it), I'll add that to my routine.

It's nice to see people being supportive of weight loss/health concerns, instead of being a complete tool about it, so kudos to you!


Peace be with you.

-truthseeker

reply to post by truthseeker1984


No problems, good luck with it my friend.

I'd also suggest swimming as it's a pretty good exercise that works all the muscles in the body without any impact on your joints, you might want to take the weight lifting easy (well at least the lower body exercises) until your knee cap has fully recovered.

If you do decide to start a blog about your program then I'd happily follow it and offer suppport/encouragement/advice.

Cheers!

Edit to add: If you followed such a routine and strictly stuck to it then every two weeks (or once a week if you desired) treat yourself to a "cheat day" i.e. you still follow the training you need to do on that day but you can eat anything, get a pizza/KFC/McDonalds/Burger King whatever you feel like.

It can actually be beneficial if you continue to train on that day as your body will utilise the sugars/fat in your workout, it's great from a psychological point of view as you have something to look forward to and it will make you feel like your not training for nothing.

Moderation is the guy and a pizza/kebab etc here and there won't kill anyone, you can die from eating too many apples!

The key is realising that a diet isn't something you go on, it's simply a change to your eating habbits. Anyone who thinks that you can't eat healthy without food being tasty has got the complete wrong idea, spices/herbs/sauces etc all make food tasty.

I could even give you a few simple recipes if you wanted, healthy recipes but tasty, U2U or post in the threads and I'll give you the ones I know.

reply to post by truthseeker1984


If i lost the use of a leg because of a break you would be seeing me doing my HIIT and weight routines in a bloody wheelchair Excuses again!

Originally posted by tommyb0y
reply to post by truthseeker1984

 

If i lost the use of a leg because of a break you would be seeing me doing my HIIT and weight routines in a bloody wheelchair

Excuses again!

No, not really excuses. It was a rather painful injury and took a long time to heal. I kept up with the change in diet portion of the program I was on, but without being able to do the exercises I was accustomed to, I ended up gaining a lot of weight back. But, baby steps.

My ex was really quite skinny. And if he didn't eat every couple of hours, he got headachey and grumpy. We ate the same meals, but he stayed thin and I didn't. When we went on holiday together, while he tucked in to snacks, I had to go without. Because if I had eaten the same as him, I would have come home like a beached whale. Similarly I have a friend who has always been slim. I spent a couple of weeks at her house and was amazed at how much she ate.
So I think there is some truth that people are built differently - and some lay down fat easier.

I MUST comment on this. The title of this thread is COMPLETE BS!!

( I am a hardcore athlete and former trainer, what follows is my personal experience with diet and exercise. Take what info you can handle and toss the rest but please don't blow it all off for you own sake).

These are effective TOOLS which is the correct word. Tools. However dieting is complete nonsense. If you really want to look, feel, and BE different than you are (read: healthier) then dieting is a bad word. A balanced diet is what is needed not diet-ing.

A healthy body is a lifestyle not an every once in a while thing to get back into your summer swim suit. You cannot just diet and then go back to what you were doing. If you are not happy with your body now then permanent changes must be made. Lifestyle must change. And the comments about eating less than the body needs (another poster) is a horrible way to diet and is very unhealthy and failure is the ultimate result.

We must give the body exactly what it needs. It can handle a little extra without any issue.

Healthy lifestyle below:

1) Forget the nonsense food pyramid and everything else you have been brainwashed to believe about diet (and dieting as well). Most of that information is intended to make someone else profit from your long term battle for health and is unnecessary.

2) Eat multiple small meals per day. Large meals with large blocks of time in between will cause your metabolism to slow down, store more fat, make you more tired and lethargic. It is also much better for your body because it does not absorb all nutrients during digestion only a percentage. Eating smaller more frequent meals is not only better for digestive health, but you gain more nutrients via increased absorption.

3) Replace at least half or more of your carbohydrate intake with more fruits, veggies, granolas, nuts, yogurts, cottage cheese etc... there are tons of healthy substitutes for carbs. Secondly, almost ALL carbohydrates that people ingest are severely modified manufactured 'foods'. They are so processed that I do not even consider them as food and neither should you. Think about what our bodies are designed to ingest. Think back thousands of years. Look even in our recent past to the 40s and 50s. You don't see lots of obese people running around because the food was more fresh, local, and unprocessed. Just keep that in mind.

4) Try NOT to cook your veggies if you can. Cooking DESTROYS the nutrients and especially the necessary living enzymes and beneficial bacterias in the food. Also attempt to find the freshest local fruits and veggies as possible. After only a few days the nutrient content in your food is 50% depleted. Most produce is already 5 days old when you see it at the store due to packaging and/or shipping. That is one reason local farmers market produce is best; another reason is the benefit to your local community keeping money circulating in your own area.

5) Limit your meat intake especially red meat and pork. I know this is where many people will have issues but the truth is these things are high in fat (mostly), hard to digest (respectively), filled with antibodies, steroids, growth hormones etc.., and in general not all that beneficial. I can just hear it now all the posters screaming about the necessary protein from meat etc...Ok, that is not all that true either. Yes meat has proteins and irons etc, but there are MUCH better ways of obtaining these dietary necessities. First meat must be digested, broken down, and separated from all the crap that is in it to get the beneficial amino acids necessary to for the proteins you body needs. You don't just absorb the proteins from the meat, its all broken down and the body uses the parts and pieces to make what it needs. You have a much better opportunity with eggs which are extremely easy for the body to digest and assimilate proteins from. Also, most people don't know but dark green veggies have TONS of amino acids, vitamins and minerals. Why do you think vegetarians are healthy. Also many animal species are herbivores or mostly herbivore including the massively muscular gorilla. Wheat grass is the king here with almost all the amino acids and minerals in one little package. One ounce is equivalent to 2.5lbs of veggies. That is pretty outstanding.

6) Your body MUST have exercise. Walking 30min a day minimum should be a goal for everyone. This is a baseline an other exercises can be substituted but the cardiovascular system needs this at minimum. Resistance training is also necessary to maintain muscle strength and tone, and is also necessary for your skeletal structures. This area can become quite detailed so I will just leave it there and answer questions relating to that. I will state the HIIT is an EXTREMELY effective way to lose weight especially, but also compress exercise periods, and gain the ability to exercise every day through shorter exercise periods and active rest.

7) Mental health is especially important as well. Stress releases cortisol which has some horrific effects when the body receives too much. These include increased body fat, immune problems, suppressed thyroid and insulin functions, decreased muscle and bone density, slower brain functioning, etc....There is a plus side to the mental aspect however. Visualization, affirmations, and meditations have a tremendously positive effect on the body in many ways. Meditation can completely counteract all symptoms one might see from high cortisol levels. Visualization is an unbelievably FANTASTIC tool for weight loss, endurance, strength, and overall athletic performance. Olympic athletes and professional athletes both use visualizations and affirmations in their training routines. It is very effective. There is plenty of scientific studies on the benefits you may look up as well as a ton of techniques to try for yourself.

Please discuss further for everyones sake.

reply to post by Death_Kron


That's pretty good advice, but I personally decided to stay away from handing out advice in this thread.

I personally eat a whole food diet and on nonworkout days consume under 100g of carbs. I do not restrict calories and I routinely consume upwards of 3500 calories a day. Workout days can vary, depending on intensity (basketball, HIIT, strength lifting, metabolic lifting). Generally, I lift 4 days a week and play basketball 4-5. But that's me. Everyone is different; however, I incorporate these aspects into programs I design for clients (what few I've had).

I think it's also worth touching on a question that someone posted:

"Why are skinny people not fat?"

Ectomorphs, as skinny people are often labeled, have a particularly hard time gaining weight, both lean and fat mass. A common answer is...Genetics. And while this is true, the next that follows is not. They don't have "fast metabolisms".

They simply have genetic expressions that inhibit fat deposition. An example would be increased insulin sensitivity in the liver and muscles. This would allow for less insulin needed to get the job done, resulting in less stored fat. Another one...lipoprotein lipase. It's an enzyme that is consider the "gatekeeper" of fat. Women have lots of these little guys around their hips and buttocks and thighs. If genetic expressions dampen LPL activity in fat cells...you won't get fat.

Skinny people aren't hungry because they have an abundance of energy that is readily available at all times. Fat people, conversely, store fuel instead of burning it...causing hyperphagia.

Because of an abundane of fuel, skinny people tend to be more active. The body reacts to this constant supply of energy by increasing thermogenesis and involuntary muscle movements.