America Rising.... New Republican ad ... A MUST WATCH!!!!

Originally posted by tyranny22
Powerful video.

If the Republicans are ever going to lift their stiff bones from out of the ashes, they're going to have to get real with America again. Stop pushing jobs overseas. Stop nation building other countries if you want to save taxpayer's money. Get some REAL politics and policies.

First of all, i'm genuine in my interest with these questions to you.

Would you explain your viewpoint on those two topics:

Why you believe it is Republicans who are pushing jobs overseas? How are they doing this?

In what way is it that you see Republicans, but not Democrats, nation building overseas?

Thank you.

reply to post by joechip


Did Bush have a hand in creating the boondoggle that was TARP? Absolutely! And I have not denied that. But, who really controls the purse strings? The Congress. And, in this case, the Democrat controlled Congress.

The final bill, authorizing the Troubled Asset purchases and other non-productive maneuvers and slight of hand tricks, was authored by 245 Democrats and 30 Republicans.

Could Bush call it "his plan"? Sure, it happens any time the Executive branch and the Legislative branch are from opposing parties. Could Patrick Kennedy, the Democrat sponsor of the bill, call it his plan? Sure, and it would be a more factual statement, even though a Republican President and cabinet implemented it.

Your insistence that because Bush said it was his, makes it so, is flawed. Besides, for 8 years, I recall Democrats (intentionally used as a generalizing term as that seems to be the fad, in this thread) continuously spouting off about how "dumb", "stupid" and "ignorant" Bush was. If so, how could he have come up with such a complicated financial plan of action? Can't have it both ways now!

Also, the President can come up with all the "plans" he wants to, but they can only come to fruition, if and when the Senate approves and delineates the funding. This is easily understandable if you read the text of the bill, or more simply, the summary:

Section 101 - Authorizes the Secretary of the Treasury...Directs the Secretary...Authorizes the Secretary...Directs the Secretary

Section 102 - Requires the Secretary...Establishes the Troubled Assets Insurance Financing Fund

Section 104 - Establishes the Financial Stability Oversight Board

www.govtrack.us...

And the same directives and requirements continue throughout the bill, written by 245 Democrats and 30 Republicans.

To address the rest of your post:

TARP II - 2009 - Obama Admin

"We Voted for You" - As in the collective, i.e. We the voters. The country is so evenly split, ideologically, there is no way Obama was elected without votes from disgruntled, middle-right, Republicans and Independents. Thankfully, many like myself and you, voted for alternative party, fiscally conservative candidates, which took additional votes away from that clown McCain.

"No more Taxes" - As in new taxes. Surely you don't disagree with that plea. We are overtaxed.

"No more Spending" - Don't you think the spending is out of control?

Although, I really fail to see how you refer to those as "lies".

The implication that Democrats exclusively engage in "back-room deals, payoffs, blatant and shameless bribes."

Was the promise made that Pelosi would lead the "most ethical" Congress? You seem to concede, by your use of the word "exclusively", that Democrats do engage in those things. Doing so, after all of the "hope" and "change" speeches, is disgusting. There has been no change and there is less hope today, than there was in November 2008. Surely, you can see that.

As far as the video being labeled as a "Republican Ad"... When I first posted the video in my thread, back in January, I looked into its origination. Though it may now have been hijacked by the Republican party, I didn't find that as its original intent. It seemed to have been created by an individual, who went into "internet seclusion" after receiving multiple threats for posting it to Youtube.

Coupled with the similarly styled video addressing Republicans, which I posted on page 2 of my thread, it really appears to be more along the lines of a Tea Party ad. But, people will take it for what they will and, using your term, "interpret" it to mean whatever they will. No ones' mind will be changed, regardless of the amount of energy expended to attempt that change.

Finally, "We the People" have been lied to and screwed by the same elitist tactics, from both parties. The only way to begin to stop it, is to vote out every incumbent. Period. No exceptions.

[edit on 5-9-2010 by WTFover]

I hesitate to say that the GOP actually put this video together, it seems so poorly made. I prefer an actual GOP ad:



I don't agree with them, I'm not going to vote for them but I'll be damned if I didn't stop and think, "Yeah! They've got the right idea!"

Propaganda at its finest.

Edit: First video link, sorry.

[edit on 5-9-2010 by links234]

reply to post by WTFover


I will concede that this is apparently NOT a Republican ad. As in, an ad made or sponsored by the NRC. However, The title thread does give one that impression. As such lie #7 is mere speculation on my part. The creator(s) could actually be disgruntled former Obama supporters, though that remains unlikely. Nevertheless, I withdraw it.

As far as the Bush administration taking credit for the TARP plan, but that being untrue because Congress voted to fund the thing, NO, NO, NO. That's an example of denying evidence out of hand, (the man's own words) apparently for no other reason than your ardent wish that it weren't so. Produce a preponderance of examples where the executive branch (particularly the Bush administration) takes credit for the Legislative plans while being ideologically opposed to them. Bush's own track record shows no hesitation to use the veto, and abuse the practice of "signing statements" to undermine the legislative plans he has disagreed with. Yes, Congressional Democrats do tend to try and work with Republican administrations more than when the situation is reversed. By your logic, that would leave the Republicans perpetually blameless.

I suppose I could concede (this not really being a "Republican ad) that "No more taxes. No more spending." aren't literally lies, but rather a call for No more taxes and spending, but I cannot shake the impression every time I watch the video that the implication is 'if you vote Republican, you'll get, no more taxes and no more spending." That, my friend, is a lie.

I find your defense of this ad strange, to say the least, if indeed you have, as I have, disdained all identification with the two major political parties. IF the ad had merely had an anti-incumbent message, (or better yet a third-party message) opposed to a republican slant, many of its assertions would be inarguable. That is not what we see here. What we see here is propaganda.

When I worked on Nader's 2000 campaign, we visited both Republican and Democrat headquarters with mops and brooms (and local TV crews!) with a clear message: Both majors parties are corrupt and corporately owned. They both need to clean house or begone. Begone, foul Republicrats! This ad does nothing but reinforce the mistaken notion that voting one party out in favor of the other will get you any "change." The only change the average person will see is the change left in their pockets.

edit for grammar.

[edit on 6-9-2010 by joechip]

reply to post by jaynkeel


If it wasn't so factually incorrect and blatant propaganda I might be swayed into the dramatics.

I love how most Politically-minded Americans have "selective memory" when it comes to their governments.

Yes, Obama is a SEVERE disappointment. He's betrayed an entire generation and screwed over the American people big time.

But he's done nothing that Bush hadn't done.

Where is all the criticism of what Bush did? Why doesn't it mention Bush threatening troops on the streets unless his wishes were carried out? Why not mention the fact that it was BUSH who pushed the Patriot Act into existence? TARP, who started that ball rolling? Who ignored the need for regulation? Who didn't see a coming economic collapse given all their experts and thinktanks?

You want to discuss freedom? That cannot be done until Americans wake the f up and realise that BOTH PARTIES ARE MANIFESTATIONS OF THE SAME MONSTER.

But you'll keep following their bidding and arguing amongst yourselves over inconsequential details, and they'll carry on selling your country to the highest corporate banking bidders, whether it's a Democrat or a Republican president in that mansion.

Send a CLEAR message. Don't vote, protest. Create a third party. Build from scratch and destroy this monopoly on your freedom.

If you don't, one day you'll look back on this opportunity and weep at the damage you ALL did to your own nation through apathy and pathetic in-fighting.

Originally posted by detachedindividual
But he's done nothing that Bush hadn't done.

Where is all the criticism of what Bush did?

That is what I see as the main point of the video. Bush and minions ignored the will of the people, so they were replaced by Obama and his, with all of the promises of hope and change. And, like you said, it has just been more of the same. So, guess what, a new group should get a chance. Until someone can get it right.

Don't vote, protest.

That is definitely not the answer. How else can the bad be weeded out? They are not just going to leave on their own, having seen the error of their ways.

reply to post by twogunstommy


Thought I would post both the videos. The one that calls out the Repubs also.

America Rising Video An Open Letter to Democrats

America Rising 2: An Open Letter to the Republican Party

The ads are remarkable when viewed one after the other. Notice anything different? In tone and substance? It's like they only made the republican one so they could make a dubious claim of independence from the republicans. Their only complaint with the Republican party seems to be a weak annoyance at being ignored.
No holding the GOP responsible for their eight years (ok, six if you want to be a stickler) of irresponsible spending, cronyism, corruption, unconstitutional overreach, unnecessary war, aggressive attack on civil liberties, etc.
No mention whatsoever of the recent past record of both the republican congress or administration.
NO video images at all.
I take back what I said earlier. These ARE republican ads, as there is no longer any real tea party. It's been co-opted by The Republican party. One big con. I'm glad you posted the second ad. It really puts the first one in perspective.

reply to post by joechip


Yeah, whoever created the two left much to be desired on the second one.

I would have pointed to Bush being exactly the same as the current Admin in their ways.

BUT, supposedly the Republicans were all about the Republic, the Constitution and fiscal responsibility.

I do admit the makers should have made the second much stronger.

Though it did tell the Republicans they would destroy the party if they did not go back to their roots.

Originally posted by WTFover

Originally posted by detachedindividual
But he's done nothing that Bush hadn't done.

Where is all the criticism of what Bush did?

That is what I see as the main point of the video. Bush and minions ignored the will of the people, so they were replaced by Obama and his, with all of the promises of hope and change. And, like you said, it has just been more of the same. So, guess what, a new group should get a chance. Until someone can get it right.

Don't vote, protest.

That is definitely not the answer. How else can the bad be weeded out? They are not just going to leave on their own, having seen the error of their ways.

So what happens then?
You vote one or the other back in, and you have the same structure, the same departments, the same staff, the same corporate backers, the same commissions, the same advisers, the same policies, the same actions and the same failures.

The very definition of Insanity is completing the same action again and again while expecting a different result.

Just as happened with Bush going out and Obama coming in, the same will happen again. If the last two years has shown us anything it has PROVEN that it makes absolutely no difference which face represents your government, policy is decided elsewhere.

What do you really expect to change through voting?

Whereas, not voting will send a clear message. Not to your government, but to the wider public. It will encourage debate, it will force change in the political scene through the mounds of reports and studies and data produced from it. It will make those who DID vote consider their reasons and the validity of their vote. It will force those who never vote to consider why they didn't and align themselves with a political thought for once in their sorry lives.

It may seem like a pointless exercise on the face of it, but consider either option.
Voting will change nothing, as evidenced by your current administration.
Not voting in massive numbers will at the very least cause incredible debate and rouse millions into considering their vote and how your country is run.

I have long thought that a third (or fourth, or fifth) party is the way forward. And that will not happen unless the people are mobilized into really thinking about their current political scene and how polluted and incestuous it is.

That will not happen while you all continue to vote right or left while expecting different results; the very definition of insanity.

Some more bull from the republicratic party sad thing is it must have fired up the dupes to once again vote and think it matters.

reply to post by detachedindividual


I do not vote for anyone with a D or R following their name. And haven't for some time. That, my friend, would send a stronger message, if more people would seriously educate themselves on the alternative party candidates or Independents.

Excellent!

Sure gets to the point, huh?

Fantastic!

Originally posted by joechip
No holding the GOP responsible for their eight years (ok, six if you want to be a stickler) of irresponsible spending, cronyism, corruption, unconstitutional overreach, unnecessary war, aggressive attack on civil liberties, etc.
No mention whatsoever of the recent past record of both the republican congress or administration.

Here we go again. You do know Bush has been gone for near two years now, right? And Republican control of either house of Congress has been gone for near 4 years now, right?

The videos address the here and now, not the then and there. Jesus Christ on a pony! Don't you people have anything better to run on than "We're Not Bush!" The Democrats are going to have to accept some responsibility at some point. This is really getting ridiculous.

Edit spelling

[edit on 7-9-2010 by WTFover]

reply to post by WTFover


My point was not that the Democrats are any better, but that this ad's intention is to elect more Republicans, who also aren't any better. I would argue that they were worse. How short-term a memory are you saying we should have? This has nothing to do with "we're not Bush." Everything to do with my firm conviction that part of the political con going on is the divided executive/legislative being engineered. It's a way for both parties to remain ultimately unaccountable for anything.

And that it is disingenuous propaganda. Again, I wonder how you can support an ad campaign that will, if effective, elect more Republicans, ensure that the puppet-show of D. v. R. remains compelling and neither party's stated ideals are ever realized or even attempted in good faith. When the parties do come together in that atmosphere, you can be sure the only agenda being furthered is a corporate one.

edit to add: I have clearly identified myself several times as a long-time third party voter. For you to attempt to characterize my arguments as Democratic talking points reminds me why I didn't want to debate you in the first place. Nothing good can come of this exchange. You either don't listen or purposefully mis-characterize what you can't refute. Nuff said.

[edit on 8-9-2010 by joechip]