2012: what do we actually know?

Originally posted by stereologist
reply to post by TheIrvy

 

Another claim is a pole shift. There is extensive evidence in the geology against such an event happening. TPWs are slow and take million of years, and have not occurred in 200My.

Please stop wheeling out this one study as evidence against poleshifts. It only highlights your propensity to dogmatic viewpoints. Your statement that there is 'extensive evidence in geology against such an event happening' is also patently false. If you care to back up your claim by citing the evidence, I will present at least as much evidence supporting the theory of poleshifts. The truth is there is conflicting evidence, but citing one study that indicates a date of 200My just shows your desperation to cling to your belief that pole shifts are not part of the earth's history.

Before you respond you may wish to read the following article that appeared in New Scientist recently:

New Scientist Article

So, it seems the evidence is not as clear cut as you presented it to be... This is yet another example of the truly dangerous perpetuation of scientific dogma - the real problem with science today - which we should all be deeply concerned about... the presentation of scientific theories as scientific facts.

Anyway, I don't believe in most of the theories about 2012. Only the Timewave one has value.
My thread was against debunkers and skeptics thinking they can assure lots of people that nothing significant is going to happen on a certain date, because that means knowing the future...
And because they think science is the perfect answer for every single thing...

They will lose most of their life experiences thinking they mean nothing...

reply to post by spinalremain

The difference between you and I is that I wouldn't leave town because History channel told me that the Mayans predicted I would be punched in the face.

Well said. I couldn't have summed up the issue as well as you did in this single sentence.

reply to post by vital_revolutionary


Obviously you never read the article. Obvious you never checked out the references in the article.

I use a few well chosen articles to highlight issues.

Your statement that there is 'extensive evidence in geology against such an event happening' is also patently false.

Your claim here is patently false. It reveals a lack of understanding of even basic geology.

And you think you can post any evidence supporting pole shifts. I'm giggling already at your hilarious gesture.

It's time to dope slap yourself. You posted a link to an article on magnetic reversals, not pole shifts. I should be hearing the dope slap right about .... now.

the presentation of scientific theories as scientific facts.

This sentence shows that you do not understand the difference between fact and theory in science.

Good luck to you.

reply to post by Zagari


You either have a very poor understanding of other people's positions or are backing off of your original position. I think it both.

One of the things scientists began to learn is that not everything is knowable. That is true even in mathematics which can be reduced to so-called ideal situations. So no, science is not the perfect answer to everything. But what it can do for us is to help us understand the world about us.

So now you are withdrawing your belief in 2012 to what you call Timewave. And you call it a theory.

Can you provide us with a succinct statement of timewave and what it means for 2012?

reply to post by stereologist


From my understanding Timewave Zero depicts a graph that pin points dates on which Novelty ( Technological progress, Interconnectedness, Global consciousness, synchronicities - lk Evasius said ) is rising or when there is more habit than novelty or when there are tension periods.

The percentuality and the amount of change is always rising, doubling , because , for example, from late 2010 to 2012 the Timewave restarts and we will experience in those 2 years the same amount of change we got in all of history...
Than, all over again, in a month, a week, a day, 6 hours, one minute, a few seconds and than it becomes inifinte...Singularity, no longer measurable.

2012 would be at point zero, the ultimate synchronicity, the point where human interconnectdness becomes infinite and when a technological singularity is MORE LIKELY to happen.
- OR- when a contact with another, foreign , culture is more likely to happen because of interferences between the Timewaves of those 2 cultures that will bring them to inevitably meet at some point.
All the dates on Timewave indicated by big lows are the dates when Progress, Significant Events are MORE LIKELY to happen, are allowed to happen, when our choices will determine much of the future, what comes next is determined by actions taken on novelty points.

Evasius also said that there are interferences between two timewaves, and those interferences are the cause of the novelty points being on those specific dates, because the cause and the trigger of past events is found in the future, from here the definition of Attractor given to whatever happens/ reaches us on point Zero...

Another important part of Timewave is that certain events have a certain shape ( or call it graph sequence ) on the graph and when that shape comes back in the future the historical event is repeated or there is something that immediately recals that same past situation.
From here, the possibility to have a glimpse of the future looking to the past.

I know is rather complicated, but , hey, I'm 20, I'm a medium level student but I understood most of it.

In few words, for 2012 it means either contact with aliens/ creatures that were thought Gods in the past/ even other people from other universes
OR Technological Singularity
OR real birth of free will, now non existing...From that point we won't have historical events to compare with events post 2012...

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Zagari]

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Zagari]

[edit on 3-9-2010 by Zagari]

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[edit on 3-9-2010 by Zagari]

reply to post by Zagari

Timewave Zero depicts a graph that pin points dates on which Novelty ( Technological progress, Interconnectedness, Global consciousness, synchronicities - lk Evasius said ) is rising or when there is more habit than novelty or when there are tension periods.

The use of a graph appears to imply that this quantity which you call novelty is a measurable quantity.

How is novelty measured? Where does this graph come from? Somehow it must be connected to the time since it is plotted against time. Is the function defined somewhere? Is it explicitly written as f(t)?

reply to post by stereologist


More than connected to time, I would say, it is connected to history.
If you take for example October 26 2009, the graph will take you directly to July 14 1942 and early 1811.
It also correlates with some date I don't know precisely, 1600 something.

But why? Because they have the same topic...Something about space/technology and something about jews in danger...
There is also the word " secret " in it, Manhattan Project and Holocaust were kept secret at the time.

November 2010 point of extreme novelty to January 2011 will most likely correlate with October 26 2009 because every jump into novelty is correlated with the other preceding big jump.


Every date of this year wil correlate to a specific date of the past when that specific topic comes back again.

Timewave is the dna of history, is like a alphabet. Such sequence of the graph means and indicates that specific kind of event/date.
Another one will indicate another specific event/ date.

FROM HERE the possibility to look at the past event and EXPECT A SIMILAR EVENT.

What it is important is that between October 21 2010 and January 17 2011 we will see events that we won't be able to correlate with any historical event so far, the situation will be BRAND NEW, something humanity has never faced.
By late 2012 we will forever detouch by historical events and the events in the future, forever, will not correlate anymore with the past, with events we know.
It is a infinite jump into the unknown, into events that are brand new.

[edit on 4-9-2010 by Zagari]

Zagari you seem to be ignoring my response to your reply to me. I raised some pretty interesting points and I am still waiting for your response.

I should point out if it has not already been mentioned that 2012 is not coming until 2017. Why? Because some dumb ass that was calculating the Julian calender screwed up. They miscalculated by 5 years. Thus, we are 5 years behind reality. It is now 2005. History buffs can confirm. I learned this disturbing fact in university.

So I guess we'll all have to wait until 2017 for the end of the world.

reply to post by Methos777


What are you talking about?
We should be in a year between 2013 and 2018 now...
Because Jesus was born between 3BC and 7BC...

And there's more, you have to add 13 days to every date to discover the real date of today, that would be September 17 2013 or 2018...

----

What you learnt in university? What they told you about the real year and day we should be?
Why do you say 2005? I think its wrong...
ANYWAY, please tell me because I find it extremely interesting since days ago I researched the same thing...

[edit on 4-9-2010 by Zagari]

reply to post by Dilligaf28


Those dates were experimental shifting of the end date...
I still think those specific events I gave on June 23 did happen, and June 23 is the direct consequence of that thread I made about April 20...

I recognize I was wrong about the July economic collapse, because in that moment I was experimenting the October 28 2011 end date of Timewave, shfited as I was requested to see what results I would have got.
Than I abandoned the possibility that Timewave ends on October 28 2011.

I was asked by people through messages to see what results I would have got with those dates...

NOTE: Those dates ARE NOT the REAL dates of Timewave...
You should follow Evasius threads if you want the ORIGINAL dates.
I'm used to experiment.

reply to post by Methos777


The only change is the name of the year...The numbers change.
2012 DOES come in 2 years.

reply to post by Methos777


The start of the Julian calendar is not the issue here. The issue is the correlation function between the Mayan Haab calendar and the Gregorian calendar. The correlation commonly in use is known as the CMT correlation. That correlation is independent of the start time of either calendar.

To answer the thread title:

We know that most of the so called prophecies are total hogwash. Planet X, polar shifts happening super fast, galactic alignment (lol), and so on are nothing but baseless statements by people who want to make $$$ selling books and DVDs. Every single one has been debunked multiple times! And the basis of it all, the Mayan calendar, doesn't just stop..it just enters a new phase. Just like we do every January 1st.

As for the people saying we see a "culmination of bad things happening" like the economic crisis, the gulf oil spill, wars...get a grip. Things like that happen all the time. The economic crisis at the beginning of the last century was worse than the one we have today, we had worse wars (WW1+2), and natural catastrophes have been happening for a long time now. If you think the gulf oil spill is so special, read up on Nigeria!

This whole paranoia is laughable.

And then there's the people who come up with the craziest of theories like "time shifts" or "dimensional changes" that lack any scientific fact. You might just as well say snakes can talk...oh...wait!!

Now I get it, 2012 is like a new age religion

reply to post by MrXYZ


you forgot something, quakes, volcano, tsunami etc something we can not control

Originally posted by stereologist
reply to post by Zagari

 

You either have a very poor understanding of other people's positions

Pot calling the kettle black???

Originally posted by lestweforget
reply to post by Zagari

 

Yeah cant agree more mate, more and more people are slowly
coming out of their cocoon and these poeple will hopefully benefit
from their awareness. There is just too much expected to happen
at thesame time.

Various cultures calenders culminating, Mayan, Chinese etc.

The galactic alignment, the suns alignment with centre of galaxy

The procession of the equinox to the thirteenth sign Ophiuchus.

The alignment of the divine cross with the terrestrial cross.

If you think all these events are false or do not culminate well,
not all of us are blessed with the same amount of discernment,
good luck!

Many calendars are created but just begin again.

The alignment already climaxed in 1998...we entered this 'bulge' in 1980 and it takes 39 years to move through it. In 2016 we will be exiting the bulge of the alignment. But still the peak, center point, was in 1998. Its a process of time...not a 'one day'.

What are you talking about with 'equinox to Ophiuchus'? Are you talking about Dec. 21st...which is not an equinox but a solstice. The winter solstice occurs in Sagittarius. The Sun is in Ophiuchus from Nov 29-Dec 16.

What Chinese calendar ends in 2012?

I would like for those that believe in 'prophecies' to give me one good reason why our future is set in stone?

By who? By what? What reasons?

What point would there be of a 'date' that would over ride natural processes?

The world could end tomorrow....wouldnt that blow 2012 out of the water!

Im sure somewhere there is a prediction though, that the world will end tomorrow...oh yeah, I forgot...there is a thread that the rapture is to occur this week I think.

I believe the future is malleable, and not set in stone.


Edit to add...yes there has been changes in our history, and history repeats itself...but to give a date of one particular day for history to repeat itself is just dangerous thinking to me. One of the biggest guru's for 2012 told me 2 years ago that I would be wasting my time by going back to school since I should be focusing on 2012....this is the kind of advice that some of these people are giving and taking. This was when I broke away from a great group of people that I enjoyed talking philosophy things with because I disagreed of advising anyone to just stop working on progression in this human life, such as continuing an education in this present time. Happily, I have my associates now and just started on my Bachelors...thank goodness I can stand on my own two feet and not follow what another persons says I should do.

Majoring in Psychology Im thinking there will be some people that are going to need some help right about the time Ill be graduating....help in understanding why the world is still the kind of world that they were hoping to escape from.

I think many of these people think or wish for the world and this existence to get a quick fix...and I think this idea of thinking is along the same lines of religions that think God will come fix our wrongs we have created here.

I think the work here on Earth is just beginning...and the ones hoping for this big change are going to be really disappointed that there was no quick fix and this is going to take actual work for this sphere to become what it is to become and WE are going to be the ones to have to find the way to do that.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


The only prophecies that I believe in are the Hopi and other Native American prophecies like the Cherokee. Cherokee foretell the coming and going of America.