Am I losing my Religion?

Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
reply to post by LoneGunMan

 

The No true Scotsman Fallacy, "Don't listen to that guy, he wasn't a real Christian"

You're barking up the wrong tree. I went to a Pentecostal church and even spoke in tongues.

The reason faith crumbles so easily is because it is a belief that isn't based on evidence, it is ignorance or indoctrination based.

No you have me all wrong. I am saying don't listen because you are a true Christian. The fact that you went to a pentecostal church and spoke tongues tells me you fell for the Christian control hook line and sinker. I believe most Christians can lose faith as easy as visiting a childrens burn ward.

Its the religion itself that is holding yourself from being truly a spiritually driven being instead of one that is driven by EGO.

I have never in my life been religious or not seen it for what it is. Since I was a very young child I have been very sensitive...I knew then that Christianity was a way of explaining spirit to those that would not be able to understand beyond the capacity of a childish story tale. Sorry but its the way it is.

Just as the courts do not dispense much justice religion is bereft of spirituality.

Try reading just a few of the spiritual masters of the times. Eckart Tolle "The Power of Now" is a very good start. When you fully understand what every facet of ego is you then will free yourself enough to let God back in.

If you meditate enough you will find God. First though you must understand ego completely.



[edit on 28-8-2010 by LoneGunMan]

reply to post by AidanK


Give up the Roman Catholic church... It is Polotics...

You (The Soul) are the offspring of God then You are a Part of God...

Read... "The Gospel of Thomas".

56. Jesus said,

“Whoever has come
to understand the World
has found only a corpse,

and whoever has found a corpse
is superior to the World.”

The answers are in you as well as outside you.

Don't be a victum of Brain washing by Roman Doctrine...

It is Impossible for the Roman Catholic church to give you the "GIFT" of LIFE...

[edit on 29-8-2010 by The Matrix Traveller]

reply to post by LoneGunMan

Try reading just a few of the spiritual masters of the times.

Spiritual implies that there is a spirit or something supernatural at work, which is no different than the various gods, ghosts and goblins of other superstitious folklore and religious myth. The difference is in religion you take marching orders from a hierarchy, and people who break away from that to be "spiritual" are merely perusing faith individually.

While I applaud those that break away from religion I think they need to apply basic skepticism to their own personal spirituality. For a long time after I stopped being a Christian I collected beliefs from a myriad of sources, a little Buddhism here, some of Jesus there, a Norse legend or two, some new age talk of energy - my beliefs were a mish-mosh because those ideas appealed to me, they, as I have heard others stuck in that position, "resonated". But you can't go just by what feels right or sounds good or offers comfort, otherwise you are identical to those still blindly locked in the religion.

I do believe that there is deep emotion in the human mind, there is a deep part of our consciousness we have termed the soul or spirit. In that sense I could be construed as spiritual, but in the supernatural or paranormal sense I reject the idea outright.

We must not be afraid to question our ideas and what merit they possess. Faith is a belief that is not based on evidence and is therefore bankrupt of any real merit. Sure it can offer comfort and fill in gaps in our knowledge but it doesn't get us closer to the truth like following the evidence does.

The OP shouldn't be afraid to give up their religious faith.

My friend, you have entered the period of faith we Christians call "The Long Dark Night of the Soul." This is one of the most written about subjects in our faith, and is in fact the title of an ancient Christian book of spriitual reflections. UNDERSTAND THIS: 2 categories are involved in your struggle -- do not confuse the two..... 1. The Object of our faith: Jesus of Nazareth.....2. the Method of one's faith. The second category is the one we question most often (and should)...how is it that my method of communicating with God is failing? Yours is Catholicism. The deep questioning of that crisis of questioning your method usually drives one to question the reliability of category one, Jesus Christ. The irony of this dilemma is that it is a necessary part of spiritual maturing. It is a kind of desert survival school - a stripping away (by God) of extraeneous material of your soul. And it is accomplished only by inner suffering. And once you wake up to this new process, you will likely endure it the rest of your life.
I was raised a Catholic, and was an evangelical for many years unitl I realized the methods of faith are very often confused with the object of faith -- Jesus of Nazareth. He is who He said he is, and cannot change -- and the Resurrection proves it and everything He ever said. Now at this point, you need confirmation from God that He is who He says he is -- but your experience reinforces that He appears ambivalent, because He allows such suffering. The illusions of your method are being stripped away, and in a sense are being shown how ancillary they are to the real relationship you already have with God.
John Bunyan's "Pilgrim's Progress" is a classic speaking of this very same experience. If you hunger and thirst for truth, you will have the inner motivation to get answers. As far as suffering goes, understand this -- there is NO ANSWER for human suffering this side of heaven. It is life's greatest mystery. But unlike the reactionary atheists and agnostics that frequent this forum, at least the Christian faith (in its essence) provides direction toward Love - their worldview provides nothing but the self. Since I began my Long Dark Night 20 years ago, I have questioned most everything about God and faith, and despite the hurt and real suffering, I know without a doubt that Jesus is the only begotten Son of God. He died, rose from the dead, is Himself the Creator of all that is, and will return some day to give true peace to the world...but mostly, the REAL LOVE we all desire and crave.
Don't give up the journey. It hurts, no doubt. God is Who He says he is. Stand tall and be proud to a Christian. After all, it's only Love we're after.

I would say that if the god you have been brought up to belive in is to return, He should understand and forgive u for losing faith due to the circumstanses,

Id say still pray and hope but dont expect any miracles

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


I don't believe in a creator because I read some nifty books.

I went down the long road of the Shaman...how I got there was a crooked path it meandered back and forth. At one time I was a church consultant and visited hundreds of churches and meant every kind of Pastor, Minister and Priests. I am an ordained Minister myself I am not of any faith or church I am ordained so that I can legally Marry people that are like me. Shamans, healers some are what you would call witches.

I have seen it all, but would not have began my path except I have had a series of personal miracles and walked in a darkness of the soul for many years. It took getting "Godsmacked" for so many years I grew to have a "knowing" of God. The events I will not cheapen to try and change you or your path for that is yours. A person cannot understand something fully until they lived it.

The point being is the OP is in distress and you are not helping. If the OP has lost faith in religion why would you even think about trying to make sure the OP loses faith in God because you have a chip on your shoulder and instead of hearing your own personal "Godsmacks" in life and failed the test does not mean you should spoil this persons chance in this lifetime to finally become close with God.

Doing what you are doing is one of the cruelest and heartlessly thoughtless deeds a human can do to another. Shame on you. :shk:

Originally posted by MagickWithoutTears
I would say that if the god you have been brought up to belive in is to return, He should understand and forgive u for losing faith due to the circumstanses,

Id say still pray and hope but dont expect any miracles

God has never left...

It is the "Son of MAN" or The "MAN CHILD" (See The Revelation of Jesus Christ) wich was said to be returning..... which already has....


From "The Gospel of Thomas"... Quote;

51. His disciple said to Him (Jesus),

“When will the repose of the dead come about,

and when will the New World come?”

He said to them,

“What you look forward to
has already come,
but you do Not recognise it.”

what the hell is spiritauality anyways?
i live everyday free of prayers and god and all that bs.
i feel as happy as i can,and yet,i can get even happier.
i dont understand why people say that if you have no religion youre lost in this world.Maybe people dont NEED religion to feel guidance.My guidance is my own brain.Thats why you were born with a brain,to use it. Believe in your ghosts if you want,just stop telling people they will go to hell if they don't believe in anything,because you're not omnisapient, and neither is your god,as he can't even speak to you in a direct way.

Originally posted by metodex
what the hell is spiritauality anyways?
i live everyday free of prayers and god and all that bs.
i feel as happy as i can,and yet,i can get even happier.
i dont understand why people say that if you have no religion youre lost in this world.Maybe people dont NEED religion to feel guidance.My guidance is my own brain.Thats why you were born with a brain,to use it. Believe in your ghosts if you want,just stop telling people they will go to hell if they don't believe in anything,because you're not omnisapient, and neither is your god,as he can't even speak to you in a direct way.

Spirituality is the entity operating your meat computer...the brain.

It is that thing deep inside yourself that if you slow down and listen, and feel you can get a glimpse. The path to true spirit takes a long time and you may not be ready as of yet.

When the student is ready the teacher will come. this teacher is not human most times. It is often life itself that will bring you to spirituality.

You dont want religion for guidance. God has no room for organized religion that is the realm of man.

"I edited this out because I see you are from Venezuela and English may not be you first language."

P.S. I just read your post again and had to add. How are you going to learn anything about the souls journey by God speaking to you in English or any human language? Any person can do that. God speaks to you in a different way that you have to learn to recognize.



[edit on 28-8-2010 by LoneGunMan]

reply to post by metodex


You said.... quote;

My guidance is my own brain.Thats why you were born with a brain,to use it.

It is Not your brain that is "Aware" of anything....

There isn't a single component of your Anotomy which knows "YOU".

Is your "hand" or "foot" Aware of YOU ???

Perhaps you meant it is "AWRENESS" that guides you...

Originally posted by AidanK
I have almost stopped praying for anything. I no longer believe that anyone is listening. I have always been taught that God answers ALL prayers, even if we might not like the answer but I must say that why MUST the answer ALWAYS be NO??

I guess I'm about at my breaking point and floundering for help. Can anyone provide any advice here? Many thanks to you all.

First, it sounds to me like you put yourself in the position of "victim" instead of the position of "ruler". In other words, I envision you saying in desperation "Look what _____ did/happened to me!" instead of "Look at what I created!" from a place of strength and internal knowledge.

We keep reliving those kind of experiences over and over in different forms with different faces until we learn the lesson of that experience. If you never learn that lesson . . . you will have that type of experience your entire life.

So ask yourself, "What does this experience teach me about myself and life?" I have a feeling I know what one of those answers is already, but YOU need to learn it for yourself. You will be able to see it better once you step out of the "victim" shoes and step into the "victor" shoes. (hint)

Second, You may (or may not) find benefit in this WEBSITE.
It is a religion of a completely different kind. It focuses on you learning your own truth and making up your own mind. You do your own research through books, movies and music recommended with the intention of planting seeds. There is no telling/commanding you what to think or feel, just you listening to what resonates with yourself to build your own direct relationship with God. (a couple pages are still being updated.)

reply to post by LoneGunMan

If the OP has lost faith in religion why would you even think about trying to make sure the OP loses faith in God

I'm not trying to make sure the OP loses their faith I'm trying to make sure they know it is OKAY to do so. There is a stigma attached to being an agnostic or atheist (more the latter than former). In many believers who begin to doubt what they were told there is a fear that if they let go of religion or God they will lose all hope. I'm trying to explain to this person that it is more a liberating experience than one that creates hopelessness.

does not mean you should spoil this persons chance in this lifetime to finally become close with God.

Maybe I didn't make this clear but I don't think there is a God to get close to. There certainly isn't evidence to suggest a God let alone which God out of the thousands we humans have worshiped is the correct one. I could just as easily turn around and say "Don't let this person spoil their one chance to be free of blind faith in a deity for which there is no evidence" but no, I didn't say that.

The OP is free to believe whatever they want. I just wanted to let them know that it is okay to let go if they no longer have a reason to believe and that letting go of religion is a good thing.

I think you're blowing what I said all out of proportion - You can re-read my response, the last thing I said was:

Feel free to lose religion, just don't lose hope. Where is the cruelty in that? When did I say that he should give up God?

Hello. I'm muslim, and although we differ on some key theological issues, our faiths agree on much--above all, we believe in the same God.

Yes, there's so much corruption and misery in the world. And, I'm sorry for your mother and your own personal difficulties. However, there is also much good in the world--there are people trying to make it a better place. They just don't get the attention that the criminals do. Even in your own life, I'm sure there is something you can look at right now that makes you smile, something that you're grateful for, some meaning in your life that no one else has.

You said you doubt anyone's listening to your prayers. This is a test of your faith. God is listening. Even as a Muslim, I believe God hears all prayers, even from non-Muslims, as long as they call upon Him ALONE. Don't stop praying. God loves it when we call upon Him. Everyone has good times and bad times in life. God created good and evil with purpose. Every moment will direct us all to a greater purpose in life. We have to trust God, and strive to do good, hoping in His Favor in the next phase of our lives.

I know it's easy for someone to simply say this to a stranger online, but I've personally been going through some hard times (within my family and also regarding my financial future). I've also been reading so much on the news about islamophobia, and just yesterday someone showed me a clip of a Mexican drug cartel member beheading a rival member. So, I've felt the same things you feel. But, I try to look past all these horrible aspects of the world. I try to look at simple pleasures and the little things that give you joy. And remember, our faiths teach us both about the greater existence--the afterlife. That is where there will be ultimate justice. The criminals and oppressors of this world will surely be punished, and those of us who truly believed in God will be rewarded.

One last bit of advice. Log off ATS for a while, turn off the PC/TV, and go outside. Enjoy the weather, and see the beauty of the world--nature, people, the beauty that humanity has accomplished. Try to see all the little coincidences in your life--even the minor things--and know that God is nudging you with a little message.

You fear losing your Religion? Well, perhaps a religion is not so very important.
It is usually a thing we are taught not being given any choices as a youngster.
I am an Atheist, but that was not always the case. I did not lose my religion, I simply
closed the book on it through much investigation. May I suggest you look at this as
a journey and whatever unfolds for you will be your perception. Since we are all made
up of star dust, and since energy does not die but merely transforms...think of the Cosmos as your mother and father and that you will return to the stars.

Good luck to you on your sojourn and remember "Life is not a puzzle to be solved but a mystery to be lived"

reply to post by LoneGunMan

Hello "LoneGunMen"

I like what you wrote about the years approaching 2012.

I feel that the greedy global elites, the Bankers and Corporations have been ruling and deceiving us, that for a long time we have been living in an old model that is NOT based on some form of Spirituality or that does not respect our fellow man.

I sense you are right that in order for us to move to a better world the process we are now going through is a necessary one to reveal the evil and selfish ways that a minority elite have been manipulating us.

In a way it is a cleansing process, we have to go through this difficult period so that the majority of people will finally see that the old ways can no longer continue as it has been doing for a long time.

We are approaching a point where some pain has to be felt in order for us to say enough is enough in order for us to realize a change from our old ways is needed.

"The wheat is being separated from the chaff". That is so true - a good line that.

I agree with you entirely, you don't need religion to find God or whatever name we use to call that which is the Power of Love and Wisdom in the whole Cosmos.

Thank you kindly for your welcome.

It is ignorant to say that I am god. The source that provides, we are not it, I hope people see it, we are part of it. It's using the byproduct to make things out of light and dark, for the sake of existance. The source and us, are two different things, the source creates the energies that be, it is outside of the energies that be. For energy to exist it needs a source. God is outside the source, the provider, we are not god. There was a design before we existed, it was created by the source, then the source created creatures, this calls for inteligent design.

People call it an illusion and some like me call it "a state of being"
Perhaps there is something outside the source, another realm.
It happened before, some came here knew the powers of what it provides and made them selfs gods, posed as gods, why would humanity want to make the same mistake ?

reply to post by AidanK


Are you losing your religion? No. If you are asking us, it is already gone. You knew the answer before posting. We all look for others to back us in our positions. You thought God was backing you up until recently. Then you came to the realization that a "no" answer could possibly mean nobody's home. Living in comfort meant God approved of your life. When the road got bumpy it wasn't enough to think that God was testing you. Imagine the billions of lives that "God tests" from birth until death. Those that never experience earthly comfort. Gazillions of "no" answers. A universal penal colony.

It's lonely, it's scary. We came in alone, we will go out alone. But for the time we are here, we are not alone. We can all ask, we can all share. We can all be God-like to someone. We can give comfort to ourselves, we can give it to others. That should be enough, religion, God, faith or what have you. It's your choice. Do unto others or pray for someone else to. One of those things works for certain the other's just a umm..................... prayer.

Originally posted by Greensage

It may be time to let the TV go unnoticed and begin to look around for the smallest miracles in your World. The change in the air as the Season's pass, the smells in the air after a light autumn rain, the celebration of Life that is so abundant to us all if we seek it. It is still there, hidden away but not invisible, and you only need to whisper the name of Our Lord and he will hear you! Then you find the real Church within!

In other words: Ignorance is bliss

I just watched a Channel 4 (UK) documentary on hurricane Katrina. After the storm had passed and the survivers emerged, there was a public congregation giving thanks to their god for allowing them to survive. It's akin to a daughter thanking and praising her father after he's stopped raping her.

As an atheist, the best advice I can give you is to take a step back from everything you were taught as a child and have a long, hard think about the reasons behind the sheer quantity of different religions and why so many of them threaten some form of punishment for non-belief.

Having said that, if you really are in need of comfort, a visit to your church will probably help more than anything. But if you're after godless comfort, it may help you to know that there are MANY people feeling exactly how you are right now. Losing your religion has the potential of being the most mind-expanding event of your life. Without religion, you can question literally everything that has ever and ever will exist to any extent you like without fear of breaching your theological contract.

[edit on 29-8-2010 by GeniusSage]

reply to post by AidanK




aidenK we need to remember the devil, has his way of tricking us into believing there is no god and that there is no hope.

like positive and negative, god and the devil must exist in synchronicity. to me, god has his ways of letting the darkest natures test us into believing there is nobody listening and that nobody cares...

when in fact, if god didnt exist, and the devil did. we would all be speaking german.

Originally posted by Cobra.EXE
reply to post by AidanK

 

aidenK we need to remember the devil, has his way of tricking us into believing there is no god and that there is no hope.

like positive and negative, god and the devil must exist in synchronicity. to me, god has his ways of letting the darkest natures test us into believing there is nobody listening and that nobody cares...

when in fact, if god didnt exist, and the devil did. we would all be speaking german.

Where did you get this information?