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Originally posted by Gorman91
And if we were going to model the sears tower we would use a different form and different structure.
I am saying the WTC is a big fat tetris tower. And so a simple simulation is all that is needed.
Originally posted by VirginiaRisesYetAgain
The thickness of the concrete slabs varied from perimeter to core.
What? No they didn't. And no they don't in every single building out there
Floor construction typically consisted of 4 inches of lightweight concrete on 1-1/2-inch, 22-gauge non-composite steel deck. In the core area, slab thickness was 5 inches.
I looked back and you're right. It was Nutter who said this, and then I missed his reply to it, which was basically to back-track and pretend he already knew they varied in thickness from open floor to core, even though he clearly denied it in the quote above.
I knew I was going to get you two confused last night the way I was trying to have two conversations at once in this thread...
This theory has been around for years and I have yet to see a single demonstration of someone creating a thermite reaction just by putting a bunch of stuff together and setting it on fire like it would have been in the rubble pile. The ONLY thermite reactions I've EVER seen were all man-made mixtures lit by humans.
Being able to reproduce a principle and demonstrate its physical validity is what science depends on, and in this case you have nothing like that.
Yes, it would be. I must have confused you with Nutter again because I remember when I asked what the parameters for some simulation was based on, the naive answer I got was "physics."
Originally posted by VirginiaRisesYetAgain
I'm talking about exact column lengths, thicknesses, depths, geometrical arrangements. These are what strengths, forces, masses, etc. are calculated from. It is CRUCIAL to have accurate data, or else you will not have accurate results. Where did this data come from, that would be REQUIRED INPUT to model the WTC Towers?
Originally posted by Nutter
if a human experiment can't be compared with something that happened naturally, how does this not negate your OP experiment?
Did he have the exact ratio of materials?
I knew I was going to get you two confused last night the way I was trying to have two conversations at once in this thread...
And yet you still argued and even went so far as to accusse someone of being inebriated.
This theory has been around for years and I have yet to see a single demonstration of someone creating a thermite reaction just by putting a bunch of stuff together and setting it on fire like it would have been in the rubble pile. The ONLY thermite reactions I've EVER seen were all man-made mixtures lit by humans.
I guess wrapping rusted steel balls in aluminum foil is a precise measured mixture?
Being able to reproduce a principle and demonstrate its physical validity is what science depends on, and in this case you have nothing like that.
A grinder can be used to simulate a tower grinding itself. Ever hear of simulations? It's the only way to experiment on something that has happened naturally.
Originally posted by VirginiaRisesYetAgain
So explain why this reaction would have to be precisely measured first of all.
For example it doesn't matter what amount of acid you throw into a base, the stuff that touches will react nonetheless. The only thing you change by the "ratio" there is how much of a reaction will take place.
In the OP's case, NO such reaction took place as what was documented by FEMA, AT ALL!!
So I would sooner believe the same corrosive agents weren't present at all. If the corrosive agents were as complex as engineered nano-energetics and required that much precision to work at all, then occam's razor would tell you that this theory is no improvement whatsoever over nanothermite. Only if you can arrive at an easier and more reproducible way to recreate the corrosion will you have a better theory.
I have no idea what you are referring to, but it has nothing to do with what you're responding to. I was talking about the fact that NONE of you have ever been able to demonstrate how a thermite reaction can occur "naturally." There has been TALK of it for years but real science is not based on TALK.
If "natural thermite" reactions are possible then I don't believe it would be necessary to grind up a skyscraper to reproduce the effect. Just take the same materials, without having to destroy a skyscraper. And why do I have to post common sense like this so often when responding to you "debunkers"?
It's really not a lot to ask that you prove your theories. I will admit right now that you have a theory. There is no debate there. But whether or not it's correct, you're not going to be able to prove that to me with just words when nobody has ever demonstrated any such thing before, so I wonder why you're even still trying. Recreate it. These are basic, everyday building materials we are talking about, not rare earth metals or anything exotic.
Originally posted by Nutter
To get a direct result, it should at least be close to the dust samples correct?
For example it doesn't matter what amount of acid you throw into a base, the stuff that touches will react nonetheless. The only thing you change by the "ratio" there is how much of a reaction will take place.
So, how does this negate the possibility that a natural thermitic reaction took place?
In the OP's case, NO such reaction took place as what was documented by FEMA, AT ALL!!
How much powderized aluminum did he use? I didn't see any.
This super nanothermite caused the corrosion on only 2 pieces of steel found out of thousands?
Look at my original videos that I posted. Wrapping aluminum around a rusted steel ball and striking against another rusted steel ball causes thermitic sparks. It's not really a precise mixture.
Do you know why steel drill bits aren't used on aluminum? It can cause a thermitic reaction. Again. Not a very precise mixture.
If "natural thermite" reactions are possible then I don't believe it would be necessary to grind up a skyscraper to reproduce the effect. Just take the same materials, without having to destroy a skyscraper. And why do I have to post common sense like this so often when responding to you "debunkers"?
Because if you grind up the materials in a grinder you are simulating the tower collapsing. I don't know how it could be any more simple.
It's really not a lot to ask that you prove your theories. I will admit right now that you have a theory. There is no debate there. But whether or not it's correct, you're not going to be able to prove that to me with just words when nobody has ever demonstrated any such thing before, so I wonder why you're even still trying. Recreate it. These are basic, everyday building materials we are talking about, not rare earth metals or anything exotic.
1. I don't have a lab.
2. I can not perform the necessary fire simulations where I live (I'd probably be arrested as an arsen).
Originally posted by jeddun
reply to post by Asktheanimals
a blinding flash etc etc etc....furthermore to even suggest that 'thermite', people have since come to LOVE this word as i NEVER heard of it prior to this charade, was 'sprayed' on the structure when 'fire proofing' was done is absurd.
Originally posted by andy1972
Originally posted by jeddun
reply to post by Asktheanimals
a blinding flash etc etc etc....furthermore to even suggest that 'thermite', people have since come to LOVE this word as i NEVER heard of it prior to this charade, was 'sprayed' on the structure when 'fire proofing' was done is absurd.
Thermite has been around since world war two,..and was used very effectively on D DAY by Dick Winters and the boys of easy to silence the guns silently at Brecourt manor.
So, its nothing new.
And building work was going on on several floors prior to the 9/11 attacks, giving the necessary access to the interior structure of the building.
Bob estimated that he carried 150 pounds of gear for his first combat jump. Amongst other equipment and gear, he jumped into Normandy with his M-1 rifle and extra supplies of food. Some guys in his company were packing the so called 'thermite' grenades, supposed to wreck the inside of the German artillery pieces they were slipped into.
Paul explains what took place at this hedgerow opening. This is where the Germans had moved the guns from Pointe du Hoc and is where Len Lommel spiked the breeches with thermite grenades, thus rendering the guns useless to the Germans.
Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by smurfy
Lewes Bomb
Here you go!