'US kills civilians to intimidate people'

lestweforget,

I understand you aren't willing or able to provide anything more than innuendo at this point.
So moving on to those topics/posters who will. There is no use wasting my time with this dance.



[edit on 12-8-2010 by LadySkadi]

reply to post by lestweforget

Taliban, gas line, poppy control

Gas pipeline: US would like for Pakistan and India not to get gas from Iran.
Hence bribe India with Nuclear technology even though India is not a NPT signer. Just flat out buy Pakistan through it's corrupt heartless president.

Two less customers for Iran's gas, hurrah for the embargo! Oh yeah, Afghanistan/Pakistan border Iran and China. Hurrah for US control of all trade while positioned to militarily intimidate China.

If there were no Taliban some other excuse would serve just as well. But 9-11, 9-11. That was Al-Qaeda. See how easy it is to shift to another reason to be in Afghanistan?

Poppies: all that opium has to get out of the country some how. US Military planes and CIA and Other Government Agencies pretty much can skip Customs as long as they claim classified mission. The Taliban air force and civilian air traffic is too limited for much smuggling.

reply to post by LadySkadi


Are you expecting me to enlighten you? To join the obvious dots?
For any conspiracy to be even considered valid, just like any crime
there should be a motive. What is the motive of this costly occupying
force do you think? Do you really believe its Bin laden?
Do you have any discerning ability at all?

reply to post by lestweforget


I don't expect anything, apparently it's too much for you to understand what I'm saying so I will be very clear. Try to pay attention:

Your original question was why nobody responded to your two-line post about poppys.

My response to you (and a possible explanation as to why you didn't receive others) is that if you choose to post information as fact, back it up. In anyway that you choose. Otherwise, it's opinion and may very well be ignored and/or overlooked.

Each time you make a post to me, you bring nothing to the table. Except for the personal digs, which though entertaining are not valuable to a discussion on the M.E. and Afghanistan in particular.



[edit on 12-8-2010 by LadySkadi]

reply to post by LadySkadi


I just read your original contribution to this thread and realised
you quoted an ex CIA openly giving information... lol
But it gets better, it was on 60mins... hahaha
Thanks for the laugh, seriously tho how do i give you evidence
of information that is not made public, even to 60mis?

What do death squads do again ...?
Hand out roses and chocolate?
No silly, they slaughter the locals to intimidate the locals.
That this is in the US army training manuals at the Captain level and above was known long before wiki leaks.
I can't believe people who claim to be experts haven't even read the manual.
Didn't get the memo?

So all those saying it ain't so
are wrong
period.
which makes Oozy right
period.

US Counterinsurgency Manual Leaked, Calls for False Flag Operations, Suspension of Human Rights

Wikileaks has released a sensitive 219 page US military counterinsurgency manual. The manual, Foreign Internal Defense Tactics Techniques and Procedures for Special Forces (1994, 2004), may be critically described as “what we learned about running death squads and propping up corrupt government in Latin America and how to apply it to other places”. Its contents are both history defining for Latin America and, given the continued role of US Special Forces in the suppression of insurgencies, including in Iraq and Afghanistan, history making.

statismwatch.ca...

what did USsrael just do...?
Oh yeah, they slaughtered a bunch of civilian aid workers including american citizens in international waters to intimidate civilian aid workers.

Now I heard on the radio today that one of the survivors of the Christian aid worker massacre said he thought the leader of the squad that did them was Pakistani.
Who pays the Pakistanis again...?
Right out of the manual.
Oh, he is Taliban is he..just because he might have he said he was?
one of Zbigniews badd assed tallybans...OK..what ever you say...
Duh ...Right out of the manual...
Come to think of it 911 was right out of the manual too...

But I guess there are some that just don't have the capacity to go by the facts...
To bad
After what happened to Saddam, and Noriega, and Kennedy, and Hitler, and Musolini, and Napoleon, after they did their gigs,
you would think they would see the value of smartening up...
Oh well...

minions die hard
have a nice day.


oh yeah star and flag
Oozy





[edit on 12-8-2010 by Danbones]

[edit on 12-8-2010 by Danbones]

reply to post by lestweforget


*Sigh.

How about something more than a two-liner about why no one is responding to your original post?

As for that video - I didn't present it as FACT, geezus...

Oozi was discussing propaganda, that was but an additional example.

Try to keep up...

there is no god, if there was, a lot of bad $%¨would happen to a lot of wealthy people

Originally posted by stephinrazin
This is sad. It is the ways of wars.

I didn't know that war was the deliberate and methodical slaughter of civilian populations over a several year period... I thought that was genocide but maybe I'm wrong... maybe this is the new definition of war.

It goes back much farther than that. Don't forget about the Indians. Countless women and children, not to mention elders, were wiped out by the US.

I dont think the air force deliberately targets civilians but whilst they can put a bomb through a window or chimney these days a 500lb or 1000lb bomb still has a considerable blast radius and will kill innocents in the way,as for ground forces well My Lai massacres and things will happen if there is any deliberate killing it would be by ground forces and more likely contractors not bound by rules of engagement.

How Many Civilian Deaths are Acceptable

Published on Sunday, August 2, 2009 © 2009 The Boston Globe
How Many Civilian Deaths are Acceptable?
by Tom Hayden

It was a cryptic Pentagon answer to Senator John Kerry's straightforward question, in notes from the Senate hearing on May 21:

Question. According to The New York Times July 20, 2003, Secretary Rumsfeld personally approved over 50 US airstrikes in Iraq which were expected to kill up to 50 innocent Iraqi civilians each. According to Pentagon policy at the time, any strikes expected to result in 50 or more civilian deaths as unavoidable collateral damage were to be approved personally by the Secretary. The media was informed of this policy in July 2003 when the chief US commander disclosed the sign-off policy. Does that policy continue today in Afghanistan, and, if so, in what form? Do White House or Pentagon officials sign off on bombing runs where civilian casualties are expected to be higher than 50? Which officials?

On matters of targeting, if a strike against 1 "bad guy" will cause the death of 30 civilians the decision is made at the lowest level. 30-1 From one of the former target planners. That was in 2003.

The acceptable civilian casualty to intended target ratio now is highly classified, so much for transparency. I would guess that it's much higher than 30-1 and probably the number for high command decision is higher than 50-1.

All of these civilian deaths are rationalized as "well we weren't targeting the civilians" which in a lawyer sort of way can be called true, yet the deaths were completely anticipated.

All that the US cares about is how to control the narrative concerning Afghan civilian deaths.

one can note the persistent pattern in which villagers, elders, and the Afghan and Pakistan governments cite high mortality figures, while the Americans engage in delay, denial, investigations of their own, and finally declare that the civilian casualties are far fewer than initially claimed. As a result there is an asymmetry of anger, with Afghan and Pakistan villagers screaming for revenge and the American public left in puzzled indifference.

Originally posted by pthena
Poppies: all that opium has to get out of the country some how. US Military planes and CIA and Other Government Agencies pretty much can skip Customs as long as they claim classified mission. The Taliban air force and civilian air traffic is too limited for much smuggling.

It goes out of the Taliban's hands and into the Russian mobs. The Taliban get money to finance their war against the west from the Russian mob, and the Russians continue pumping it into their veins. The Taliban have no issues with the Russians getting hooked. They still remember them invading the country back in the 80s

Russia finally admits to its hidden heroin epidemic

He estimated that there are more than two million drug addicts in Russia, which amounts to one addict for every 50 Russians of working age, a level that is up to eight times higher than in EU countries.

Most of these people are addicted to heroin which transits from Afghanistan, through central Asia, and across the long and porous border from Kazakhstan into Russia. There are people addicted to heroin across Russia's 11 time-zones, and the country's anti-drugs body says that Russia now uses more heroin than any other country in the world.

I know I know. It's easier and more convenient to blame the CIA. Even though nobody wants to admit that the poppy fields up until recently were in Taliban controlled areas of Afghanistan for the past 8 1/2 years.


[edit on 13-8-2010 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by SLAYER69
I must admit that the US forces don't have much control over the trucking routes. But the US does have military presence in all the countries between Afghanistan and Russia. I think that's where graft and corruption comes in. The Karzai government and his northern warlord allies are probably getting a lot of money, and every one else from all factions for that matter.

Speaking of the Russians, isn't the US buying some of the old Soviet Era helicopters to use for special missions? That ought to raise a few hackles.

The guy I was responding to seemed to think the pharmaceutical industry was the big profit maker out of Afghanistan, I really don't know what kind of percentages of their opiates come from Afghanistan. Turkey used to be the supplier.

The Soviets didn't invade. There was a small unpopular pro-soviet government that couldn't survive without foreign military aid. They asked for the Soviet help. The US now is propping up a government that would have zero chance of lasting without US presence. I don't see much difference.

www.independent.co.uk...
We've heard Barack Obama and David Miliband come out and say that it was a mistake. The level of Afghan drugs production now is 44 times higher than it was in 2001."

War and drugs seem to go together.

[edit on 13-8-2010 by pthena]

whoever supports the taliban deserves to die.
and stop bashing the U.S.
we get it, US is evil, everyone else is good.
So what are we going to do about it? Make endless discussions on a forum? Then what?
Hey Moozy, why don't you go there and help or protect the civilians since the US army is so bad. Scared that some taliban cuts off your neck? Really why don't you do something about it? Talk is cheap.



[edit on 13-8-2010 by ProdigalSon]

reply to post by pthena


"US Military Presence" Doesn't mean enough troops to seal the borders of those countries in between.

As far as Heroin production. People need to realize where most of it came from for the past 8 1/2 years. Here's a map of production.



Now looky here.
Where the Taliban up until last fall and winter had control.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/1228b61870cb.jpg[/atsimg]


Whats that smack dabbed in the Middle? Helmand province.

The US/NATO forces just took control of the region this past spring. Here are a couple of stories from last year.

Fighting Insurgents in Helmand Province

and

Afghan province to provide one-third of world's heroin

American congressmen are increasing the pressure to start poppy eradication with crop-spraying planes - a controversial tactic opposed by British and Afghan officials, who say it would be disastrous. "It could drive farmers into the hands of the insurgents," said one.

Then no sooner do we take control of the province then all of a sudden BOOM!
Afghan Poppy Crop Hit by Fungus

KABUL, Afghanistan, May 13 (UPI) -- A serious fungal disease has hit Afghanistan's poppy crop, which could reduce this year's opium output by a quarter from last year, a U.N. official said.

The infection has affected half of the Afghan poppy crop, Antonio Maria Costa, head of the U.N. Office on Drugs and Crime, told the BBC. Afghanistan accounts for 92 percent of the world's opium.

The fungus attacks the root of the plant and causes the opium capsule to wither....

[edit on 13-8-2010 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by oozyism


I've been saying for years that attacks on villages, civi vehicle columns and weddings were reprisal/intimidation attacks, just like the other Nazi's did in Poland and the USSR in WW2

Originally posted by Danbones

That this is in the US army training manuals at the Captain level and above

But I guess there are some that just don't have the capacity to go by the facts...
To bad
After what happened to Saddam, and Noriega, and Kennedy, and Hitler, and Musolini, and Napoleon, after they did their gigs,
you would think they would see the value of smartening up...
Oh well...

minions die hard
have a nice day.

oh yeah star and flag
Oozy

Doesn't the US have a school where this is taught, iirc School of the Americas, they've had years of practice and the bonus of locating their own psychopaths to do the work in South America.

Also s n' f.

The irony is, if they hadn't done their thing like this, they're likely to have won the war with minimum bloodloss.

And yet they do this - to win the war.

reply to post by SLAYER69
I lose track sometimes of what's where in Afghanistan. Those red areas seem to be the best farmlands. Makes me wonder what people are eating. Plus a lot of the opium could be going through Pakistan too. I've got no idea what the roads are like on the southern border.

The world is going to be short on wheat for awhile because of fires in Russia. I kind of remember reading somewhere that Afghanistan could be a wheat exporter if not for opium being so much more lucrative. I really am starting to hate graft, corruption, drug addiction.

I forgot what else I was thinking. Going to bed.

Take it easy


[edit on 13-8-2010 by pthena]