H.R. 2159, the Disarming American Citizens Act

reply to post by Lupin


We're not a great nation. We're a nation of greedy, self serving, apathetic goons who have become overweight, and primarily concerned with entertainment.

We have become a nation of bullies who have destroyed world economies, including our own. We have spread ourselves out like every other empire who has fallen, and we are in debt to the very people we claim are our enemies.

We're known as liars, bullies, thieves to most of our allies, which means our reputation isn't very favorable to those who aren't our allies. The only thing great about this nation is our perceived military might which is only superseded by our egos.

That's my analysis. I'm sure yours will be far different, but, I will agree to disagree.

Namaste and Love

Are Democrats, including Obama, going to try and nullify the 2nd Amendment? Of course not. And anybody that thinks that they will has not been paying attention. Rather, Democrats have taken the stance that they are open to further supporting gun owners' rights -- knowing it's a very hot topic -- in order to try and get "new votes" come November. However, if you believe that story at face value, you're also not paying attention.

What nobody seems to get -- and this applies to Democrats, Republicans, and anybody else in Washington politics right now -- is that disarming Americans is not going to be the headlines. It will happen and you won't even know it until its done.

Rather, there is going to be a different type of movement, that which will remove guns from criminals, terrorists, and any person or group wishing to do the United States or its citizens' harm. Sounds good enough. The Sheeple will jump on board -- get the terrorists' guns! Unfortunately, it is the definition of terrorist that is changing, not the Second Amendment.

Further, this is even more dangerous to the American people because both sides can agree on this -- Democrats will view this as a method to acquiring the guns they desperately need to remove our power, and Republicans will view this as simply expanding the war on terror which will create an even larger defense budget.

What scares me is that people are only focusing on the Second Amendment, and not to the headlines that read -- "Obama wants to have the right to remove citizenship from domestic terrorists", "Democrats want to go after domestic terrorist groups", "Domestic terrorism is on the rise", etc.

After the above headlines surface, more reports surface regarding the targets of the government -- Cyber threats, anti-government groups, whistle blowers, heavily armed militias distributing anti-government propaganda, disgruntled veterans, etc.

This will not be done with fanfare and hoopla. Rather, it will be quiet, seemingly positive, and sooner rather than later your neighbors and yourself will be on the "potential" domestic terrorist watch list. Further, it will be hard to start screaming from the rooftops -- "I'm not a terrorist!" Think of how many have already been arrested or written about that when you read it you simply say, "Hmmm....never would have guessed him to be a terrorist....shows you never can tell."

It will be a true test and frankly, given the fact that the government has spent the last 9 years convincing us there is a terrorist under every rock and we are constantly under the threat of attack -- a fairly easy one.

Do you think your neighbors will come to your aide if the feds show up and demand your guns due to your questionable ties to domestic terrorism? How are your neighbors going to react when the feds claim to be investigating a possible sleeper cell in their own backyard?

I think those are the questions you need to start asking yourself, not if/when the Second Amendment is going to hit the Supreme Court. Because it won't.

Originally posted by crichton13
Just a short point of fact I wanted to put here.

Not attributing ANYTHING regarding Gun Control in the US to these numbers but make of them what you will.

Number of Deaths attributed to Firearms in the USA in 2009 = 29,569.

Number of Deaths attributed to Firearms in the UK in 2009 = 29.

Enough said I think.

Ahem... Canada has more guns than America yet, their gun related deaths are extremely low, both in homicides and in hunting accidents. Most of them are accidental or used for purposes of suicide. So, I see your point, but, its not reflective of gun ownership. It is reflective of the amount of psychotic people that America has.
www.calliflower.com...
en.wikipedia.org...
www.phac-aspc.gc.ca...

reply to post by lpowell0627


Thumbs up for your post. Very good analytical thinking. The usual 'sleight of hand technique' that sheeps would not know that the rug had been slowly pulled out of their feet.

The final thug at the rug remains to be seen yet, but it can't be far, after all , it's been 9 years already with HSA. The sheeps are happy and contented with american idol, discussing Paris Hilton, glued to their ipads, will not even know what freedom is till it has been taken away, but it will be too late, just as frogs happily adapt themselves to hot water till they perish....

reply to post by lpowell0627


"Are Democrats, including Obama, going to try and nullify the 2nd Amendment? Of course not."

Yes, yes they are.

Hence why they are putting forth bills that remove due process from the equation.

You have to eliminate due process to have a gun ban.

This is the first step.

As I said earlier:

If a person is plotting to engage in "terrorism" or is aiding and abetting a "terrorist," they are already committing a crime.

Therefore if the government actually had any evidence of this, they would arrest the person and bring them to trial where they would prove beyond a reasonable doubt that this is actually the case.

Hence, if the government bans a person from buying a gun because they are a terrorist, but an arrest warrant is not issued for that persons arrest at the same time, we can assume THAT THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO ACTUALLY CONVICT THE PERSON.

[edit on 30-7-2010 by mnemeth1]

well 2012 or latter then??????? but if the world is hit with the big one, in 2012 it will not matter any way, my question is how do we put the peaces back, when it all falls apart. as far as the laws go, it is nothing but fear, as a member of the NRA i get them alerts all the time, you are at risk, they are coming to get your gun, UN plans on gun ban, UN to pass gun Ban, Mex and Obama plan to take your gun, i remember the Brady bill do you, why do you need 20 round's to go deer hunting? or 60 for that matter, the one i heard the most was, i just what to look cool, 3 60's taped together, (that's 60 round clips for them that do not know) i would hate to see what was left of the deer, i was raised one shot 2 at most need more than that stay at home go the range and get some practice, or do not buy one at all, a gun is for one thing and thing only killing if you can not bring your self to doing that, rather be for food, or for self defense, then why have one? and why so many rounds?

May be I am stupid but I follow closely any congressional bill filed pertaining to handguns, rifles, and ammunition. In fact, my son (a computer programmer) wrote me a program that alerts my computer when such type bills are filed.

NOW: H.R. 2159 was filed in April 2009. It went to committee and they voted to sent it to a subcommittee which is usually a KISS OF DEATH for a bill. I have not seen this bill pop-up on my computer screen since last year.

If ! am wrong, send me the link to find current info. If you please.

In God and My Guns I Do Trust

Freedommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!

reply to post by PsychoX42


How does canada have more guns? I'm not arguing we don't but its just we have less people and that confuses the hell out of me... But then again I know a lot of people collect guns and never fire them...

Now that I think about it up north they need the guns and same with in the country areas. We haven't killed all our wild life yet with big cities and polar bears are scary and can kill... And the moose... Moose are evil.

I think owning a gun is just fine as long as kids can't get a hold of them, they are registered by serial number AND by striation of the bullets fired so that police can easily track down owners of guns, and solve murders faster. I would love to own a gun and go to the firing range since I have night classes and as a woman I'd like a little more assurance than a good kick to a rapists pants. Only problem is you need a permit for a concealed weapon and we have VERY strict rules on concealed weapons. That includes any knife with a blade longer than your palm, or butterfly knives I believe they are illegal in Ontario.

IMHO
Being Canadian I can say this for sure...
People make fun of our three round mags.
you know what Canadians say?

If you can't shoot it dead in three rounds or less, don't shoot it at all.

EVERYONE even the police know the gun registry is fubar, but because we have bears, and because we hunt for food, and fish, and farm, we know what guns are for.

People who use guns for crimes are despised up here....thats right, despised.
Our best anti crime measure is that we consider gun crimers cowards...
as in
get a job dipstick

The government knows that if they try to take our guns away we will still be able to walk over and punch them out.

Thats why Hockey is a better national sport than baseball.
Here guns are at the BACK of the toolbox, not the front.

The government is already taking your guns incrementally, so the debate regarding IF is toast.
Period.

IMHO, and I am not trying to be rude, you guys need to skip plan B and go straight to plan A
Figure out how to fix things with your brains.
not your guns.

reply to post by felonius


Thanks for the backup felonius, some folks just post comments to try to spread the wealth of personal misery in thier lives amongst the community. It all reflects in the way they treat thier fellows.

reply to post by Xiamara


People with registered guns don't commit murders.

And if they do, they don't use the gun that's registered in their name.

The number of murders that could be solved by the solutions you proposed is infinitesimally small.

Thus, the only real reason government pushes for those regulations is so that they can more easily confiscate the guns when the time comes. Such regulations also drive up the price of guns, putting them out of reach for the lower class.



[edit on 30-7-2010 by mnemeth1]

Hence, if the government bans a person from buying a gun because they are a terrorist, but an arrest warrant is not issued for that persons arrest at the same time, we can assume THAT THEY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH EVIDENCE TO ACTUALLY CONVICT THE PERSON.

According to the Patriot Act, the government doesn't need to prove anything to anyone in order to try a terrorist, whom they so labeled, once again without any right for reason achnowledged, so that said 'terrorist' can then be tried in military tribunal - free from observance or outside scrutiny.

Now, You also lose your citizenship and Constitutional rights as an American if found to be a terrorist...

So this bill isn't as far off as you may think. If you're labeled a terrorist, you're already screwed!... and they're comming for you. Heck, you might even be wallking in to work one day and *POP* you take one in the head from a FBI sharp shooter because you even made it on the Assassination list....

PEOPLE REALLY NEED TO WAKE THE HECK UP!

SNIFF....... SNIFF SNIFF.... do you smell that?....

REVOLUTION!!!!

I got one sentence that says it all. It's NOT going to happen. Try it. And it still won't happen. Especially now. These dumb asses moved wayyyy too fast on the people.

To be honest, I think part of this is part of the old game where they wanted to actually try to bring this form of government in. And they moved too fast. Why they moved so fast is because they know whats coming down the road and they want to distract. It's all distraction, all of it. It's all part of a play. If you pull back and see whats really going on. These #in morons in the WH and at the CIA and whatever agency / form of rule you want to call it - are #tin their boots. Plain and Simple. Things are going to change, and its out of their hands whether they like it or not. Am I going to be part of that change, on a small scale - and thats where it will start. Grassroots baby! Grassroots. Have another beer why dontcha

reply to post by mnemeth1


Exactly Whats wrong with that, gun control like that is great. So A gun is a bit more expensive and its a pain to register but its keeping it out of the hands of some crack head mugging you and taking your money. Taking peoples guns is stupid making them register them is smart.

reply to post by Xiamara


If you can't see a problem with that, then I'm not sure what's left to discuss.

You think poor people shouldn't have the same right to defend themselves as rich people?

Crack heads don't get their guns from gun dealers by the way.

[edit on 30-7-2010 by mnemeth1]

From My Cold Dead Hands.


Bring it on already damn it.


WE'VE BEEN WAITING TO CLEAN YOUR HOUSE!




[edit on 30-7-2010 by VirginiaRisesYetAgain]

reply to post by PsychoX42


Speak for yourself and those you congregate with. It really fires me up when some creature such as yourself paint's with so broad a brush.

reply to post by PsychoX42


Canada has more guns than the U.S.? Where are your facts. Psycho?

According to the 1997 Survey of State Prison Inmates, among those possessing a gun, the source of the gun was from -

a flea market or gun show for fewer than 2%
a retail store or pawnshop for about 12%
family, friends, a street buy, or an illegal source for 80%

web.archive.org...://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/guns.htm


[edit on 30-7-2010 by mnemeth1]