Afghanistan war logs: Massive leak of secret files exposes truth of occupation

reply to post by Section31




Nope, im actually proud of it.
If I had enough balls, and nothing to lose id love to do the same...

Good to see there are people inside who are willing to stand up for humanity... i just wish there were more of them.

I have the bad feeling wikileaks is a psi op to get us to accept our troops to be tried for war crimes. Why? To make us "equal" as part of the plan to implement a world government where no nation is above the law than another.

Originally posted by Logarock

No I dont remember it like this this. The two sides of the issue have always made a point out of showing that women were treated poorly.

I do remember it. Much like we tend to use that line of reasoning (or silence) when commenting on Saudi Arabias treatment of women and their human rights.

reply to post by pavil


what War?

you call this a war?

for what?

they had nothing to do with 9 11 ... they just didn't want the pipeline going through there land..

what did Iraq have to do with anything??!!


have you been on this forum long?

because anyone here at ATS can tell ya we have no business being over there looking for Bin Laden..

its all a joke now.. for years.. and you want to defend killing innocent children be PRETENDING we are in a war with a third world country..

doing what again?? looking for who?? and why??

this is sickening..

"I believe in facts about conspiracies," he [Julian Assage of Wikileaks] says, choosing his words slowly. "Any time people with power plan in secret, they are conducting a conspiracy. So there are conspiracies everywhere. There are also crazed conspiracy theories. It's important not to confuse these two. Generally, when there's enough facts about a conspiracy we simply call this news." What about 9/11? "I'm constantly annoyed that people are distracted by false conspiracies such as 9/11, when all around we provide evidence of real conspiracies, for war or mass financial fraud."

This fails my litmus test I'm afraid. Reading this article in the NYT does the rest: "Pakistan Aids Insurgency in Afghanistan, Reports Assert"

www.nytimes.com...

At least it's clear, and my suspicions have been confirmed in full: Wikileaks has CIA written all over it. If anyone has anything to leak, do yourselves a favor and leak it somewhere else....

[edit on 27-7-2010 by D377MC]

Originally posted by D377MC
This fails my litmus test I'm afraid.

Seems like a fairly well balanced quote to me. If he'd say "false conspiracies about 911", rather than "false conspiracies such as 911", it would have been more balanced. The official story is a conspiracy theory, of course, as he just elucidated in his previous sentence.

Originally posted by Come Clean

Originally posted by Nomad451
Anyone else slightly worried that this release may spur the US to create some kind on "incident" on the Korean Peninsula? It would certainly take the focus off, especially if any incident was particularly large

I thought I was the only one worried about that region. Seems like a provocative move on our part. N. Korea just sank a S. Korean ship a few months ago.

Any incident involving our ships would be huge.

Time to catch up with the news. The South Koreans initially admitted that North Korea could not be involved in the sinking of the SK ship. They later changed their tune and started the "investigation." The stitch-up investigation was just another politically motivated exercise from the Clintonista gang.

As the South Korean newspaper The Hankyoreh reported on 1st April:

"In the immediate wake of the incident, the Cheong Wa Dae (the presidential office in South Korea or Blue House) and the military detailed the chance of North Korean involvement as slight. Following a security-related ministerial meeting presided over by President Lee Myung-bak just after the accident took place on Friday night, Cheong Wa Dae spokesman Kim Eun-hye was circumspect, saying, “At present, we are not clear about the question of a North Korean connection.” In a National Assembly briefing Saturday, Lee Ki-sik, head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff intelligence operations office, said, “No North Korean warships have been detected, and there is no possibility of their approaching the waters where the accident took place.” Additionally, the military has stressed on multiple occasions that it has picked up no “unusual trends” in North Korean military movements while monitoring…

As recently as Tuesday, Cheong Wa Dae spokesman Park Sun-kyu said, “As of now, nothing has emerged indicating that North Korea was involved.”

For the Cheonan to have been broken in two by a torpedo in the way described by the South Korean JIG group, by “a shock wave and bubble effect”, only a bubble jet torpedo could have been used in the ‘attack’. The Hankyoreh article continued:

“The Russian investigation team’s primary interest was in whether North Korea, which had been unable to produce its own torpedoes until 1995, suddenly was able to attack the Cheonan with a state-of-the-art bubble jet torpedo,” said a South Korean diplomatic source.

Indeed, the technology for bubble jet torpedoes, which are capable of splitting a vessel in two through the expansion and contraction of a bubble resulting from a powerful explosion, is possessed only by the U.S. and a small number of other countries, and has only been successful to date in experiments on stationary ships rather than actual fighting. The joint civilian-military investigation team also acknowledged in its June 29 briefing to media groups that North Korea was the first to have succeeded in using a bubble jet torpedo in the field.

Source: Shock wave and bubble: the untruth about the Cheonan

reply to post by Ian McLean


Semantics. He is on record as supporting the official BS - therefore of three possibilities one:

(i) unaware of the facts
(ii) mentally deficient
(iii) pushing an agenda

I'll have to go with (ii) and (iii) ...

Originally posted by XPLodER

Originally posted by nite owl
reply to post by Mark Harris

 

I recommend everyone see this video, It will WAKE YOU UP. www.youtube.com...

thank you and i recomend it

if the ussr couldnt win in a twenty year war and they were next door

what makes america think it can win from thousands of miles away?

xploder

The Russians might have "won" if the USA hadn't funded and supplied the mujahideen against them. From what I've read, the Russians had made great improvements in human rights and education for women. It would have taken decades of decades to overcome the culture of Afghanistan but perhaps there would have been peace!

Originally posted by Xcathdra
Yes by all means lets demozie US forces. Lets overlook all of the civilian Deaths at the hands of the Taliban in the name of religion. While I have absolutely no problem holding our leaders / military accountible I ask this:

Who holds the Taliban accountible? Al Queda? Its hard to not have civilian casualties when the Taliban / Al Queda use schools and mosques to fight from.

Gee, where was the US in about 1998 when the Taliban was going around blowing up ancient historic statues because they were made under a different religion? Oh, they didn't have a fake 9/11 story to make a fraudulent war with... that is when the war started. It never once started to "free people from the Taliban" if you could just look back to the 2001 news.

If you want to hold the Taliban accountable please by all means go over there and do it yourself, and nobody will stop you. But when you support my property being taken without permission in a process called "taxes" in order to support a cause I am frankly offended by, then you've crossed a line where I will defend myself as much as possible against.

Maybe the US should first work on bringing actual freedom back to the US before it goes forcing its fraudulent non-freedom brand of freedom on other countries.

I was quite pissed off when the Taliban said "sure we'll give OBL just give us evidence" and then we responded to the perfectly reasonable and ordinary request by saying "well we don't have any so well just kill you all any ways, losers". I'm sorry but the war had nothing to do with the Taliban being bad people and had everything to do with them being easy targets for a war.

Its like a game of Survivor to Obama & company. If you are unpopular you just may be kicked off the political island. And if you think Obama cares about freedom for one second maybe consider that despite teaching a constitution class he helped vote in the patriot act and every single subsequent extension of it. So clearly killing people in Afghanistan has nothing to do with getting rid of anti-freedom people.

reply to post by Peruvianmonk

I was listening to BBC radio 4 last night (am I getting that old? - lol).

They mentioned links (stated in the wiki leak expose) between the Taliban and North Korea and Iran.

- Justifying an invasion of Iran?
- Extra sanctions for NK? - U.S and SK have already stages a military excercise to the dis-pleasure of the NKs.

I'm thinking this is starting to smell of dis-info; real info 'leaked' combined with dis-info.

Clever Girl.....


EDIT: spelling and grammar - must do better D-


[edit on 27-7-2010 by OptimusPrimate]

This leak is tantamount to the pentagon papers that were released by Daniel Ellsberg and Anthony Russo. Just hope the media will actively to through the material and release the most compelling evidence thats most likely to end the war. I just hope it will have the same effect as in the time period of the pentagon papers.

reply to post by OptimusPrimate


Hey mate there is nothing wrong with Radio 4 and i am 24! For me it is the only BBC outlet that reports the news and events with some depth.

However i was not listening last night so missed that on NK Iran. The U.S. has argued before that Iran has been supplying the Taliban. It's not even news though is it?

Afghanistan is within Iran's sphere of influence, Iran is under serious threat of attack from Israel/U.S. and may even be so already with the sanctions and terrorist attacks within Iran. Any country, even Switzerland, would involve themselves in Afghanistan to see the withdrawl of Iran's enemies.

Firstly, this was done first n ATS about three months ago... Another example of why I come to this site... The vids were posted here months ago from wikileaks.. along with the fact that the site owner (wikileaks)had his passport taken.. ATS deserves a collective pullitzer..




Now my opinion...

We are fighting an enemy that has no western ingrained sense of honour.. They play to win by any means... We are dealing with slaughter the women and children and males of fighting age tactics. Putting heads on a pike and sending fear throufhout the land... Leave one survivor to tell the tale.. Spread fear...

That is how to win in afganistan.. Harsh.. Evil.. But a language they understand.... That is why everyone who invaded these hard people failed except genghis khan because only he was ruthless enough to win...

Killing is killing.. Any amount of landmine treaties or whinging about phosphorous grenades makes you weak in their eyes.. Which they exploit necause they know of the pussies back home and use that to reduce the will to win...

Like a daisy chain bomb aint gonna burn or maim..

There are kids there too who fire... You fire at me you are dead.

You people live in a self righteous lala land... You have no clue.. Unless you have freinds die next to you or you are being bombed, shot at or someone is trying to kill you and your mates i suggest you shut up because it is wankers like YOU tht kill us by policy and mke all the good we have done mean nothing. It was my mates who died so some civvie company could build a school or hospital in that place.. You dishonour their memory andyou had better prepare yourself for your ass being kicked.

So the question is., Do you wanna win?. if so shut the hell up.. or bring us home.

YOUR CHOICE

[edit on 27-7-2010 by Yissachar1]

reply to post by Yissachar1


I believe Yissa that you are from Israel or have lived there?

As much as it must have been painful for you and i respect that people were bombed or shot at in your land Yissar because Israel continues to maintain an illegal, cruel and humiliating occupation of Palestinian land which bred and continues to breed despair among all Palestinians and violence among some elements.

I do not want to 'win' in Afghanistan. There is no victory to be had there. If you think there is then i am afraid i feel it is you who is living in la la land. The British were humiliated in the 1830's, the Russians in the 1980's and this will be the same.

Whenever the 'coalition' leaves the result will be the same. Either Karzai will make a deal with the Taliban and they will effectively control large swathes of the country or he will be completly toppled by the Taliban and numerous warlords.

If there are still elements of Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan i am sure we will be able to come to some kind of arrangement with the Talibn to deal with that in a law enforcement method no matter how unpalatable it will be to deal with them.

reply to post by Yissachar1

Come home.
Its not about winning or losing!! - The Natos forces are the only ones wanting to race!
As far as I can tell you seem to be addressing TPTB and not people on ATS or the general public right?

The war is illegal...who's benifited from it? haliburton? numerous civvie companies? Maybe we should've spent the war chest money on protecting boarders and increasing intelligence bandwidth to deal with this 'terrorist threat' instead.

If my land was being occupied by force - I'd be blowing # up too.



[edit on 27-7-2010 by OptimusPrimate]

Originally posted by JohnJasper

Originally posted by XPLodER

Originally posted by nite owl
reply to post by Mark Harris

 

I recommend everyone see this video, It will WAKE YOU UP. www.youtube.com...

thank you and i recomend it

if the ussr couldnt win in a twenty year war and they were next door

what makes america think it can win from thousands of miles away?

xploder

The Russians might have "won" if the USA hadn't funded and supplied the mujahideen against them. From what I've read, the Russians had made great improvements in human rights and education for women. It would have taken decades of decades to overcome the culture of Afghanistan but perhaps there would have been peace!

does that not mean without help afghanistan would have been over by now question is who is helping and how many countries and to win do you have to engage them on there own ground and how big does this get?

if the money from the us is funding pakastan and they are training the taliban then the argument becomes circular and ever expanding

answer pull out like the russians cant win dont try

i imagine that the russians might be giving help to the teleban as well kinda goes round and round

question

what does the end of these wars look like?
does anyone know?
why be there?
who benifits from being there?
is it really important why it started it has evolved passed a joke
anyone could be fighting a proxie war with the us in the stan
including the us supplying both sides to prolong a war that a few earn money from

money has been paid to the teleban for safe passage from the us

are you really comfortable with the idea you are being used as pawns in somebody elses game?

how about starving families living in tents in america to pay for a war that is unwinable?

how about your boarder being more of a security threat than some gurrillas in a mountain country?

how about adding borrowing money at interest (debt) to your childerens future to fight a war that only creates more war and debt

when does kids dying in a far of country bring you security

all war is is profit from death and destruction

who profits and who dies

this is not aimed at anyone in particular but does make you think

XPLOdER

Originally posted by OptimusPrimate
reply to post by Yissachar1

 

Come home.
Its not about winning or losing!! - The Natos forces are the only ones wanting to race!
As far as I can tell you seem to be addressing TPTB and not people on ATS or the general public right?

The war is illegal...who's benifited from it? haliburton? numerous civvie companies? Maybe we should've spent the war chest money on protecting boarders and increasing intelligence bandwidth to deal with this 'terrorist threat' instead.

If my land was being occupied by force - I'd be blowing # up too.



[edit on 27-7-2010 by OptimusPrimate]

I agree.


I would do the same too..

But too much blood has been spilt...

Airmchair generals get my mates killed y an enemy that has no "rules of engagement" ....
Ruthlessness is the only way to win..

For the troops it is not about you or some zionist conspiracy but... REVENGE. For our mates who took the land that was ordered to take for a school... YOU MADE THAT HAPPEN WITH YOU VOTE., Share some blood on your hands..

You can change it... But itwill NEVER bring back the dead and maimed on both sides.

Share in the responsabilty

[edit on 27-7-2010 by Yissachar1]

reply to post by Yissachar1


I agree!

A British troops uniform is MY uniform; anything and everything thats is done while wearing that is in MY name and OUR names.
If these zionist cospiracies do exist then its because of our apathy - LIH is as bad as LIHOP.

We may not be able to stop '9/11's'; the machine is too autonomus for that, but we CAN control the fall out...

Peace.



[edit on 27-7-2010 by OptimusPrimate]

The only reason we are caving to Pakistan is because they have nukes.

Backing out now would be akin to walking away and leaving a meth-lab standing, then trying to curb the amount of drugs coming from it.

I say, burn the poppies, take the nukes and leave.



[edit on 27-7-2010 by rusethorcain]