Demons 101

A purely Christian dmeonologist is like a cilvil attorney trying a criminal case. Or a physics teacher teaching chemistry. Even the Catholic CHurch acknowledges that some demons are prechristian and prehistory and are not beholden to christ.

I have never witnessed an angel. Even in the excorcisms, nor have I felt the presence of one. I've also seen nonjudeo christian excoorcisms be highly effective. The importance is in the pattern. But most people don't realize that. And if its a religon bound demon then it is bound by that interperetation of the Creator.

I have spent a great portion of my life dedicated to the study of demons and the supernatural. A tormented childhood can do that. I also went into the psychology field because I felt many cases of possession were falsey diagnosed. I was actually one of Father Barahan's 1st 80 students at UPRA on their 1st excorcism course.

Most excorcism are needless acts performed on the mentally ill. The Catholic CHurch has a specific set of requirements in place. THey are so stringent that soem in need of an excorcism do not recieve them.

If you would like to see a true case of possession, then think again. You most certainly wouldn't. The shock value isn't worth it.

What would you really do if you saw a teenage Kenyan girl float off the floor with 12 people trying to pull her down? What would you do if you saw her bend over backwards and crawl through her own legs while listening to her bowns cracking under the strain? What would you do if you say the demon inside her manifest itself briefly and call forth little black grotesque entities to torment you while you try to save the girl? How would you respond to the girls blood pressure regularly changing from 260/190 to 66/36 with great frequency? How would you feel to watch this girl open her mouth and create a sound so deafening that it measured at 165 decibels for a period of several minutes. Watching her speak 14 different languages. Telling you things about your family.

People tend to think it would be cool to see a possession. Just like Linda Blair in the excorcist. Which is more severe than 99% of the excorcisms performed. But the 1% that are legitimate, probably less than that, are infinitely more horrifying.

And the absolute worst are the demons that predate human religon. And are unbound. Imagine a creature so old, so evil, with no method to control it short of direct, i mean that in the literal sense, direct intervention from a diety. These entities aremore of a negotiation.

I take my day job very seriouslly and I treat my night job with equal seriousness. There are things out there that you don't want to see. Leave them alone. Once you open yourself up, its almost impossible to go back. It's just like hunting, if you can see them then they can see you. And your existence would be a much happier one if they don't/

Thank you all so much for this advice. I'm going to save your posts, if it's okay with you and speak with her about it.

Yes her ex is a large man, not that it matters.

And the one thing I forgot to include was, when she was packing to leave him, she came across a box she had not seen. When she started to go through it, there were some pictures that had been drawn and colored, one was of a figure looking like a demon colored in black. The rest was red and white. When she asked him what it was he said it was the anger that lived inside of him. I know that this sounds very hollywood-ish, but I am wondering if some of you are accurate that this is something that was trying to come at her through him.

Thanks again.

This is basically what we've come down to guys. =[

[edit on 10-6-2010 by lucyfr]

[edit on 10-6-2010 by lucyfr]

Originally posted by lucyfr
reply to post by LordBucket

 

To further refine my statement for felines trying to drag down the eagle....
Demons are harmful to those who live in fear of themselves, or the cage it puts us in. I don't really know what you want me to say.

Demons can't harm a willing creature.


Edited to cure his ailments!



[edit on 10-6-2010 by lucyfr]

yes they can. I've witnessed a physical summoning outside of an excorcism. And I watched in horror what this creature did to the summoner. The comment I recieved was "He didn't pay his debts".

Just because you haven't encountered a demon capable or willing to harm someone who doesn't live in fear of himself doesn't mean they don't exist.

Originally posted by pondrthis

Originally posted by snowspirit
I have also at times closed my eyes and seen the strangest types of faces, but I stopped being afraid of them at one point, because I felt like I was more of an observer, and that they couldn't hurt me, or have me. It has been a while since I had any of those nightmares. They felt so real.

Wow. All I can say is, "Wow."

I too will be having perfectly normal thoughts about my day, turn out my lights, sneak into bed, close my eyes, and suddenly be presented with a grotesque face or image. I've never been very visually creative (i.e. try to get me to do a character design or something and you won't get very far), but these images are vivid and utterly unlike anything one comes across on Earth. Sometimes they aren't even really recognizable as faces, I just somehow "know" that I am looking at a sentient being's emotional center--a kind of corresponding organ to a face.

It doesn't happen every night, and I'm still not quite ready to say it's something paranormal, but the thought that I might be experiencing something and just not noticing sloughed off a bit of my skepticism of the occult world.

Consider it a victory.

It's really disturbing at times isn't it. The first few times it really freaked me out, but to step back as an observer and just watch them somehow makes it feel a little safer. If you ever feel like they see you, or feel anything tugging at your inner self, do what I do, and just fight it like crazy. Every win makes you stronger. Forget about any of the religious mantras, Just have a really strong intent to get them away. I have never been religious, I don't think any religion covers all of what it out there. Strength of intent, in my opinion is the main thing.

reply to post by DrJay1975


But what happens when this demon has already been put through all the tests. This is a demon with a heart of steel, and a mind of love.

Yawn...next! There are demons. There are ANGELS. There is GOD. Choose.

reply to post by bittersylence


I choose to remain anonymous.

Originally posted by Bilw85


A Christian stance on demons should be focused on defeating demons, but rejoicing that we have eternal life.

None the less Jesus and his followers went about casting out demons. Get it? I have seen this said before most commonly from those that had no power to cast out demons. No one is trying to make a big deal out of it so you can spare your favored little spritual ego....and no if you cant be of any help kindly get out of the road or go back to the dishes.

[edit on 10-6-2010 by Logarock]

reply to post by Logarock


Jesus was possessed. His disciples knew that. He was granted the power to make those choices.

[edit on 10-6-2010 by lucyfr]

Originally posted by postmeme
So let me take you apart piece by piece.

Contradictory. Forums are a place for discourse, not power trips. Already you have started off your post on a defensive note. Basically you are saying, you only want to engage with people who agree with you, rather than being open to "healthy debat(sic)". That is hypocrisy. Again this is a forum for open discourse, not power trips.

You are correct, forums are a place for discourse, not randomly insulting people and pointing out that they are wrong without providing them with evidence to back up the claim they are wrong. I've been around ATS a little longer than 300 posts - I know how people can act in this forum. So yeah, I started out defensively and you'll see several posts here which went ignored because of their content. I'm not looking for people who solely agree with me - because if you truly took your time to read through my posts, you'll see I'm open to healthy debate and differing opinions - not flames. Two different things.

Now do bear in mind as to where some people like myself are coming from. To us, your post WAS metaphorically the "garbage from random people".

So far, your "us" consists of you and one other person.

So how is this Demons 101 then? So far all I've read by this point are just opinions passed off as facts. There's really nothing anyone can express in order to counter your "opinions" other than using opinions of their own, which really means they run afoul of point 1 above.

Actually, several other people have expressed differing viewpoints most of which I took into account and thanked them for. Not seeing how I wasn't open to differing viewpoints - key here... they didn't flame...

And on and on ad nauseum as you rattle off a lot of opinions passed off as facts with no sources.

Of course you can't since all your OP really was, was an opinion piece.

Since it is just an opinion piece, then what do you want the rest of the forumers do? We can only provide our opinions as well, i.e. rattle our sabres in a battle of epeens.

I didn't get to it last night, but I will be posting a list of references for the research I conducted but I will give you this - I cannot provide references to personal experiences without giving up contact information for people around the world. That - I will not do.

Hmm, then you go on expressing your "opinion" about what goes on in summonings blah blah blah. Evidence? None because again your whole thread is just an opinion piece.

Would you care to explain how a summoning works for us, then? Seeing as you've apparently witnessed it more than me?

Do you see the contradiction? I'm not even going to explain the contradictions. Read the whole thing.

I'm sorry that you misunderstood so let me explain in a bit more detail.

1) People out there believe that they can summon demons and control them - have them do as they will - and not face consequences. They cannot. This isn't WoW or some other video game that people are playing these days.

however

2) BANISHING rituals DO work - and that's something that's been tested. As opposed to "controlling" the demon and getting it to obey your commands, you are forcing it to leave.

Different points.

In summary, this is just a big load of opinions trying to pass off as fact or as research. No evidence, no source, just a whole lot of "opinions" to put it nicely. You are not asking for discussion, you are just asking for agreement. Sorry but this doesn't fly on ATS.

From the beginning I said it was personal experience without much proof to back it up - so congrats for reading! As far as the research, it's been done, I have the books - you are more than welcome to come take a look if you're ever in the area. As far as accounts of the stories, I can and will not put people's personal information on a site with interesting characters running about.

Not asking for discussion? I believe in at least two areas of the original posts I said I am open for discussion/healthy debate/differing viewpoints. What I will not tolerate is flames.

As for what will and will not fly on ATS?! LOL - get a few more posts and threads under your belt before you try to educate me on this forum works.

Cheers!

[edit on 10-6-2010 by mf_luder]

I had attained Knowledge and Conversation with my Holy Guardian Angel, and based on the Dehn and Mathers translations of that awesome manuscript of Abramelin's legacy for his son, I figured the next most important thing to do after attaining K et C was to conjure up the demons of Hell and get them to serve me.

Red

Accomplish everything on the Emerald Tablet in three easy steps:

1. Attain the Supernatural Assistant
2. Get initiated into the Seven Planetary Spheres
3. Start conjuring the demons and putting them to work creating the universe as you see fit.

I like your information and the way you presented it. Very interesting. Now for some questions.

1) If daemons are interdimensional beings, why do our lowly human rituals even function to summon them?

2) How does a religious person even succeed in banishing an interdimensional creature?

3) Why is the language of Latin more effective for banishing than say German, Arabic, or English?

4) Do daemons have physical form when they are in their own reality/universe? If so, where does their physical body go when they are summoned? What happens to it when they are banished?

I would appreciate your answers to all of these questions.

Originally posted by DrJay1975

Originally posted by lucyfr
reply to post by LordBucket

 

To further refine my statement for felines trying to drag down the eagle....

[edit on 10-6-2010 by lucyfr]

yes they can. I've witnessed a physical summoning outside of an excorcism. And I watched in horror what this creature did to the summoner. The comment I recieved was "He didn't pay his debts".

Just because you haven't encountered a demon capable or willing to harm someone who doesn't live in fear of himself doesn't mean they don't exist.

Well even Paul prayed that a messenger of satan be sent to buffet someone. What was he doing engaging in witch craft? I think real christanity is way over the head of the average "practitioner". The prophet called up a bear to eat them.

By the way its not a cat trying to drag down the eagle....its about the eagle getting ready to eat a cat. lol All in the persepective friend.

[edit on 10-6-2010 by Logarock]

reply to post by mf_luder


You keep talking about investigating demons. Is this an US Army investigation or just your personal hobby?

Originally posted by postmeme

Originally posted by pondrthis

Originally posted by snowspirit
I have also at times closed my eyes and seen the strangest types of faces, but I stopped being afraid of them at one point, because I felt like I was more of an observer, and that they couldn't hurt me, or have me. It has been a while since I had any of those nightmares. They felt so real.

Wow. All I can say is, "Wow."

I'm a hardcore skeptic, and have never experienced anything paranormal in the least. However, this post made me realize that I perhaps just chalk up any experiences I have to "bizarre psychology" and the like.

I too will be having perfectly normal thoughts about my day, turn out my lights, sneak into bed, close my eyes, and suddenly be presented with a grotesque face or image. I've never been very visually creative (i.e. try to get me to do a character design or something and you won't get very far), but these images are vivid and utterly unlike anything one comes across on Earth. Sometimes they aren't even really recognizable as faces

LMAO... recently I've been experiencing this as well. Maybe you should start a thread on that.

[edit on 10-6-2010 by postmeme]

I wonder how many others experience this? Maybe this is a bad sign that means there is too much negative energy in the world right now. A person only needs to pay attention to the news these days and it seems like pychotic episodes are happening all over, people shooting large groups of people, those events in China, about 5 or 6 incidents of men attacking young innocent children. A strong inner strength is certainly needed in these strange times.

Originally posted by Aisling
I have a question, OP, and hope you can help me.

Can a person summon a demon onto someone else?

My sister married a man who practiced witchcraft. She was pagan as well, but did not practice spell work. She told me that shortly after they married his demeanor completely changed, and that he was angry and bitter alot. He was a believer in using magic against other people, even to do harm.
He became physically abusive and so she left him.

After she left him, she moved across country to live with a friend. That is when her troubles began and after 7 years they have never stopped.

She has told me of her experiences with feeling like something is choking her, or waking her up from sleep. Feeling as if she is constantly watched. She has had moments where she felt like someone was screaming at her, but could intuitively hear this, not outside of herself. She has heard screaming noises coming from outside of a window. You see, it does not matter where she goes to, or how many times she has moved, this scenario has continued in her life for years.

I went to visit with her once and she was shaking and crying because she said she had just heard a scary scream outside of her bedroom window. I didn't feel or hear these things, until my 2nd week of staying with her. One night in the dining room, I was there alone cooking dinner and setting the table when I heard the most chilling scream outside of her window. I've never heard anything like that again in my life. I cannot describe it but it sounded other worldly.

I attempted to salt with sea salt and I burned sage and said prayers. I used the Our Father. When I left she said her place felt better for awhile and that she had not been hearing things. Then she told me over the holidays it returned.

A psychic came to her home and during the visit the psychic said she could sense the presence of a male. And the description was her ex. Her ex is still alive.

So what could be happening here? Her ex has found away to do this from a distance with spells? Or, has he summoned a demon?

I hope that I can find answers for her as we have been trying to settle this for years. Her health is not good from all of this.

Sorry that this is so long. Thank you.

I have seen where people summoned things and made a deal to have them cause havoc with other people, whether or not it's actually a demon is another story. Demons are notoriously hard, nigh impossible to control so if it were a demon there would have had to have been some kind of deal made or something along those lines.

The actual appearance the psychic described, I wouldn't put much weight into that alone - most demons and other entities can shapeshift. It it were a summoned thing - it may have been using the ex's form as a sort of signature or something along those lines.

Then there's also the possibility that he's done some sort of spell or something along those lines and with that there's no telling. There's no set guidelines for exactly how a spell works and what spells there are. In the end, it all boils down to intent.

If the salt barriers failed, then you are not dealing with a demon. I would need to talk to you further to get more insight into the situation.

Originally posted by OrphenFire
I like your information and the way you presented it. Very interesting. Now for some questions.

1) If daemons are interdimensional beings, why do our lowly human rituals even function to summon them?

In this particular thread, I speak of the entities known as demons - not daemons, they are two different things. I don't know the exact mechanics of how summonings push a call over to the other side and pull them through. What I can best approximate it to is the intense focusing of will and the effects it has in regards to the demon, wherever it may be. May act as an attractor.

2) How does a religious person even succeed in banishing an interdimensional creature?

By using their particular faith's methods. Remember a lot of magick users and law of attraction fiends will tell you that it's all on your will and the focusing of it.

3) Why is the language of Latin more effective for banishing than say German, Arabic, or English?

It's not. You could use any spoken language - it's the words and the focusing of intent. I prefer latin, I know others who use Spanish - English - Korean. It just depends.

4) Do daemons have physical form when they are in their own reality/universe? If so, where does their physical body go when they are summoned? What happens to it when they are banished?

Again, I'm speaking of 'demons' not 'daemons' and as far as their "true" forms - there really is no way of knowing short of finding a way to jump over to wherever it is they are and that sounds impossible.

reply to post by DrJay1975


Don't take offense but you remind me a lot of the witch doctor in constantine "Midnite". An experienced guy who fought off 14 or something demons alone without breaking a sweat.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/cf1cc27c99d0.jpg[/atsimg]

and mf_luder "Chas Kramer" the kid who kept chasing behind constantine being a fanboy and reading books about exorcisms.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/250bc62b8ba3.jpg[/atsimg]

Originally posted by snowspirit
So, If I am dreaming/having nightmare and I feel my inner being being pulled out of my physical being, am I fighting off something real when I start to yell NO? Seriously, I was getting these for a while. It was not pleasant. Once I was looking at a friend's ouiji board, and feeling like I missed the one I used to have, and had horrible nightmares that night. I remember yelling in my dream "I only touched it". I have also at times closed my eyes and seen the strangest types of faces, but I stopped being afraid of them at one point, because I felt like I was more of an observer, and that they couldn't hurt me, or have me. It has been a while since I had any of those nightmares. They felt so real.
I am not a religious person, because I feel that no one knows for sure until they are dead. I have had some freaky things happen too when awake, but nothing scary, just weird.

i too have played with a quija board and ive also experienced those dreams you talk about where it feels like your being picked up by a force and dragged across the room by an invisible figure