Israeli Commando: 'We Had No Choice': (I beleive this guy more than anyone else)

reply to post by BingeBob

And those items arent essential to survival...The blockade isnt to make you feel comfortable...its the other way around

So note books,pens,paper and such are for making people "comfortable"?..realy
And here i was thinking they were everyday things that made life and business possible...you know like keeping inventory in a shop..taking notes on day to day life...Oh...now i get it.
And for anyone thinking life in Gaza is not so bad..

According to the United Nations Relief and Works Agency, the number of refugees living in abject poverty in the Gaza Strip has tripled since the blockade began. These families lack the means to purchase even the most basic items, including soap, school materials and clean drinking water. According to the UN, more than 60 per cent of households are currently "food insecure".

Link

But then again you can't trust them commie socilast hippy bleading heart liberal NGO's can ya.....WAKE UP!!!

reply to post by mack37


Right...So the blockade is working...whats your point?

"Food insecure" What kind of made up verbiage is that???

Sounds like "Man Caused Disaster" So they arent starving...they just cant go down to 7-11 and buy a slurpee every day

[edit on 5-6-2010 by BingeBob]

reply to post by BingeBob


Mass unemployment, extreme poverty and food price rises caused by shortages have left four in five Gazans dependent on humanitarian aid. As a form of collective punishment, Israel’s continuing blockade of Gaza is a flagrant violation of international law.

that's my point.

reply to post by BingeBob

Millions of people worldwide suffer from hunger and undernutrition . A major factor contributing to this international problem is food insecurity. This condition exists when people lack sustainable physical or economic access to enough safe, nutritious, and socially acceptable food for a healthy and productive life. Food insecurity may be chronic , seasonal, or temporary, and it may occur at the household, regional, or national level. Read more: Food Insecurity - nutrition, deficiency, body, health, protein, vitamin, weight www.faqs.org...

Link

NOT made up.

reply to post by BingeBob


I guess it's hard for you to get ya head around that concept...are you off to macD's for a big mack then....have one for me....lol

Originally posted by Blue_Jay33
Curious that they took guns from the Israeli's opened fire and not 1 Israeli solider died, they would have gone for head shots to kill, if they were so murderous.

I saw the weapons removed from the ship so it is obvious the people were not pacifists.

But this is spin, both sides are spinning this.

Yeah, I saw the "weapons" too. As a matter of fact, those "weapons" weren't "weapons" at all. It was stuff that was laying around the ship that were used for self defense when they were illegally fired upon by the psychopathic Israelis. Anyone that calls those tools weapons are simply making excuses for the Israelis because they don't want to believe the situation that is occurring right before their eyes. Or, they're just simply DELUSIONAL.

You're trying to complain that the people who were fired upon were not Pacifists??? Let me tell you right now...Pacifism goes out the window when someone is firing bullets at you. Would you have preferred that they didn't defend themselves at all so that the Israelis could have gotten a higher body count??? And not a single ONE of those activists had guns, knives, or anything of the sort. They had tools that were already on the ship that they used to defend themselves.

There's no spin here. Israel was CAUGHT RED-Handed doing what Israel does best...terrorism...plain and simple. Need I drop a reminder here...

It was the Europeans that were on board that caused the public outrage after viewing what the Israelis did to INNOCENT people. Imagine what would have happened if the Israelis had accidentally killed ONE OF THE EUROPEANS. OH MY GOD...The UK would already be at war with Israel, and America would be back peddling as usual trying to save face as their little brother commences to getting their butts kicked by the European Union. But, as it were, Israel only killed a few "WORTHLESS" Muslims, so people like YOU can rest easy and place the blame back on the Western made Boogeyman of the Islamic faith without having to lose a seconds worth of sleep.

So, let me get this straight... in this age, even self defense is viewed upon by the "hopelessly brainwashed" as aggression, and something as simple as a pipe from aboard a ship can be considered a "viable" weapon against machine guns being wielded by highly trained COMMANDOS. Is that close? Am I representing your opinion with accuracy here?

HAVE YOU LISTENED TO YOURSELF???

This is the reason why Ireland even sent an additional ship just to see what the Israelis would do. As a matter of fact, Israel had NO RIGHT to even attack that ship because it had not yet entered THEIR territory. If you choose to remain blind, at least have your story straight.

There was not a single Israeli commando that lost their lives, but 9 Muslims did. So, where's the SPIN??? Maybe you're forgetting that there were IMPARTIAL people who saw this atrocity which included WHITE Europeans and Westernized Media Professionals who were SICK to their stomachs because of the Israeli aggression that they had to witness while sharing this boat with activists and Turks. There's no spin here except Israeli lack of admittance to their psychosis.

Weapons...LOL. You mean like the WMD that we found in IRAQ??? It seems you're quick to believe anything that the media tells you...as long as it fits with your predetermined view of reality.

Final example: Lets say someone were to come to your home with a 9 millimeter and start shooting while attempting to break into your house. They make their way into your home, and somehow you're able to neutralize the assailant by smashing a lamp over his head because its the only thing at your disposal. The next thing that you know, you're being arrested in your own home for defending yourself against this lunatic. Then the lunatic decides to sue you because of your act of aggression against him. The next thing that you know, you're having to explain your side of the story to the American public for nothing more than trying to protect you and your family. That's right. Now, you're the criminal. Now, you're the one that is viewed as aggressive because someone claimed that you were simply adding your own, "SPIN" to the story. Believe it or not, this exact scenario has happened before because people LIKE YOU have made it possible for a CRIMINAL to get away with MURDER because of the subjective way that they CHOOSE to view the story, as opposed to looking at the HARD facts that surround the event. Those commandos didn't even get a splinter, while people died and were injured on the other side of the coin.

I bet you're the type of person that claims that there are two sides of a story when a woman gets raped as well. "Spin," as you call it. Tell me, when a woman gets raped...DOES SHE DESERVE IT??? Does she cease to be a pacifist, in your eyes, when she has the AUDACITY to defend herself against the advances of a lunatic??? Was she asking for it???

Why don't you put that into perspective and come again when you've applied some critical thought to this situation.

Jesus wept.

Much love to all...


[edit on 5-6-2010 by EvolvedMinistry]

Take a look...knives...metal pipe...hammers...purpose made clubs...gas masks...body armor...slingshots with ammunition bottles...



I mean really...are we still arguing that this cruise ship was bringing babyfood?

Omg THEY HAD COOKING KNIVES!!!!!!! Call the press.. I wonder if they had an ultra hi-tech Ginsu knife on board!!! IT can cut through an aluminum can for Pete's Sake! The Horror!!!!!! / end sarcasm.

If you take that evidence for arms trafficking to Gaza and this is what they are transporting why in the hell does Israel even care? They are goddamn knives! Scary. Perfect anti-tank weapons huh?

It is pretty easy to point fingers at either party in the age-old palestinian / Israel debate.

Just play it out in your own head and try to be objective. Lets say the U.N. decided that a huge chunk of your country will now be forfeited to a minority group without that countries say-so. So they move in but then decide to build walls and start occupying space that was not initially part of the deal.

All the sudden you are going to the grocery store down the street but it is blockaded. Bulldozers are tearing down your neighborhood and armed soldiers are threatening anyone from trying to stop them. Over the years it gets worse and thousands are turned homeless and poverty is running rampant.

A group forms that has had enough and pledges to stop this inhumanity before it destroys their people. Of course the people will want that kind of protection. Someone willing to fight the "man". So they responds with "terror" attacks because they would be retarded to go up against this invading nation which in turn is supplied by the worlds largest military.

Now every time this rich nation is Retaliated against for their transgression against these poor people who are fighting for their right to live it is spun to be "anti-semite" and undeserved for this peace loving occupier. After all they only plow schools , bomb commercial districts, and treat their neighbors like a roach infestation. Surely, these people should not be able to defend themselves from this great humanitarian nation of Israel.

Israel on the other hand has good reason to be afraid. Every nation surrounding them has wanted their nation to wither. They should be on the lookout, but taking over territories forcefully and with impunity is not helping their cause. It is only making it worse for them. Just like policing the Middle East is doing for American popularity there. They will only end up hating us more.

Long story short. You can call Hamas a "terrorist" organization just as well as you can call Israel one. Just because one doesn't worship "Allah" and condones jihad doesn't make its actions any less of a form of terror. Terrorism isn't bound by religion or by race. It is by hatred, actions, and intent.

Why can we do air raids on a country and it not be terrorism? Because our weapons are more advanced? Well shame on the others for not having the billions we spend as a "civilized" society to blows us up with.

As I think about it more and more it is hard not to condone any act of war between two countries with such a spread in power as not being terrorism.
Whether it be rickets or tank , air raids to IEDs in truth they are terrorizing each other and convincing us they both have good intentions.

Originally posted by IamBoon
Omg THEY HAD COOKING KNIVES!!!!!!! Call the press.. I wonder if they had an ultra hi-tech Ginsu knife on board!!! IT can cut through an aluminum can for Pete's Sake! The Horror!!!!!! / end sarcasm.

If you take that evidence for arms trafficking to Gaza and this is what they are transporting why in the hell does Israel even care? They are goddamn knives! Scary. Perfect anti-tank weapons huh?

You guys are still using the 5 D's of dodgeball on this issue...

THIS SHIP WASNT CARRYING AID FOR GAZA...IT WAS A SHIP LOADED WITH TERRORISTS!

ter·ror·ism [ter-uh-riz-uhm]–noun
1.the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. for political purposes.
2.the state of fear and submission produced by terrorism or terrorization.
3.a terroristic method of governing or of resisting a government.


[edit on 5-6-2010 by BingeBob]

reply to post by BingeBob


By that definition of terrorism which is basically true then Israel by using a blockade to weaken an enemy that it constantly undermines is also guilty of terrorism. By that definition any act of aggression or attempt to manipulate politics by use of force is also intended terrorism.


There is no proof of terrorism in connection with the boat being raided. And , by your standards , the vessel raided by Israeli forces was protecting itse;f from terrorism. It is kinda weird to see it that way when you are brainwashed into thinking terrorism has to come from people who are Islamic and do not control tanks and speak Arabic. Sad really.

reply to post by IamBoon




Its truely sad to for you to think that anyone who holds a different view from you is a racist.

The embargo is not a new tactic. The embargo on Gaza has been in place for some time and nobody cared internationally until a bunch of terrorists were killed while conducting terrorist operations.

reply to post by BingeBob


Never said anything about racism.... All I said was that most people hold the view that in order to be a terrorist you have to be Islamic, come from the Middle East, and speak Arabic. I am sad you cannot comprehend that well.

And I have always cared about human rights... But who are you to one group "terrorists" and not the other? Seems by the very definition of terrorism that not only is Hamas a Terrorist group but so is Israel.

Seems kinda of one-sided of you. Just because Hamas doesn't have a superpower backing them and Israel does doesn't make their actions any less oppressive. Are armies not terrorists just because of their uniforms and quality of their weapons? Many people and yourself, by your definition , seem to realize Israel is just as much a terrorist state as you claim Hamas to be.

I am sad too...Because you pretty much defined racism and didnt realize it...

rac·ism (rā'sĭz'əm)
n.
1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

So you said that I only attribute middle eastern, muslim, arabic speaking peoples to be terrorists. In which case I would ONLY choose that certain race/creed of people to be terrorists. I never claimed to believe such things and i dont.

The FACTS of the case are that this CRUISE SHIP was loaded with people who are suspected (by the US CIA) to have ties to terror groups. And the people on the ship ENGAGED IN VIOLENT ACTS TO FURTHER THEIR POLICTICAL AGENDA especially under guise of bringing aid to a people who are currently under embargo.

The difference between Gaza and Israel is that Gaza supports terrorist acts. If Gaza partnered with Israel to find the people responsible for launching rockets onto Israeli niehborhoods then Gaza probably wouldnt be under embargo right now.

The TERRORISTS that shoot rockets at Israel do so and then mix in with the civilian population. Israel is a country...a government with a standing army that carries out objectives to protect its people. A government that sends a uniformed army into another country carrying out a police action is not by definition a terrorist act - no matter how emotional you get about it.

reply to post by BingeBob


Hamas is a democratically elected party with a standing army. And you cannot add to a definition after the fact just to support your belief that Israel does not commit terrorism. THey attack civilians and were the ones who started bulldozing and claiming land as they saw fit.

I never said you and in "YOU" I meant it as a generalization... a common flaw in the way I write.


Just because a nation has an army and a flag doesn't mean that when it murders , it is not longer called murder. Just like when Hamas attacks Israeli expansions it is in defense of the Palestinians land. They have no other choice but to fight that way. They do not have an army to counter Israels. They must fight anyway they can. And you, and I mean YOU this time, condone Israel acts against peasants and civilians because they have tanks and better equipment? You expect the oppressed to sit back and be oppressed?


Like I said, you need to comprehend better and not be so blinded by yourself. I dunno why you side with one over the other when it is all wrong. Are you bound religiously? Do you believe that any state from the Middle East that uses god as a motivator to war is a terrorist state?

Originally posted by IamBoon
Omg THEY HAD COOKING KNIVES!!!!!!! Call the press.. I wonder if they had an ultra hi-tech Ginsu knife on board!!! IT can cut through an aluminum can for Pete's Sake! The Horror!!!!!! / end sarcasm.

If you take that evidence for arms trafficking to Gaza and this is what they are transporting why in the hell does Israel even care? They are *snip* knives! Scary. Perfect anti-tank weapons huh?

So, at first, the anti-semitic crowd was saying there were no weapons. Now that there is evidence, you try to rationalize what they found by stating these are cooking knives. They're not pipes or clubs..it's just railing! You'd find some excuse to marginalize this, no matter what was presented to you.

Fact is you support Hamas. And Hamas does not recognize Israel, which is one reason the blockade was enacted 4 years ago. Hamas has had its share of issues with the blockade in the past by confiscating aid and selling to the highest bidder. Makes you wonder if those "democratically elected" really care about the people they claim to represent.

[edit on 5-6-2010 by Freenrgy2]

reply to post by IamBoon


So youre saying that Hamas sent uniformed soldiers to shoot rockets at Israel?

Gaza/Hamas isnt serving their people very well if they dont do everything they can to allieviate this situation...i.e. Make a joint campaign to oust the terrorist groups firing rockets...

You know, Nazi Germany wasnt a terrorist group. It was a country bent on world domination. And if you told me a story where a group of individuals got together and started killing 1940's german civilians to make a point that they didnt like polka music, i would tell you that the group killing the german civilians was a terrorist group.


Also what do you think would happen if Canada started lobbing rockets into Maine (i know they probably would only hit a moose)...We would cut them off from the rest of the world too. Make them hurt until they smarten up and come back to the good side


[edit on 5-6-2010 by BingeBob]

Originally posted by BingeBob
The TERRORISTS that shoot rockets at Israel do so and then mix in with the civilian population. Israel is a country...a government with a standing army that carries out objectives to protect its people. A government that sends a uniformed army into another country carrying out a police action is not by definition a terrorist act - no matter how emotional you get about it.

This is a classic argument. That essentially it is only terrorism when they do it. Un-uniformed combatants attack uniformed combatants in their own country, it's called terrorism. Uniformed combatants deliberately assault civilians, it's called legitimate military action. We reserve the dirty words for the deeds of others and describe ours in a sanitized, technical way.

Originally posted by JohnnyElohim
reply to post by Libertygal

 

This was an allegation from a single French magistrate, not a fact. In fact all of the ties beyond the diplomatic ones are allegations and most of the allegations come from Israel.

Allegation != Terrorist.

There are allegations that Israeli snipers target Palestinian children and laugh at it. Shall we bring unsupported allegations into the dialog, then? There are plenty to go around.

[edit on 5-6-2010 by JohnnyElohim]

Funny. There are allegations against "Israeli Snipers", so you are justified in villifying all Israel, but allegations against the others... are 'just allegations', not to be taken seriously...

Thanks, bub. I needed to start my day with a good laugh!

[edit on 2010/6/5 by nenothtu]

reply to post by JohnnyElohim


NONONONONONO

a group that launches assualt against civilians in attempt to push an agenda is a terrorist