Question for ATS members - Facebook or "Conspiracy" Book?

As everyone knows (or should know by now), we've been working on a great deal of behind-the-scenes improvements for ATS in 2010. The "social component" of ATS has been an increasingly important piece of what our users expect, and our profile pages have been a partial step in that direction.

One of the items on the list has been a long-anticipated increase in social networking integration via an official Facebook "fan" page and various related tools. However, recent news and serious questions about Facebook's severe disregard for member privacy -- and especially their most-recent efforts focused on data-mining everything they can learn about FB users -- we're now reluctant to push this part of our expansion forward. Even at the expense of discarding the work accomplished by a trusted developer whom we've already paid.

But rather than make a rash decision, because there are a ton of people on FB, I thought it would make sense to make our concerns known, and see what our members think.



Facebook

Lot's of people are already there, and generally speaking, nothing anyone does online is entirely safe from privacy incursions. However, it seems as though Facebook privacy concerns are reaching a new level of serious concern.

If you're an ATS member with a Facebook page, are you concerned? And if you are, have you ended or otherwise limited your Facebook involvement?

If you're an ATS member without a Facebook page, have these recent news articles and related information caused you to no longer consider using Facebook (if you ever did at all)?

(SIDE NOTE: We've successfully tested methods whereby links to FB from ATS, and links from FB to ATS cannot be profiled and included in the data mining performed by FB.)



"Conspiracy" Book

One alternative that we're seriously considering is the launch of a high-privacy social network geared specifically toward members with an affinity for the kinds of topics covered on ATS. One of our internal working names is "TinBook," and would be targeted not just for ATS members, but frequent users of all "alternative" and "subversive" (as apparently classified by the current occupiers of the White House) web sites.

This "Facebook for Conspiracy Theorists" would contain the same standards of fanatical privacy protection employed here on ATS. No data mining. No server logs retained. No profile trolling. No clickstream tracking. No topic preference profiling. No sharing of your info to anyone. While the available tools and social components would be very similar (if not identical) to what is offered by Facebook, the operations and management would be diametrically different.

So the question is, if we were to lunch such a new site/service, would you use it. And if you did, would it cause you to abandon Facebook?



Thanks, in advance, for helping us work out this rather big decision.

First post! Woohoo!

I support an ATS style of Facebook, or 'Tinbook' as you say.

I currently have a Facebook, but would prefer to use an alternative source to communicate with people on ATS.

My vote is for 'Tinbook'.

[edit on 5/10/10 by Misoir]

Its funny you should ask.
I deactivated my account already because of privacy concerns.
If you guys made a safer more private version then I would be willing to jump onboard.

I HATE FACEBOOK!!!!

Edit to ask....Would the T&C apply there as well??

[edit on 10-5-2010 by DrumsRfun]

[edit on 10-5-2010 by DrumsRfun]

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


I would use it. I just want to know how to get all of my friends here...some arent really into the conspiracy part, they just like to have "fluff" conversations that dont require brain power.


BTW, there is a group on FB that is demanding that they not charge after July 9, 2010...or people will leave....

[edit on 5/10/2010 by rangersdad]

I do use farcebunk, my main excuse being I have friends scattered around the country and the world - it's a nice and easy way to keep in contact.

Sometimes I use it to publish interesting links I find on ATS or other sites to let people be aware of them too.

I wouldn't abandon farcebunk on the basis I have a lot of friends that only use that. I'm also well aware of the security issues involved with the site, yet also feel that if any on wants to Big Brother me, they'll be able to do it anyway - given enough effort.

I'd quite happily use an ATS/farcebunk application, although would prefer to actually see any "social-networking" integrated into my ATS profile here... I think the U2U system could do with a bit of an overhaul/modernisation - aside from that I'm quite happy with my profile, I wouldn't particularly feel the need to air my personal life with constant status updates

Yes the conspiracy book all the way.

I have a facebook page and never use it.

However I would like it if the account owner could decide for him/her self if they want to share personal info.
Please don't prohibit it just advice against it ?

So the question is, if we were to lunch such a new site/service, would you use it. And if you did, would it cause you to abandon Facebook?



Thanks, in advance, for helping us work out this rather big decision.

In two words....YES PLEASE!!....I use fb, but grudgingly....I find it not only hopelessly superficial and indiscrete, but just really damn annoying somehow....constant application thingies and sending people hugs and stuff....bah humbug. The only thing that makes me keep it is that so many people use it, and it's a good way to get in touch with people you may not have seen for a while.

So yeah.....and ATS facebook would be just delicious. Thank you very much in advance.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


The only way I would use it is if it was integrated into ATS and used the same ATS login. I don't go to BTS right now because of the hassel...so I don't think I would go to "TinBook" for the same reason.

I'm on Facebook...but wouldn't become a fan of an ATS page. Wouldn't want to mix real life "me" with ATS "me".

i currently do not use facebook, due to my own tinfoil theories on the network.

having an ATS version would be great for us super paranoid type.

Originally posted by DrumsRfun
If you guys made a safer more private version then I would be willing to jump onboard.

In total agreement here, I have never considered joining facebook due to privacy concerns, but would definitely join an ATS "private" version.

And since it wouldn't be an ATS only site, it would draw even more like minded people together.

in my opinion.....

When I was 15, i would use it like crazy.

Now, i have deleted my facebook page, not because of privacy or conspiracies surrounding it, but because its only use to me was to talk to local people i knew, but a i figured a phone would do just as well.

Too me, Facebook is mainly about ego, but indeed there are some very exposing things about it. Its one of those things that add up into the total amount of information about you, and facebook is really personal, so its easy to tell who you are via all of your wall posts, ect.

Tinbook sounds like an amazing idea, in which i think a lot of people would use. There are endless possibilities you could add to a website such as that one.

I say go for it, its one of those things that are bound to be a success.

Aren't we already networking?

[edit on 10-5-2010 by broahes]

The internet has made our lives almost open books. I too have a Facebook account but am unwilling to join ATS with it. This decision is due to the anger some thread posters generate toward fellow posters. I and everyone else use they real name on Facebook, on ATS I wish to remain just Rhain.

Thanks for the thought though.

Rhain



[edit on 10/5/10 by Rhain]

Personally I wouldn't dare use face book nor would I encourage anyone else too... I can say that as I had one of the very first accounts there... it was okay when it was just a few of us, but once it made it big it became a target for every kind of low-life

They just have a bad history, hacks, viruses, security issues... they are very slow to respond to these attacks...

I think this is very funny...

I've been saying for a long time that ATS is turning into Facebook and is gearing more towards the Facebook/social networking arena and moving away from the serious conspiracy topics and alternative chat.

And this kinda confirms that..


Anyway, yeah... facebook sucks and they're very dodgy too.... and privacy is not an issue there.. as it is I've had several suggestions to befriend ATS members.... and this is Facebook suggesting them..... How the hell do they know I'm a member here and who all the other members are?

Dodgy...


If you're going down this route, and you clearly are, then I would rather have an ATS style "tinbook" and have your style of privacy and vigilance behind the scenes.


Personally speaking and just being totally honest, Id rather not have either, forget all this "Social networking" rubbish that's clearly just aimed at kids with pocket money and so on, and get back to focusing on the site here and making it great again.

But I also support ATS in making money and furthering themselves as a business so if you're gonna do it, do your own version and don't go near facebook.

[edit on 10/5/10 by blupblup]

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


It would really depend on what it's like.

I can't ever see me leaving Facebook though to be honest, it's far to easy to get in contact with my friends etc via Facebook, but I would defo consider using ATS' version if it was decent.

As long as it doesn't have all the 'Farmville' nonsense!

AlienVille - NEW AND EXCLUSIVE TO CONSPIRACY BOOK!

Please stop sending me Grey Aliens :shk:



[edit on 10/5/10 by LiveForever8]

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


I personally would not use it. I don't use any of the social networking sites and don't plan to use them.

Personality I think linkages to more public domains would ultimately harm ATS. One of the things that is terrific about the site is that you don't know who you're discussing something with. Thinking about the perspective absent knowing the age, location in many cases, sex and background of the person makes for a richer and more interesting debate environment, IMO.

I also think making it more "maintsteam" detracts from the feel of the site. Its a site for predominately serious folks who want to debate and discuss things in a thoughtful way. Thats exactly the opposite from the tripe that folks put on Facebook.

You've hit a home run with this site the way it is and marginal usability enhancements and some look and feel enhancements to make it seem fresh is all I would recommend, not changing the achitecture or integration with other sites

I love how facebook comes up with advertisements in the right portion of the screen based off what my marriage status is, where my employment has been, and attempts to generalize my desires. Its a joke, but a clever one at that. - It's not the only site that does it, but its the one I probably give away the most personal information on about my own history.

I would enjoy seeing a conspiracy version of this, mainly because I think it would break down some personal barriers between some of the user's who keep so much about themselves anonymous. IMO ATS forum website is doing fine as it is, even with the small bit of social networking inside it.

It would at least be more interesting if you guys got together, profiled us, and put up some advertisements based off our wild conspiracy habits or searches lol

I would definately prefer an ATS version of social networking (Tinbook) ... I do have a FB but rarely use it and when I do it is usually to interact / chat, with my grown-up children who are scattered around the country.

But I believe a specially designed 'conspiracy tinbook' would be much better suited to our needs.

Great Idea

Woody

SO,

I have to first add my own .$02 to the Facebook conspiracy.

I was not aware of the new "data mining" practices used on the site until I checked my cookie records and found several new cookies from Facebook, which essentially raped my browser of information about all of the other websites I have visited, what times of day I have visited them, and for how long. I only know this through a programmer friend of mine who was able to figure out some of the code behind these new cookies. So, I went to my Facebook privacy settings, and lo and behold, found a whole new page that was dedicated to trying to pass out your information to anybody within earshot. I proceeded to decline all of this stuff, turned it all off, and blocked my page from sharing ANYTHING with ANYONE. Well, now, nothing appears on my info section of my Facebook page, as everything you talk about is "linked" to a webpage or webservice. If it wasn't for the fact that I have so many business contacts, relatives, and friends on facebook within easy contact, I would have shut mine down ages ago. I don't think linking ATS with the "mainstream" Facebook is the best of things, as we take pride on the fact that we are pseudo-anonymous on this page, and by linking to Facebook, it would raise concerns about keeping our anonymity intact. From a business stand point, I think it could raise revenue in the long run, however, I think our privacy and anonymity is much more important than the all-mighty buck.

As far as creating an ATS-esque social networking site, I think the profiles on ATS serves that purpose. I don't know personally if I would be interested in a "Tinbook" as you have put it, and it would probably not stop me from using Facebook, for the reasons that I listed above.

Being only a 4.5 month old member, I have to say that I enjoy the fact that ATS is a secure place to discuss these "off-beat" topics, and I applaud all of the strides that you and your staff have made to make this a safe place to discuss these topics. I would say, don't change a thing, because what you have now is working quite well.


Just my .$02


Peace be with you.

-truthseeker