Hawaii governor announces 'exact' place of Obama birth. No wonder there is confusion!

reply to post by kozmo


Thank you for that. Which begs the question, if one can request and obtain a LFBC, then why is Hawaii saying his was destroyed in a fire?

My bigger question is, (I asked this the other day but no one responded). Has anyone verified a record acrchive fire actually happened, and if so-what records were actually destroyed?

I did a search of the net and didn't find any stories. And, ususally those facilities are very well potected from fire. Anyone?



[edit on 5/8/2010 by anon72]

Originally posted by butcherguy
reply to post by K J Gunderson

 

Not lost, as stated in this thread repeatedly. It has been viewed by a government employee to verify it's existence!

Wow, when did I say Obama's had been lost?

You just like to turn the story away from the fact that Obama has what it takes to produce the long form, which we are told exists.

No, I just accept the fact that I know what a short form is and what it looks like so no need to see the long form which is a private document and not my business anyway. If you knew what the short form actually was, you would understand but instead you really really like ignorance in this matter and seem to plan on staying with that.

But he won't.
He is a smart guy, no question about that in my mind. So I am left to wonder why he doesn't just produce it.

If you want a new copy of your Hawaiian BC, YOU CAN NOT GET A LONG FORM EITHER. What is so hard about that to understand? They no longer issue them. What are you confused about?

You are not lost, neither am I.

You are half right.

Originally posted by anon72
reply to post by kozmo

 

Thank you for that. Which begs the question, if one can request and obtain a LFBC, then why is Hawaii saying his was destroyed in a fire?

Because Kozmo is lying through his fingers. It is not true and that is why he is having a hard time backing it up with anything other than him just saying so.

Going by some of your most recent threads, I see you only like and respond to people that promote the same ignorant lies with nothing to back them up as you do so I suppose Kozmos complete lack of evidence to back up his lie is exactly the kind of thing you think is just awesome.

I hope you are getting all this great evidence ready for court. Just hope no one on the other side looks anything - and I mean ANYTHING up.

reply to post by K J Gunderson


Sooooooo... I'm a LIAR!?!? That takes huevos the size of bowling balls to call someone a liar when they are NOT lying. I have requested, and received, a printed LFBC which was stored on microfiche with the County Recorder's office for the county within which I was born. So what of it?

And why should I enumerate for you the dozens of things which are pointing to OBama being a fraud? They have been presented ad nauseum, but you and your ilk have no desire to investigate them. You continue to dissemble and obfuscate instead. Fine with me. I could care less what YOUR opinion is on the matter. Many people believed the Earth was flat for thousands of years - even AFTER there was plenty of evidence to indicate otherwise. So, you are a flat-Earther - good for you!

Edited to add: I find hysterical irony in the fact that you demand evidence but have to receive any from Obama but yet you continue to guzzle that kool aid! Careful, wouldn't want you to fall of the edge of the Earth!

[edit on 8-5-2010 by kozmo]

Originally posted by kozmo
reply to post by K J Gunderson

 

Sooooooo... I'm a LIAR!?!? That takes huevos the size of bowling balls to call someone a liar when they are NOT lying. I have requested, and received, a printed LFBC which was stored on microfiche with the County Recorder's office for the county within which I was born. So what of it?

From what state? Is it one of the states that no longer issues them or does your state still issue them and you just do not understand the difference?

And why should I enumerate for you the dozens of things which are pointing to OBama being a fraud?

Because you waste time talking about them all over the place so how about listing them for once?

They have been presented ad nauseum, but you and your ilk have no desire to investigate them.

Then a link should be no issue for you.

You continue to dissemble and obfuscate instead. Fine with me. I could care less what YOUR opinion is on the matter. Many people believed the Earth was flat for thousands of years - even AFTER there was plenty of evidence to indicate otherwise. So, you are a flat-Earther - good for you!

LOL, ok.

Edited to add: I find hysterical irony in the fact that you demand evidence but have to receive any from Obama but yet you continue to guzzle that kool aid! Careful, wouldn't want you to fall of the edge of the Earth!

Not sure how you can say I have not gotten any evidence from Obama. If you mean where he was born, I have seen plenty of evidence. You have failed to show otherwise or debunk that evidence.

Let me know when you figure out what state you say you got your long form from oh and uh....why would I be expected to take your word without proof?

It kind works like this. I can just go to the department of health and see that they no longer issue long forms. Perhaps you can find a way to prove that the department of health is lying?

Maybe you do not know states differ from each other. Either way I cannot wait until you shut me up!

Originally posted by kozmo
What doesn't add up are the dozens of pieces of evidence that support that Obama is likely INELIGIBLE,

What pieces of evidence? The he said she said evidence? Do you think passing comments count as evidence under a court of law?

What else? That the Hawaiian short form birth certificate is fake? Which experts will you bring in to argue that point? The three mysterious members at atlas shrugged who showed absolutely no credentials (let along their identities) to their claims? Oh wait, the court has to take your word against Hawaiian officials over the authenticity of the birth certificate?

What evidence Kozmo? Please, list them for us here again.

[edit on 8-5-2010 by Southern Guardian]

Originally posted by vkey08
I do not believe that Mr Obama is telling the truth, I cannot put my finger on it, I have no verifiable info to back up my feeling, it's just that, a feeling.

And that there pretty much sums it up for the birthers. Atleast Vkey was honest here.

[edit on 8-5-2010 by Southern Guardian]

Originally posted by Southern Guardian

Originally posted by kozmo
What doesn't add up are the dozens of pieces of evidence that support that Obama is likely INELIGIBLE,

What pieces of evidence? The he said she said evidence? Do you think passing comments count as evidence under a court of law?

I know many of the things I have posted would count as evidence, or supporting testimony in a court of law if the people I have quoted were called to testify.

What have you shown as evidence?

What else? That the Hawaiian short form birth certificate is fake? Which experts will you bring in to argue that point? The three mysterious members at atlas shrugged who showed absolutely no credentials (let along their identities) to their claims? Oh wait, the court has to take your word against Hawaiian officials over the authenticity of the birth certificate?

The court doesn't *have* to take anyones' word. The court should hear the evidence and testimony, and make a decision based on merits, not standing. Not one case has been heard on merits. NOT ONE.

How about one non-mysterious expert?

Keyes v. Lingle: Case Dismissed; Forensic Examiner Disproves Online COLB

...forensic document examiner Sandra Ramsey Lines (pictured) has documented in an associated affidavit (PDF) the following:


2. I have reviewed the attached affidavit posted on the internet from “Ron Polarik,” [PDF] who has declined to provide his name because of a number of death threats he has received. After my review and based on my years of experience, I can state with certainty that the COLB presented on the internet by the various groups, which include the “Daily Kos,” the Obama Campaign, “Factcheck.org” and others cannot be relied upon as genuine. Mr. Polarik raises issues concerning the COLB that I can affirm. Software such as Adobe Photoshop can produce complete images or alter images that appear to be genuine; therefore, any image offered on the internet cannot be relied upon as being a copy of the authentic document.

3. Upon a cursory inspection of the internet COLB, one aspect of the image that is clearly questionable is the obliteration of the Certificate No. That number is a tracking number that would allow anyone to ask the question, “Does this number refer to the Certification of Live Birth for the child Barack Hussein Obama II?” It would not reveal any further personal information; therefore, there would be no justifiable reason for oliterating it.

4. In my experience as a forensic document examiner, if an original of any document exists, that is the document that must be examined to obtain a definitive finding of genuineness or non-genuineness. In this case, examination of the vault birth certificate for President-Elect Obama would lay this issue to rest once and for all. [emphasis mine]

The above clearly illustrates that it is impossible to determine eligibility based on the widely-circulated certification of live birth and that the only way to determine Barack Hussein Obama’s natural born citizenship status is to retrieve the currently-sealed certificate of live birth.

You will notice that the case was dismissed on a technicality (according to the judge, the Plaintiffs referred to the wrong Hawaiian statute(s)), not on content.

reply to post by christianpatrick


I also said that I highly doubted that Irish law superceded US Laws.

I also said I didn't have any further answers than what I said, but I would bargain that once the births began in this country, and they became Natural Born US citizens, that I seriously doubt Irish Law could be deemed to supercede US Law, hence negating the argument of dual citizenship.

For the bried amount of research I did, I found absolutely no mention of question of him carrying dual citizenship or dual nationality.

Can you cite some sources?

Originally posted by Libertygal


How about one non-mysterious expert?

Keyes v. Lingle: Case Dismissed; Forensic Examiner Disproves Online COLB

He is obviously wrong because his first argument is that it was created with photoshop and photoshop does not have an actual physical embossing feature but the BC clearly has a raised seal.

Other than that all he really says is 'I am smart and I think it is fake.' He does not actually present a valid argument why.

Originally posted by vkey08
Lets face it we got duped... we are now under the control of the Kenyan Master and there's nothing we can do about it...

Well.. there is something we can legally do about it... Vote Him Out... VHO.. 2012.... Remember it.

the KENYEN MASTER????? wow!!! that's a new name to me...but it does the trick of ramping up fear and loathing.

Originally posted by Libertygal
I know many of the things I have posted would count as evidence,
No, what you posted Libertygal was speculation. Infact I am actually awaiting for you to reply to a previous members post based on what you had posted:

Barry Dunham
Barack Dunham
Barack Obama
Barry Obama
Barry Soetoro
Barry Soetelo
Barak Obama
Barak Soetelo

Where is the evidence that he used all these names? You posted that it was 'possible', you speculated, yet you provided nothing beyond the sort.

Then you went to argue that evidence points to Obama having not legally changed his named back to Barack Obama. However you contradicted yourself here as you had not proven where Obama legally changed his name to Barry Soetoro. It was a name used, but was it a legal name? You provided no such evidence. Then you went so far as to argue that (based on speculation) that the president had to have been adopted. You failed to research on the fact that under Indonesian law at the time he could not have been adopted.

Your entire posts were based on speculation, based on suspicion, to which none prove at all as to how the president was born in Kenya. For your conspiracy to be true, you would need to argue that Hawaiian officials were involved in the cover up, that the 8 month pregnant mother of obama decided to hop on a 8 day plane trip worth $20,000 today to fly to a country she barely knew of, to take a battery of vaccinations before she gets there, to spend a couple of days only to rush back to Hawaii to announce it in the newspaper.

Look why don't you explain to us here what you think happened. From when Obama's mother left for Kenya, to who was involved in the cover up, to how and why his political rivals during the elections kept shut. Please of please fill us in on this theory of yours libertygal.

The court doesn't *have* to take anyones' word. The court should hear the evidence and testimony, and make a decision based on merits, not standing. Not one case has been heard on merits. NOT ONE.

No, thats another lie. Both Phillip Berg and Orly Taitz had their time in court, on numerous occasions, and on both cases their arguments were dismissed. Other birther lawsuits were dismissed because they followed around the same arguments that the courts refused to take as evidence enough.

Now please stop complaining about lawsuits, about what he/she said in a passing comment, about how Hawaiian officials are somehow being deceptive. Where is the evidence that Barack Obama was born in Kenyan. WHERE? Either put up or shut up.

[edit on 8-5-2010 by Southern Guardian]

reply to post by Southern Guardian


To be fair, a lot of court cases have been dismissed on lack of standing or because the court lacked jurisdiction. I can't recall any that were dismissed because the court said the case had no merit, or any that even made it far enough to have the merits heard to begin with.

Originally posted by jimmyx

Originally posted by vkey08
Lets face it we got duped... we are now under the control of the Kenyan Master and there's nothing we can do about it...

Well.. there is something we can legally do about it... Vote Him Out... VHO.. 2012.... Remember it.

the KENYEN MASTER????? wow!!! that's a new name to me...but it does the trick of ramping up fear and loathing.

Actually it was used not as a fearmongering title but more sarcastically, he is a master of oratory, I will not take that way from him, and he is at least afaik Kenyan by ancestry, so it kind of fits.. Don't always read too much into things, it may not be what you expect.

I was once called sarcastically the Nippie Master (I am half Japanese, and I am a master a one or more things) as a dig at me, but it wasn't used to create fear or loathing, just to be sarcastic.

Originally posted by K J Gunderson

Originally posted by Libertygal


How about one non-mysterious expert?

Keyes v. Lingle: Case Dismissed; Forensic Examiner Disproves Online COLB

He is obviously wrong because his first argument is that it was created with photoshop and photoshop does not have an actual physical embossing feature but the BC clearly has a raised seal.

Other than that all he really says is 'I am smart and I think it is fake.' He does not actually present a valid argument why.

There you go again - dissembling and obfuscating!

First of all, he didn't say it was done in Photoshop, he said using a program LIKE photoshop. Next, in the detailed description he expounded on the fact that this COLB was likely a REAL COLB that had been scanned and altered as evidenced by the digital artifacts surrounding the text. That would explain the seal. It would also explain why the number has been obliterated. But of course you knew all of that already, right?

With a crash a bang a boom a and big taste too - OH YEAH - HEY KOOLAID!!!

Originally posted by K J Gunderson

Originally posted by Libertygal


How about one non-mysterious expert?

Keyes v. Lingle: Case Dismissed; Forensic Examiner Disproves Online COLB

He is obviously wrong because his first argument is that it was created with photoshop and photoshop does not have an actual physical embossing feature but the BC clearly has a raised seal.

Other than that all he really says is 'I am smart and I think it is fake.' He does not actually present a valid argument why.

Ok this is where i can step in and call BS.. While you are technically correct about PS not having a physical embossing feature, there are many routines and actions within PS that could be used to simulate that effect, especially with the newer 3D versions (PS CS3-5 Extended). It is not outside the realm of possibility that was what was referred to, and to most people, myself included the results can look almost 100% real as if it was an embossed piece of paper. Maybe however you were not aware of that functionality from within the extended versions of PS, and if that is the case, it wasn't BS but just being uninformed.

The above was meant to illustrate a point that it could be done, not that I am suggesting that it was or was not done, I do not have a clue, nor really am I willing to investigate and try it myself, I have far too many projects at present to deal with, without spending time playing with the PS actions, I have used them before for other projects, and for importing bump maps into Lightwave to save time, and I am sure that someone who was so inclined could make something that looked real enough under JPEG compression to pass.

Originally posted by vkey08

Ok this is where i can step in and call BS.. While you are technically correct about PS not having a physical embossing feature, there are many routines and actions within PS that could be used to simulate that effect, especially with the newer 3D versions (PS CS3-5 Extended). It is not outside the realm of possibility that was what was referred to, and to most people, myself included the results can look almost 100% real as if it was an embossed piece of paper. Maybe however you were not aware of that functionality from within the extended versions of PS, and if that is the case, it wasn't BS but just being uninformed.

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!

Oh god that is good. So you actually think that the emboss filters in photoshop will appear three dimensional when viewd at an angle? I am quite familar with photoshop so you are going to have to tell me where I find a function that does this [atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3b0362910a58.jpg[/atsimg]



Oh god. Looking like something is embossed on a 2d screen and being able to turn it in the light and actually see the paper has been pressed are sooooo very very very different.

Calling bs? LOL!

The above was meant to illustrate a point that it could be done, not that I am suggesting that it was or was not done, I do not have a clue, nor really am I willing to investigate and try it myself, I have far too many projects at present to deal with, without spending time playing with the PS actions, I have used them before for other projects, and for importing bump maps into Lightwave to save time, and I am sure that someone who was so inclined could make something that looked real enough under JPEG compression to pass.

No, it cannot be done. I am not sure you know much about photoshop or how printers work.

reply to post by K J Gunderson


Oh really, I suggest you go to Adobe's site and start reading up on the 3D aspects of PS extended, I use it daily, now you are insulting what I do for a living (I do CGI work) and quite honestly, that's where I'm going to leave it, I have neither the time nor the inclination to get into it with you as I will inevitably say something that will get me banned ..



[edit on 8-5-2010 by vkey08]

Originally posted by kozmo

There you go again - dissembling and obfuscating!

First of all, he didn't say it was done in Photoshop, he said using a program LIKE photoshop.

LOL. Oh excuse me. I was obviously waaaaaaaaaaaay off. How about you tell me which program "like photoshop" that can creat 3 dimensional printouts. Maybe if you were not in such a hurry to respond to all of my posts just to attack me you could have taken the moment it would have to realize IT DOES NOT MATTER if it was photoshop or a program LIKE photoshop. NONE OF THEM DO THAT!

Next, in the detailed description he expounded on the fact that this COLB was likely a REAL COLB that had been scanned and altered as evidenced by the digital artifacts surrounding the text. That would explain the seal.

How would that explain the seal? If it were scanned and altered, it would need to be printed again - thus getting rid of the 3D seal. I am not sure you even understood what he said because what you just said makes way less sense.

It would also explain why the number has been obliterated. But of course you knew all of that already, right?

LOL, I will give you that one. Scanning a document and fudging it in a photoshop LIKE program could explain altered numbers but unfortunately you still have that pesky seal.

With a crash a bang a boom a and big taste too - OH YEAH - HEY KOOLAID!!!

LOL. You are pretty darn proud of yourself for someone who just said scanning it into an art program would explain the seal.

You guys are too funny, I love it!

Originally posted by vkey08
reply to post by K J Gunderson

 

Oh really, I suggest you go to Adobe's site and start reading up on the 3D aspects of PS extended, I use it daily, now you are insulting what I do for a living (I do CGI work) and quite honestly, that's where I'm going to leave it, I have neither the time nor the inclination to get into it with you as I will inevitably say something that will get me banned ..

LOL

LOL

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!

Are you lying or joking? You say you do CGI work and insist the photoshop can physically emboss paper?

OK which function would do that? Tell me how that is done. Link me to a tutorial.

Nothing you just said makes any sense. I have an early release of CS4 about 3 months ago. I am pretty familiar with it but I can go back to CS3 for you if that helps.

I really want to learn. I also do cgi work and have never once been able to force my printer to physically stamp paper so that it actually has a 3d seal pressed into he surface.

Help me out here.

Can anyone back you up on this? I really think you have no idea what you are talking about.