Spiritual Awakening- a taste of what it's like

reply to post by imans


I dont disagree with you, but I personally avoid using "positive" as a pointer.

"Positive" is often a mental judgment, the way we use the word commonly. It has no real meaning, as it means many things in many contexts to many people. Killing can be positive in the right situation, to the right person.

Because of this, I prefer to avoid the oppositions of positive, negative. If you are able to bring yourself into the moment, fully, you have no possibility of doing anything other than the "right/free/positive/good" thing that that moment calls for.

But I think I am with you on why you like that word, when you are flowing with What Is, it feels easy free and positive. When you are struggling against the unfolding, it feels bad negative and restrictive.

Ultimately, however, there is no objective positive/negative. What Is, Is, and it is Perfect. (like a sphere) We either accept it unconditionally, (love) or we struggle against it, (fear/hate). It is the act of struggling that causes us pain.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Well said my friend. I love this subject, maybe I can help a little too.

The brain tends to label things based on our previous conditioning, but in the long run we have no idea what situation is positive or negative for us. This may be the 10th time I have quoted this zen story on this website, but it sums up this point very well.

Once upon a time in a village in far away China, a boy got a horse as a gift on his 14th birthday. All the villagers said, “Wow, that’s great.”

But the Zen master said, “We shall see.”

Some months later as the young boy rode up the hill, he fell down and broke his leg. All the villagers said, “That’s terrible.”

“We shall see,” smiled the Zen master.

A few years later all the young men in the village had to go to war. But because the young boy had bent his leg, he couldn’t go. All the villagers said, “This fellow is lucky.”

“We shall see,” replied the Zen master.

We humans have trouble seeing the big picture. What we may get upset about and resist, may be saving us from a car accident. The only thing we can really do is trust in the present moment at all time.There is no positive or negative because in the big picture...it all fades away.


[edit on 13-5-2010 by bringthelight]

positive is the whole truth that is why too at the end of times positive is in opposition with negative as truth vs lies

what you maybe lack to see is that positive is an absolute sphere, that has levels which strat by certainty of present to certainty of living when it means more positive constantly

it is positive truth not positive creations
what you create is inherently not existing that is why it becomes irrelevant what you would consider there positive or negative

Originally posted by imans
positive is the whole truth

? well how about acceptance (negative),
that is also required for experience,
or truth.

truth be present moment now experience.

that is why too at the end of times positive is in opposition with negative as truth vs lies

? perhaps such a view might bring about your demise.

however the multiverse be infinite,
and those that understand unity,
can live in harmonious paradise for extended periods of time.

Unity be Or-ALL.

this or that.
all acceptable.

you can refine your personal experience,
but others require the same freedom.
remember even rocks have souls.

karma treat you,
as you treat we.

what you maybe lack to see is that positive is an absolute sphere,

any outgoing action is considered positive.
including bullets, grains, and information.

all these things require a negative,
or an entity to accept these gifts.

Acceptance, appreciation, belonging.

it is positive truth not positive creations

positive statements,
or constructive statements,
do create.

what you create is inherently not existing

actually if you can imagine something then it exists.
so once you've come up with the idea of what to do,
it has already come into existence.

it will be physically true just as soon as you experience it physically.

that is why it becomes irrelevant what you would consider there positive or negative

it is rellevant to you what you consider "correct" or "wrong".
based on the particular goals that you strive towards.

though different people can have different goal settings,
so have different ideas of what is correct for them.

[edit on 14-5-2010 by lowki]

reply to post by lowki


Love & Light passes the test, but its very hard, so by consequence this school/dvd player digital Universe is peopled by many in varying degrees of polarity in a certain level of channels. It takes a while to finally learn that only Love = happiness, and joy and progresses us, that Hurting = hurts for self as well, and consequence to action.

We do learn eventually, and we have a team watching over us. The duality is not about equal sides positive and negative. Its merely asking a question, unity or separation, the power of love, or the love of power. Our actions are graded, we ourselves are a major part of the grading team. Once you're grounded in Love & Light, you can never willingly, harm another, you'd rather die a thousand deaths, Hidden Hand was disinfo. Love never comes down from on High to brutalize us, controllers do though, and they want us to think, that Right is Wrong, Good is Evil, that we can obey authority seeing it as from On High, and go to war and brutalize families, twist the truth thats in our hearts.
This ensures karma, and that we don't pass the test,so they have perpetual slavery.

Love loves, though if someone from the Beyond comes down here, after passing the test to help, they can over time, become affected by the negative lower vibrations and be lost.

This is all about Love & Light. And we are always the Many In One, for from the moment we perceive our individuality in this lower vibrational, school, dvd player, flower that germinated an infinity ago in the a fertile garden in the beyond, where Infinities nestle into each other , and seed germination could be likened to the Big Bang, but where for the sake of schools we erect our Hologram, we become unique snowflakes, the many branches. We are becoming self, in addition to this school, doing it our way, and that infinite roll of film in quantum wierdness, stretches to Infinity in both directions, and in No Time, this is many many us's. Our Future Selves are our Higher Selves.

Its endless progression and the basic lessons are concerning Love & Equality, and awareness. Light = awareness, intelligence, consciousness, and soul. Slavery seems to be a constant component of negative systems, and it relates primarily to our ability to question things, become aware, know in our heart things aren't right and the Love to want to see it change.

Unity is what occurs, after this level, Universal Understanding, innermost thoughts understood, unity is not being reformed into One without identity though.

Eventually everyone will get the Love & Light needed, they'll know they need to yearn for a world of complete equality, where the greatest, where in No Time, there is no greater or smaller, and these are but concepts, is the smallest, poorest, most neglected, and ignored person. The person is literally the greatest in the Universe. And those with Love always assist, never hurt.

what is true about you and people in general you identify with ? the positive you are sure receiving always by living in creations
wether food or intelligent opportunities moves or of course money rewarding you for whatever hard labor or beauty experience or that love thing you belief being everything, as a god that would never let you down and always surprise you of knowing you and seeing you totally

so

that is how you accept that positive is negative because you are puting yourself out of it while meaning the true positive only you which is you effectively aware there so you dont need any reference to positive to be, you handle your moves

but objectively you are the positive fact existing there and nothing else

and effectively you will never mean to hurt yourself as positive existing do
and if there is any objective reason to move you would love to be more positive existing and move your whole being fact forward

they say how poor people are usually very kind, well for true people like me it is good to know how the world changed about that

but that belief was due to positive truth too, when there is no money as the source of you being positive out of everything counting in your head your possessions and gains to feel well as existing fact, the poor are counting on themselves alone so they yell for what they cant accept and smile for what they are happy to exist about, until they repeat their reasons of smiles and stuck there as positive ones

the base is positive one of any free move or expression, and it is the same base of gods it is the nature of void absolute positive life, now the problem or the issue is what the sense is something else

go to bases man it is positive forever, throw that crap they sell about love it is just an extra nothing real or certain and is responsable of so many crimes

what is called love is the sense of full one life that he would move constantly as a whole and not parts steps to assemble
but that god who can see you from above totally if he can make you sense his presence to love moving fully he can also break you down and claim being free above you, you cannot say then that god is meaning to love him always so he can keep the positive income to yourself from where you define you existing, otherwise it is your fault from what he is judging you and educating you as the sense of his love to you
you cannot say objectively that, the only thing that you can say there is that you are pissed off for not being treated as positive existing and you are trying to find reasons that can justify that fact lost, because you are an objective positive existing fact and dont take pleasure in hurting yourself

truth is about positive one as base and then positive life as also positive one according to move reference being always positive more

positive existence is all in between that truth realsations, it is the existing fact where many things happen in the whole fact
you talk to yourself sometimes i guess you know how you bargain with things that are parts of everything, that is existing moves, daily balance work or the whole

and the goal is of course always the same reference that define the balance being positive fact existing, that is why you see bargains between negative and positive it means we are the same existing fact, so positive have full interst in being whole positive that is why it gives to negative what it can and as a same existence the cannals are open for exchange and supports

but like you knwo i am sure, existence is in different level dimensions a positive fact or true

i never judge who perceive their positive existence from what they gain wether money or pleasures or simple joys, on the contrary i support them mentally always, because it is right noone is suppose to be forced to love truth and be geniun move positive one, the sense of living existence is positive life not being one, we dont have to choose values and so on
we have to choose having fun and enjoying to move

so the issue is gods really, for what they mean the same and share with use that fact life opportunity, but they abuse their positions to leave nothing to us and enslave us to their gains in exchange
they nourrish negative ones that never mean positive at the first place to the reference of one no have any idea about void nature to make them rule on us between us and giving them a whole dimension above us so they can mess with as it pleases them to get something from living sense
when they are not to positive one base any fact existing

god and gods should save the bases always of positive one they know before meaning their lives through, and not abuse the rights of others existence by denying existence base truth and claiming that existence being only to their lives
they are responsable of void nature truth being their base but also the source of opportunities, it cannot continue like that with bigger fixing rules as it wish, we can speak of bigger of bigger frm the voice of void source till void source would break them to respect what they know and stop the lies market

if they want to give moeny and lives dreams it must be till the end sure wether from them or from the moving for

consider that post an original reply that is in the vogue of all lives sense, you cannot judge what i say, it is still my right to say about everything wahtever i want, i am an individual positive existing one and i am fully in my rights expressions

observe how people are being enslaved to positive source, because there is no existence life but of postive living sense, it says how positive is the issue for what it is the exclusive base

now that is my point let find out whre is the true positive source so we can have a base, you know before dancing and making spectacular shows about love and all that groove that dont last as nothing

and that is real truth to an extent that people are becoming possessors of positive source, knowing how it is better then to live by simply keeping money and enslaving others with, when it is the condition of present existing positive fact, all they must do is showing their money spent as having fun and prooving how others dont to consider them not existing and them yes
it is all responsability of god and gods in general that some followed the logics well to incarnate perfectly

reply to post by lowki


acceptance is the word of your expression there, but why do you accept ? because you cant do otherwise or because you are meaning to not hurt yourself so you still believe that it is the best to remain positive one
while you can within always seek to realize its fact and the whole hypocrt way moving on

acceptance is not negative, on the contrary it is clear that the act of accepting else is positive self means of being very positive one

of course we disagree fundamentally, from what i mean freedom righrts and you mean assistance of bigger to you as positive source and ending realities

positive freedom is the right of everyone and everything base, like everyone say you got what you move for you dont get what bigger move to do with you, so if you dont move you stay positive free right as much as you can balance that fact to your awareness existence
this is the simplest obvious minimus right i would struggle for till the end and nothing else

So true.. can't wait to have mine!!

reply to post by imans


"now that is my point let find out whre is the true positive source so we can have a base, you know before dancing and making spectacular shows about love and all that groove that dont last as nothing"

Now were prey tell were will such a conundrum be as it is. No thing lasts forever but you'r right all that dancing and love groove caves under it's own pressure and lasts as nothing. Is not that based on personal relevant to mass opinion. "Were is the true positive source", is the call of the herd to pasture. Can you be more specific on that as a true source.

Originally posted by imans
positive is the whole truth that is why too at the end of times positive is in opposition with negative as truth vs lies

Here we may disagree, or perhaps it is just a language issue.

I do not believe that there is a battle between "light and dark" or "good and evil" at the ultimate level of truth. The apparent battle is our own creation.

"Positivity" is the source of "negativity," or vice versa. The idea of the one, creates the idea of the other. Without the one idea, the other does not exist either. So, the more positivity you seek to create, in the world, in yourself, wherever, the more evil you create at the same time.

There is a reason most traditions eschew "duality." Even the Judeo Christian tradition acknowledges that the idea that we could know "Good" from "Evil" was the original "sin." (And dont forget, "sin" originally meant "mistake" not the morally charged meaning it has now)

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


sorry to say that you dont seem to think truly that is why you cant see what is happening in truth
truth is absolute facts and not wills or moves identifications and results ends
when i say that the void is an objective reality one, that is true, which mean that any move there of void is absolute positive one, and cant be otherwise

now the issue as i explained it, is the opportunity of more then positive one objectively from that whole move of void to else as superior one

which in truth brought out the problem of all ones heritated that fact of being ones moves absolutely without being it really and moving for more and not for positive one present first

and that is why darkness is associated with lies and greed, when you move for more without actualizing present objective fact existing, it means how you are meaning to take advantage from a sense realisations absolutely hoping that it wont ever be absolutely true, so you could always mean being more without beinganything at all

the dimension of ultimate truth is the dimension above that would never mean to get something of dimension below, so it is the true positive one dimension, that by being positive truly absolutely is always objective positive more same, as it is always objective more positive a will of it would be always objective and cannot mean ones death, it could lead to their moves death when they are not according to the objective positive more will, but it cannot induce a negative result on what is objectively existing on smaller one dimension

we are talking about negative result here on subjects and not on world life objective realities, thiis say fully the presence of bad as evil powerful force against truth

we see how your means are about one truth being wills, one truth is not free will, you cannot will something unless you are one complete that know itself from its objective constance as full absolute one fact existence, that is not in needs to be one
and the will must then be justified by something else then more, and this is the issue how you cannot be complete one even if you are like everyone from one base absolutely positive, unless you act as present positive one
the truth of one is one concept one, but also realistically it must always only one absolutely before meaning anythign

i insist on that thought to clarify my subjective sense of being that i never hear about from others, or anywhere, you are always what you realize objectively as absolute fact reality, you are not genetically, that would be the whole reality one and not you
you must act in freedom space reference truth to mean or will for yourself a reality you do
what is above interfer only from where it is absolutely another dimension of one positive but bigger with that free space between above and down
it cannot in truth act on down unless absolutely the whole reality down

which proove the evil force life with those obvious inequity that god do according to his subjectve pleasure of getting to be living of more then one freedom without being one positively objectively existing free

down in truth is more positive objective when above is more positive one

so the sense look like meaning, that positive one would mean more positive objective, and positive objective would mean more positive one

that is why we have lives of heroes meaning taht how humans lives could be real positive ones lives by themselves alone from the whole absolute reality meaning objective positive that move some true ones base freely, and those small lives as objective constance are practical for that end, i mean when everything is creations around you the intelligent reaction is to be free as the base positive of it to realize being yoruself one life

as when you are alone one the intelligent reaction is to innovate of your constance objective positive constances life to be more forward in new positive realisations that would never end or get you back to less than you or even to you as absolute positive one out

but also seeing you down and down seeing the objective sense living you meant being free of, is always confirming positive truth base certainty and its POSITIVE life

i would never stop repeating positive it is teh mantra that everyone should keep repeating it especially when it bothers you a lot
buuu positive are the ultimate truth that is going to put negative down

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


You talk about 'accept unconditionally' what do you accept?
Accepting means choice, i accept this but not that, if there is no that, then you dont accept but remain with what is.

Or am i reading it wrongly?



[edit on 14-5-2010 by godddd]

reply to post by galadofwarthethird


even if it isnt the answer you want, i would say that positive source is absolute freedom as fact base reality always anywhere

because absolute freedom is the base existence, that existence become absolutely too which mean positive present objectively as a result true fact constance realisations of absolute freedom source

that is why it is very important to respect who dont do anything and judge instead who mean to do something if it isnt absolutely positive present objectively then it is not right and he is stepping for sure on positive source as absolute freedom our base in truth life

Originally posted by imans

sorry to say that you dont seem to think truly that is why you cant see what is happening in truth

That is a possibility. It is also possible that your thinking is the problem.

I do have a very hard time with your language choices, so parts of what you are saying are not clear to me at all.

Originally posted by imans
and that is why darkness is associated with lies and greed, when you move for more without actualizing present objective fact existing, it means how you are meaning to take advantage from a sense realisations absolutely hoping that it wont ever be absolutely true, so you could always mean being more without beinganything at all

I would say that why darkness is associated with lies, negativity, etc., is because things we judge mentally to be negative, we also choose to push from our awareness as much as possible. The fully awake consciousness that is accepting without judgment is like a light that shines everywhere casting no shadow.

When consciousness is partial, those areas not in the consciousness are in "darkness." Those partially conscious tend to want to pick and choose their experiences, and so they tend to greedily seek out beautiful things, pleasant things, objects of desire. Or in themselves they only look at the qualities they have that their egos approve of. They turn their eyes from that which the ego judged "bad, ugly." We associate darkness with lies and evil because whatever we hold in darkness is that which we already deem to be evil, and that which we hope is untrue.

Originally posted by imans
we see how your means are about one truth being wills, one truth is not free will, you cannot will something unless you are one complete that know itself from its objective constance as full absolute one fact existence, that is not in needs to be one

I am not sure where you get a discussion of free will from what I said. I am not sure I feel the will is completely free, or maybe not even free at all, personally. But that is a long philosophical debate that I havent a strong stand on either way. I am agnostic on the issue. I do not know if our will is free or not. We have at the very least the illusion it is. But logically, it seems impossible.

Originally posted by imans
i would never stop repeating positive it is teh mantra that everyone should keep repeating it especially when it bothers you a lot
buuu positive are the ultimate truth that is going to put negative down

Whatever mantra works for you. I dont get a lot of what you are saying unfortunately. Not that I disagree with all of it, I dont know if I do or not. There are only fragments where I can glean what you are intending because of the language issue.

As for the above, the only part I am certain I agree with, is that you should look where your eyes try to escape. If for some they seek to escape "positivity" then sure, place your awareness where you feel uncomfortable. I dont feel uncomfortable with "positivity," however, or prefer "negativity" I just dont see them as being real outside my own judgmental mind.

Is my death going to be positive or negative? Is my life going to be positive or negative? Or is it just going to be what it is. I personally feel it just is what it is. And when I dont cling to the positive, and flee from the negative, I find my life is normally quite pleasant. When I do catch myself running towards the positive, and fleeing from the negative, I find myself disturbed. It doesnt feel good.

Life for me, is not "easy and free" when I seek to saturate myself in positivity and escape from negativity. Life for me is "easy and free" when I stop judging what my life is and just accept it. Then both positive and negative disappear and I am left with harmony, balance.

I do wish I understood where you were going with the whole hero thing though. Lol.

Originally posted by godddd

You talk about 'accept unconditionally' what do you accept?
Accepting means choice, i accept this but not that, if there is no that, then you dont accept but remain with what is.

Or am i reading it wrongly?

No, you arent reading it wrongly, I just cant find words that are better for the feeling, the experience. No, it isnt that type of acceptance, not the choosing of this or that. It is opening, accepting, non-resistance to, what is, without struggle.

Choosing like you are saying, "this but not that" is "struggling" as I would phrase it. You are moving towards what you like, and away from what you dont like. It isnt acceptance as I mean it, because you are rejecting.

Its also not "forcing" yourself to "like" things you dont like. That would imply struggle with who you are, as well as with "what is." Its more of a deep stillness where you just allow your awareness to fall upon whatever "is" in that moment, including your own minds opinion of it, without moving, without struggling against any of it.

You just accept it, and yourself, and the act of becoming deeply aware and still, and accepting it, somehow makes the negative feelings dissipate. It doesnt magically change your circumstance, but there is something magical about not struggling in term of how it makes your experience feel.

I guess an example would be, you are stuck in traffic.

You can get angry, (reject it) and go spinning off into your mental story about what is happening and what it means, or you can try to force positivity, (resignation) and go spinning off into a story about why its "bad" to get angry, OR you can just get really still inside and accept both what is happening and your feelings about it, (whatever they might be) and somehow the act of doing that feels "free and easy." Not joyful in the "woohoo oh boy" strongly positive sense, but like a warm, deep, still pond. Good, not unpleasant, but somewhat neutral as well.

Those still arent great examples. But I cant think of any better at the moment.

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


you dont justify anything you just use things to justify them, that cannot judge another one thinking out of nothing clearly getting to the roots inoventions from what everything is the way it is obviously

now the fact that you mean to judge what you would get as a living say how you dont understand what positive base absolutely is
while i repeated it endlessly, it is you one positive existing free and meaning from that existing whole fact positive more or else as positive living
not what you would get to pertend being or living, what you get is from its dimension positive not yours, yours to be positive is your free move

that is how the world is also because of humans wrong moves

for me i wont care for whatever happening to me, for me it is the same anywhere since it is me
that is why even when i die it would be ok since i wont be anymore

i care for objective else only of what i would care for it

sorry but you are not thinking realistically nor of any truth which is free obvious facts existence

it doesnt matter anymore to argue since there is no discussion there with such hostile reaction to my words, i meant just quick reply to major points defense

and i thought it was clear as a joke the word mantra i used there, people can read what you say without reading my contribution first and you are deforming the whole context of my expressions

it is free expressions anyway why do you like to argue about nothing, from nothing there is nothing unless it is objective positive thing, and if it is positive objective then it beome itself to talk about positively and itself positive existence objectivity more present living

and if you want something then you can realize it fully when you mean willing to be of that realisations, you dont seem to aknowledge yourself being a source of surprising energy constance, if you mean to get from what is there already it means that you care only about pretending being more without doing anything or caring for any particular objective fact real, and that is how it ended by killing positive sources in possessions wills prooving not being true ones that are of objective positive constance existing
money were meant before as positive objective reward to being existing positive move one, when you jump on capitol possessions you are killing the base of positive source which is objective positive one realisations

and language cannot be an issue when we are trying to talk about free ideas about all sources and ends, unless you mean a particular philosophy you follow which i dont it is really totally free

reply to post by Illusionsaregrander


Thanks, and yes its difficult to make a good example
That why i wrote 'remain with what is' and problably thats no good either.

you cant accept any objective negative fact unless you realized your free positive self one, so the expectation of positive more to you would be less but you would be more positive true, and that is what generate in truth objective effects as positive realities of what you thought meaning totally else livings

it is always about objective absolute positive life, but this cant be but through true positive ones free livings wills

Originally posted by imans

and i thought it was clear as a joke the word mantra i used there, people can read what you say without reading my contribution first and you are deforming the whole context of my expressions

I am sorry if I am misinterpreting what you are saying. It really isnt intentional. I would love to understand your point of view better, but I really can only get so much out of the way you use English. You are still much better in English as a second language than I am in any second language, but I just cant discern your meaning sometimes.

Originally posted by imans
it is free expressions anyway why do you like to argue about nothing, from nothing there is nothing unless it is objective positive thing, and if it is positive objective then it beome itself to talk about positively and itself positive existence objectivity more present living

Well, I am certainly not arguing in the informal sense, but I am presenting a different argument than you are, I think. And you are right, discussion boards are for the airing of various opinions and arguing for or against those opinions.

I am for more present living, however. On that we agree.

reply to post by godddd


Yes, "remain with what is" is probably your version of what I call "acceptance."

And it makes perfect sense to phrase it that way, too. As long as someone didnt mistake it for "resignation." Its a wholly different feeling than being resigned. The language problem exists when speaking of these things even when people are both native speakers of the same language. We just dont have words that completely cover what one is trying to share or discuss.