Plane carrying Polish president Lech Kaczynski crashes near Russian airport, CONFIRMED DEAD

Not to mention all the top generals of the polish army were killed too.

This is a decapitation of the country.

And to all polish people I'm sorry if I sounded mean, I didn't meant too, my wife's parents are polish and I love them very much. I think poles are a great people.

Just heard about this, my mother rang to tell me, she's already heard (and passed on to me), rumors of Russian involvement.

Apparently they serviced the plane before it took off or something?

Apparently, there were many parliamentarians, ministers, commanders of Polish Navy, Land forces and Special Forces et.c in the plane along with the president himself. So basically, we can say that almost entire government of Poland was in that plane. Now, it could be a case of tragic plane crash. However, I believe that there should have been some form of diplomatic and safety protocols in place. The Russian government has although responded very quickly by placing an investigating commission headed by Vladimir Putin himself.

Originally posted by order in chaos

The Russian government has although responded very quickly by placing an investigating commission headed by Vladimir Putin himself.

I am afraid that's like putting the fox in charge of an investigation into who raided the henhouse. I do not like the look of this one little bit, and if I were Polish, I would be asking some questions. Someone has already pointed out that this was the perfect decapitation strike.

reply to post by potential_problem


List of you have lost is just awful - I am very sorry about your lost!

Behalf of my fellow members in ATS,

We are in ATS and usually taking to our notion any signs of that invisible hand to all whats happening in the world - but also we should respect good behaviour and victims of events - giving more place for whats known if there is no sign from unknown, I mean if we have no facts to shown from opposite truth, we also should keep our mouth shut - and to do what we should here - investigate carefully.

Friends in ATS!

In this moment we see accident, right? So lets respect that. Everything what opposes this is highly welcome here, but we should remember that we are in international community here, so lets respect our polish members and give our sorry for their losses.

Peace, bro!

Originally posted by Vitchilo
Not to mention all the top generals of the polish army were killed too.

This is a decapitation of the country.

Exactly. There were some reports on the internet mentioning that many prominent commanders/officials of the Polish armed services were on board that plane. Now what should be observed is the stance of the political successors in Poland vis-a-vis Russia. If the new Polish government leans towards Russia or is neutral, then that would be certainly different from the pro-NATO stance of the past government.

Why are the news outlets so quiet about this? They have in huge letters that Tiger Woods had an affair but they can't do this for a head-of-state of Poland which is one of our closest allies!?

Something is not right here, they are trying to keep this low key. They are hiding something. This is Poland's president and virtually their entire government that is now dead and they don't make a big deal out of this!?

[edit on 4/10/10 by Misoir]

Watching this live on BBC now. So far I havent seen a single insert attempting to explain the crash. To top it off, no mention of the other dignitaries on the plane.

Right thats it, already cut back to David Cameron and pre-election hype.

-Definitely not as much coverage as I was expecting.

Agree it looks like a decapitation.

[edit on 10-4-2010 by da_ruse]

Wx conditions at the airport were reported as heavy fog, and the airport is apparently not ILS equipped. At first glance this seems to be a case of Controlled Flight Into Terrain. On the other hand, we are talking about Russia here...

I read somewhere that it was apparently going around for the 4th time before landing, not sure how much truth to that there is, not whether it is fairly standard to have to queue to land a plane?

Any pilots on ATS want to enlighten us?

[edit on 10-4-2010 by Xadaz]

Originally posted by Rukas
Just heard about this, my mother rang to tell me, she's already heard (and passed on to me), rumors of Russian involvement.

Apparently they serviced the plane before it took off or something?

Is this just her speculation or something that is being reported?

I agree with her, just curious...

Marshal of the Sejm will take over the presidency for now on (until the election will be organiased), but they are still waiting for official papers regarding president's death.
It is a tragedy for our country.
But I don't think Russia has anything to do with that. I mean the weather was really bad and our plane was really old. They should have replaced it long time ago. On the other hand, who could have expected for this to happen?
I guess there will be some theories about possible Russian envolvment, but not in official media. I listened to the radio this morning and the only thing people are talking about is loss - country's loss, familis' loss and so on. And I think it's better than pointing fingers and blaiming someone without any evidence.
Anyway, we'll manage.

reply to post by da_ruse


You mean like at 911?

Nobody telling any explanations means also that there is no trace of agenda behind this... I remember how odd it was that at 911 everything was presented just in hours without natural shock from terrible events.

I think there will go days without any official statement of causes, if this was natural accident. They neeed to check out both black boxes and gather comission to gather all needed data, and I think Mr Putin is just the right man to do this job, because there is no door or official who could slow this crucial work of investigation in front of him.

I dont say that everything is possible, but all motions should hold now and learn the facts first.

Originally posted by pause4thought


Isn't he the guy who refused to buy Swine Flu vaccines for his country?

Very sad news, whatever the cause.

wish there was some way to bring the threads together

RT were interviewing one of the Polish Ministers just now - Iwinski, I think. He said this will bring forward the elections which will probably be held in the next two months. In the meantime, Bronislaw Komorowski will be the Interim President.

Iwinski said he didn't know what the consequences of this crash would be.

One thing for sure is that the Polish political landscape has been dramatically changed.

Wasn't there some diplomatic feud between Israel and Poland within the past year? I could be mistaken.

reply to post by Vitchilo


Weeks of Russian plane bashing is due.. and obviously overdue. Those old Tupelov planes are death traps and should all be grounded and turned into scrap.

I was shocked when I learned that Poland was still using one for a Presidential aircraft. The European Union is handing out billions of Euros for all kinds of the most dimwit nonsense projects you can imagine and yet they let top political leaders of member states fly around in junk like that.

The insane pressure and bad press that descends on any corporation or political leader that spends money on executive aircraft is also to blame. There is a reason that people like that need to have private aircraft, its called busy schedule and security for people that are top leaders and executives.

I wonder if fear of that kind of criticism was the reason they were still using the old crate instead of getting something modern and safe.

[edit on 10-4-2010 by expat2368]

If someone thinks from a Kremlin perspective, Viktor Yuschenko of Ukraine was a staunch opponent of Russia. He was ousted in the last election. Krygyz President was playing flip flop with Russia and USA and he was ousted in a bloody revolution two days back. Polish president was a very vocal critic of the Kremlin and he was on board the ill fated presidential plane. The only remaining anti Russian politician in Russia's backyard is Georgia's president Mikhail Saakashvilli.

Originally posted by Xadaz
I read somewhere that it was apparently going around for the 4th time before landing, not sure how much truth to that there is, not whether it is fairly standard to have to queue to land a plane?

Any pilots want to enlighten us?

Sure, It's standard to have a queue to land a plane, but his is usually well organised and would most likely have nothing to do with 4 go-arounds. Most likely reason for repeating 4 times would be not seeing the runway lights at a prescribed altitude/distance from the runway threshold. At this point the Pilot In Command makes a decision to continue the approach, or go-around if he cannot see runway/runway lights. So it does indeed sound like a "legit crash". But the Russians cannot be trusted and foul play may indeed have been involved. I'll have a look to see if the airport was ILS equipped. If so, tampering with the ILS system at the airport is a distinct possibility.

latest news -

Pilot error is suspected as a cause in the crash Saturday in western Russia of the plane carrying President Lech Kaczynski and other top Polish officials, Russian news agencies reported.

The cause of the plane crash was apparently an error by the crew during the approach to landing," Russian state news agency RIA Novosti quoted an unnamed official in the Russian region of Smolensk as saying

www.hindustantimes.com...

[edit on 10-4-2010 by grantbeed]