Christianity is a Conspiracy; ALL of you are going to HELL

reply to post by Legion2112


Regardless of the many different modern interpretations , the Bible was not written with any sort of access to those modern interpretations .

To suggest that the 'modern interpretations' give an honest explanation as to what the origional author's intent and meaning was is fallacy.

Suppose that you author an autobiography, describing your life, your opinions, your view of the current world affairs around you.
Now, suppose that two thousand years into the future, your book has been translated and interpreted numerous times to fit with the 'current' meaning of the words each consecutive time.

If I were living during that time, two thousand years from now, do you think that I would be able to describe your life and the world around you correctly to your satisfaction ?

Do you suppose that I would know what was really going on at the time that you wrote it, once the words had been altered to fit the 'modern' conceptoin of those words ?

Get my point ? Yes, word-play has everything to do with what I am attempting to expose in this thread .

reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic


Great post. I've always been fascinated with Norse mythology, but it's been years since I have read any. You may have just rekindled my interest.

I was just reading today, something that is synonomous with everything that you just posted, although it wasn't Norse. I will try to find it again and post it later.

I am also intrigued how one religion seems to be tied in with the next, and on and on ...

I have known this for a long time but am only now taking up interest in it again.

No one 'religion' has 'exclusive' rights or access to 'God'. It is fallacy for anyone to believe that 'God' loves one part of 'creation' more than another, in my opinion.

A written word, of who, who are you? I know not of you, who are you? I bow to no man or mammon. I want to know you, who are you? why do you say those things? I am man, who are you? Teach me, please, teach me. Knowlege, please help me, im curious.

Originally posted by okbmd
reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic

 

No one 'religion' has 'exclusive' rights or access to 'God'. It is fallacy for anyone to believe that 'God' loves one part of 'creation' more than another, in my opinion.

Thanks for the kind words, and in response to your above quoted eh quote I'll simply reply with a word from Isajah concerning this:

Is 19:23 In that day there will be a highway from Egypt to Assyria. The Assyrians will go to Egypt and the Egyptians to Assyria. The Egyptians and Assyrians will worship together. 24 In that day Israel will be the third, along with Egypt and Assyria, a blessing on the earth. 25 The LORD Almighty will bless them, saying, "Blessed be Egypt my people, Assyria my handiwork, and Israel my inheritance."

reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic

Compare that to the story of Noah, who had nine mothers from Eve to his own mothers, and fathered three sons, one being black, and how God placed the rainbow in the heavens after the Great Flood. It's the exact same story. Which makes me believe that the Norse gods were infact patriarchs of the Torah, and that the whole Norse religion is infact based on the Bible or the other way around.

I'm starting to see a certain pattern developing. If one were to accept the Norse tradition as most ancient that would explain much. The World Tree is key here. Greek myths are most closely similar to Norse, being the result of two successive migrations from the north. Almost all stories one for one, yet Mount Olympus became substitute for World Tree. Similarly, in desert areas Mountains as places of worship of gods became dominant. Flat desert areas, Mesopotamia, Egypt, man made mountains, tower of Babel, Pyramids.

The Turkic Shamanic traditions stretching from Mongolia to Turkey had the world tree and mountains. Seemingly, the only place in Hebrew scripture the World Tree re-emerges is in Daniel and in some parables of Jesus, that most likely from Persian influence, importing from Turkic tradition.

As far as hell goes, comparing disposition of the dead is instructive. Burial or entombment implies a belief in a physical re-animation of the actual dead body at the Day of Resurrection , whereas cremation or leaving the dead in trees to be eaten by carrion birds implies a belief in ascension to Sky.

Starting with Abraham, it seems Hebrew traditions quite consciously demean the concept of ascension. Gehenna is 'the dump' for instance, the Amorites 'don't bury their dead', 'cursed is any one hung on a tree', bodies left for birds of the air, etc.

There is a gulf between concepts, what others consider noble, the Hebrews consider a thing to be ridiculed. Some Christianitys merge concepts of resurrection and ascension, as in two parts separated at death, held in separate holding cells until rejoined at resurrection.

I guess the point is that the idea of being tossed into Gehenna may seem really bad to some and not such a bad thing to others, at least not as horrible as what is being implied by those issuing threats of hell at others. Kind of on a par with being ridiculed for being bow-legged, when to the bow-legged person it is a mark of distinction, as being a great horse backed warrior. What can you say then to the insult but 'thank you'.



[edit on 3-4-2010 by pthena]

To those of you who find the title of this thread to be in poor taste, it was meant to grab your attention.

Headlines which are bold, absurd,offensive,and shocking demand your attention., whereas those which are mild, meek, mundane, etc. do not sell copy.

This is $$$ for the MSM, as well as the pulpit. It is a fact that a booming voice from the pulpit puts more $$$ in the offering plate than a meek, mild 'love thy neighbor' presentation .

If I alarm you or offend you , then you will think about what I say to you for a longer period than if I present it to you in a mild manner .

When someone angers you , you concetrate on it longer than you would if you were in agreement with them .

I am not here to 'tickle your ears' and tell you what you want to hear .

MY people are DESTROYED for lack of knowledge ...

To those of you who find the title of this thread to be in poor taste, it was meant to grab your attention.

Headlines which are bold, absurd,offensive,and shocking demand your attention., whereas those which are mild, meek, mundane, etc. do not sell copy.

This is $$$ for the MSM, as well as the pulpit. It is a fact that a booming voice from the pulpit puts more $$$ in the offering plate than a meek, mild 'love thy neighbor' presentation .

If I alarm you or offend you , then you will think about what I say to you for a longer period than if I present it to you in a mild manner .

When someone angers you , you concetrate on it longer than you would if you were in agreement with them .

I am not here to 'tickle your ears' and tell you what you want to hear .

MY people are DESTROYED for lack of knowledge ...

reply to post by pthena


As for world tree. The Yggdrasil Ask of Norse tradition and Irminsul of the continental Europeans, and the Tree(s) of Knowledge and or Life in Hebrew tradition it somewhat implies a concept of life stretching for the heavens, reflected in the stories of the Tower of Babel where Man built structures in lack of trees or as you said, mountains. They all reflect on a "need" for ascension to the gods, or as a way to rise up to meet with the gods by the sky perimeter. In Voluspå found in the Elder Edda, an important book on Norse religion dating back to the middle of the first millennium AD, but resting on much more ancient bronze age lore, the old lady prophecying tells of a Tree of wisdom, possibly comparing it to or refering to it as a gallow tree. The very name Edda here may infact be a further clue as to where these stories originally came from. Edda means grandmother, and Edda was also the name of the mother of Heimdall's first son, who was black and called Trell. Trell means slave, so here we have a black man who is called slave. Are we seeing a futher parallell to Egypt and the Middle-East here? Is it a parallell to how Noah says to Canaan (patriarch of the pre-Israeli settlements in the Land, and son of the black Kam who is the patriarch of the post flood Egyptians), who said he would be the slave of Shem? There are so many parallells between old Norse religion and Judaism that the two must be of the same origins in my opinion.

[edit on 3/4/2010 by Neo Christian Mystic]

reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic


All I can say is wow, you sure know your Norse history . I think you may be on to something about the two being one. I do know that most all the stories of the Bible can be found in earlier cultures.

You might check out the thread titled ' Strange Rock Carving ' and give us your take on that., very interesting...

reply to post by okbmd


Thanks for the compliments. I dropped by the thread you mentioned, and I have a quite far fetched, but still possible theory of what it might be.

Jump to the thread here: www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by okbmd


Almost, but not quite...

Hades is the term used in the New Testament as opposed to the Sheol of the Old Testament, but Gehenna is something different. Hades is not Hell.

We are all going to Hades/Sheol/Paradise but we are not all going to Hell.

The OT writers often declared that the grave (sheol) was the common destination of every man, so in this respect you are correct. But we also read in Revelation that Hades will be thrown into the lake of fire (Rev. 20:14). The translator did a terrible thing by translating Hades as Hell because in that verse they had to leave it as Hades because it wouldnt make any sense at all to say that Hell would be thrown into the lake of fire (Hell).

Also, consider the story of the rich man and Lazarus found in Luke 16. This is not a parable, and if it is it is the only parable where Jesus uses the name of a person. He could have just said rich and poor man but he named both Lazarus and Abraham. The NIV translated this as a description of Hell, but the word should have been left as Hades.

We will all go to Hades (good or bad) until the judgment when Hades will be emptied and the place of Hades will be destroyed in the lake of fire (Hell) along with those who have been condemned because they refused to believe in the name of the Son of God.

John 3:16-18

16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son,[f] that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.[g]

I hope that helps clarify a little.

reply to post by wylekat


Yes, I have considered what some of these other religions teach and I have found them to be left wanting. I think we've already had that conversation before so I'll leave it at that I suppose.

Regretfully, you are right in that many would choose ignorance because they see it as bliss. Truth often brings with it pain.

To me, ignorance is the scary thing. No matter how much the truth hurts, living a lie sounds much, much worse. I think many people here probably feel that way.

Ignorance is bliss until you stub your toe on the dresser because you didn't know where the furniture was...

reply to post by Mykahel


Rev. 20:14 "...death and hell..."

Death= Thanatos= the daemon (demon) personification of death in Greek mythology... I smell conspiracy ...

Hell= Hades= the unseen world= the underworld= the abode of daemons= Greek mythology ... I smell conspiracy ...

Greek mythology being 'christianized', plain and simple when you do your homework.

Taken literally, in the origional, it would read something to the effect of the pagan beliefs in greek mythology being cast into the fire.

In other words, ..."Thou shall have no other gods before me "...

Go figure.

reply to post by okbmd


"Death and Hades", not "Death and Hell" in Revelation 20:13-14. Most translations acknowledge the difference between Hades and the Lake of Fire (Hell) in this verse if none other.

You're playing word games. Please stop trying to confuse people by using half-truths and deceptive rhetoric.

Other belief systems and cultures may have had kernels of truth in them. Just because two different faiths share a similar view of something does not mean that they borrowed from each other. It can also be that they came to similar conclusions by their own experience or insight.

The actual teachings of the Bible are VERY similar to Greek mythology. Again, consider the teaching of Jesus in Luke concerning the rich man and Lazarus. That is almost identical to the Greek thought. This place called Hades or Sheol will be destroyed in Hell.

Hi/
The New Testament is the New Covenant....Death is no more!
Jesus Christ destroyed DEATH and has called all to hear Him!
Jesus Christ became the Second Adam by destroying the Old Testament curse on man -the SIN-the falling away from God that brought DEATH to all of mankind!
There was no hope since DEATH was the result of mans falling away from God....a SAVIOUR was needed to DESTROY DEATH, and so came the Son of God,the Lord Jesus Christ!

Old Testament are filled with dark thoughts concerning existence beyond the grave:“For in death there is none that is mindful of Thee, and in hades who will confess Thee?”

(Ps.6:6). This is not a denial of immortality,
but a reflection of the hopeless darkness beyond the grave.

Such awareness and sorrow were eased only by the hope of future deliverance through the coming of the Savior: “I know that my Redeemer liveth, and that He shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though my skin hath been destroyed,
yet in my flesh shall I see God” (Job 19:25-26).

“Therefore did my heart rejoice and my tongue was glad; moreover,
my flesh shall dwell in hope.
For Thou wilt not abandon my soul in hades,
nor wilt Thou suffer Thy Holy One to see corruption” (Ps. 15:9-10).
SOURCE

Revelation 20:13-15
The sea, Death and Hades-the powers that held men captive-all give up their dead,showing that all the dead of the world are judged.
That Christ Christ has the Keys of Death and Hades(1:18)expresses not His power to put men to death,
but His trampling of death by death.
He is victorious over death.
The sea is a symbol of turbulance,chaos and the unknown will be no more(21:11)
Death,''the last enemy to be destroyed"(1Corinthians 15:26),
and Hades,the intermediate state between death and resurrection,will end.
They are cast into hell,the lake of fire(vv14,15),
along with all who reject the grace of God.

Revelation of S.John of the Apocalypse

And thank you Mykahel for your informative posts!


Xristos Anesti!-(Christ has Risen!)
Alithos Anesti!-(Indeed He has Risen!)
ICXC NIKA
helen

Originally posted by helen670
Hi/
The New Testament is the New Covenant....Death is no more!

You have to be joking! As far as I know every damned person who lived after your 616 Jesus has died. Not a single person has survived life. Your constant ignorance based on Cathoic dogma and ludacris blasphemian doctrines are lies made to excuse the Roman empire for "killing" Jesjuah ha Mesjiach who despite their plans received help so he survived the crucifixion. People like you should be ashamed. God promised us death when Adam and Eve ate the forbidden fruit, and Adam died at the age of 930 years, or within sundown in God's world, where one day equals a thousand years. You believe more in magic and lies than truth and sense, and inherited sin, that we chose the path of knowledge, in effect demanding to figure out ourselves how to survive life and get eternal life. You can't seriously mean that your great great grandfather is still alive. You live in denial, twisting the testimony of Jesjuah ha Mesjiach into blatant lies. But give our scientists another millennium and we will have figured out the cure for life, when we plant the Tree of Life which will yield fruit every month and give us healing and eternal life from the well washing out from below it.

[edit on 3/4/2010 by Neo Christian Mystic]

reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic


It might be more appropriate at this point to say that death has been "disarmed" and will yet be defeated. We no longer have to fear the eternal consequences of death based on the blood and resurrection of Christ, but many of us, if not all of us here today, will still die the first death. The Bible itself shows that there were many who still died after the time of Yeshua. In fact, some were even condemned by God and killed on the spot such as Ananias and Saphira.

It might also be better viewed as the second death having been defeated, since those who have faith will be saved from the second death. It holds no power over us.

Hebrews 9:27-28
27Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.

Revelation 2:11
He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.

Revelation 21:8
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death."

Science will never create the "tree of life." They have been trying to expand life expectancy forever but we will never reach the point of living for eternity via science. We can't even pass the 120 year limit placed by God. Even if natural death could be completely ruled out, men with evil hearts will always go to war and commit violence against each other, bringing each others' heads down to the grave in blood. Death is to powerful for anyone but the Messiah to overcome.

[edit on 3-4-2010 by Mykahel]

reply to post by Mykahel


"...it wouldn't make any sense at all to say that hell was cast into the lake of fire (hell)."

You are right, it wouldn't make sense to say that hell was cast into hell. So, show me where it says that ?

Your quote above is exactly what I am addressing with this thread, so please pay attention... HELL IS NOT THE LAKE OF FIRE . When you go to HELL you are not going to burn forever and ever !!!

Authorized King James Version : " And DEATH and HELL were cast into the lake of fire !!!!!

Now read this really so and maybe you will get it this time around...

DEATH ( Rev. 20:14 )= THANATOS., the daemon (DEMON) personification of death in GREEK MYTHOLOGY !!!

HELL ( Rev.20:14 )= HADES., THE UNSEEN WORLD !!! GREEK MYTHOLOGY !!! ( Youngs Analytical Concordance to the Bible )

PLEASE show me where 'lake of fire' has been translated from 'hell' or vice-versa ?????

So, Who is really the one playing word-games here ?!! I can,and will, back up what I am saying . Can/Will YOU ?!

reply to post by okbmd


You're right about Gehenna, I've been saying this stuff for years and no-one wants to listen, most want to hold on to that mythical idea of Hell being 'down there' beneath the Earth...

There are so many different names for the underworlds, even, as you pointed out, the Bible isn't clear on who goes where after they died and what these places are whether they are describing the same religious concept or not...

There is also the Lake of Fire, most Christians think of the Lake of Fire at the end of Revelation as the real Hell, just as the Heavenly City at the end of Revelation is taken to be the actual 'Heaven'. The concepts really have fluctuated quite a bit over the years.

I think its horrible there are people who actually believe their god could send them to eternal torment (especially for some of the stuff it says you can go in for, Revelations states that cowards, sorcerers/magicians and ALL LIARS will go to Hell, well that's damn near every human being on Earth)..

Originally posted by Mykahel
reply to post by Neo Christian Mystic

 

It might also be better viewed as the second death having been defeated, since those who have faith will be saved from the second death. It holds no power over us.

I see the faith is strong with you, but surviving the certain death has to do with love and knowledge, not faith in som hoc est corpus solution which hasn't saved anyone from dying yet. I know people who have been clinically dead, one of them for as long as 45 minutes, who thanks to the workers of the true Cross, the red one, were revived and still lives to tell the story. I myself has cheated death, with what I believe is the Lord's help atleast 24 times. Yes twentyfour times, that was when I stopped counting. But believe me Jesjuah ha Mesjiach had nothing to do with it. One day I will die, and looking at how my life has been until now, I will probably be relatively young too. I have smoked twenty cigarettes since I was very young, and I drink and lead a risky life so I will probably only have myself to blame. At times I have been living on a deathwish, tired and worn out of these worlds' troubles, and wound't even think twise before risking my life again to save another or to get some peace of mind and a certain calm relief. However, when the day comes, and it does, I will be as dead as anyone who has gone there before me. But I believe in reincarnation, well, it's not even faith no more, it's a fact to me. We will all be ressurrected and every day is judgement day. The gods play games on our souls, and they couldn't care less, all they want is to win the bet. I have met Jesjuah and I have met ha Shatan. I have seen the great light and the New Jerusalem. I know I will live on, and I don't fear death. Why do you care so much about a second death when you will have another life? Our Lord is the Life, why focusing so much on his supposed death, don't you know that gods don't really die? They, like their souls of pure energy just change and transform, turning into life again. A secret a certain character we all know told me, we don't remember dying, we remember living, and we thank God for the ones who let us live, who helps us to live on. Blessed be Longinus Panthera and his lance, sponge and brave soul. Without him Jesjuah would have had all his bones crushed and have been burnt in Gehenna. Blessed be Joseph of Arimathea who bought his body and hid him. Blessed be the Essene healers who showed up by the tomb to treat him and heal his wounds, blessed be Miriam the Magdalene for her uncompromised love and her knowledge of making oils and medicine, Blessed be John for unwrapping the Truth. It's written there in plain sight, but still you cling to hocus pocus, or like Jesjuah would have said in Latin if he mastered that thoungue: Hoc est corpus: "This is my flesh."

Tell me when you see a Science' Lamp, get an idea and voluntere to save a Zion's Lamb, and quit believing in clichés and repeated sin. The Truth is our king, not saying it. Screaming "Lord Jesus Lord Jesus! You are the Messiah" won't help you one inch. The Lord said so himself. Make sure you are loved and love yourself, then you might just have a chance....