You must be High on the desert, to think your on the moon.

reply to post by wmd_2008

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by wmd_2008


Do you really think it is BS to show you some pictures that I think look alike? I'm having a hard time understanding what all the pro Apollo people are trying to prove here.

Just so everyone knows. What I have done is taken some photos and videos that are on the net of the moon landings, most notably Apollo 17 to compare with A place here on earth called Sand Mountain that is in the High Desert of Nevada.

I took the Apollo footage and also took the footage of Sand mountain and placed them side by side so that I may bring it here to my peers and let them have a look so that they could FOR THEM SELVES make up their own mind as to if the images looked similar or not.

I'm not here to make up anyone's mind for them, nor would I want to and really wouldn't want to know you if that was something that wasn't within your own cognitive powers of judgment.

I, for the record, could care less what you believe in be it Apollo or the Cookie monster. All I wanted to do was share what I saw.

If sharing with you what I saw bothers you, any of you...you are free and able to think what ever it is you would like and honestly I could care less.

No fooling, no dvd sales, no beef and as a matter of fact, I don't even care about the points or flags or any of it. Zero me out for all I care.

The only thing I actually care about is that people would act like adults and have civil conversations preferably on topic, not only in this thread but any.

Again, I have no agenda. I don't think it matters one way or the other if people believe in the moon landings other then the fact that they pay for it and what a bummer to be paying for a huge lie if they be false.

Apollo is not the only thing of major significance in our history that I believe has been falsified, but again if people believe everything they see on TV or the net for that matter, we have way bigger problems then the authenticity of those missions to worry about.

I would hate to find out the big payoff of all this was Velcro.

So, be happy, enjoy life, try not to let what other people believe bother you and always know that you believe what you believe even if no one else does and that is really all that matters....

Peace

Originally posted by SphinxMontreal
"Why waste all that money? Why not just fake the footage on a shoestring budget and then dupe the public?"

But it does look like fake footage done on a shoestring budget! The spacecraft looks like it was constructed from tinfoil. And there is something really messed up with the background in those moon pictures.

Good post. Definitely a prime location for a fake landing. Since everyone who is watching had never been to the moon, how would they know any better? If they did go to the moon, the images they showed were total crap. More people than you think were also claiming hoax back in '69.

They really did use tin and foil to hurtle through the empty void in unimaginable speeds, walk on top a desolate rock and then come back.
Your average Mercedes Benz has much more technology in it than that tin foil capsule and those rocket boosters, yet it can't get you in to space. It can get you only killed through needing you to have wars with other people until no one is left alive on the planet to tell the tale.
That tin can never killed anybody in the most unforgiving of environments yet your super safe transport down here on earth operating on solid ground and well constructed highways do. Some people act in denial trying to disbelieve what older generations achieved. Current generation can have all the technology they can get yet they're failing miserably.
What's wrong with this picture?

To teslandline: If you can't see a moon it doesn't really mean it's not there. It could mean it's orbiting much further out.

[edit on 1-4-2010 by spacebot]

And now for some future talk with Dr. Werner Von Braun on behalf of the Walt Disney, the man responsible for raising a whole Generation telling them that their "dreams come true".

Quick trivia: How are Doctor Emmet Brown (Back to the Future) and Werner Von Braun associated? (hint: one of the characters is fictional...)





This is a scene from Frau Im Mond from 1929. Almost perfected by 1929 folks, that is Filming and making it look real.



Peace



[edit on 1-4-2010 by letthereaderunderstand]

reply to post by letthereaderunderstand


Because you CONTINUE to foster this nonsense....I call "FOUL" on you, sir or madam!

IF you cannot comprehend, or you REFUSE to do the due diligence to study the actual HISTORY....I can only assume that you are NOT interested in any actual investigaton, but merely trolling this Board, for some perverted reason that I cannot fathom.

I am specifically referring to the video of Werner von Braun, care of "Disney"....

ANYONE who cares to look into the history of this topic will know, immediately, that there was a great deal of discussion (and even heated controversy) over the proper method to achieve a manned Lunar landing mission.

To use a film made IN THE VERY EARLY DAYS, before the science was considered, but when it was just an 'imagination' stage is wholelly deceptive, and I expect YOU are well aware that you are employing this tactic.

STOP IT!

MOST people are way, way too smart for this, and will NOT be fooled by the nonsense.

BUT, if you wish to fool a few 'accolytes', via the ATS site forae...well, shame on you. I know, though, that tactics employed WILL out you, eventually....



Now....I invite those sitll paying attention to investigate, and study, the history of the earlier concepts proposed by various people, in order to accomplish a manned Lunar landing, and return.

The idea of a FULLY-EQUPPED massive vehicle, launched from Earth, landed on the Moon, then launched again, to return, was immediately rejected, due to simple physics (and basic 'rocket science'...)

"staging" of the vehicle, and using various components, was recognized as a viable alternative, and was also viewed as feasible, given the technology (and thrust available/lift requirements for payloads, etc...)

BIG problem of discussion, and bone of contention, was the "Earth-Orbit-Rendezvous" versus "Lunar Orbit Rendezvous" competing scenarios.

As it turned out, Apollo went with the "LOR", and it worked well...AFTER many, many initial tests in Low Earth Orbit (LEO) using Gemini missions, as precursors. The equipment that flew as Apollo was ALSO tested, initially, in LEO too.

Really, people, just do some research, there are LOADS and LOADS of good information out there. Stuff you WILL NOT SEE on these silly "Moon Landing Hoax" websites. BECAUSE those people who are behind those websites know Jack-[censored] about the technical aspects, and just how much was involved....in order to make Apollo (and Gemini, AND Mercury) a reality....

reply to post by letthereaderunderstand


Never said your OP was BS did I BUT look at this post plenty of BS statements here

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Lets ALL have a look!

Originally posted by letthereaderunderstand

People will say 400,000 employees worked for NASA, but can't name one
unless famous. People will say there are reflectors on the moon when the whole moon is a reflector. People will say we have rocks, but those can fall in Antarctica just as Mars rocks can. People will say the Moon has a 1/6th of gravity when it (the moon) is caught in the Earths gravity, how can this be?
How can we see the moon with the naked eye in such detail as to make out shadows, but it is supposed to be 240,000 miles from earth? It only takes thirty miles before you disappear from site, if your a ship that is, not because you go over the horizon, but because our optics can only bend that much light in.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by letthereaderunderstand]

I dont know any of the 400,000 workers either I live in the UK about 10,000 work on the railway network here I dont know any of them either and we do have TRAINS!

Yes the Moon reflects light but the reflectors left on the Moon ALWAYS reflect the laser light STRAIGHT back so the the distance can be calculated!

Yes we can collect small meteorites in the antartic so that does not disprove the ones brought back.

Love the statement about gravity are you trying to claim the gravity on the Moon should be the same as the Earth because it orbits the Earth because thats what your statement looks like.

When you look at the Moon its a straight line from your eyeball to the Moon
A ship disappears over the HORIZON, the Earth is curved is it not or are you really trying to act stupid! Also for a man about 6ft tall at sea level the Horizon is about 3 miles away iirc. You can see the shadows on the moon and the areas called the seas because guess what the are F-kn HUGE!
I also love your optics can only bend that much light in.

reply to post by weedwhacker


Olberman, I knew it was you....you trickster.

Mod Note: Excessive Quoting – Please Review This Link

[edit on Fri Apr 2 2010 by Jbird]

reply to post by weedwhacker


Let's take a look at the years 1964 through 1974. The importance of comparing these two American programs is to link them in their time frames and there completely opposite psychological effects.
I was a part of both of these programs. I sipped tea with JFK's personal secretary in a small village outside of Saigon. I was affectionately close to the man and family from Saigon that were the hosts to LBJ and Lady Bird when they made a visit there while LBJ was Vice President. I was knocked for a loop when close to 200 of a company of the 173 Airborne Brigade didn't come back from the Triangle one day. They were my drinking buddies.


Vietnam (RVN) War Chronology/Timeline
Vietnam (RVN) War Chronology. (This timeline consists of basic info on the Vietnam War. along with info pertaining to the 25th Infantry Division ...

I would appreciate it if someone would take the time to set these links up to make it easier for anyone interested in the analogy. thanks

cybersarges.tripod.com/timeline.html - Similar The Apollo Spacecraft - A Chronology.

Part of the NASA Historical Series. The chronology of the development of the Apollo spacecraft and the lunar mission. Provides specific documented ...

history.nasa.gov/SP-4009/cover.htm - Similar

When I returned from the war I took a job with a company that did business with the likes of Grumman, Lockheed, Martin Marietta, Fairchild Hiller, Radiation Incorporated, PRD, Kuffler & Esser and many more of these electronic and aircraft industry giants. I personally solved the silver migration problem that plagued the industry for months if not years, I don't know if Wernher von Braun was in the house the day I brought equipment for interface at Fairchild in Germantown Maryland or not. The equipment for sure was, for his projects. Of interest to me was, that it was his last and only job as a civilian before he died with tears in his eyes just a few years later.

Please believe me --I do not mean to be blowing my own horn.

If I am blowing any horn at all, It would be the bells of freedom and my respect for all the amazing brave, intelligent and truly American--- Americans that I have been privileged to know and love in my time. Weedy and company would like to dismiss all those that would challenge the accomplishments of the Apollo program.

I owe to much to my countrymen to let them do that.

This is still America.

Why should anyone take a backseat to the likes of these folks.

Let the truth about the moon be known.

reply to post by Donny 4 million

Let the truth about the moon be known.

I agree. That is why threads that "question" the truth, by making veiled allegations of 'trickery', as in, comparing a site in the American desert to a vague resemblance to terrain on the Moon.....

However, I AM puzzled by your post. AND, and thankful to you, for having found it. Reading through it, a first-hand account of the TRUTH of the American Space Program, in those years (1962 - 1974)

Once again, because it's vitally important for people to read it, here is the link to Volumes I - IV: history.nasa.gov...


Here is just a teaser snippet from the Foreward to Volume IV:

To summarize Project Apollo - there were 11 manned flights; 27 Americans orbited the moon; 12 walked on its surface; 6 drove lunar vehicles. Perhaps one of the most important legacies of Apollo to future programs is the demonstration that great successes can be achieved in spite of serious difficulties along the way.

Again, very nice of you to find that information, it is good to hear the truth from the 'horse's mouth', so to speak.






[edit on 2 April 2010 by weedwhacker]

reply to post by weedwhacker


Tell me why the war stopped with Apollo?
Why did the Astrodome become non-profitable at the same time?
Why did supposed space travel die with Wernher von Braun?
And do not give me any of that LEO nonsense. Please.

reply to post by Donny 4 million


Apollo is just the story of the handsome prince told to the children while the reality NIGHTMARE rages on.

reply to post by Donny 4 million


I couldn't agree with you more.


Mod Note: Excessive Quoting – Please Review This Link

[edit on Fri Apr 2 2010 by Jbird]

When I look at Apollo:

I look to find what is the accurate record of the events stated.

No matter what the version, what a story it is!

Originally posted by theability
When I look at Apollo:

I look to find what is the accurate record of the events stated.

No matter what the version, what a story it is!

Well what have you to say about the time lines when nuzzled up to and compared to the war in Vietnam?
WEEDY DODGED THIS too! WHY"

reply to post by letthereaderunderstand


It is a real problem lately LTRU here on ATS, seems like it gets harder each day to have a civil conversation or thread on here, dunno, maybe the planets are out of sync or something, i see what you are trying to say though and i understand ..just gonna have to ignore the trolls and hope an intelligent conversation pops up..good luck..good thread by the way...

reply to post by Donny 4 million


You are so correct about the nature of the Vietnam War and the way the cancellation started with the end of the Apollo era of NASA.

I have such, how to word it, suspicions about how this all unfolded.

Mis-direction, is a very effective tool! I agree with you!

[edit on 3-4-2010 by theability]

reply to post by theability


Thanks

It is funny how life works.
When I was a kid my dad was an executive for a major oil company on 42 street NYC.
He would take me to work sometimes.
I would watch the steel workers high above dad's 50 high story office window.
I would sneak in to an elevator and tour the building.
I my favorite thing to do was go to the lobby and go out on the street and just watch the myriad of way different folks. When a friend in high school that had a car said let's skip today and do something different.
I said--- I have an idea!
In a few hours we were having hot dogs on top of the Empire State Building 60 miles from school.
When we got in the elevator to return to the streets below, the elevator operator said "Kennedy has been shot in Dallas and may be dead."
By January of 64 I was in boot camp.
In 66 I was carrying my rifle through Dallas international, flying to NYC with it as carry on luggage.
No one batted an eye on. This was a commercial flight and I was in civilian clothing.
I have always listened to the news and read at least some of the newspaper headlines.
I returned from the war to be confronted with this with-in six months.


Robert F. Kennedy Speech - On the death of Martin Luther King
At The History Place, the extraordinary words of Robert Kennedy as he announces Kings death to a group of African Americans.

www.historyplace.com/speeches/rfk.htm - Similar

THen this

The Death of RFK Bobby Kennedy Robert F. Kennedy

June 17, 1968: Bobby Kennedy knew who killed his brother; he wrote about it in his unpublished book, The Enemy Within. When he foolishly tried to run for ...www.findadeath.com/Deceased/k/rfk/RFK.htm - Similar


Well then Nixon got elected and stopped the war and the Apollo program.

They then made short work of him as well.

America has been in a nose dive since then and is being manipulated by the same ole same---

We suffer the same M.O. now, just like the pre Mc McCarthy communist invasion.

Most likely never heard of by most members.

Apollo was shear politics and tax manipulation. If it was not ------
Then MEN and WOMEN would have colonized SPACE by NOW. PERIOD

The moon flicks have earth mountains.

reply to post by Donny 4 million


The Vietnam conflict "stopped" with Apollo??

This is just another example of using two (or more) disparate evnts, and mish-mashing them together into some kind of new way to look at it...

...It's known as 'Revisionist History'.

The Fall of Saigon was the capture of Saigon, the capital of South Vietnam, by the North Vietnamese Army on April 30, 1975.

en.wikipedia.org...

1975. April. 1975.

Apollo 17 was the eleventh manned space mission in the NASA Apollo program. It was the first night launch of a U.S. human spaceflight and the sixth and final lunar landing mission of the Apollo program. The mission was launched at 12:33 a.m. EST on December 7, 1972, and concluded on December 19.

en.wikipedia.org...

1972. December. 1972.



VIETNAM was the reason Apollo was cancelled early! Apollo was NOT the reason for Vietnam! That is reverse logic (and, mish-mashed revistionist history, as mentioned).


Apparently, it is THIS that is causing confusion:

The Apollo program ran from 1961 until 1975...

Ah!! See? But wait, there's more:

... and was the US civilian space agency's third human spaceflight program (following Mercury and Gemini). Apollo used Apollo spacecraft and Saturn launch vehicles, which were later used for the Skylab program and the joint American-Soviet Apollo-Soyuz Test Project. These subsequent programs are thus often considered part of the Apollo program.

That hardware, utilized for Skylab and Soyuz, were in the production pipeline, originally intended to fly as Apollo 18, 19 and 20.

Canceled missions

(Main article: Canceled Apollo missions]

Originally three additional lunar landing missions had been planned, as Apollo 18 through Apollo 20. In light of the drastically shrinking NASA budget and the decision not to produce a second batch of Saturn Vs, these missions were canceled to make funds available for the development of the Space Shuttle, and to make their Apollo spacecraft and Saturn V launch vehicles available to the Skylab program.

en.wikipedia.org...

Really, this is common knowledge**, and part of REAL history. NOT some made-up after-the-fact 'conspiracy' claim....

(** I should say, common knowledge to people who actually have studied the US manned spaceflight programs, as a hobby...)

reply to post by weedwhacker


Here, I have discovered a new book, out last year:

"ONE GIANT LEAP: Apollo 11 Remembered"

by Piers Bizony. [ISBN-13: 978-0-7603-3710-8]


Has the full text of a letter I had heard about months ago, and was trying to find.

It was written (and placed into permanent record at the Library of Congress) by former Senator (D) Margaret Chase Smith.

She wrote it to commemorate the 10th anniversary of Apllo 11 --- July 19, 1979.

A portion of her letter:

"I am saddened by, and disappointed with, three matters. The first is the public's apathy about the space program. Once we had a man on the moon, the American public lost interest. My second disappointment was the inevitable consequence of public apathy. It was the decline of the Senate Space Committee. When the public lost interest, its elected representatives in Congress found the space program less productive in terms of providing votes for reelection. After 1973 the Senate struggled to get someone to chair the Committee, because none of the sitting members were particularly interested. My third disappointment has been the lack of recognition for the person who put a man on the moon: James Webb, NASA's Administratorduring its most crucial years. He had to take the heat and fire of partican political attacks from headline-hungry politicians.

I saw this first-hand in my work on the Space Committee! What recognition or material benefits did Jim Webb, and the thousands of people behind the scenes that he typified, receive? Minimal, if any -- and today, they are forgotten people of a forgotten program. What we need today on the energy crisis is another Jim Webb."


"energy crisis".....ring any bells? For we old-timers, it sure should. Long lines (and waits) at gas stations. Gas rationing. Public was fed UP with Vietnam, then the OPEC crunch, the economy....they didn't give a hoot about the space program, because in their minds it WAS DONE! OVER! Finished, accomplished. They wanted to move on, and the politicians then (as now) smelled the winds, and blew with whatever was blowing at the time, for that almighty goal: REelection. (and power, fame, fortune, etc...)


Sorry, but trying to alter history is fruitless, when you examine the full facts of the era.

BTW...there is another good book, recently came out, that focusses on James Webb....I highly recommend it to those interested in TRUE space program factoids.

Title is "Rocket Man"....

[edit on 3 April 2010 by weedwhacker]

reply to post by weedwhacker


It is nonsense like this that truly makes me laugh. There was not only public apathy towards space before Gemini and Apollo there was down right ridicule and plenty of public sayings to go along with it.
Public apathy BA, The US government did what it wanted and if somebody didn't like it they were,
threatened, black balled, black listed or killed. Remember, Operation Northwoods? Don't forget it.
Kennedy may have suggested getting to the moon but his idea was hijacked along with his and his brother's life. He would have stopped the war in Vietnam as he stopped the Russians in Cuba. He made the mistake of stopping Northwoods.
What makes you think Margaret Smith knew anything. She was a Senator for crying out loud. All they want is more votes and appropriations.
Interesting that Webb ditched Apollo and the space race. right after the death of Gus Grissom.


Oh yeah-- that economic False Flag, duh we gots no oil left duh.
They did it with toilet paper too! Oh crap No.

I wonder if Webb was an investor in that huge climate control highly lit Astro Dome too? hummm!

[edit on 3-4-2010 by Donny 4 million]