Trillions in Debt? I Know, Lets Give Out Free WiFi

regardless of profitability i think it being an avenue for communication, i argue that internet access is indeed an entitlement necessary to guarantee free speech or at least it should be.

Originally posted by endisnighe
I did not mean to demean, hey, that is kinda good.

I am me and you are you.

Star for that

Tell me of any society that has gone the collectivist way that has not led to tyranny? One.

One can hope.. eventually we will progress to that point. Possibly even in our lifetime if we can come across an event enlightening enough..

But we also cannot always base our perception of what we will do on what our history has recorded.. Firstly, our history is always bias and Secondly, it changes us completely.

Tired of control freaks and things that are SUPPOSEDLY free.

Nothing that is worth having, is free.

Except WiFI



I understand you completely though mate, I had your views for a number of years and still do to an extent.. But Iv just had a shift in scope of how I view the end result and am quite a bit more even minded over the whole thing these days so I just try and open a possibility of another perspective to people.

Newspapers: Used to convey ideas, present news and opinion. Also used for advertising. These are not free. There is someone who has placed time and capital into a business in order to provide the means.

Radio: Radio is not free. Can anyone tell me what it costs to own and maintain a 50KW transmitter? Along with leasing the land the antenna is sitting on?

Internet: Routers, repeaters, backbones, countless miles of fiber-optics...all cost money. They cost money to put into place, they cost money to maintain.

You want to entrust a government that cannot maintain its roads and bridges with the backbone of its digital infrastructure?

There are already a multitude of places where WiFi spots are free. Hell, I am on business in Oklahoma City and even Burger King here has free WiFi.

This leads to the question, why is the government sticking its nose into an industry that is already taking care of business?


[edit on 11-3-2010 by ownbestenemy]

Originally posted by ownbestenemy
U.S. Considers Some Free Wireless Broadband Service



Why work anymore right?

I throw my hands up; this has become beyond ridiculous...

[edit on 10-3-2010 by ownbestenemy]

Why work? You know Americans work harder than most industrialized nations? Life should be enjoyed. Work because you want to. Work on something you love and then work doesn't feel like work at all. Maybe if you didn't chase the abstraction of money you would be happier and not worried about what others were doing so much.

You may only see it as a fun tool....But having Wifi everywhere would be a boon to education and the general literacy of the nation. Its called investing in your most valuable resource....your people.

Maybe we can get lucky, and get free iphones for everyone too, since they are the internet phone of hte future and soo many applications are useable on the iphones.



Government: "Free wifi and iphones for all!"
Citizens: "Yay!"
Government official mumbles "now make sure they are all logged and tracked, and the first person to spew anything slighlty off-color goes to prison or dissapears"

reply to post by Dermo


This is nothing but an handout and some egalatarian nonsense. Super, we give poor folks wifi and they can put donate their porn dvds and get a tax credit against taxes they don't pay.

Back in the 40's the US government created the Tennessee Valley Authority which was intended to implement utilities in the rural south. It still exists, yet I'm fairly certain they have electricity and flush toilets in Mississippi and West Virginia.

During the Civil War the Union wore mohair uniforms. The government was concerned that there would be a shortage of mohair and created a mohair subsidy to incent the farmers who produced mohair to continue to do so. The mohair subsidy is still in existance, yet I think that the Civil War's over, we have things like synthetic fabrics and all fabrics in any event are created in some third world hell hole and shipped here.

This is yet another feel good nothing proposed by the government to get a block of voters who already live off the labor of others to have yet another thing to thank the government for.

The government will never sell this infrastructure should it be put in place. What they will do is create a "public" option for telecom and put the major telecoms out of business.

reply to post by dolphinfan


Explain to me how denying a vast section of the country access to the Internet helps America?

I can list many ways having it helps...

I don't understand the disdain for your fellow Americans just because they do not have your wealth,education and knowledge. Since you hate these people perhaps giving them access to online schools, training and certifications will help them rise out of poverty...

Its such a small investment for such a huge return....

And the Public WiFi would be filtered...meaning if you want to watch your gay midget porn, you will have too subscribe to a provider that does not filter such content.


[edit on 11-3-2010 by Bahb3]

reply to post by endisnighe


Its evident when it is something that people want (ie, free internet service) they are more than willing to claim they should get it for free.

Nothing in life is free. No matter what Utopian ideal you put into place, everything has a cost. Period.

The internet is the modern day Library on steroids. Does that put it into perspective for you? Sheesh.

reply to post by Bahb3


So you think government should control this library on steroids?

Sheesh, follow the linear conclusion of the government taking over the internet.

As one commenter said, will this be the new internet 2.0, where they censor it?

Riddle me this, when something that is controlled by the government, decides to say there is something wrong with the government, who will be censored the control, or the controllee?

reply to post by endisnighe


And something that is controlled by Private means is clearly for the good of mankind...

I mean, all you have to do is look at all the financial investment companies, banks, tobacco companies, media outlets, corporations of all shapes and sizes to realize that they should be left to their own devices without any hint of government regulation.

Oh wait..



**Edit to add**

Originally posted by endisnighe
So you think government should control this library on steroids?

And how is giving free WiFI.. I assume you know how WiFI works.. Controlling the Internet?

Its a lot easier to convince people of your perspective when you use rational explaining and examples.. Instead of jumping from "Free WiFI in rural area's" to "Total Government control of the Internet and the end of human freedom"..

I understand the direction you are trying to push.. free WiFI here leads to free WiFI everywhere and suddenly it can only access Internet 2.0..

What I say is.. In what, like 25 years? When the Internet is probably only one of several major intertwined communication and connectivity hubs..


[edit on 11/3/10 by Dermo]

reply to post by Dermo


No, the anti monopoly laws and such never get enforced.

Fraud, not enforced.

I believe there needs to be gov and regs, but not to the extreme that enforces a monopolistic attitude.

Regulations created by big business is everything you just mentioned here.

Reply to post by Dermo

If it's private you can take it or leave it. Nobody is going to force anything on you or mandate anything on you or kick in your door at 3AM and shoot your dog and haul you off to prison.

If it's the government in charge all that can happen, has happened and will continue to happen.


Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com

reply to post by thisguyrighthere




If my business went belly up and I was in trouble for money, I could get approx 250 dollars a week and a flat from the Irish Government for my contributions to Social Insurance.. I would also be entitled to any free education I wanted to Masters level, healthcare etc under regulation until I got back on my feet as a (hopefully) better educated, more profitable citizen..

I have never availed of it.. but its there if I need it..

Now.. unless I was spending my time building bombs, selling drugs or murdering people.. Getting my door booted in by Irish cops or EU cops is literally impossible..

So excuse me if I find it hard to take your idea of free WiFI leading to cops kicking in my door and bagging me to be a little extreme.

If you are really that scared of your government in the US, then I am beginning to feel a bit sorry for you.

Originally posted by endisnighe
Regulations created by big business is everything you just mentioned here.

lol

And where was Government then??

You can bitch and moan about it all you like but at the end of the day, without it, we would be at the mercy of the wealthier people with the bigger stick.

reply to post by Dermo


Big Business, Big Banks, Big Government are all and the same in the US.

I would like to start a business again, but now, to just get the licenses, insurances, etc it takes a huge investment to just begin.

Here, you have to get a license to me a manicurist! No, you cannot even clip finger nails without a license.

Yep, freedom to run a business.

Well, might just as well go work for..................oh wait, there are no jobs.

reply to post by endisnighe


Believe me, I know the story.

Its almost at the point where if you want to make a Deli roll in Ireland, you need a safety certificate..

But we deal with it.. One is just as bad as the other in most ways.

Look at the French. One of the most regulated, borderline socialist Capitalist economies in the world when it comes to working.. but they are almost the most productive and healthiest people on the planet... Even though they drink and smoke ridiculous amounts as a people.

In fact, they have so much free time, all they do is complain

reply to post by Dermo


Sorry if my outlook based on learned repeated experiences upsets you. If you can trust your government Im happy for you. Ours regularly kidnaps, kills, steals and imprisons for no reason whatsoever. If you're not from here maybe you never heard of Sam Weaver or how the DEA regularly kills the neighbors of drug dealers and blames it on "wrong addresses" or how cities use mandatory street sweeping to impound cars, sell them, charge the owners with random bills, and intentionally create indebted homeless so the homes can be confiscated and traded off to banks and businesses and universities? Our government hates every last one of us. It has never done a single thing in our best interest.

National free wifi sounds nice and all but with simultaneous pushing for national ID cards one has to wonder if WiFi-ID is coming down the pipe for everyone. Then there's the Class 3 medical implants thing they keep pushing in their healthcare plans. Isnt a chip, if it monitors vitals and stores them in a medical database, a healthcare device?

Naw. The explanation is really a lot simpler.

Wi-fi is going free because in reality it's becoming so pervasive that there's no way to prevent people from getting it or using it. Hot spots are appearing everywhere and they really can't figure out a way to charge people for it unless then do have a permanent address and/or pay for equipment that makes its use more convenient and reliable.

It's sort of like water? Water is "free" but you pay for the convenience in some places of having it piped into your home. So only some "pay for water."

[edit on 11-3-2010 by ~Lucidity]

reply to post by Bahb3


First there are places folks can go to get free internet, like a library. Many city hall facilities and Ys also have them. Granted there are places where folks may not have access to them, but in many cases they do. There is no reason why someone can't used their free bus pass and take a ride over to the library to surf the web.

The problem is this. The federal government provides an enormous number of things for people. A few:

Subsidized housing
Food stamps
WIC (women and children) food subsidies
Subsidized telephone (many cases free)
Free cable TV to the extent that the person lives in public housing
Welfare
Free school lunches
Free job training
Free health care
"tax credits" for folks who pay no taxes

I don't "disdain" the poor. The issue is that the suite of free items provided by the government and hence funded by the productive members of society continues to grow. The means testing for these items continues to rise. That creates a increasing class of folks who have little motivation to improve their circumstances.

The items above are not "rights" and neither is the internet. To the extent that they are provided at all it should be for a limited period of time, not provided in this generational model of dependency we are currently dealing with.

It hurts society because it is another item that incents folks to remain unproductive, since the internet is primarily used for entertainment purposes, hence that is time that folks should be looking for work or properly parenting their children.

Now you might be living in a pipe dream where you think that the folks who are given free internet will use that infrastructure to educate themselves, look for work or potentially start productive businesses. Good for you. I happen to think the opposite