WSJ: "Prepare for an apocalyptic anarchy ending Wall Street's toxic capitalism"

Iran is going to announce they have a bomb.(They bought 3 from the Z stolen from russia by chechnyans and got triggers from n. Korea). They will say if israel doesn't return to pre-67 borders or lifts a finger of agression, they will be forced to protect themselves.

They will say bombs have been placed in the US and if obama tries to help, they will detonate.

Fill your gas tanks. Stock up on ramen noodles and vitamins. If we can last 9 minths 2011 will be the beginning of a global awakening.

Stay positive. Get ready for the rest of the 90% of your "junk dna" to light up the 80% of your cortex that neurologists still aren't sure how it works.

So much doom and gloom, time for a little humor to cheer you up!

It's not just Greece people! Check out this site.

P.I.G.S- Portugal, Ireland, Greece and Spain

Originally posted by antonia
I'm getting that angle but what about the possibility of a bailout from outside the EU? maybe the US? That might be a hell of a longshot but considering the postions we play i wouldn't put it past the Fed.

The Fed has gone so far beyond legality, you're right, anything is possible. I don't think it's likely though. The Fed has made it known for the past couple months now that they are going to be ending Quantitative Easing in March. I just don't see them stepping up to help Europe, especially when several other nations need help, not just Greece. You're looking at trillions that they need to get out of their mess, and they have the same problems we do. They have all of the expenses and no one wants to cut benefits and programs. It's simple Math 101. If you pay out more than you take in, you're going to run a deficit. Sooner or later (looks like sooner for us and Europe) those debts are going to get called.

We don't have the money to get ourselves out of our own mess, how are we going to fund Europe with the Trillions the PIIGS will need to get out of their mess?

Collapses can't happen without, well, collapses.

reply to post by Dbriefed


Doom, gloom, lmao...back to doom and gloom!

Thanks for the laugh!

Nothing will end capitalism for as long as the poor are with us.

Originally posted by bpg131313

Collapses can't happen without, well, collapses.

I'm not really disputing there will be a collapse. I think this is an inevitably at this point. I'm just not sure that trigger is going to come from the P.I.G.S. though. I have a strange feeling the trigger is going to be something we weren't expecting at all.

[edit on 10-2-2010 by antonia]

reply to post by bpg131313


Good surmise there. Why not sell some of their debt to china? They do seem to be in the market for buying debt. There are buyers of debt out there.

Originally posted by Quetzalcoatl12
It's not just Greece people! Check out this site.

P.I.G.S- Portugal, Ireland, Greece and Spain

You left out Italy. PIIGS. There are several other nations in Eastern Europe that need help as well, they just tend to stay out of our media and off of our radar.

Greece ought to pay attention to what happened with Ireland. They didn't a bailout, and they've been in a mess a lot longer than Greece.

The important thing to remember is that this won't remain regional. The big banks in Europe do business with the big banks in America and Asia. It's a big row of dominos. We're all just waiting to see which piece will be toppled first.

The people here need to be thinking about what Wall Street is going to do about our mess here in the US. We have the President's Day weekend coming up where things could come to light while most people aren't in the office. These days, Friday's make me cringe.

Originally posted by TiM3LoRd
I wonder how much of all this us just fear mongering.

I ask myself the same thing... but you only need to take a good long hard look at the state of play and the whole thing takes on a real possibility of everything going down the toilet.

Taking JUST the USA and the UK

:Mired in two wars costing billions
:Not producing much of anything any more
:High unemployment
:Currencies backed up by hot air and nothing else
:Spending taxpayers money like there's no tomorrow (they probably realise there isn't )
:Taxing the crap out of whatever part of the population is still working
:Astronomical national debts
:Share markets living in cloud cuckoo land... where the countries are desintergrating and the likes of Goldman Sachs are giving themselves billions in bonuses and boasting they are having the best year ever.

I could go on and on... but you get the picture.

Fear mongering would be if the reality was rosy but people were wrongly painting a dark picture ... unfortunately you don't need to 'dishonestly' paint a dark picture... the picture is PITCH BLACK and getting darker.

[edit on 10/2/2010 by Dagar]

The funny thing about the Greece issue is the information that has been coming out over the past weekend and few days. It's reported that there is a deal, there's a report that there isn't a deal, there's another report that it's guaranteed to be bailed out (CNBC), then we have the one that came out that Merkels own party in parliment says that it isn't possible for Germany or any EU country to bail Greece out. I know that German doesn't want to do it or even France. Germany definitely because they didn't want to be one of three financially big countries that the rest of the EU went to when those weak countries couldn't or wouldn't fix their economies. In fact the provisions that her own party talk about is the clincher to getting Germany into the EU. What is going on is somebody is playing the market to make money by putting stories out there, pure and simple. Germany knows that it will take at least 50 billion dollars to get them through this year. The problem is that how are they going to pay back that money when they are essentially broke. That would be at least that amount of debt on top of the other debt that takes up 113% of their GDP for next year (347 billion). So you add that 50 billion you push the national debt for the country up to 127% at least, when they are supposed to be lowering their debt ratio.

If you ask me I don't think Germany is going to sign on, because they have problems of their own to deal with economically. What I think may happen is that they will say that Greece must go to the IMF to get the loan, which they really don't want to do.

What could cause our collapse? Well here are a few things off the top of my head that are lining up like dominos:

1. Iran’s “Punch” to the West on the 11th. We don’t know what they mean, or if it means anything at all. One of these days it won’t be empty words, we all know that.

2. We’re selling arms to Taiwan. China has known about this for sometime. They aren’t idiots. Still, they claim Taiwan as their own, and if we’re selling arms to Taiwan, we’re suggesting that China can’t handle their own business.

3. Obama meets the Dalai Lama. They haven’t met yet, but as of 5 days ago, the meeting is still a go. This meeting is a slap in the face to the Chinese who consider Tibet theirs.

4. US military bases in Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and Afghanistan. While most believe those bases and the war they are there to support are for fighting the Taliban, others can pull up a map and see that they are also interestingly close to China. Keep in mind that the US also has bases in South Korea and Japan, and you begin to see a perimeter. Interesting isn’t it?

5. The US and Israel are focused on war with Iran. They tell everyone that it’s because Iran is enriching uranium to the 8-10% levels needed for power production, when everyone who didn’t sleep through high school knows that uranium needs to be enriched beyond 95% for it to be weapons grade. Once we see the nuclear issue as a disguise, we have to look further. Could it be that we’re after Iran because they sell their oil and gas to China and Japan for electronics, cars, etc.?

6. We all got to experience the talking heads speak non-stop about the Pandemic that wasn’t. The swine flu was a non-event, and everyone knows it. If it was released to be a population reducer and it wound up a dud, it stands to reason that those that assembled it will be disappointed and try again, with something else. I’m not saying this is what happened, but if it was the case, it stands to reason that they'd try again.

7. All of Europe going down in an economic fireball. While Germany, France, Luxembourg, and a few other nations are managing themselves well, the vast majority of Europe is not. They all agreed to join together and in so doing, they are also pledged to fall together.

8. The US has over 12 Trillion in debt and that number is growing every second of every day with no changes to the banking system that made it what it is. Will the Fed leave rates at near-zero forever? What happens when that rate rises and the cost to finance our debt raises exponentially?

9. How’s your State doing? States are in way over their heads at this point. Wyoming and New Mexico are the only two States not running a deficit with the latest numbers. The housing market has yet to fall completely, and commercial real estate has a long way yet to fall.

10. Employment rates at serious lows. The problem here is that the Government isn’t being honest and “revises” the numbers afterward when no one is looking. People are out of work, defaulting on mortgages, not paying their bills, and dramatically reducing what they used to pay in taxes because they aren’t bringing in income, and they are walking away from houses where States used to collect property taxes. It’s not even close to done yet. Business sent all the jobs overseas. Now we all get to suffer as a result.

11. Military spending at an all-time high. Never before have we been spread so thin, covering so much area, spending so much money. When that spending stops, or even is reduced, you’ll see another sharp decline in production numbers as the military uses a lot of that production capacity.

12. Some unknown catastrophic event that wipes out a huge portion of the US. It could be a massive earthquake, a huge tsunami, an asteroid impact, or the Yellowstone caldera erupting. This one is just here as the Mother Nature card. Something catastrophic could bring the system down.

13. A nuclear strike. Lets face it. We know the weapons are out there. We all like to think that they are all locked away and that's the way they'll stay. If the weapons exist, they remain an option for those that simply don't care, and know they are on their way out anyway. A nuclear event (even if isolated) in a populated area would usher in the collapse, especially when considering the immediate military response.

I haven’t covered everything. There are a lot of other things out there. This is a good starting point for what could set off the collapse.

you wanna know how to invest? the same way its been done for centuries,... hold your gold! Dont give it to lame cash for gold business cause gold will be valuable when dollar bills are worthless. There is no arguing it, these business will run the show when they have more wealth then what remains of the government if anything buy gold!

The Iranian govt has already blocked access to Google and gmail. Seems like Iran is getting prepared for the massive rallies that will take place tomorrow. I feel terribly for the Iranians as i believe they will be dealt with more harshly than before. God keep them safe.

news.bbc.co.uk...

Speaking of Greece, economics and Anarchy...

www.crimethinc.com...

Let's not forget that there was/is a very strong resistance against tyranny in Greece.

Anarchist groups are alive and well in Greece and are standing up against oppression by police, the government, banks, and other wealthy/powerful establishments.

Anarchists are your brothers/sisters, have no doubt in your mind about that, if you don't see them as such then you are probably either an elite yourself or you're ignorant of the history/facts. Phony fascist sacks of crap like Limbaugh, Beck and O'Reilly claim that Democrats are far-left radicals, but REAL far-left radicals absolutely LAUGH at such a notion and see Democrats as merely the lesser evil of an ineffectual two-party, neo-liberal/conservative corporatist plutocracy. The REAL far-left is actually a very intelligent, truth-seeking, ballsy, freedom-loving, anti-capitalist/communist, anti-fascist/racist, anti-corporate/government, pro-environment, pro-worker, pro-little man, and yes PROUDLY radical bunch. The far-left is where the REAL resistance against tyranny is at, don't let anybody fool you otherwise. WHO marches against the WTO, G20, Neo-Nazis, Republicans AND Democrats, police brutality, the surveillance state, the olympics and gentrification, for workers/womens/minority/gay rights, for the environment, so on and so forth? It's overwhelmingly the FAR-LEFT. They stick their necks out more than any other group, and they're not rich or powerful either, they're barely armed yet they still resist. But enough of my rambling, hah, here are a couple videos on the Greek riots...


The Greek Riots: Some Basic Facts

PART 1


PART 2



Photo collage of the Greek riots:

reply to post by Mr Poopra


Reading articles like these it makes me think the markets will continue to go up. Still way too many people doubting recovery, you have to think the greater percentage will have to be bullish before things really turn around again.

Originally posted by Mr Poopra
Typically an article like this would be found in some sort of "fringe" website, but when it's in the WSJ i pay extra close attention. Feb 11th seems to be a big day not only because of Iran's announcement but also because Greece's fate will be decided that day as well. It will be interesting to see what develops, although everyone from the WSJ to George Ure seem to think it won't be pretty.

www.marketwatch.com...

I wouldn't be betting of EU kicking Greece out of the Euro-zone (although I wished they did since if this happens all illegals have to go elsewhere to find their "promise land", since this one would be officially bankrupt, they all come here because of the euro or for easier transit to the rest of the Euro-zone) since they very much like that added "air-bag" protection that stops the large immigration waves from Africa and Asia. Else, God forbid..if they would need to deal with that themselves. Last time another EU country had to deal with large waves of illegals, for instance Italy, they just sunk the damn ships turning everyone aboard to fish food, including women and children. EU would also have to deal themselves directly with all human and drug trafficking rings and risking making these rings "operators" angry..and we can't have that now, can we?
They probably have a ploy set up with the new government that of course will use EU demands as a threat to abide in even harsher economic measures . Yes governments in Greece used to do this for a long time. They blackmail the citizenry and always have to hide behind what EU demands. It's never their fault.

Nobody has to take my word for all the above though.

[edit on 10-2-2010 by spacebot]



-Red arrows in the picture are the current illegal immigration routes trying to enter the Euro-zone. Asia, Balkans, East Europe, Africa all converge to the shores of this single country, the one that is the further to the south-east from the rest of the Euro-zone countries.
-All Euro-zone countries are colored light blue.

[edit on 10-2-2010 by spacebot]

Originally posted by djusdjus
Exactly nothing will come of any of this. It's all speculation, like all market thought is. You can't guarantee anything on the free market. You never could and nobody can accurately predict any of it.

Actually NO. It has become almost mathematicaly impossible for many countries to service, let alone repay their debts and by locking the CDS debt into the state's finances through the bailout, it guarantees absolute ftotal fiscal failure.

After many, many days of hard thought, I conclude that the ONLY means out from multiple catastrophic international bankruptcy:-

1. Space aliens land and give the uSA a goodwill gift of 1,000,000 tons of gold bullion.
2. Someone finds that, by a quirk of geological fate, Manhattan island is built on almost entirely pure gold reef.
3. David Rotheschild becomes a born again Christian and, broken hearted and repentant for all his past deeds, he wills his entire fortune to the US Treasury and shoots himself dead in the head.
4. The entire population of China and India are accidentally knocked down by a vegetable truck..
5. Canada mounts a sudden and unexpected invasion of the USA in a single night of bloodless, but ruthless conquest, leaving the US bondholders out in the cold.

Originally posted by poet1b

Who loses out if the stock market collapses?

People with lots of money in the stock market.

It seems to me that the rise and fall of the stock market really doesn't affect Mainstreet. It doesn't create jobs, or expand businesses.

You seriously are totally and dangerously naive.

If the USA defaults on its debt, the following would happen:-

- Comprehnsive banking collapse.
- All Governement employees stop being paid, including teacheras, Police etc..
- All borrowing for commerce stops dead, including finance to buy new food.
- All Air Traffic Control and hence air traffic stops dead.
- Massive immediate strike by all public employees, paralysing all Governement services, making many things like freeways non-operational.
- All businesses with Government contracts are defaulted on and most go immediately bankrupt.
- Total tax default.
- All Coastguard services stop meaning USA instantly floods with coc aine and crack.
- With communications gone and no cash to fund new stock, all stores run out of food within about one week.
- All food stamps and welfare cheques stop resulting in staggering increase in crime, closing what businesses are left open.
- No police to stop rioting. Even if special legislation exists to allow US Army to be paid, there are now no means to pay them as all the banks have collapsed.
- Scared for their families who are now starving, soldiers either dessert or often turn their guns on their own officers.
- Hospitals, now overflowing with gunshot victims and lacking supplies, close across the board. People left ot die on the street.
- Emergency cremations of the dead in the streets and on waste grounds.
- Murder out of control as neighbuors turn on each other for food.
- All telephones go down due to no payment of the Government's invoices
- Mass exodus and panic amongst the populus and anger.
- Starvation follows within the month in parts of the USA.
- Foreign countries with claim on US Territory would seem=k to reclaim it. For instance, Guantanamo Bay can only be legally occupied on Cuba so long as they keep offering to pay the Communist's the tab agreed with the Batista Government. Okinawa has bases so long as US keeps paying the token rent to Japan. Diego Garcia would be reclaimed by the UK as the US can no longer pay the rent.

These are a FEW of the immediate effects if the US goes bust..

The salvation of Greece.

Ironically, the strong trade union movement and presence of extreme left in the country might actually save Greece from going under.

If some form of General Strike is called, then the Government of Greece will not have to pay the strikers' salaries nor provide those public services whilst it is on. The massive cost saving just might allow them to pull back from the brink.