Atheist? probably not.

FOR THE ATHEISTS:

A few days ago I was discussing religion with some friends. One of my friends was visibly upset and he said "I'm an atheist. I don't believe in any of that. Lets change the subject". Everybody agreed but I had to push the issue. I asked if he was offended by our discussing religion in front of him. He said he was, and I said "then you aren't an atheist!". I then explained why. (this bothers me about a lot of so-called atheists)

Me: "do you believe in God?"

Him: "no'

Me: "do you believe in Mickey Mouse? Do you think he's real?"

Him: "no"

Me: "do you get offended when people talk about Mickey Mouse?"

Him: "no"

Me: "then why do you get offended at people for talking about God? if you were a
true atheist than God would be no more real to you than Mickey Mouse."

Him: "that's different"

Me: "how?"

Him: "i don't know"

Me: "do you believe in Superman and Wolverine?"

Him: "no"

Me: "but you like talking about comics..."

Him: "whatever dude"

I can't understand why somebody would be offended in something that didn't exist, yet this seems to be my experience with the so-called atheists I have run into. They vehemently deny the possibility of God and their feathers are ruffled at the mere mention of the 'g-word'. If anything I would think they would have pity on those who practice religion. How silly and delusional we must be to them! The only thing I can think of is that yes, they acknowledge God, but for whatever personal reason they choose to shun rather than embrace. But that's just my guess. Any thoughts on this?

Its seems to me that what bothers them is religious people themselves (I like to believe I am spiritual and not religious) and not so much "God" but that is just based on my own experience.

reply to post by Arizonee


It has nothing to do with the mention or speaking of god. It has EVERYTHING to do with having the ideas of god pushed upon people, and the general stigma from god-believers that atheists are in denial, that they are heathens, or are going to hell.

Now, I am agnostic, not an atheist, but I see it every day. Both sides of this argument lack any understanding of the other.

You know that feeling you get when someone believes that they know the right highway to take, and you're holding a map and a gps saying to them "You're going the wrong way!!!"

And they just don't believe you cause they 'gotta feeling', and you may just be on the phone with them not even in the car, and it doesn't affect you at all, but you're still pissed cause their deliberately being ignorant.

Originally posted by calstorm
Its seems to me that what bothers them is religious people themselves (I like to believe I am spiritual and not religious) and not so much "God" but that is just based on my own experience.

Thats incorrect

I couldnt give two craps about what you believe in or what you want to worship. Fact is, Im atheist, and the only things that bothers me about religious people are:

1. When you tell me Im going to hell for not believing in god or think you are better than me because of being atheist

2. When you preach to me

3. When you assume we all hate god, when we simply dont believe in god

4. Anyone who is a fundamentalist

Continue believing in what you want, but dont assume that everyone will want to talk about it and be like you

In this particular conversation we were just mentioning the bible in passing. Not even in a preachy manner. I am not 'religious' but I personally believe in some sort of creating force. Nobody likes to have religion preached, but I am referring to those who get upset at the mere mention of a God.

reply to post by Arizonee


I don't recall any wars in the name of Mickey Mouse. I might liken your argument here to Atheism as that of peadophiles trying to justify "inter-generational sex".

Originally posted by Arizonee
In this particular conversation we were just mentioning the bible in passing. Not even in a preachy manner. I am not 'religious' but I personally believe in some sort of creating force. Nobody likes to have religion preached, but I am referring to those who get upset at the mere mention of a God.

I have rarely met anyone who gets offended at the simple mentioning of god, and I would guess you are trying to figure out the actions of a simple few.

That being said, I do think that it can get quite frustrating, when having a religious or spiritual discussion, to have someone continue to throw the bible and its passages in as arguments.

It seems that, even though there are many of us who dont believe in the bible (or take it as a simple metaphor), and are arguing from that standpoint, are supposed to take the quoting of it as counter arguments. There is a glaring hole in that logic.

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by calstorm
Its seems to me that what bothers them is religious people themselves (I like to believe I am spiritual and not religious) and not so much "God" but that is just based on my own experience.

Thats incorrect

I couldnt give two craps about what you believe in or what you want to worship. Fact is, Im atheist, and the only things that bothers me about religious people are:

1. When you tell me Im going to hell for not believing in god or think you are better than me because of being atheist

2. When you preach to me

3. When you assume we all hate god, when we simply dont believe in god

4. Anyone who is a fundamentalist

Continue believing in what you want, but dont assume that everyone will want to talk about it and be like you

Perhaps you misunderstood me or I was not clear on what I meant because
statments like this is what I was referring to when I said the problem was with religious people and not with God himself. How can you have a problem with something you don't believe exists?

reply to post by OzWeatherman

Continue believing in what you want, but dont assume that everyone will want to talk about it and be like you

Not everyone will, I sometimes like to speculate on some of the stuff like the rapture, and well other of the odd events the bible and others talk about.

I don't believe it, but it is stimulating to talk about it

arizonee-

Nobody likes to have religion preached, but I am referring to those who get upset at the mere mention of a God.

People get upset at so many things though, god subject is just kind of singled out cause its a belief and sensitive.

If someone starts talking to me about nephilim coming down and anal probing people, my blood will start to boil, hell if someone tells me canadian beer isn't good, my blood explodes out of my veins.

I get angry at the mere mention of alot of stuff, cause i'm human, contrary to popular belief.

.......

Me: "but you like talking about comics..."

What year is this?

Originally posted by calstorm

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by calstorm
Its seems to me that what bothers them is religious people themselves (I like to believe I am spiritual and not religious) and not so much "God" but that is just based on my own experience.

Thats incorrect

I couldnt give two craps about what you believe in or what you want to worship. Fact is, Im atheist, and the only things that bothers me about religious people are:

1. When you tell me Im going to hell for not believing in god or think you are better than me because of being atheist

2. When you preach to me

3. When you assume we all hate god, when we simply dont believe in god

4. Anyone who is a fundamentalist

Continue believing in what you want, but dont assume that everyone will want to talk about it and be like you

Perhaps you misunderstood me or I was not clear on what I meant because
statments like this is what I was referring to when I said the problem was with religious people and not with God himself. How can you have a problem with something you don't believe exists?

That something ends up causing alot of people harm and misfortune, although I wouldn't say all atheists have a problem with god, some just don't see it.

Your premise for the conversation between the 2 is incredibly childish... and thats because you wrote both sides of it. If a logical person were talking to the fool who discribes wolverine as REAL then surely if there was any chance to help, a logical person would help the them understand that wolverine is not real... but a fictional caracter created to help ignorant people get up in the moring believing that justice exists "somewhere".

If a thread ever comes up that WOLVERINE is REAL then i will be there to tell them how pitifull that is, if they dont need it to survive.

Would you be freaked out if someone talked about mickey mouse as if he acctually was real?

if you were a true atheist than God would be no more real to you than Mickey Mouse.

What? He is not offended by talking about Mickey Mouse, so he's not a "real" atheist? Mickey mouse is supposed to be fantasy, not real (for anyone except mental patients)

Your friend doesnt talk about Mikey as if he existed, but thats what religious people do about their gods.

reply to post by Arizonee


It's possible your friend may feel uncomfortable discussing religion with someone who firmly believes in a god - as he may prefer not to offend you by pointing out various inconsistencies in your religion, and feel it is not his place to cause you to question your faith*

Other than that, no idea - I don't know your friend.



edit: as an analogy, imagine talking to a child who totally believes in Father Christmas - would you feel comfortable having a discussion with him in which you might well say something to destroy that belief?





[edit on 2-2-2010 by Essan]

Haha great post! I have many issues with these self righteous atheist my self. The thing I hate the most is when you use the lord name in vain and the atheist chimes in with "I don't believe in god." Like it was a question.

Originally posted by Lophe
Haha great post! I have many issues with these self righteous atheist my self. The thing I hate the most is when you use the lord name in vain and the atheist chimes in with "I don't believe in god." Like it was a question.

Oh god

Here we go

reply to post by Lophe


One should never use Lord Voldemorte's name in vain - you never know when a deatheater might be around

Originally posted by Arizonee
FOR THE ATHEISTS:

A few days ago I was discussing religion with some friends. One of my friends was visibly upset and he said "I'm an atheist. I don't believe in any of that. Lets change the subject". Everybody agreed but I had to push the issue. I asked if he was offended by our discussing religion in front of him. He said he was, and I said "then you aren't an atheist!". I then explained why. (this bothers me about a lot of so-called atheists)

Me: "do you believe in God?"

Him: "no'

Me: "do you believe in Mickey Mouse? Do you think he's real?"

Him: "no"

Me: "do you get offended when people talk about Mickey Mouse?"

Him: "no"

Me: "then why do you get offended at people for talking about God? if you were a
true atheist than God would be no more real to you than Mickey Mouse."

Him: "that's different"

Me: "how?"

Him: "i don't know"

Me: "do you believe in Superman and Wolverine?"

Him: "no"

Me: "but you like talking about comics..."

Him: "whatever dude"

I can't understand why somebody would be offended in something that didn't exist, yet this seems to be my experience with the so-called atheists I have run into. They vehemently deny the possibility of God and their feathers are ruffled at the mere mention of the 'g-word'. If anything I would think they would have pity on those who practice religion. How silly and delusional we must be to them! The only thing I can think of is that yes, they acknowledge God, but for whatever personal reason they choose to shun rather than embrace. But that's just my guess. Any thoughts on this?

I can tell you why it's different easily enough. Let me do it by having a conversation with you.

you: "do you believe in God?"

me: "no'

you: "do you believe in Mickey Mouse? Do you think he's real?"

me: "no"

you: "do you get offended when people talk about Mickey Mouse?"

me: "no"

you: "then why do you get offended at people for talking about God? if you were a
true atheist than God would be no more real to you than Mickey Mouse."

me: "i wouldnt be offended if you talked about mickey mouse"

you: "why not?"

me: "because you know he isnt real"

you: "do you believe in Superman and Wolverine?"

me: "no"

you: "but you like talking about comics..."

me: "you like talking about a comic called the bible, only you believe its real"

you: "now im getting offended"

me: "why because now you think wolverine is real?"




[edit on 2-2-2010 by watcher73]

I can't understand why somebody would be offended in something that didn't exist, yet this seems to be my experience with the so-called atheists I have run into. They vehemently deny the possibility of God and their feathers are ruffled at the mere mention of the 'g-word'. If anything I would think they would have pity on those who practice religion. How silly and delusional we must be to them! The only thing I can think of is that yes, they acknowledge God, but for whatever personal reason they choose to shun rather than embrace. But that's just my guess. Any thoughts on this?

Why would we pity you? We know how much better the world could be without you "silly and delusion" people. Yet you outnumber us. So the laws of the mob apply.

It would probably make you a bit angry to be drowned out by what is mostly a moral less war mongering majority.



[edit on 2-2-2010 by watcher73]

Originally posted by Arizonee
Me: "do you believe in God?"
Him: "no'
Me: "do you believe in Mickey Mouse? Do you think he's real?"
Him: "no"
Me: "do you get offended when people talk about Mickey Mouse?"
Him: "no"
Me: "then why do you get offended at people for talking about God? if you were a true atheist than God would be no more real to you than Mickey Mouse."
Him: "that's different"
Me: "how?"
Him: "i don't know"
Me: "do you believe in Superman and Wolverine?"
Him: "no"
Me: "but you like talking about comics..."
Him: "whatever dude"

I can't understand why somebody would be offended in something that didn't exist, yet this seems to be my experience with the so-called atheists I have run into. They vehemently deny the possibility of God and their feathers are ruffled at the mere mention of the 'g-word'. If anything I would think they would have pity on those who practice religion. How silly and delusional we must be to them! The only thing I can think of is that yes, they acknowledge God, but for whatever personal reason they choose to shun rather than embrace. But that's just my guess. Any thoughts on this?

I like your straw man. He's cute.

God doesn't offend atheists, for just the reason you suspect it shouldn't. Why be offended by what isn't there?

However when Wolverine is slobbering himself at the thought of getting himself some preteen tail, one can certainly be offended at the writers. Or at the people who think that's awesome.

We do pity the religious. Her we have a bunch of people who have deluded themselves into believing that if they do not devote their entire life and everything they accomplish to a magical but silent and invisible being, then not only will they turn into werewolves (so to speak, the whole "you need religion to be moral" argument) but then their loving god will turn on them, kill them, and throw them into eternal torture.

Or for another religion, we have people who believe that who's crotch you fall out of determines whether you get to be the abuser or the abusee in society, because the gods ordained your caste. Or perhaps the spirits of your tribe require chastity... meaning you're going to have your clitoris sliced out and your labia stitched shut, how fun.

We're also irritated by the constant need of the religious to swing their faith around like a dead cat. Do Christians and Muslims really need to be surrounded by religious iconography and reminders of their faith? What, are they afraid that they might slip up and forget about their magical invisible silent imaginary man in the sky?

Even that's not so bad compared to the way the religious keep shoving their faces into social and religious policies around the world. Here in the United States, Christians are barking mad that the Jesus-Horse Hypothesis isn't treated with the same dignitas as authentic scientific theories - and their pressure has gotten a few schools to cave, anyway. The world over, there are nations where homosexuality is illegal, sometimes even punishable by death, because religion says so. In India, you can't give your girlfriend a kiss in public, because that violates the chastity laws with origins in two religions. Ireland has made it so that you can't "blaspheme" with the definition of Blasphemy no doubt judged on an individual rather than standardized basis - and it seems like atheism = blasphemy there.

if the religious could just mind their own business, I certainly wouldn't mind if they talked to invisible people, magic statues, friendly sticks, sandals and gourds, or whatever.