Where was all that 95% of UA93 wreckage?

reply to post by Lillydale


Maybe I should read it to you, since it clearly states that KSM, OBL and others conspired with the 19 men who hijacked airliners on September 11, 2001.

You didnt even have to read the full indictment to see that.

reply to post by Lillydale


Well, since I had assumed that the person I was replying to was smart enough to know I was referencing the events of 9/11/2001...I assumed that other posters would be smart enough know that as well. In your case, I was wrong, for that I apologize and I am editing my post.

Originally posted by hooper
No, because of the evidence.

Kind of poor evidence.

Again, when was his arraignment? When was he captured? Must have missed that one on TV. Damn mainstream media.

Again both the FBI and DOJ have stated there is not enough evidence to charge OBL with being behind 9/11.

You should at least try to do some research before responding so it seems like you know what your talking about.

[edit on 17-1-2010 by REMISNE]

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by Lillydale

 

Maybe I should read it to you, since it clearly states that KSM, OBL and others conspired with the 19 men who hijacked airliners on September 11, 2001.

You better because I see what you are talking about and it is just you not understanding what you are reading. It clearly states that he had given support to the same people that ended up being the 9/11 hijackers. NOWHERE does it say he supported them in that particular mission.

Do not worry, I am starting to understand your issues here. If you can show me which part refutes what I have just stated, please do.

reply to post by Lillydale

conspire and agree with Usama bin Laden, Ayman al Zawahiri, Mo~a.rned al Kahtan; Mohammed Atef(a/k/a Abu Hafs al Masri), 19 individuals who hijacked four commercial airliners on September 11,2001:

I cannot make it any clearer.

Originally posted by GenRadek
Hmm.... No human bodies? Really? What did they find instead? Shredded remains. Shredded human remains in a violent crash site? NO!!! Couldnt happen!

But enough to ID at least 34 victims.

Oh man, I totally forgot.



They identified everyone but one person who was supposed to be on that flight. Yet, there were also 5 hijackers, none of whom were listed on the manifest. Spare me the "updated passenger manifest to make up for the accidental release of the 'victim's list.'" So bravo on your theory and all but it is a little hard to believe they founded the shredded remains of all but one passenger AS WELL AS the 5 hijackers who were apparently stow aways, never really checked in, or magically appeared. Delicious.

There is a reason I do not reply to you often. Thanks for reminding me.

reply to post by Lillydale

Spare me the "updated passenger manifest to make up for the accidental release of the 'victim's list

There is nothing "updated" about it. The passenger manifest as printed off by the gate agent shows the terrorists.

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
There is nothing "updated" about it. The passenger manifest as printed off by the gate agent shows the terrorists.

You mean the terrorists that used fake and phoney ID's?

reply to post by REMISNE

You mean the terrorists that used fake and phoney ID's?

Well no wonder you are so confused when it comes to 9/11. You are still believing rumors from long ago that were cleared up....long ago.

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
Well no wonder you are so confused when it comes to 9/11. You are still believing rumors from long ago that were cleared up....long ago.

Not according to government and professional research sites. You really should try to do some research before repsonding.



[edit on 17-1-2010 by REMISNE]

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999

Now, the man that lives next to the crash site is a liar too?

You made that claim, do you have a source to back your statement?

So, a large chunk of the military are liars

You made that statement I have never made any such statement that a “large chunk” of the military are lairs?

as is the FAA in reference to the events of 9/11

You made that statement up, I have never made the claim on this thread that a large chunk of military or FAA are lairs?

All of the FBI are liars in reference to the events of 9/11

You just made it up as usual,I never made the statement on this thread that “ALL” the FBI are all lying.

The media is liars in reference to the events of 9/11

I stand correct on that issue.

Most of our elected officials are liars in reference to the events of 9/11

I never said that. You are making stuff up again, however I would have to say, yes most elected officials are liars given that we have enough proof of that already.

FDNY, NYPD, PAPD are full of liars in reference to the events of 9/11

I have never made that claim in this tread, and I do not support such an insane idea

The families of the victims are mostly liars in reference to the events of 9/11

I have never made any such claims to these wild accusation and I do not believe the real families and victims are lairs you need to take a chill pill and come back later.

In your world, appearantly the only people that tell the truth are David Ray Griffen and William Rodriguez in reference to the events of 9/11.

You are not a psychiatrist or qualified to make such medical determination and you do not know what my world or reality is. So stop trying to diagnose people on ATS because you do not like their beliefs about 911.

The fact is flight UAL 93 never crashed in Shanskville PA.

United 93 Still Airborne After Alleged Crash - According To ATC/Radar

pilotsfor911truth.org...

The photos that were taken, and posted all over the internet does not constitute, it is the truth. The photos could have been taken anywhere, at any place, or time, in any country, or at any crash scene or at airplane bone yard.







[edit on 17-1-2010 by impressme]

reply to post by impressme



Perpetuating more ignorance, courtesy of that (well discredted) source "Pilots for 9/11 Truth".

The fact is flight UAL 93 never crashed in Shanskville PA.


United 93 Still Airborne After Alleged Crash - According To ATC/Radar

They (and you) sure like to trot this out, but leave off the details. We're talking a three-minute (if that much) discrepancy in the time. That is, the time recorded at the ATC facility, and the onboard clock (whick provides the time reference for the FDR, via the ADC).

Really, you would think that the "Pilots" over there would have realized this by now --- are they intentionally misleading in order to keep those 'donations' coming in???

Recall, for the record, the FDR showed a time of about 1003 EDT when it stopped, and the only difference with the ATC (from the transcripts) is THEY lost the primary target at 1006.

What has come up in another ATS thread (something that isn't well understood by those not in the business) are the remarks by the wife of United 93 Captain Jason Dahl.

Her only disagreement (and this is very minor) is that, prior to actually hearing the CVR tapes for herself, as part of a special event just for relatives, she came away with a different interpretation of the final seconds than she thought she had been led to believe.

For some reason she had the impression (from FBI and sources) that the passengers had breached the cockpit (which we know is incorrect) and that here husband's body was out of the cockpit, on the floor either in the forward galley, or at door 1L.

The only thing she is upset about is that she thinks her husband was mortally wounded, but not dead, and still in his seat. She's upset because the passengers get all the "hero" recognition, and none was given to her husband.

She may have a point.

THAT could explain why the puzzling anomaly happened, just before impact, as trumpeted by the "pilots" (although they have not, as yet, come up with a reason:

WHY did the transponder briefly squawk altitude (Mode C)?

I surmise that it could have been Capt. Dahl who turned the transponder back on. When the hijackers were distracted by the commotion in the cabin, as the passengers were mounting their assault.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I choose to add here, that the transponder controls are located on the center pedestal, as can be confirmed by anyone who chooses to research, I don't have to continually link sources....

Point is, Capt. Dahl could easily have (if he were still consicious, and alive, and in is seat) reached down with is right hand to turn on the transponder....
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Given his serious injuries, there would have been little else he could do, despite her obvious pride and faith in him, that he would have tried anything. She thinks somehow he could have 'disabled' the autopilot, but sohort of standing up and reaching behind him to the circuit breaker panels on the ceiling of the cockpit, there just wasn't much that could be done there. He COULD have switched off the generators, and that would disable the aitopilot (but it also would have made the FDR and CVR stop immediately, since they require normal AC and DC).


[edit on 18 January 2010 by weedwhacker]

Originally posted by weedwhacker
I surmise that it could have been Capt. Dahl who turned the transponder back on. When the hijackers were distracted by the commotion in the cabin, as the passengers were mounting their assault.

How could he do this if his body was found outside the cockpit?



[edit on 18-1-2010 by REMISNE]

reply to post by Lillydale


Ahh so now you are playing the special semantics games again? Wow. Anything to ignore the facts eh?

I posted eyewitnesses who watched the plane going into a nose-dive, going straight down, etc etc etc, and saw the fireball go up, with the sound of the engines cuttin off on impact and the explosion sounds, and and to you thats not enough. So exactly WHAT do you think happened when those people that saw a plane doing a high speed nose-dive INTO THE GROUND and a resulting fireball going up? It magically pulled up and faked everyone out and disappeared? Is this what you are insinuating?

My God, you just make the WORST excuses ever to try and ignore the facts. You wanted eyewitnesses that saw the plane plummeting into the ground or just feet above the ground and crashing, and to you: Oh thats not good enough, I wanted people who were standing 1 ft away from the crater with a completely unobstructed view and saw it from final dive to the moment where it slams into the ground If thats not being a troll I dont know what is anymore. and in that list there was one who DID see it, (Nevin Lambert) and you STILL missed it until Swampfox pointed it out to you. And you say MY reading comprehension is bad?



admin edit: quotation marks removed to show that GenRadek's summation of lillydale's stance is his thought, not an actual quote.

[edit on 18-1-2010 by Crakeur]

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
There is nothing "updated" about it. The passenger manifest as printed off by the gate agent shows the terrorists.

If there was nothing "updated" about it then there were no last minute changes.

Since there were last minute changes and you know about them, apparently there was an updated list. Please please please try to keep up. You claimed there were last minute changes and there was no way anyone could fake their calls because they were last minute changes. You know about these changes. We all know about these changes. Why is that? Either it is psychic ability or it something was updated to reflect those changes. Seems pretty simple.

Originally posted by GenRadek
reply to post by Lillydale

 

Ahh so now you are playing the special semantics games again? Wow. Anything to ignore the facts eh?

Am I?

I posted eyewitnesses who watched the plane going into a nose-dive, going straight down, etc etc etc, and saw the fireball go up, with the sound of the engines cuttin off on impact and the explosion sounds, and and to you thats not enough.

When? Where are the names and quotes? The only thing I got was a couple long pdf files and was told to go fishing. Please point me to these witnesses that you posted.

So exactly WHAT do you think happened when those people that saw a plane doing a high speed nose-dive INTO THE GROUND and a resulting fireball going up? It magically pulled up and faked everyone out and disappeared? Is this what you are insinuating?

I am not insinuating anything. I am waiting for these witnesses you and other continue to claim have been shown in this thread. Where are they?

My God, you just make the WORST excuses ever to try and ignore the facts.

When I accuse people of something, I quote them doing it in order to show that I am not just making things up to try and attack someone without anything to base it on.

You wanted eyewitnesses that saw the plane plummeting into the ground or just feet above the ground and crashing, and to you, "Oh thats not good enough, I wanted people who were standing 1 ft away from the crater with a completely unobstructed view and saw it from final dive to the moment where it slams into the ground"

Those are quotation marks. That would indicate you are quoting me directly. I never said any of that so you had best apologize, include a disclaimer, or fix it. Do I get to just make up things you said now?

I still want eyewitnesses, not someone insisting I am ignoring them. Who are they? Where are their statements? Another muddy pdf file?

If thats not being a troll I dont know what is anymore. and in that list there was one who DID see it, (Nevin Lambert) and you STILL missed it until Swampfox pointed it out to you. And you say MY reading comprehension is bad?

LOL. You admit it right there!

You are the troll here sir. You just wasted all that time telling me how wrong I am for ignoring a list of witnesses that in your closing paragraph you admit DID NOT ACTUALLY SEE IT.

Witnesses who did not see anything are really not witnesses. I can get you a dictionary as long as I am sending so many out this year.

I did not miss Nevin Lambert. I clearly stated that I was not going fishing through a muddled pdf file and asked that he be pointed out. Sine these things are in print where you can read them and you still somehow seemed to not understand any of it, that would most definitely speak to your reading comprehension and not mine. Please try and mock me again for missing something else I said in print I was not going fishing for. It really makes you seem clever.

Please allow yourselves a moment to review this thread:

Attention 9-11 posters

Don't respond to this post. Read the thread I linked.

reply to post by REMISNE

How could he do this if his body was found outside the cockpit?

Please substantiate this allegation.

What I mean is, IS this another one of those false leads, meant to distract and deflect...??

There is certainly no way to ascertain any locations of bodies within the United Airlines 93 prior to impact, at least not based on the accident site, except for what may be inferred by the meager clues that exist, IE the CVR....

Speaking on this subject, BTW...

Anyone who is even vaguely familiar with the layout of the area and the "floor plan" (whether as a person looking into this, or someone who is intimately familiar from having worked there) onboard an airplane wil understand this....

The ONLY way that any sort of "assault" on the cockpit would or could have been mounted, by passengers destined to trying to foil the intent of
the hijackers, in order to wrest control (and possibly, with time on their side, survive to a safe landing, becaue it WOULD have been possible --- but that's another thread...) would have been if "bodies" or other impediments weren't laying in the aisle, correct???

I am sorry, but so many times the logic is inescapable, at least for those of us who have actually WORKED in the industry, and can comprehend HOW this could have played out.

Too many people, who do NOT know anything about airlines, aviation, flying, you name it, keep chiming in with their nonsense "theories" and, unfortuantely, the 'nonsens' gets attention, despite being pure NONSENSE in most instances!!!!

What we lack, here at ATS, is enough OTHER pilots, or even Flight Attendants, to offer their perspectives and stories.

Fortunately we have at least a few military pilots, and a few mechanics....but, the misinformation keeps trudging along, in spite of the value that many bring to the discussion.

I don't know how else to describe it, except to say that those of us who LIVED through the consequences and the results, in the way it impacted our personal and professional lives, post-9/11, have a better perpective on just WHAT IS, and WHAT IS NOT 'truth'.....

This is why I bristle, so often, at the idiocy and inanity that I see so often, here on ATS.

Most of it comes from the lack of full understanding, and experience, than many others are willing to bring to this discussion.

It's not about "apologizing" for the "Government"...that is a concept invented by those who wish to perpetuate this nonsense....

OK, I ranted a bit, sorry....

....back to topic

The intent of this OP was to plant a mental image in people's minds regarding the United Airines 93 wreckage recovery from the crash site at Shanksville, PA, and to (in the mind of the OP) impart the impression that the publically available photos somehow "destroy" the 'official story' (whatever that is supposed to mean).


The fact that the crash site, in Shanksville, is completely unprecedented in nature is continually ignored by the ones who wish to find "fault" in the events of reality...they just cannot grasp that something unusual, and never seen before happened, and this concept is fueled by those hucksters who widh to profit on it, for purely personal reasons....

It is disgusting.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

edit the tags.....



[edit on 18 January 2010 by weedwhacker]

reply to post by weedwhacker


star i wish you luck my freind the facts are there but most dont have the understanding or personal experience im a metal fabricator and avid builder i own a shop its my job yet trying to explain how different metal acts under different kinds of heat and temperature changes at the twin towers core youd think i was saying aliens are attacking(would proly be accpted here in a second) truth is there are alot of ATSers who are simply trying to create fake conspiacys in order to get attention. I live in NY right by the city like ten minutes out i remember 9-11 well im 30 now and to hear people f up the truth with all this BS nwo TPTB crapola only shows they are truly the sheeple often made fun of.
The blind leading the blind.
Flight 93 wasnt real your kidding??? there is one thing to prove the naysayers wrong its called evidence
witnesses,science ya know the little things
Im just about done debating on these threads cause while i am willing to learn, I cannot deal with the ignorance of someone who says everbody is in on 9-11 (the witnesses me my family, the government police and fire officials who are our sisters brother and so on, the military also made up of citizens geez on and on)
have sum respect people denying 9-11 is a direct insult to all americans even those to blind to see the truth.

reply to post by GenRadek


Turns out i might stick around this thread after all i didnt think anyone would make any sense i see im not alone
Thank you
bing bing star