Where was all that 95% of UA93 wreckage?

reply to post by hooper


I said common sense 46 years worth ! Not common knowledge ! I said in my opinion i haven't seen a plane break up into phone book size pieces ! Now if you can't accept my word on that then you are ultimately calling me a LIAR ! It is a fact that in my lifetime i have not seen an aircraft break into small pieces like that ! FACT ! I have seen many many many crash site photographs and video etc and none looked like this ! FACT ! I did not want to get into this argument as you can see from earlier post i look at both sides as i stated and only wish that the truth, whatever that may be comes along to put closure to this for everyone ! Oh and just to add Lockerbie happened just a few miles from where i live ! I think you get the idea !

Respects


[edit on 093131p://12America/Chicago30 by ProRipp]

Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by ATH911

 

There is actually a huge amount of evidence for UA 93 crashing near Shanksville. For example :- Air Traffic Control tapes, Flight Data Recorder and Cockpit Voice Recorder recovered from the site. ( The latter providing clear evidence of conflict between hi-jackers and passengers near the end.) Telephone calls from passengers to close relatives describing hi-jacking. DNA confirmed body parts of passengers and crew recovered from acres adjacent to crash site. Personal effects recovered from crash site. Plane parts compatible with a Boeing 757 (at least one engine part weighing about 1000 lbs)

Against that, all you seem to be offering is your personal opinion of what a photo of a high speed crash site should look like.

I would be interested to know, and I have never got a straight answer from a truther on this, is why would anyone fake a crash site in a field in Pennsylvania ?

I saw a video presentation before which claimed that the "Black Boxes" were of the wrong make/year for the plane that crashed. Was this ever proven to be false?

I'll try to find a link to it on UTube

Originally posted by TXRabbit
I saw a video presentation before which claimed that the "Black Boxes" were of the wrong make/year for the plane that crashed. Was this ever proven to be false?

I'll try to find a link to it on UTube

Look up if the boxes were ever matched to planes by serial number.

Here's a link to the video I was referring to.


Back in Black Boxes

Originally posted by TXRabbit
Here's a link to the video I was referring to.


Back in Black Boxes

I am sorry but I could see nothing in that video beyond suggestion and innuendo.

The CVR recording has actually been played back to close relatives of the passengers by the FBI. I would suggest that would be something no-one would dare do with a phoney.

Originally posted by ProRipp
reply to post by hooper

 

I said common sense 46 years worth ! Not common knowledge ! I said in my opinion i haven't seen a plane break up into phone book size pieces ! Now if you can't accept my word on that then you are ultimately calling me a LIAR ! It is a fact that in my lifetime i have not seen an aircraft break into small pieces like that ! FACT ! I have seen many many many crash site photographs and video etc and none looked like this ! FACT ! I did not want to get into this argument as you can see from earlier post i look at both sides as i stated and only wish that the truth, whatever that may be comes along to put closure to this for everyone ! Oh and just to add Lockerbie happened just a few miles from where i live ! I think you get the idea !

Respects


[edit on 093131p://12America/Chicago30 by ProRipp]

No, I don't get the idea. WTC and Shanksville happened close to me yet I would never use that as a basis for declaring myself a crash site expert. On another note - there is not two sides to this story. There is the reality which is accepted by the rational world and then there is this submicroscopic subculture of the microscopic conspiracy culture that want anyone that will listen to them think there are honest questions about whether or not a plane crashed in Shanksville or whether or not George Bush had explosives planted in the WTC towers.

And really, you've looked at many, many crash site photos and they all looked alright to you but the ones taken in Shanksville and entered into evidence in an American court of law somehow look suspect??

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by ATH911

 

So basically, you've concluded that the FBI lied based on your amateur analysis of photos you can find on the internet.

Can't argue with those high intellectual standards.

Just as a fun note - the one photo you posted was taken a few hundred feet away from the crash site and the other was an aerial photo taken at some point after the clean up had begun.

Just as oh, a fun note - Those photos were used by the FBI as "official evidence".

And where is your proof or reference that the photo was taken during or after any clean up effort?

The intellectual "standards" you refer to are what this country founded upon rather than the passive head in dark places, gullable standard all of OS'ers use to keep yourselfs in a comfortable position to take in the ......each time your government hands you another big one.

Thats not a crash site. Its a staging site. Used to stage one of the world's greatest disapperaing acts of all time. Along with contributing to the biggest lie ever told in history.

reply to post by mikelee

Just as oh, a fun note - Those photos were used by the FBI as "official evidence".

And? Didn't I didn't call into question the authenticity of the photos, just your ability to analyze them and draw conclusions about the state of the wreckage.

And where is your proof or reference that the photo was taken during or after any clean up effort?

You're right that aerial photo was taken before the crash, that's why there is that blue tent and the light plants.

The intellectual "standards" you refer to are what this country founded upon

God, I hope you are not an American and are talking about some other country.

reply to post by ProRipp


ProRipp, it's likely that never in your life have you seen airplane crashes similar to the ones from 9/1 because you probably just not into studying every one on record...

It is a fact that in my lifetime i have not seen an aircraft break into small pieces like that ! FACT ! I have seen many many many crash site photographs and video etc and none looked like this ! FACT !

Which ones? How about PSA 1771, from year 1987?

The plane was estimated to have crashed nose first at a speed of around 700 miles per hour (1100 km/h, 600 kn), disintegrating instantly.

en.wikipedia.org...



(There are other photos, if you look)

SwissAir 111? From year 1998.



(Please note that the black metal frame you see was NOT part of the original airplane. They are re-constructing those tiny, tiny pieces in order to determine the cause of the crash. Another hihg-velocity impact, except this time into the ocean...)

The aircraft disintegrated on impact, killing all aboard instantly.

en.wikipedia.org...

Oh and just to add Lockerbie happened just a few miles from where i live ! I think you get the idea !

Yes, sorry you lived through that.

Gruesome, it was...more, in some ways, than other crashes, but that's a tough call to make.

Disintegration of aircraft

The explosion punched a 20-inch (0.51 m)-wide hole on the left side of the fuselage, almost directly under the 'P' in Pan Am. The disintegration of the aircraft was rapid.

Investigators from the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) were lowered into the cockpit in the wreckage before it was moved from the crash site and while the bodies of the flight crew were still in the cockpit. They concluded that no emergency procedures had been started. The pressure control and fuel switches were both set for cruise, and the crew had not used their oxygen masks, which would have been required within five seconds of a rapid depressurisation of the aircraft...

en.wikipedia.org...


But, that also isn't a valid comparison. Pan Am 103 FELL from the sky, after the bomb exploded, and the airplane broke up in flight, and the sections fell at merely terminal velocity, due to gravity. The airplane was NOT impacted, intact, into the ground.

Very different results.....

Again, the FBI claims 95% of Flight 93 was recovered.

So where was it all?



[edit on 30-12-2009 by ATH911]

reply to post by ATH911


In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania. What else do you want? GPS coordinates and glossy 8 1/2 x 11 color photos of every scrap of plane and human remians? You aint going to get it. You're not satisfied? Well, then contact Untied Airlines and ask to see the remains in storage.

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by ATH911

 

In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania. What else do you want? GPS coordinates and glossy 8 1/2 x 11 color photos of every scrap of plane and human remians? You aint going to get it. You're not satisfied? Well, then contact Untied Airlines and ask to see the remains in storage.

It works both ways ! I can bet if it was ATH911 saying those things you would be demanding exactly that ! Proof ! So give it him or give us a source to the photographs at least ?

[edit on 013131p://12America/Chicago30 by ProRipp]

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by ATH911

 

In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania. What else do you want? GPS coordinates and glossy 8 1/2 x 11 color photos of every scrap of plane and human remians? You aint going to get it.

What's the matter Hooper, this thread make you nervous that the official story you're spending so much time and energy defending is about to crumble down?

You're not satisfied? Well, then contact Untied Airlines and ask to see the remains in storage.

I don't recall the official story that Flight 93 crashed into a storage facility.

Originally posted by ProRipp

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by ATH911

 

In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania. What else do you want? GPS coordinates and glossy 8 1/2 x 11 color photos of every scrap of plane and human remians? You aint going to get it. You're not satisfied? Well, then contact Untied Airlines and ask to see the remains in storage.

It works both ways ! I can bet if it was ATH911 saying those things you would be demanding exactly that ! Proof ! So give it him or give us a source to the photographs at least ?

[edit on 013131p://12America/Chicago30 by ProRipp]

Source for what photographs? The ones posted by ATH911? Ask him/her for the source. The one photo was entered into as an exhibit in a trial obviously.

ATH911 doesn't want proof. He/she wants to just keep repeating the same stuff over and over and over again, no matter how silly it is. ATH911 has been posting the same one or two photographs and then calling the FBI liars for years. Another tactic was to claim that the government was lying when the government claimed that 95% of the plane was buried beneath the crater. I pressed him long enough on that until he admitted that there was no official claim by the government, it was based on his interpretation of a presentation given by retiree volunteers at the Flight 93 Memorial site.

reply to post by hooper



In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania. What else do you want? GPS coordinates and glossy 8 1/2 x 11 color photos


Since your askin YES we do want to see the photos of your claim that the wreckage is...your words.....'In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania.'

Is this clearer for you ? Don't make claims on ATS and not expect to get examined on it ! Both sides can play the game its not just your ball !

Originally posted by ProRipp
reply to post by hooper

 

In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania. What else do you want? GPS coordinates and glossy 8 1/2 x 11 color photos


Since your askin YES we do want to see the photos of your claim that the wreckage is...your words.....'In the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in soutwestern Pennsylvania.'

Is this clearer for you ? Don't make claims on ATS and not expect to get examined on it ! Both sides can play the game its not just your ball !

Fine, look up the Mossaui trial exhibits. There they are. Presented and accepted in an American court of law as proof of the crash of Flight 93 in the fields and woods near an old open pit coal mine in Southwestern Pennsylvania. Done and done. Next?

reply to post by ATH911


I asked earlier and my question has been ignored as I have come to expect. Can you give a reason why anyone would want to fake a crash site in a field in Pennsylvania ?

Notice that Hooper can't show us where most of the claimed recovered 95% of a Boeing 757 was at the Shanksville site.

Hmm.

Originally posted by Alfie1
I asked earlier and my question has been ignored as I have come to expect. Can you give a reason why anyone would want to fake a crash site in a field in Pennsylvania ?

Not faked just not the type of crash site you think. More of a shoot down site.